OrthodoxChristianity.net
April 20, 2014, 02:40:08 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: The Rules page has been updated.  Please familiarize yourself with its contents!
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Prayer Table  (Read 2486 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« on: June 07, 2006, 12:25:38 PM »

When one sets up a table with icons & vigil lamp (iconostasis) for prayer in the home, what room of the house should it be in and does it matter if it is N, E, W, S?  We were told many years ago when we gotmarried that the stefanothiki (crowns) should be in a corner of the bedroom where the sun rises (so the sun shines on it.  Which is the correct way.  Thanks again.
Logged
sdcheung
it's as if..Saint Photios and Saint Mark Ephesus, has come back
Banned
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,325


...even though Romania Falls, another will Rise...


« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2006, 12:58:06 PM »

I suppose the east.
and near the main door to the exterior of the house so that Guests can salute the icon corner before they salute you.
Logged


Keep Breed Mixing, and this Maine Coon Cat will be the last of it's kind. /\
No profanities in your sig line if you're going to post in the public forum.
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2006, 03:47:37 PM »

I suppose the east.
and near the main door to the exterior of the house so that Guests can salute the icon corner before they salute you.

Salute!?!??ÂÂ  

Should I put a Patriarchate flag there too so it could be saluted as well?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2006, 03:48:04 PM by Psalti Boy » Logged
sdcheung
it's as if..Saint Photios and Saint Mark Ephesus, has come back
Banned
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,325


...even though Romania Falls, another will Rise...


« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2006, 03:53:24 PM »

Salute!?!?? 

Should I put a Patriarchate flag there too so it could be saluted as well?

Absolutely
Logged


Keep Breed Mixing, and this Maine Coon Cat will be the last of it's kind. /\
No profanities in your sig line if you're going to post in the public forum.
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2006, 04:41:17 PM »

Absolutely

Aye Aye El Capitan!!
Logged
sdcheung
it's as if..Saint Photios and Saint Mark Ephesus, has come back
Banned
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,325


...even though Romania Falls, another will Rise...


« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2006, 04:55:19 PM »

Aye Aye El Capitan!!

Gooood...
outstanding!
Logged


Keep Breed Mixing, and this Maine Coon Cat will be the last of it's kind. /\
No profanities in your sig line if you're going to post in the public forum.
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2006, 05:49:11 PM »

All kidding aside . . . does anyone have a serious answer to my original question?  Right now we have the prayer table in our bedroom, so that when myself or my wife pray we may have a little privacy.  I was once told by an Antiochian priest that we shouldn't have the icons in the bedroom because they might see what we are doing.  Hhmmm.
Logged
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2006, 05:50:26 PM »

I suppose the east.
and near the main door to the exterior of the house so that Guests can salute the icon corner before they salute you.

I had once heard that an icon of the Theotokos should be near the main door to the house.  Any truth to that?
Logged
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2006, 06:36:32 PM »

Any truth to that?
Do you mean any truth to the fact that you heard it?
I'd like to know who makes all these "rules" about Iconostasia in the home.... Cheesy
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Αριστοκλής
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese
Posts: 9,907


ΠΑΝΑΓΙΑ ΣΟΥΜΕΛΑ


« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2006, 06:54:27 PM »

I had once heard that an icon of the Theotokos should be near the main door to the house.ÂÂ  Any truth to that?

Good question. I have more often heard the same said of the Icon Not Made by Hands.
Logged

"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
pensateomnia
Bibliophylax
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Posts: 2,342


metron ariston


« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2006, 07:16:12 PM »

When one sets up a table with icons & vigil lamp (iconostasis) for prayer in the home, what room of the house should it be in and does it matter if it is N, E, W, S?

Whatever room in which you and your family will use it most prayerfully and often. (It certainly would make sense, though, to have it on the east wall of said room if possible, wouldn't it?)

Quote
We were told many years ago when we gotmarried that the stefanothiki (crowns) should be in a corner of the bedroom where the sun rises (so the sun shines on it.  Which is the correct way.  Thanks again.

