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Author Topic: Homeschool VS Public School  (Read 67513 times) Average Rating: 1
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« Reply #585 on: May 30, 2013, 09:16:06 AM »

The other big change coming to public education is the Common Core Curriculum. This nationwide program will be used in 45 states. One of the saddest and most frightening goals of this new program is to eliminate a large percentage of literature from English classes and to replace it with fact-based reading material. Any observant bystander would question the wisdom in such a significant change when one realizes math, history, and science provide plenty of opportunity to become a proficient fact-based reader. But it is only in English class, where one has the luxury of reading literature that spans the literate time period of man's history. And it is only when one is taught to analyze the writings of various writers through the ages and from various cultures that one can fine tune the critical thinking skills a person needs to survive in today's world.

One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

The students need to do fact-based reading in English classes because Science and History classes are no longer fact-based and math doesn't have any letters (because, you know, no one uses algebra after high school...).  Of course, the "facts" being taught will just be more political agenda just like Science and History.

"Give me four years to teach your children and the seed that I have sown will never be uprooted." - V.I. Lenin.

BTW, tell your son that the only way he is going to get any real reading in is if he does it himself.  When I was in High School we were supposed to be reading "My Antonia" but I always kept my copy of Mercenary by Mike Hoare just low enough on my desk that I could get some real education in!   Wink
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« Reply #586 on: May 30, 2013, 11:20:53 AM »

(because, you know, no one uses algebra after high school...)

Are you joking? Every trip to the grocery store seems to be an algebra test that has to be solved on the spot in my head. And as their (the grocery store) gimmicks get more complex, I will one day not be able to solve the equations in my head in order to find the break even point.
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« Reply #587 on: May 30, 2013, 11:41:11 AM »

(because, you know, no one uses algebra after high school...)

Are you joking? Every trip to the grocery store seems to be an algebra test that has to be solved on the spot in my head. And as their (the grocery store) gimmicks get more complex, I will one day not be able to solve the equations in my head in order to find the break even point.

 Wink

I haven't used algebra yet today but the day is young!
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« Reply #588 on: May 30, 2013, 11:44:28 AM »

BTW, tell your son that the only way he is going to get any real reading in is if he does it himself.  When I was in High School we were supposed to be reading "My Antonia" but I always kept my copy of Mercenary by Mike Hoare just low enough on my desk that I could get some real education in!   Wink
Never read "My Antonia," but I always felt that the public education system makes students read books that are either objectively awful or are worthy but beyond the full comprehension of the young. The time to read is wasted on the youthful.
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« Reply #589 on: May 30, 2013, 08:18:02 PM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
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« Reply #590 on: May 31, 2013, 12:40:49 AM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
Funny, I have always seen it the other way around.  The ones with a "one world order" mentality are the ones who kill the most.  Those who want a peacful nation and be left alone are usually the last to fight and its usually the fighting the ones with the world order mentality.
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« Reply #591 on: May 31, 2013, 04:30:52 AM »


Do you agree that if you need to have your foot amputated, you go to a doctor? Or not?
It depends. There was a case here of a doctor who amputated the wrong leg at the local hospital. He was not fired or anything.
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« Reply #592 on: May 31, 2013, 09:08:10 AM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
Funny, I have always seen it the other way around.  The ones with a "one world order" mentality are the ones who kill the most.  Those who want a peacful nation and be left alone are usually the last to fight and its usually the fighting the ones with the world order mentality.

The only people I know who talk about "one world orders" are conspiracy theorists who are convinced the government is watching them with black helicopters.  Those are the people that are nuts IMHO.  Nations are just artificial constructs.  I believe love for our fellow man should trancend nations borders.
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« Reply #593 on: May 31, 2013, 09:54:36 AM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
Funny, I have always seen it the other way around.  The ones with a "one world order" mentality are the ones who kill the most.  Those who want a peacful nation and be left alone are usually the last to fight and its usually the fighting the ones with the world order mentality.

The only people I know who talk about "one world orders" are conspiracy theorists who are convinced the government is watching them with black helicopters.  Those are the people that are nuts IMHO.  Nations are just artificial constructs.  I believe love for our fellow man should trancend nations borders.

