Author Topic: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight  (Read 908 times)

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Offline IreneOlinyk

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I know Kanye West's wife and children were recently baptised in the Armenian Orthodox Church but the prosperity "gospel" is not Christian.

Quote
November 19, 2019
A performance by artist Kanye West at Joel Osteen’s Lakewood Church in Houston on Sunday has launched a debate among Christians over controversial prosperity gospel teachings and the role of race in conservative evangelical Christianity.
“Kanye West and Joel Osteen are a match made in market-driven heaven,” said Jonathan L. Walton, dean of Wake Forest Divinity School, who noted how West sold $170 “Jesus Is King” sweatshirts with his new album.

“Both have baptized their commercial notoriety and their financial gains in Jesus’ name,” Walton said. “The communion table has become a merch table.”
West’s recent album “Jesus Is King” has earned praise in unusual corners of conservative Christianity, but his comments have raised eyebrows over their association with Osteen’s prosperity gospel teachings, the idea that God grants health and wealth to his followers. Some Christians are also questioning whether black hip-hop artists are being used by white evangelical preachers to boost their own brand and falsely signal progressive racial attitudes.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/religion/2019/11/19/how-kanye-west-put-joel-osteens-prosperity-gospel-back-under-spotlight/

Offline SolEX01

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2019, 12:24:45 AM »
Increased spirituality is one symptom of mental illness.  Kanye West needs treatment instead of proselytizing.

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2019, 09:20:54 AM »
It probably isn't Christianity but popular marketing.
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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2019, 02:39:37 PM »
Increased spirituality is one symptom of mental illness.  Kanye West needs treatment instead of proselytizing.

Lol.
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Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2019, 03:55:40 PM »
demonic spirits are the cause of mental illness. Also, sorcerers attacking people with the aid of demonic spirits could be the cause :

http://orthodoxinfo.com/death/cyprian_justina.aspx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZksHQpnu-JA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWBhU0AXTtA&t=196s



I think our unconfessed sins might have something to do with it also.



.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2019, 03:59:19 PM by Jude1:3 »

Offline biro

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2019, 05:48:15 PM »
"Demonic spirits are the cause of mental illness."

Just wow.
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Offline SolEX01

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2019, 06:28:58 PM »
"Demonic spirits are the cause of mental illness."

Just wow.

It's true.  Instead of relying on Christ to exorcise the demons, people turn to treatment, therapy, and medication.

In 2006, I went to my priest with a notebook full of things related to my mental illness.  I asked him for confession and he refused because my ex-girlfriend was with me (he probably couldn't do confessions at that time anyway).  After I broke up with my ex-girlfriend, I visited an Antiochian church and received the sacrament of confession.  Unfortunately, that priest was laicized and he went to the Old Calendarists.

Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2019, 06:35:29 PM »
demonic spirits are the cause of mental illness. Also, sorcerers attacking people with the aid of demonic spirits could be the cause :

http://orthodoxinfo.com/death/cyprian_justina.aspx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZksHQpnu-JA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWBhU0AXTtA&t=196s



I think our unconfessed sins might have something to do with it also.



.

This is true.  Most lay types are unfamiliar with the spiritual battles that take place over the souls of men.

While those in the monastic fields often come into contact with these fallen 'spirits' and are harassed by them.

So they, being sent forth by the Holy Ghost, departed unto Seleucia; and from thence they sailed to Cyprus. 5 And when they were at Salamis, they preached the word of God in the synagogues of the Jews: and they had also John to their minister. 6 And when they had gone through the isle unto Paphos, they found a certain sorcerer, a false prophet, a Jew, whose name was Barjesus: 7 Which was with the deputy of the country, Sergius Paulus, a prudent man; who called for Barnabas and Saul, and desired to hear the word of God. 8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for so is his name by interpretation) withstood them, seeking to turn away the deputy from the faith. 9 Then Saul, (who also is called Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him, 10 And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord? 11 And now, behold, the hand of the Lord is upon thee, and thou shalt be blind, not seeing the sun for a season. And immediately there fell on him a mist and a darkness; and he went about seeking some to lead him by the hand. 12 Then the deputy, when he saw what was done, believed, being astonished at the doctrine of the Lord. (Ac 13:4-12).

