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Author Topic: Further proof that God exists...  (Read 2517 times) Average Rating: 0
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Matthew777
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« on: August 24, 2006, 01:25:02 PM »

During Winter Quarter, Math 91 proved to be far too difficult for me. Therefore, I dropped the class, which although not affecting my GPA, placed me on academic probation. In order to not lose financial aid, I was placed with the task of not earning a grade below 2.0 for the next two quarters.
In Spring Quarter, I actually forgot to take the final exam for Philosophy 101. There were three possible test dates, and I did not attend either of them. A few days after the fact, I realized what had happened, and requested my instructor that I may make up the exam. Not only was I allowed to take the test, but I ended up earning a 4.0 in the class. It's only Divine Providence, in my opinion, which could have allowed that to happen.
In Summer Quarter, near the end, I was very worried about my grades, even thinking that, perhaps, I'd fail psychology. Even my instructor expressed doubt that I'd earn at least a 2 point.
Today, Summer Quarter grades were released, and it turns out that not only did I pass psychology, but I did so with a 3.1. My accumulate GPA for two years of college so far is 3.3, higher than I would have expected it to be. Had God not been there for me, I doubt that I'd still be in college. I may even have ended up on the streets, like some of my friends, begging for drug money. Who knows? But what I can say is that I am forever in debt to God, for helping me despite my being such a foolish person.

Peace.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2006, 07:50:11 PM by Matthew777 » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2006, 05:55:03 PM »

It could also be that, for example, your professors are not there to purposely cause students problems and are willing to extend compassion to encourge them to stay in school.

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« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2006, 07:08:45 PM »

It occurs to me, Matthew, that school pressures do seem to affect you, as apparently your unexpectedly good grades are cited by you as proof of the Creator's goodness.

Therefore, rather than challenge God while you are at school, perhaps you should not be so distracted in your studies. Perhaps it is best if you take a hiatus from posting on OC.net for the length of time that you are attending school.

Of course, after you graduate you should consider postgraduate work, and then you'll need some time to settle in to your career---surely you won't want many distractions then either!

So, really, Matthew, please think about abstaining from posting on OC.net for the next 12-15 years, only for the reason that you can concentrate on important things in your life.
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« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2006, 07:10:26 PM »

I am not sure classes have begun yet for him...
If so, he's not studying enough  Wink
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« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2006, 07:20:35 PM »

Ack. Study and prepare. Don't pray for God to bail you out. If you pass, then either you did a good job, or your professors are to be especially thanked. If you fail, it's your fault.
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« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2006, 07:43:58 PM »

Sure, I do the work assigned to me. Nonetheless, I still get stressed out. If you told me coming into community college that I'd make honor roll four times, I wouldn't have believed you. It must be the grace of God which has allowed me to go this far.
It's hard to imagine how I could have dealt with some of the problems I've encountered along the way without this forum and its members.

Peace.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2006, 07:48:28 PM by Matthew777 » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2006, 07:46:33 PM »

[quote author=Αριστοκλής link=topic=9838.msg133070#msg133070 date=1156461026]
I am not sure classes have begun yet for him...
If so, he's not studying enough  Wink
[/quote]

Now that Summer Quarter is over, I don't have school until January when I transfer to Evergreen. Until then, I need to have a job to earn some extra money for college.

Peace.
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« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2006, 09:34:29 PM »

Sure, I do the work assigned to me. Nonetheless, I still get stressed out. If you told me coming into community college that I'd make honor roll four times, I wouldn't have believed you. It must be the grace of God which has allowed me to go this far.
It's hard to imagine how I could have dealt with some of the problems I've encountered along the way without this forum and its members.

Peace.

Well, I'd say that forums are a good waste of time if you have studying that must be done.  They're only good to learn something new, or spiritually engaging, but there's nothing better than cyberless relationship with God (and computerless).

God bless.

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« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2006, 10:25:56 PM »

It must be the grace of God which has allowed me to go this far.

And you.  And your professors.  And you again.

You presume to know that God granted some special dispensation to you.  You cannot know this.  Assuming that you can or do know this is something you shouldn't do.

It could be your brains coinciding with professor's mercy.  Those are both from God, yes, but nothing special had to happen for your incident to occur.  For you to think that God moved in some special way just for you is presumptuous, in my opinion.
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« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2006, 11:52:10 PM »

I don't see any harm in Matthew attributing any goodness he sees in his life to the Grace of God. I congratulate him for adopting such a mindset. The only thing his thinking presumes is faith in Divine providence and the absolute sovereignty of God in his life.

The Grace of God may have worked by (1)(a) inspiring the professor's compassion and (1)(b) enhancing Matthew's personal abilities at a crucial time, or it may have worked (2)(a) in spite of the professor's normative approach to such matters which may have been naturally inclined against Matthew's interests, and (2)(b) in spite of Matthew's limited efforts and abilities; I guess one will never know for sure, but two things are for certain: (i) the work of the Grace of God was surely at hand*, and (ii) it is surely better for one to err on the side of glorifying God (if indeed the term err even appropriately applies in this context at all), than to err on the side of glorifying one's self.

I find it shameful that anyone seek to question Matthew's personal experience of God's providence in his life--the surest and most intimate thing to his person.