The nebulous phrase of " citizens of the world" will not  give you the utopian fantasy you dream about. There will always be laws and there will always be governments but freedom as you know it will probably be a distant memory. Freedom is precious and easily lost. I spent a few weeks in communist Russia during the 1980s. I came home loving this country even more than when I left. I also saw this country with the same view my Syrian and Italian immigrant grandparents had when I returned home.
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« Reply #594 on: May 31, 2013, 09:59:38 AM »

A nation-wide curriculum is not going to bring about the NWO. Many countries have them; in fact, I struggled for the longest time to wrap my mind around the notion of a country that doesn't.
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« Reply #595 on: May 31, 2013, 10:17:19 AM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
Funny, I have always seen it the other way around.  The ones with a "one world order" mentality are the ones who kill the most.  Those who want a peacful nation and be left alone are usually the last to fight and its usually the fighting the ones with the world order mentality.

The only people I know who talk about "one world orders" are conspiracy theorists who are convinced the government is watching them with black helicopters.  Those are the people that are nuts IMHO.  Nations are just artificial constructs.  I believe love for our fellow man should trancend nations borders.

The nebulous phrase of " citizens of the world" will not  give you the utopian fantasy you dream about. There will always be laws and there will always be governments but freedom as you know it will probably be a distant memory. Freedom is precious and easily lost. I spent a few weeks in communist Russia during the 1980s. I came home loving this country even more than when I left. I also saw this country with the same view my Syrian and Italian immigrant grandparents had when I returned home.

I'm not dreaming about any utopian fantasy.  I'm just saying that as I raise my children, I want them to be able to sypmathize and support others who live in other parts of the world rather than hold on to this silly notion that our nation or people are any better than any other group of people.  I have spent enough time abroad to recognize that people are people regardless of where they come from. They all have the same dreams and fears and need the same things.  To encourage my children to close their eyes to those bonds is to cause tension where none need exist.  On my list of things to worry about, nefarious "one world orders" come in pretty low.  Probably right above dinosaurs being cloned and taking over the world.
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« Reply #596 on: May 31, 2013, 11:17:24 AM »

A nation-wide curriculum is not going to bring about the NWO. Many countries have them; in fact, I struggled for the longest time to wrap my mind around the notion of a country that doesn't.

A question, is the curriculum within England the same as it is in Scotland(and the same for Wales and N. Ireland)?

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« Reply #597 on: May 31, 2013, 12:45:07 PM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

I would rather have my children be good citizens of the world than patriotic citizens of our nation.  Good citizens of the world go extreme by joining the Peace Corps.  Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.
Funny, I have always seen it the other way around.  The ones with a "one world order" mentality are the ones who kill the most.  Those who want a peacful nation and be left alone are usually the last to fight and its usually the fighting the ones with the world order mentality.

The only people I know who talk about "one world orders" are conspiracy theorists who are convinced the government is watching them with black helicopters.  Those are the people that are nuts IMHO.  Nations are just artificial constructs.  I believe love for our fellow man should trancend nations borders.

The nebulous phrase of " citizens of the world" will not  give you the utopian fantasy you dream about. There will always be laws and there will always be governments but freedom as you know it will probably be a distant memory. Freedom is precious and easily lost. I spent a few weeks in communist Russia during the 1980s. I came home loving this country even more than when I left. I also saw this country with the same view my Syrian and Italian immigrant grandparents had when I returned home.

I'm not dreaming about any utopian fantasy.  I'm just saying that as I raise my children, I want them to be able to sypmathize and support others who live in other parts of the world rather than hold on to this silly notion that our nation or people are any better than any other group of people.  I have spent enough time abroad to recognize that people are people regardless of where they come from. They all have the same dreams and fears and need the same things.  To encourage my children to close their eyes to those bonds is to cause tension where none need exist.  On my list of things to worry about, nefarious "one world orders" come in pretty low.  Probably right above dinosaurs being cloned and taking over the world.