Offline biro

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2019, 06:50:53 PM »
Sorcerers.

Somebody took a couple novels way too seriously.
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Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2019, 07:56:06 PM »
Sorcerers.
Somebody took a couple novels way too seriously.

The reality of Sorcerers / Witches is confirmed by The lives of Martyred Saints Justina and Cyprian.

https://www.christianforums.com/threads/saints-cyprian-and-justina-and-what-we-can-learn-from-their-story-as-christians-repost.8107683/

https://www.oca.org/saints/lives/2016/10/02/102835-hieromartyr-cyprian-virgin-martyr-justina-and-martyr-theoctistus

From : http://orthodoxinfo.com/death/cyprian_justina.aspx

"Cyprian called Aglaias and sent him to sprinkle the house of Justina secretly with the contents of The Demon's vessel. When this had been done, The Demon Of Fornication Entered The House with the flaming arrows of fleshly lust in order to wound the heart of the maiden with fornication, and to ignite her flesh with impure lust.

Justina had the custom every night to offer up prayers to the Lord. And behold, when, according to custom, she arose at the third hour of the night and was praying to God, she suddenly felt an agitation in her body, a storm of bodily lust and the flame of the fire of gehenna. In such agitation and inward battle she remained for quite a long time; the youth Aglaias came to her mind, and shameful thoughts arose in her. The maiden marveled and was ashamed of herself, feeling that her blood was boiling as in a kettle; now she thought about that which she had always despised as vile. But in her good sense Justina understood that this battle had arisen in her from the devil; immediately She Turned To The Weapon Of The Sign Of The Cross, hastened to God with fervent prayer, and from the depths of her heart cried out to Christ her Bridegroom:

Having prayed long and fervently, the holy virgin put the enemy to shame. Being conquered by her prayer, he fled from her with shame, and again there came a calm in Justina's body and heart; the flame of desire was quenched, the battle ceased, the boiling blood was stilled. Justina glorified God and sang a song of victory.

The demon, on the other hand, returned to Cyprian with the sad news that he had accomplished nothing"




• It's also confirmed by The Old and New Testament and writings of The Church Fathers :

https://www.christianforums.com/threads/are-there-any-magicians-who-do-real-magic.8115202/#post-73972557


But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, Sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars Shall Have Their Part In The Lake Which Burns With Fire And Brimstone, which is the second death."
• Revelation 21:8


But Elymas The Sorcerer (for so his name is translated) withstood them, seeking to turn the proconsul away from the faith.
• Acts 13:8


But there was a certain man called Simon, who previously Practiced Sorcery in the city and astonished the people of Samaria, claiming that he was someone great,
• Acts 8:9



• The Death of Simon Magus : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Magus
• Cyril of Jerusalem (346 A.D.) in the sixth of his Catechetical Lectures prefaces his history of the Manichaeans by a brief account of earlier heresies: "Simon Magus, he says, had given out that he was going to be translated to heaven, And Was Actually Careening Through The Air In A Chariot Drawn By Demons when Peter and Paul knelt down and prayed, and their prayers brought him to earth a mangled corpse."



• Jannes and Jambres
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jannes_and_Jambres

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbhMTfBsD9g&feature=emb_title

Then The Magicians of Egypt did so with their Enchantments; and Pharaoh’s heart grew hard, and he did not heed them, as the Lord had said.
• Exodus 7:22


Now As Jannes and Jambres resisted Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, disapproved concerning the faith;
• 2 Timothy 3:8



• The Witch / Medium of Endor in 1 Samuel 28 that uses Necromancy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-pD1ivVxIY&feature=emb_title



Stand now With Your Enchantments
And The Multitude Of YOUR SORCERIES,
In which you have labored from your youth

Perhaps you will be able to profit,
Perhaps you will prevail.
You are wearied in the multitude of your counsels;
Let now The Astrologers, The Stargazers,
And The Monthly Prognosticators
Stand up and save you
From what shall come upon you.
Behold, They Shall Be As Stubble,
The Fire Shall Burn Them;
They shall not deliver themselves
From The Power Of The Flame;

It shall not be a coal to be warmed by,
Nor a fire to sit before!
• Isaiah 47:12-14



• Athanasius of Alexandria (296-373 A.D.)
(On The Incarnation Of The Word - 31)
"By The Sign Of The Cross All Magic Is Stopped, and All Witchcraft Brought To Nothing,


• Athanasius of Alexandria - Life of St Anthony - par 78 (296-373 A.D.)
But we by the mention of Christ crucified put all demons to flight, whom you fear as if they were gods. Where The Sign Of The Cross Is, Magic Is Weak And Witchcraft Has No Strength.