Interesting. Usually, I see the stefanothiki (crown-container) placed somewhere around the prayer corner. As ozgeorge implied, there really aren't any "rules" for these things. What matters is that you have some Icons in your home, you reverence them properly, and you pray with them frequently.
Logged

But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2006, 08:55:26 PM »

Do you mean any truth to the fact that you heard it?
I'd like to know who makes all these "rules" about Iconostasia in the home.... Cheesy

I heard this from an Antiochian priest.
Logged
Thomas
Section Moderator
Archon
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,711



« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2006, 03:14:43 AM »

The primary Icon Corner or "family Altar" or Icon Table should be placed in a prominent public place in the home, preferably located on an eastern wall if possible, it should  acessible to all family members for it is the heart of the household.  You should have at least one icon near the front door that can be reverenced by those entering the home, the icon of Christ, the Theotokos, or the family Patronal Saint  is usually there (the ethnic traditions will vary as to whom the Icon at the front door will be, consult your priest if you have a concern of what your juridictions tradition is).  I have heard the  no icons in the bedroom, but understand it is a Slavic  rather than a Byzantine tradition---I have heard that in one room Russian Cottages, that the scarves used to be pulled over the Icons when a couple had marital relations--- your Antiochian Priest may follow Slavic traditions in that area).  My Antiochian parish tradition encourages the newly weds to place a marital icon in the Icon Corner in their room with their marriage crowns---a marital Icon is a dyptich style icon with Christ and the Virgin Mary that are hinged---for a newly wed couple often this is their first Icon together for their new home.

In Christ,
Thomas
Logged

Your brother in Christ ,
Thomas
Psalti Boy
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Don't need one
Posts: 842



« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2006, 02:27:27 AM »

Thank you all for your help.  You have all been very and helpful.
Logged
aurelia
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 588


« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2006, 08:54:40 AM »

I do have question though, since I am not sure.  For various reasons I have the icons on a shelf at the end of the hall to the bedrooms. Not an eastern wall, but things being how they are that's where they have to live.  However, I heard that the kids should have their icons in their rooms? That I could do.  i also have been to many homes where there is a set up in the kitchen over by the stove with a light/cadle whatever and various icons.  I dont' have counter room for something like that, but I was wondering why.  (I never thought to ask while at these homes)
Logged
jmbejdl
Count-Palatine James the Spurious of Giggleswick on the Naze
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Church of Romania
Posts: 1,480


Great Martyr St. John the New of Suceava


« Reply #15 on: June 09, 2006, 09:12:11 AM »

I do have question though, since I am not sure.ÂÂ  For various reasons I have the icons on a shelf at the end of the hall to the bedrooms. Not an eastern wall, but things being how they are that's where they have to live.ÂÂ  However, I heard that the kids should have their icons in their rooms? That I could do.ÂÂ  i also have been to many homes where there is a set up in the kitchen over by the stove with a light/cadle whatever and various icons.ÂÂ  I dont' have counter room for something like that, but I was wondering why.ÂÂ  (I never thought to ask while at these homes)

I've never seen anyone put icons up in the kitchen, but it is quite common in Romania to see a candela there. We have one that my wife bought at Putna monastery in our kitchen and we light it on all the major feasts as well as at other times when we feel the need. If I remember corectly, my wife bought the candela just before our wedding because it's traditional to have one in the newly married couple's home (sort of like blessing the household I guess). You'll probably find that the reason it's usually found in the kitchen is that this is really the centre of the household's life, especially in the villages where people often eat, live and sleep in the kitchen. In case you don't know what I mean by a candela, it's a vigil oil lamp that hangs on the wall with an attached icon (in our case, and usally, of the Theotokos with Christ). I don't know if other traditions have these sorts of lamps but while they're quite common in Romania I've never seen one in the west outside of my own house.

James
Logged

We owe greater gratitude to those who humble us, wrong us, and douse us with venom, than to those who nurse us with honour and sweet words, or feed us with tasty food and confections, for bile is the best medicine for our soul. - Elder Paisios of Mount Athos
pensateomnia
Bibliophylax
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Posts: 2,342


metron ariston


« Reply #16 on: June 09, 2006, 10:03:19 AM »

Such candela exist here in the West as well. In Romanian homes in the U.S. I often see them in the eating area proper (either nook or dining room, depending on the floor plan). The Greeks have their own version too, which is usually more ad hoc (i.e. an icon or two, possibly with a separate hanging oil lamp), but one could, of course, buy a pre-fab "set," especially in the neighborhoods with lots of ecclesiastical artisans in Athens and Thessaloniki.

It is not uncommon to see an Icon of St. Euphrosynos the Cook in the kitchen proper -- a custom I have seen in Romanian, Greek and Russian monasteries, parishes and homes (especially nowadays, when one can buy "fake," i.e. not hand-painted, Icons for so little; before such printed, pasted and varnished Icons hit the scene, I rather doubt most normal Orthodox families could afford Icon upon Icon for all these little customs; in fact, some of these customs seem to come from monasteries, whereat one would expect to find a large number of iconographic spaces). Again, what's most important is that the Icons be properly reverenced and that one actually prays with them -- not that one has all the right things on display (as if there were any "rules" for such things in the first place!).