Of course people are people regardless of where they are from, but governments are not all the same and the notion of citizens of the world implies we all have the same values when it comes to governance but we don't. Some value freedom and others value theocratic dictatorships. We can't be citizens of the world with contradictory values when it comes to governance and I will not give up the Constitution and the Bill of Rights to become a part of some undefined pseudo-world citizenship nonsense.
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« Reply #598 on: May 31, 2013, 01:08:11 PM »

A nation-wide curriculum is not going to bring about the NWO. Many countries have them; in fact, I struggled for the longest time to wrap my mind around the notion of a country that doesn't.

A question, is the curriculum within England the same as it is in Scotland(and the same for Wales and N. Ireland)?

There are regional variations for Wales and N. Ireland, mainly involving language, but it's still London that works them out. Scotland is, for all intents and purposes, a separate country with its own system.
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« Reply #599 on: May 31, 2013, 04:14:29 PM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.
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« Reply #600 on: May 31, 2013, 04:22:43 PM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.

Wisdom.
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« Reply #601 on: May 31, 2013, 04:42:57 PM »

That is true. The 10th amendment shouldn't be dead letter, although with federalism and state delegation to smaller units, it might have become dead letter. Personally, I would not be afraid to teach my kids controversial opinions such as "homosexuality is wrong" or "constitutional monarchy is a better form of government than democracy".
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« Reply #602 on: May 31, 2013, 05:09:46 PM »

That is true. The 10th amendment shouldn't be dead letter, although with federalism and state delegation to smaller units, it might have become dead letter. Personally, I would not be afraid to teach my kids controversial opinions such as "homosexuality is wrong" or "constitutional monarchy is a better form of government than democracy".
And Noah had dinosaurs in his ark. Which is a controversial idea.
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« Reply #603 on: May 31, 2013, 07:24:40 PM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.

I heartily agree. Each local area has different issues to deal with and different populations to educate. One size fits all approach will fail our children.
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« Reply #604 on: May 31, 2013, 08:04:05 PM »

So some children should learn geography, some should learn flat earthism, some should learn about medicine, others should learn that medicine is bad and we should only pray for healing, some should learn that Israel doesn't exist and others should learn that the Palestinians deserve to be pushed off their land all because they live in different parts of the US?  Shocked
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« Reply #605 on: May 31, 2013, 10:04:03 PM »

Each state should have standards that need to be met on the curriculum devised by the school.

Take me for example. I'm going into education to be an English teacher in a secondary school. I should not be expected to teach the same books as everyone else. Now, should my students be able to read and communicate at the same level ad anyone else, of course. They need to meet the same level of literacy as everyone else, regardless of the school. That being said, I should have flexibility on the texts I choose to teach.
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« Reply #606 on: June 01, 2013, 12:29:06 AM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.

Wisdom.

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« Reply #607 on: June 01, 2013, 12:31:26 AM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.
actually a national program would be a lot more beneficial.

ill get to this garbage later tomorrow.
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« Reply #608 on: June 01, 2013, 12:38:25 AM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.
actually a national program would be a lot more beneficial.

ill get to this garbage later tomorrow.

No child left behind is not beneficial in any way, and that is just one example.  Our government has provided multiple examples of how bad it gets when the government gets involved into things it should not.  
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« Reply #609 on: June 01, 2013, 12:47:12 AM »

So some children should learn geography, some should learn flat earthism, some should learn about medicine, others should learn that medicine is bad and we should only pray for healing, some should learn that Israel doesn't exist and others should learn that the Palestinians deserve to be pushed off their land all because they live in different parts of the US?  Shocked

You are very dramatic. Could you please be sensible? In some parts of the country we have children who are barely able to speak English and have parents who are illiterate. They need a program to help them become fluent. In other upper class neighborhoods we have children who are very intelligent and need the curriculum to move at a much faster pace. One curriculum will ever be able to meet the needs of the disparate groups we have in the United States.
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« Reply #610 on: June 01, 2013, 08:11:59 AM »

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One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.

Really?  You're going to stand by such an asinine statement.

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« Reply #611 on: June 01, 2013, 08:15:34 AM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.
actually a national program would be a lot more beneficial.

ill get to this garbage later tomorrow.

A national program won't do anything except to continue to dumb down students, reduce standards, give little or no emphasis to critical thinking and make teachers essentially unnecessary or just mindless automatons.  We have the evidence for this in NCLB which was an expanded reauthorization of earlier national education laws. 