« Last Edit: November 25, 2019, 08:06:34 PM by Jude1:3 »

Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2019, 08:18:22 PM »
Saints Cyprian and Justina


Offline Brilko

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2019, 09:08:40 PM »
I couldn’t stand the couple of cuts that I heard off Kanye’s album. If people are willing to buy it, though, he deserves to get paid. If he wants to lighten any load on his conscience by dropping some $ on a poor cripple, I’d be willing to take some of that weight.

As far as demons go... The exorcists that I’ve heard, say that most of the people brought to them need psychiatrists rather than exorcists. Maybe evil is so widespread that the demons of today have gotten lazy.

Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2019, 09:15:07 PM »
Sorcery in the Old testament understanding was dabbling in the black arts.

While sorcery in the New testament understanding still includes this but was applied more to those who teach and preach a false gospel.

Offline IreneOlinyk

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2019, 10:04:29 PM »
It probably isn't Christianity but popular marketing.

Yeah you are so right: marketing to make the big bucks.

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2019, 10:12:30 AM »
Sorcerers.

Somebody took a couple novels way too seriously.

Do not be so quick to reject the Scriptures. Nor the vast and insidious reach of demon-work.
"Take heed, you who listen to me: Our misfortune is inevitable, we cannot escape it. If God allows scandals, it is that the elect shall be revealed. Let them be burned, let them be purified, let them who have been tried be made manifest among you."   - The Life of the Archpriest Avvakum by Himself

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2019, 10:58:27 AM »
Plenty of mental illness is a symptom of physical illness that needs a skilled pharmacist, a capable surgeon, or a combination of the two to sort out.

That said, I doubt either West or Osteen have any mental illness beyond over-inflated egos.
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Offline biro

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2019, 01:03:40 PM »
Art people are weird. I'm not into Kanye's music, but then again, art people are weird.
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Offline Hawkeye

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2019, 07:42:51 PM »
Plenty of mental illness is a symptom of physical illness that needs a skilled pharmacist, a capable surgeon, or a combination of the two to sort out.

That said, I doubt either West or Osteen have any mental illness beyond over-inflated egos.

Kanye West has been fairly open about his bipolar disorder. As far as I know, anyhow.
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Offline JTLoganville

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2019, 08:14:40 PM »
When referring to the teachings of Osteen, Hagin, Hinn, Copeland, and their ilk the word Gospel should be placed in quotation marks.

Or titled pseudo Gospel or faux Gospel...or keep it uncapitalized.

It is one of the many heresies I have been fighting for decades.

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2019, 09:00:52 PM »
Anti-Gospels, I think.
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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #20 on: November 27, 2019, 01:01:51 AM »
Anti-Gospels, I think.

Precisely.

Its proponents are Legion.

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2019, 06:46:44 AM »
"Demonic spirits are the cause of mental illness."

Just wow.

It's true.  Instead of relying on Christ to exorcise the demons, people turn to treatment, therapy, and medication.

In 2006, I went to my priest with a notebook full of things related to my mental illness.  I asked him for confession and he refused because my ex-girlfriend was with me (he probably couldn't do confessions at that time anyway).  After I broke up with my ex-girlfriend, I visited an Antiochian church and received the sacrament of confession.  Unfortunately, that priest was laicized and he went to the Old Calendarists.

No, Biro is right.  There are a number of Orthodox priests who work in mental health.  Only a small percentage of cases they encounter are actual demonic posession.

If your point however is that mental illness is driven by the passions, in some cases, that could be true, but in many other cases people are mentally ill due to neuropsychiatric problems; the central nervous system or the endocrine system can malfunction, causing psychological disturbances.

Council of Nicea:
Εθη ἀρχαῖα κρατείτω. 
Mores antiqui obtineant.
The ancient ways shall prevail.

