Author Topic: Simon Peter, Do you love me?  (Read 1351 times)

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Offline Matthew777

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Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« on: March 31, 2006, 02:15:54 AM »
In the Greek, "agape" is unconditional love, one that is spiritual and selfless. "Phileo", on the other hand, is the love that one would feel for a brother or close friend. In the English of John 21, we lose an important distinction between these two Greek words.

John 21

"Simon, son of Jonah, do you agape me?"

"Yes Lord, you know that I phileo you."

"Simon, son of Jonah, do you agape me?"

"Yes Lord, you know that I phileo you."

"Simon, son of Jonah, do you phileo me?"

"Yes Lord, you know all things, you know I phileo you."


When Jesus asks, "Peter, do you love me with an unconditional love?", Peter responds, "I love you with the love for a brother." Could it be that Peter was not yet ready to love Christ unconditionally? Perhaps it's impossible for humans to unconditionally love Christ. Otherwise, why would we sin against Him?


But later on, in his epistle, Peter shows that agape love for Christ is possible...

"Though you have not seen him, you agape him...."
1 Peter 1:8

Anyways, it's interesting just to see how meaning is sometimes lost in translation.

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline Elisha

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Re: Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« Reply #1 on: March 31, 2006, 04:21:53 AM »
Matthew,
You should pick up a copy of C.S. Lewis's "The Four Loves" - it goes over this (the greek versions of the word) rather well.

Offline montalban

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Re: Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« Reply #2 on: March 31, 2006, 05:19:24 AM »
Matthew,
You should pick up a copy of C.S. Lewis's "The Four Loves" - it goes over this (the greek versions of the word) rather well.

Why don't you just give a run-down of what it says? How many people come to the forum to suggest that out there somewhere else is 'the answer'!  ???
Fàilte dhut a Mhoire,
tha thu lan de na gràsan;
Tha an Tighearna maille riut.

Offline Ebor

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Re: Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2006, 09:49:25 AM »
An excellent suggestion, Elisha.  That is a very good and understandable book for explaining the different meanings.

Ebor
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Offline montalban

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Re: Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2006, 07:37:11 PM »
An excellent suggestion, Elisha.  That is a very good and understandable book for explaining the different meanings.

Ebor

Why not let 'us' in on it then?
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tha thu lan de na gràsan;
Tha an Tighearna maille riut.

Offline mathetes

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Re: Simon Peter, Do you love me?
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2006, 10:17:17 AM »
In the Greek, "agape" is unconditional love, one that is spiritual and selfless. "Phileo", on the other hand, is the love that one would feel for a brother or close friend. In the English of John 21, we lose an important distinction between these two Greek words. ...


M777,

Have you read the article Sloppy Agape at the site for the International Standard Version?  It presents the words agape and phileo as interchangeable and far more versatile than they are made out to be in comments about John 21: 15-17.

Using Strong's Concordance, we can see that the verb agapao even appears where we read of the "love" of Demas and Balaam:

Quote
for Demas has forsaken me, having loved this present world ... ( 2 Timothy 4: 10 ).

They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness ( 2 Peter 2: 15 ).

In Christ,
Mathetes
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