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« Reply #612 on: June 01, 2013, 09:19:30 AM »

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One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.

Really?  You're going to stand by such an asinine statement.


Would you like to address my entire statement rather than just call it asinine?
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« Reply #613 on: June 01, 2013, 10:18:38 AM »

I want to take a moment to point out that America isn't one country split into states for administrative or any other purpose. It is a group of independently functioning states that joined together for protection etc.

 To have one national curriculum is unconstitutional, it flies in the face of the 10th amendment. The Dept of Education itself shouldn't even exist. Many, MANY of our problems stem from an over zealous federal government reaching into places it was never intended to reach. 300 million people is more difficult to govern than 6 or 7. The United States cannot (and should not) emulate any foreign educational system. However, the individual states are free to do so. If I don't like it? I can move, or enroll my children in private school or home school. See how nicely that works out? I have the freedom to choose how to educate my children, and the freedom to seek out like minded individuals if I am in the state minority.

Seems like this is lost on a few people.
actually a national program would be a lot more beneficial.

ill get to this garbage later tomorrow.

A national program won't do anything except to continue to dumb down students, reduce standards, give little or no emphasis to critical thinking and make teachers essentially unnecessary or just mindless automatons.  We have the evidence for this in NCLB which was an expanded reauthorization of earlier national education laws. 



You are correct about every point. We even had one school board member who said the classrooms of the future would look different. Each child would be plugged into a computer learning the curriculum while a teacher would move around the room just making sure students could access the material. This school board member is an east coast Ivy League grad who is a real supporter of the Core Curriculum program. We seem to have many of these transplants from the east coast who want to transform our education system. I don't trust any of them.
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« Reply #614 on: June 01, 2013, 01:54:03 PM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.

Really?  You're going to stand by such an asinine statement.


Would you like to address my entire statement rather than just call it asinine?

Would you care to first prove your statement?  Then I will offer a rebuttal.  You can't just make blanket inflammatory statements like that and then shift the onus of proof to those who would rebut (I.e. make the case for you).
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TheTrisagion
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« Reply #615 on: June 01, 2013, 07:36:52 PM »

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One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.

Really?  You're going to stand by such an asinine statement.


Would you like to address my entire statement rather than just call it asinine?

Would you care to first prove your statement?  Then I will offer a rebuttal.  You can't just make blanket inflammatory statements like that and then shift the onus of proof to those who would rebut (I.e. make the case for you).

"Patriotic" Nationalists who went hardcore and who started world (or major) wars:
Adolf Hitler
Benito Mussolini
Hirohito
Gavrilo Princip
Dragutin Dimitrijević
Otto Von Bismark
Kaiser Wilhelm II
Kim Il Sung

"Citizens of the World" who went hardcore about their beliefs
Jesus
Ghandi
Buddha
Confucius
Henry David Thoreau
Leo Tolstoy
Jody Williams
Thomas Merton

How many more names did you want me to provide?  Would you like to name half as many examples to the contrary in each category, because I have a feeling you would come up empty.


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« Reply #616 on: June 01, 2013, 07:42:10 PM »

Quote
One other important side note, more emphasis will be placed on being a good citizen of the world versus a patriotic citizen of our nation. We don't have one world government yet, but the curriculum seems to be aiming for that goal. Parents beware.

Patriotic citizens of our nation go extreme by becoming nationalistic nutjobs and start world wars.

Really?  You're going to stand by such an asinine statement.


Would you like to address my entire statement rather than just call it asinine?

Would you care to first prove your statement?  Then I will offer a rebuttal.  You can't just make blanket inflammatory statements like that and then shift the onus of proof to those who would rebut (I.e. make the case for you).

"Patriotic" Nationalists who went hardcore and who started world (or major) wars:
Adolf Hitler
Benito Mussolini
Hirohito
Gavrilo Princip
Dragutin Dimitrijević
Otto Von Bismark
Kaiser Wilhelm II
Kim Il Sung

"Citizens of the World" who went hardcore about their beliefs
Jesus
Ghandi
Buddha
Confucius
Henry David Thoreau
Leo Tolstoy
Jody Williams
Thomas Merton

How many more names did you want me to provide?  Would you like to name half as many examples to the contrary in each category, because I have a feeling you would come up empty.



