Author Topic: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil  (Read 4733 times)

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Offline Matthew777

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Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« on: February 25, 2006, 09:23:24 PM »
Two of my best friends from high school became homeless meth addicts after our graduation. It hurt me but didn't surprise me too much because they were silly guys who did silly things.
But a female friend of mine is also now homeless and she's either been using drugs or has suffered from a nervous breakdown. It's so hard to see such a beautiful creature in the situation she's in. I wish that life weren't so insane.
We can say that God's gift of free will is what makes life so crazy. But would you give a gun to a small child, knowing full well what could happen? If not, does that make you more sensible than God?
We can say that Adam's fall is what caused this state we are now in. But don't you see how simplistic and unsatisfying of an answer that is, especially in this modern world?

Peace.
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Offline ozgeorge

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Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2006, 09:43:41 PM »
But would you give a gun to a small child, knowing full well what could happen?

Yes, no age is to young to learn to shoot...plus the earlier they start the better shot they usually end up being.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2006, 09:43:54 PM by greekischristian »
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Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2006, 09:46:03 PM »
Ozgeorge,   That site was hilarious but sad at the same time.  The description of Acne seems particularly apt for the youngsters of today! :D

Juliana

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2006, 09:59:19 PM »
Ozgeorge,   That site was hilarious but sad at the same time.  The description of Acne seems particularly apt for the
Have a look through the different types of Flame Warriors, and you can see most posters represented. I think I'm a combination of a few, but possible mainly this one: http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/bigcat.htm, but then, I don't see mysyself as others do.

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/duelists.htm
Yes, no age is to young to learn to shoot...plus the earlier they start the better shot they usually end up being.
You know, I've never actually seen a gun in real life. A patient once threatened to shoot himself in the mouth in front of me, but the "gun" turned out to be a replica.
I know they exist, I've seen them on TV, just never in real life....what a sheltered life I've led.
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2006, 10:14:34 PM »
http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/acne.htm

That is rather offensive. I'm talking about real life and real people. Maybe I could tell you some stories involving my father's alcoholism and the pain this has caused my family. This is a very serious problem, how one can reconcile the pain and sufferings of this world with an all-powerful, all-loving God.
Your response is entirely immature and unsympathetic. I've shared about a real person who I know that is struggling in life and would like to know why God would allow such a situation. You accuse me of being a flamer? Perhaps if you were a Christian, you'd feel compelled to pray for my friends instead of attacking me.

Peace.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2006, 10:34:20 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2006, 10:31:52 PM »
http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/crybaby.htm

If you want prayers, why don't you ask us to pray for you in the prayer forum?
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2006, 10:33:36 PM »
Because I also want answers as to why life is the way it is.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2006, 10:35:42 PM »

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2006, 10:39:54 PM »
If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.

Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2006, 10:44:41 PM »
Excellent for Chris...but who are his henchman? ha.

Offline Faith

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2006, 10:49:29 PM »
Hey Matthew777,
I think you should listen to this sermon:
http://www.coptichymns.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sermons&file=index&q=f&f=%2FEnglish%2F_Fr_Anthony_Messeh%2FWhy_Does_God_Allow_Suffering

I hope this helps...
Take care, God bless...
Faith

Offline ozgeorge

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« Last Edit: February 25, 2006, 10:54:49 PM by ozgeorge »
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Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2006, 10:54:59 PM »
I can go along with you for EkhristoAnesti's description however I must disagree with Robert's.  Is he really that young?  and hormonal?  Hmmmm.

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2006, 10:57:35 PM »
I can go along with you for EkhristoAnesti's description
No, that was Anastasios. Here's EA: http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/issues.htm
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Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2006, 11:14:39 PM »
Whoops, ok, it also fits Anastasios...but I don't agree with EA as the issue guy.  It seems to me that he has mellowed a bit.  On another note I have found that this describes TomS....http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/grunter.htm
And Jennifer strikes me as: http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/fragilefemme.htm

I am still trying to find one for myself.  Most of the time I am a bit of a lurker but I am still reading through the list.
 
PS.  I hope everyone knows that this is all in jest.  Of course I don't know any of you personally.  It's just an amusing little bit for comic relief.

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2006, 11:19:19 PM »
PS.  I hope everyone knows that this is all in jest.  Of course I don't know any of you personally.  It's just an amusing little bit for comic relief.

Hear hear! And thank God we are all different. A garden full of nothing but lillies would be very boring indeed! "Many Gifts, One Spirit."
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Offline DavidH

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2006, 11:22:02 PM »
Matthew-

 ÃƒÆ’‚  May God help your friends and your struggle to understand such a difficult subject. For understanding I think there is a lot of good to be gained from a reading of CS Lewis' The Problem of Pain. But sometimes it is not so important that we understand all the whys and see only opportunities to grow in our love for others. That you care so much for your friends you wish to understand their situation better shows your love for them growing, that they have a friend who cares for them shows that God is blessing them already. I don't think personally that the traditional answers to the problem of pain and evil are unsatisfying. It seems more true to me that the modern world's self-understanding of itself are overly complicated. I find the Church's historic approach to these issues to be satisfying but incomplete. Necessarily incomplete because we now see through a glass darkly and won't understand everything until the next life (if even then)............

Just a few random thoughts,
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2006, 11:28:09 PM »
I saw her today for the first time in almost a year. She's just as beautiful as she's always been but her personality has changed. I could sense that she was either intoxicated or that something really terrible has happened to her. She spoke in incomplete, non-sensical sentences and when I'd ask her what she meant, she'd tell me that it was a secret. As far as I could tell, she has become mentally ill. It honestly hurts me inside to see someone, especially a friend, in her situation.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2006, 11:30:01 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2006, 11:29:15 PM »
what a sheltered life I've led.