Accordingly, it makes good sense to put Icons in the room/area in which the family eats, so as to have some Icons to face while praying before and after meals. Because of the lay-out of our apartment, my wife and I happen to have an Icon of my patron and the Anastasis on the east wall of our dining area.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2006, 10:15:13 AM by pensateomnia » Logged

But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
FrChris
The Rodney Dangerfield of OC.net
Site Supporter
Taxiarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Posts: 7,252


Holy Father Patrick, thank you for your help!


« Reply #17 on: June 09, 2006, 10:06:27 AM »

My wife has icons in the kitchen (Joy Of All Who Sorrow as well as St. Euphrosynos the Cook) for several reasons:

1. She likes icons

2. This will sound sexist, but...she spends a lot of time in the kitchen. (Before I get booed and hissed, she likes to cook, and I plus the kids spend time in there as well cooking and cleaning up).

Lori was thinking that she spends a lot of her waking time there, and so if she would like to pray or meditate the icons should also be there as well.

3. The kitchen area is where she also bakes prosphora.

4. Our family eats just off the kitchen, and so the icons help us pray during our meals as well.

We don't have a kandyla there...we're one of the families that uses the Pascha flame on the water heater and stove.

Finally, each of our kids have icons in their rooms to help them pray before they go to sleep and when they wake up. These icons are not all on the east wall, but it seems like the planet keeps spinning even if icons are put in the "wrong" location  Roll Eyes
Logged

"As the sparrow flees from a hawk, so the man seeking humility flees from an argument". St John Climacus
FrChris
The Rodney Dangerfield of OC.net
Site Supporter
Taxiarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Posts: 7,252


Holy Father Patrick, thank you for your help!


« Reply #18 on: June 09, 2006, 10:08:34 AM »

Wow, Pense! I didn't realize how close my reply followed yours until after I read both of them!
Logged

"As the sparrow flees from a hawk, so the man seeking humility flees from an argument". St John Climacus
pensateomnia
Bibliophylax
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Posts: 2,342


metron ariston


« Reply #19 on: June 09, 2006, 10:28:28 AM »

Wow, Pense!

LoL! Speaking of sexism and one's wife, chris, what are you trying to say by going about shouting "Pense!" like that? (Pense is the vocative singular of pensum, which means an "allotment of wool" -- specifically the allotment of wool given to a slave for her daily spinning.)

Hmmmm....Coincidence? I think not.
Logged

But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
FrChris
The Rodney Dangerfield of OC.net
Site Supporter
Taxiarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Posts: 7,252


Holy Father Patrick, thank you for your help!


« Reply #20 on: June 09, 2006, 10:40:39 AM »

LoL! Speaking of sexism and one's wife, chris, what are you trying to say by going about shouting "Pense!" like that? (Pense is the vocative singular of pensum, which means an "allotment of wool" -- specifically the allotment of wool given to a slave for her daily spinning.)

Hmmmm....Coincidence? I think not.

Well, let's see...I don't speak Latin, even though there are three Latin speakers in my house (we all know my incredible language abilities...) so I can defend myself by saying it's a coincidence, even though half of my household may be thinking along the same lines as you.

Actually, it is indeed interesting that you immediately flashed on the idea of domestic slavery,as if this was something you have had your mind dwelling upon...

One last thing: is pense partof the root for recompense?
Logged

"As the sparrow flees from a hawk, so the man seeking humility flees from an argument". St John Climacus
pensateomnia
Bibliophylax
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Posts: 2,342


metron ariston


« Reply #21 on: June 09, 2006, 11:11:22 AM »

One last thing: is pense partof the root for recompense?

It is indeedy, through Middle English (recompensen), from Old French (recompenser), and medieval Latin (recompensare). So, yeah, the ultimate old Latin root would be "pensare," to weigh, weigh out, (or, by extension, to ponder/consider).

To avoid all such naughty Old French influence, however, and stick to our good solid Middle/Old English roots, perhaps we should just say: "comeuppance." As in, "He'll get his comeuppance, the swine!" (Rather fitting example for all things Anglo-Saxon.)

After all, one must always go ad fontes, right? (Wait a second...!)
Logged

But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
aurelia
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 588


« Reply #22 on: June 09, 2006, 11:13:32 AM »

LOL you crack me up. 
 Chant with me now: amo, amas, amat, amamus, amatis, amant
see, I remember a bit. Wink

Anyway, all of those reasons make perfect sense since the houses that I've been in are all of major cooks and prosforo makers! I like that icons are affordable, and Fr is always willing to stick them behind the altar for 40 day if you bring them in. (which reminds me...) Personally I am planning to move my icon shelf out in the living room over by the door (which happens to be on the east wall) when I get around to repainting, which has to be soon (the child art on my wall is astounding.) I really don't like them at the end of a dark hallway.
Logged
Tags: icon corner 
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.082 seconds with 49 queries.