You realize, of course, a list could easily be made showing the opposite, and some on your list are arguable for the opposite.  I think it safer if we all just agree we have differing opinions based on different view points and respect the other.
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« Reply #617 on: June 01, 2013, 08:15:16 PM »

I don't have a problem with that, but when someone asks me to prove my "asinine" opinion, I'm going to respond.

I would be interested in seeing a list for the opposite or reasoning for why my list might be flawed.  I even put that in my post.  I am not threatened by a good debate or the fear of being wrong.  It has happened before, and I'm sure it will happen again.  Wink
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« Reply #618 on: June 01, 2013, 08:16:26 PM »

Our children learned about different types of fowls today.  We ended up going to the State Park and on our pasture looking for birds.

The older children had fun classifying them.   Our youngest had fun "learning to count".

Our 8 year old would take the classified birds and put them in alphabetical order.

Then the lesson moved on to symmetry with the leaves.    We also found a big fat toad.

Homeschool is good times.
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« Reply #619 on: June 09, 2013, 03:18:07 PM »

From a new article on breitbart.com. If you pay attention to this thread, most, if not all of the arguments against homeschooling have absolutely no studies or facts to back them up.  At best, someone knew a homeschooler who was "weird" or they had some ex-homeschool students in their class who didn't perform well.  It is all anecdotal and usually based on emotion and bias.  I guess the critics know something M.I.T., Stanford, Harvard and Duke don't.  Wink

The good of homeschooling is proven factually as any study you find will show the benefits of homeschooling.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/06/07/Report-Growth-in-Homeschooling-Outpacing-Public-Schools

"Any concerns about the quality of education children receive by their parents can be put to rest by the consistently high placement of homeschooled students on standardized assessment exams. Data demonstrates that those who are independently educated generally score between the 65th and 89th percentile on these measures, while those in traditional academic settings average at around the 50th percentile. In addition, achievement gaps between sexes, income levels, or ethnicity—all of which have plagued public schools around the country—do not exist in homeschooling environments."

"The high achievement level of homeschoolers is readily recognized by recruiters from some of the best colleges in the nation. Home-educated children matriculate in colleges and attain a four-year degree at much higher rates than their counterparts from both public and private schools. Schools such as Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Harvard, Stanford, and Duke Universities all actively recruit homeschoolers.

Similarly, the common myth that homeschoolers “miss out” on so-called “socialization opportunities,” often thought to be a vital aspect of traditional academic settings, has proven to be without merit. According to the National Home Education Research Institute survey, homeschoolers tend to be more socially engaged than their peers and demonstrate “healthy social, psychological, and emotional development, and success into adulthood.”
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« Reply #620 on: June 09, 2013, 03:34:38 PM »

Bottom line, most people who want to home school shouldn't.

I don't need studies. I just need to meet them or read what they write. Typically, I walk away feeling very sorry for their children. 

Those who could very well homeschool aren't passionately burning to do so.

A puzzle for the ages.
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« Reply #621 on: June 09, 2013, 03:49:56 PM »

Bottom line, most people who want to home school shouldn't.

I don't need studies. I just need to meet them or read what they write. Typically, I walk away feeling very sorry for their children. 

Those who could very well homeschool aren't passionately burning to do so.

A puzzle for the ages.

Why let facts get in the way of your beliefs?  How many homeschoolers do you really know?  Honestly, give me numbers.  No homeschoolers I have ever met (and I work with a few organizations around here because I can teach them Latin and Greek which their organizations do not have the credentials to do so) are the socially backward, intellectually challenged people you assume them to be.  Are there exceptions? Of course, but you'd be surprised that most homeschoolers in this country are not generally individual households, but they form local and state organizations and share teachers, resources, et al.
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« Reply #622 on: June 09, 2013, 04:06:25 PM »

Bottom line, most people who want to home school shouldn't.

I don't need studies. I just need to meet them or read what they write. Typically, I walk away feeling very sorry for their children. 

Those who could very well homeschool aren't passionately burning to do so.