* In the Thanksgiving Prayer of the Coptic Liturgy of St. Basil, the priest prays: "O Master, Lord, God the Pantocrator, the Father of our Lord, God and Saviour, Jesus Christ, we thank you for every condition, concerning every condition, and in every condition. For you have covered us, helped us, guarded us, accepted us to You, spared us, supported us, and have brought us to this hour." - Note that all those last verbs, in the original Coptic, exist in a grammatical tense that implies that God is performing accordingly at every instance up until "this hour".
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« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2006, 11:56:21 PM »

Look at the title of the thread.

No one's questioning that God could have been (and probably was!) working behind the scenes to help him.  What I'm questioning is that this situation of his can be used as irrefutable proof that God does, in fact, exist.

It is nothing of the kind.
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« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2006, 12:00:58 AM »

There is no greater proof for one than one's own experience.

If Matthew were attempting to propose a serious argument in favour of the proposition that God exists, one intended to induce rational minds to the conclusion that God exists, and to hence persuade other persons upon the basis of his own personal experience in spite of theirs, then I would deem such an attempt foolish. It doesn't seem to me that such was his intention however.

He was simply sharing his personal experience, the surest and most intimate proof to his person, and that personal experience is not up for debate, nor do I believe he was attempting to put it up for debate. But then again, he can speak for himself and prove either one of us wrong.
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« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2006, 12:43:19 AM »

He was simply sharing his personal experience, the surest and most intimate proof to his person, and that personal experience is not up for debate, nor do I believe he was attempting to put it up for debate.

Exactly. I'm sure every member of this forum has had a similar faith-affirming experience.
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« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2006, 01:02:47 AM »

Just be careful with the way you word things Matthew. I can understand why some may have received the wrong impression.
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« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2006, 01:41:49 AM »

If receiving good grades for poor effort and substandard work is evidence of the Existance of God, then I can say without a doubt that the Orthodox Seminaries in this country are definitive and undeniable proof of God's existance.
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« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2006, 02:03:21 AM »

If receiving good grades for poor effort and substandard work is evidence of the Existance of God, then I can say without a doubt that the Orthodox Seminaries in this country are definitive and undeniable proof of the existance God's existance.

This is not to say that I've given poor effort into school, I've just done a lot of second-guessing and stressing over little things.
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« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2006, 08:02:45 AM »

If receiving good grades for poor effort and substandard work is evidence of the Existance of God, then I can say without a doubt that the Orthodox Seminaries in this country are definitive and undeniable proof of God's existance.
Ah, this is why the Church in Her Divine Wisdom has the prayer of ordination read "Divine Grace, which completes that which is lacking..."
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« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2006, 01:34:37 PM »

"Pray to God, but row away from the rocks."
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« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2006, 10:18:52 PM »

I only hope that God will be as merciful in the next two years of college as He has been in the last two years. Smiley
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« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2006, 11:34:50 PM »

I only hope that God will be as merciful in the next two years of college as He has been in the last two years. Smiley

Please let us know 12-15 years from now, as I suggested earlier.

You wouldn't want to strain yourself through overcommitment... Wink
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« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2006, 11:43:21 PM »

Hopefully, 15 years from now, I'll be a successful journalist, with a good wife, in a country much better than this one. Either that or wherever God's wind blows me. It doesn't really matter where I end up, as long it's not a Viet Cong prison camp.

Peace.
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« Reply #21 on: August 27, 2006, 03:37:06 AM »

Hopefully, 15 years from now, I'll be a successful journalist, with a good wife, in a country much better than this one. Either that or wherever God's wind blows me. It doesn't really matter where I end up, as long it's not a Viet Cong prison camp.

Peace.

May I suggest Somalia? I hear it's nice this time of year...and seeing how they have no established government, you don't have to worry about suffering under a government that is in league with the United States, a.k.a. the 'Great Satan.'
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« Reply #22 on: August 27, 2006, 08:39:34 PM »

It is a false dichotomy that either you are for America or you should move to a country like Semolia, Iran, China, etc. There are countries that are more pleasant, and more just, than ours. Furthermore, never did I accuse America of being the "Great Satan," you have created a strawman. Did you take logic class in college?
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« Reply #23 on: August 28, 2006, 07:41:54 AM »

Strawman? I don't know.
Where else have you been?
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« Reply #24 on: August 28, 2006, 07:50:05 AM »

[quote author=Αριστοκλής link=topic=9838.msg133562#msg133562 date=1156765314]
Strawman? I don't know.
[/quote]
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« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2006, 07:54:48 AM »

May I suggest Somalia? I hear it's nice this time of year...and seeing how they have no established government, you don't have to worry about suffering under a government that is in league with the United States, a.k.a. the 'Great Satan.'

Um....I'm afraid you cannot suggest Somalia. The CIA's already there. You surely are not too young to remember "Operation Restore Hope"?
Face it. You guys have a finger in every pie. Cheesy
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« Reply #26 on: August 29, 2006, 07:54:06 PM »

Maybe it's not America, but just this backward, conservative town in which I live. When I move to the coast, things will be a lot better.
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« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2012, 10:18:33 PM »

There is a related thread on this topic in the Faith issues  section which is off limits to Catholics.   I wanted to respond to an assertion on that thread that there is no logical reason why there cannot be an infinite regression. I believe that this is not true because of the Borde Guth Vilenkin paper which shows that  de Sitter inflation cannot be past-eternal.
This basically rules out  an infinite regression of our universe.  For a dark energy dominated universe, the scale factor in the Friedmann-Lemaitre-Robertson-Walker metric  has an exponential dependence on time, which means that the dark energy dominated universe, which began about 9 billion years ago, is pretty much  identical to a deSitter universe. Please see:
http://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0110012v2.pdf
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