Yeah, I'd say ;) ...if you're ever in the states perhaps I can show you the great pleasure that can be taken in the controlling of large amounts of firepower  ;D

I tend to view myself as http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/philosopher.htm without the being considerate of other's arguments part...but I could certainly see the Android in me  ;D  ;D  ;D
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2006, 11:33:22 PM »
Yeah, I'd say ;) ...if you're ever in the states perhaps I can show you the great pleasure that can be taken in the controlling of large amounts of firepower  ;D
Is it true that on Pascha, instead of ringing the bells, you guys fire a few rounds into the ceiling?
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Offline jlerms

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2006, 11:36:48 PM »
Matthew,
I am sorry if I came across as petty and inconsiderate for continuing my idle banter with Ozgeorge. ÂÂ I think Rd. DavidH's message to you was compassionate and helpful. ÂÂ I also agree that it would be a good idea to post in the prayer forum for this young woman friend of yours. ÂÂ  
God bless you.   ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚ Juliana :)
« Last Edit: February 25, 2006, 11:37:57 PM by jlerms »

Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2006, 11:38:22 PM »
Or this one...

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/target.htm

Though I know exactly why I'm always attacked ;)
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Offline EkhristosAnesti

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Offline ozgeorge

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Offline Matthew777

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #25 on: February 25, 2006, 11:45:58 PM »
You guys are silly and your posts are trivial.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline FrChris

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #26 on: February 25, 2006, 11:49:18 PM »
I noted that someone who shall be nameless indicated that I am a godfather-type. The following is an excerpt of this description:

Quote
always have a Godfather who is surrounded by a cadre of loyal henchmen.

I clearly am not the godfather, since it seems none of my henchmen are loyal...
"As the sparrow flees from a hawk, so the man seeking humility flees from an argument". St John Climacus

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #27 on: February 25, 2006, 11:51:05 PM »
I noted that someone who shall be nameless indicated that I am a godfather-type. The following is an excerpt of this description:
I clearly am not the godfather, since it seems none of my henchmen are loyal...
Said with a true air of finality.....
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #28 on: February 25, 2006, 11:55:13 PM »
You guys are silly and your posts are trivial.
Yep. But isn't it good, Matthew, that a thread you started brought so many members together so quickly for a bit of fun?
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Offline DavidH

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #29 on: February 25, 2006, 11:58:48 PM »
I can only imagine how difficult that encounter must have been for you or the circumstances that might have brought someone once so full of life and promise to be in such a condition. I think it would have been very difficult for me and the sadness of it would have lingered for some time. I hope that I would be able to convert that compassion into prayer and, if possible, to helping her in some practical way with my friendship. Our theological answers to the problem of evil and pain, coming from revelation and tradition are undoubtedly correct. But being correct doesn't necessarily make them satisfying when the "case" we are examining is someone we care for. The big WHY of it all is something we ourselves, feeling pain -whether for ourselves or others- may not be objectively ready to recieve. The little WHY however is something you seem to be well on the way to experiencing and understanding. She is there for you to help in some way. You are there for her to see God's love in some way. Exactly how will only become clear through prayer and effort.


Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #30 on: February 25, 2006, 11:59:56 PM »
"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry

Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2006, 12:01:30 AM »
In recent communication from the godfather:

Elisha and Nektarios:
http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/cybersisters.htm
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Offline ozgeorge

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Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #33 on: February 26, 2006, 12:22:34 AM »
Came across another one that fits me.

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/jerk.htm
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Offline SouthSerb99

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #34 on: February 26, 2006, 12:36:26 AM »
GiC & Ozgeorge,

     How about you lads start a seperate discussion for hutman?  Thanks in advance. :)
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #35 on: February 26, 2006, 12:39:15 AM »
GiC & Ozgeorge,

     How about you lads start a seperate discussion for hutman?  Thanks in advance. :)
Sorry, you're right of course. http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/netiquettenazi.htm
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #36 on: February 26, 2006, 12:46:04 AM »
Actually, I reported the thread to the moderator. Not because I think anything terrible or unChristian is going on, but just because Matthew is obviously sensitive on this issue, and I think the jocularity going on in this thread should be taking place somewhere else. What would a visitor think if they happened upon this thread, and saw the concern of Matthew for his friends, and then almost all the responses were unrelated jokes? Perhaps Matthew should have put it in a Prayer thread to begin with, but the issue he brought up was not just one of requesting prayer, but also one of pastoral and theological importance. This website has come up before, and I think it's as funny as the next guy; I just don't think that this is the thread for it.
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Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #37 on: February 26, 2006, 12:54:25 AM »
From the title of the thread, 'Another Thread on the Problem of Evil' we can see that this form was started in the presence of another ongoing thread on the same issue...it seems to me that matthew simply wanted to start the conversation over again from scratch, which is a pointless exersize...such a thread leaves itself wide open to being hijacked and used for something more productive.

Hmmmm, so would this complaint put you in the category of
http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/weenie.htm

or

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/crybaby.htm

j/k ;)
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Offline Νεκτάριος

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #38 on: February 26, 2006, 02:06:07 AM »

Offline Elisha

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #39 on: February 26, 2006, 02:30:25 AM »
[quote author=Νεκτάριος link=topic=8302.msg109160#msg109160 date=1140933967]

If you really want an identity for Matthew (and Jennifer as well) http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/pinko.htm
[/quote]

Hmmm...I'm inclined to agree..

Cybersister?  Bah.  Much more of a Big Cat and Lurker.

Offline GiC

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #40 on: February 26, 2006, 03:16:01 PM »
How funny you both chimed in support of each other ;)
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Offline Meekle

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Re: Another Thread on the Problem of Evil
« Reply #41 on: February 26, 2006, 04:43:39 PM »
I think I am a rot pup, what say ye?