A puzzle for the ages.

There is no puzzle.  Again, you are using nothing but your own personal anecdotes, emotion and bias.  Provide one factual study by anyone that homeschooling does a poorer job than public schooling and maybe more people will be persuaded by your argument and you might just save some "poor" homeschooled children.  Wink
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« Reply #623 on: June 09, 2013, 06:12:08 PM »

Funny how people lash out emotionally at those they think are acting on emotion.

Number of households I've had contact with that have home schooled.

Greater than 100 probably closer to 1000.

Maniacs tend to congregate.
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« Reply #624 on: June 09, 2013, 06:45:46 PM »

Funny how people lash out emotionally at those they think are acting on emotion.

Number of households I've had contact with that have home schooled.

Greater than 100 probably closer to 1000.

Maniacs tend to congregate.

I'm sure your sample size and statistical analysis is greater and more accurate than Harvard, Stanford, Duke and MIT. Heck, they could probably use your expertise on the matter.  I'm sure they would appreciate being saved from the maniac homeschoolers. But then again they would probably only see one maniac because, oh, that's right, according to STUDIES, not opinions, homeschoolers do better in college and graduate in four years at a higher rate than public schooled children.

From what I already posted above.

"Schools such as Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Harvard, Stanford, and Duke Universities all actively recruit homeschoolers."
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« Reply #625 on: June 09, 2013, 08:28:19 PM »

Funny how people lash out emotionally at those they think are acting on emotion.

Number of households I've had contact with that have home schooled.

Greater than 100 probably closer to 1000.

Maniacs tend to congregate.

I'm sure your sample size and statistical analysis is greater and more accurate than Harvard, Stanford, Duke and MIT. Heck, they could probably use your expertise on the matter.  I'm sure they would appreciate being saved from the maniac homeschoolers. But then again they would probably only see one maniac because, oh, that's right, according to STUDIES, not opinions, homeschoolers do better in college and graduate in four years at a higher rate than public schooled children.

From what I already posted above.

"Schools such as Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Harvard, Stanford, and Duke Universities all actively recruit homeschoolers."

All this means is that they actively recruit homeschoolers like they do for anyone else. I have read that with the increase in homeschoolers colleges have instituted programs to help with all the paper work that is necessary for them.

The one reference for a study that you cited has no citation for the study referred to and the article that was referenced also had no citations.

The increase of  homeschooling is here:
http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d11/tables/dt11_040.asp

The one study I found with academic outcomes is here and it is not peer reviewed but there is no reason to doubt it:
http://www.airum.org/docs/presentations/2009-Cogan.pdf

If you find a study that takes into account the large demographic difference (see the first link), let me know. Look at it. The problem is obvious.

If you find a study that compares outcome when there is parental involvement in the education of students in public and private schools vs home schooling, let me know.
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« Reply #626 on: June 09, 2013, 08:31:04 PM »

according to STUDIES, not opinions,

lol
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« Reply #627 on: June 09, 2013, 08:43:51 PM »

Funny how people lash out emotionally at those they think are acting on emotion.

Number of households I've had contact with that have home schooled.

Greater than 100 probably closer to 1000.

Maniacs tend to congregate.

Just watched several children from our homeschool group get scholarships. 

You've got to be trolling.... got to be.
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« Reply #628 on: June 09, 2013, 08:51:52 PM »

Funny how people lash out emotionally at those they think are acting on emotion.

Number of households I've had contact with that have home schooled.

Greater than 100 probably closer to 1000.

Maniacs tend to congregate.

Just watched several children from our homeschool group get scholarships. 

You've got to be trolling.... got to be.
what sort of scholarships and to where?

sheesh you act like the word scholarship is some big deal without the details.
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« Reply #629 on: June 09, 2013, 09:07:10 PM »

This isn't hard to find guys.  Google "homeschool outcomes" and you'll find plenty of studies that reinforce the good of homeschooling.

And yes, we have known plenty of people who didn't homeschool their children well, and guess what, in every case they ended up sending their kids to public school. Nothing wrong with that.

We are not anti-public school and we don't think everyone should homeschooled.  For us it was a choice we are thankful we made.  It is not for everyone.
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