The sentiment of Nicea in Greek and Latin, translated into English.

Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2019, 12:13:32 PM »
Human beings are holistic creatures meaning we are not flesh alone and not spirit alone but a combination of the two.

Modern medical science completely eliminates the spiritual aspect of humankind and so every problem is fleshly or carnal so the solution or cure must be fleshly or carnal.

i.e. every disease can only be cured by drugs only and the prayers of the faithful to cure disease is just hocus pocus of deluded Christians.


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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2019, 01:10:48 PM »
Human beings are holistic creatures meaning we are not flesh alone and not spirit alone but a combination of the two.

Modern medical science completely eliminates the spiritual aspect of humankind and so every problem is fleshly or carnal so the solution or cure must be fleshly or carnal.

i.e. every disease can only be cured by drugs only and the prayers of the faithful to cure disease is just hocus pocus of deluded Christians.

Hardly. Research repeatedly shows that patients who have religious/spiritual convictions, both of themselves and in their support network, have measurably better outcomes in treatment, even for purely physical ailments.

There are people within medicine, as within all sciences and out of them, who do deny any spiritual component in humankind, but the majority work in a 'horses, not zebras' paradigm - start with targeting the most probable cause of an ailment, and if that doesn't work, move to progressively more exotic ones. Sertraline before lithium, therapy before exorcism.
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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2019, 11:38:32 PM »
If you go back read my post slowly you might notice that I did not discount the use of medicine.

You can still medicate the deluded masses until pills shoot out of their ears,

and they drift slowly into that great good night without ever knowing the reality of God's Holy Spirit.

Offline biro

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2019, 11:50:39 PM »
I have struggled with mental health issues for many years. Lord have mercy.

Prayer is very good, but St. Luke was a doctor. For pity's sake. Pray *and* do something.
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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2019, 04:50:56 AM »
If you go back read my post slowly you might notice that I did not discount the use of medicine.

You can still medicate the deluded masses until pills shoot out of their ears,

and they drift slowly into that great good night without ever knowing the reality of God's Holy Spirit.

You discounted it then and you're discounting it now.
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Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2019, 08:17:03 PM »
I discounted over-medication and highlighted the benefits of spiritual medication.

Ever hear of the opioid crisis in the US?  Stupid Americans are dropping like flies.

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2019, 11:31:51 PM »
Aren't we off-topic?
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Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2019, 09:11:47 PM »
The Kardashians are Armenian so that would explain their connection to Orthodoxy as for Kanye and the prosperity gospel I don't have a problem with it.

The prosperity gospel is the protestant rejection of 2000 years of Catholic and Orthodox teaching. Where in order to be be spiritual you have to give up all your money, family and friends and join a monastery and spend the rest of your life on your knees.

The prosperity gospel with the mega church pastor in his G6, sipping champagne is a good example for the world.

Offline IreneOlinyk

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #30 on: December 01, 2019, 09:31:42 PM »
If you go back read my post slowly you might notice that I did not discount the use of medicine.

You can still medicate the deluded masses until pills shoot out of their ears,

and they drift slowly into that great good night without ever knowing the reality of God's Holy Spirit.

I would advise you to read this very good article here:
http://joyofallwhosorrow-indy.org/2019/09/11/christian-you-should-get-counseling/

The author, Eric Hyde is an Orthodox Christian who holds a BA in Pastoral Ministry, an MA in Theological and Historical Studies, and an MS in Counseling Psychology. He currently works as a psychotherapist for adolescents and adults.

Offline Malihah

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2019, 06:48:23 PM »
I would advise you to read this very good article here:
http://joyofallwhosorrow-indy.org/2019/09/11/christian-you-should-get-counseling/

The author, Eric Hyde is an Orthodox Christian who holds a BA in Pastoral Ministry, an MA in Theological and Historical Studies, and an MS in Counseling Psychology. He currently works as a psychotherapist for adolescents and adults.

This was a good article and whenever this subject comes up I always ask:

Is depression a physical malady to be cured by drugs and antidepressants?

or a spiritual malady to be cured by faith, prayer and confession?

God allows disease to afflict people so they will turn to him and when he chooses he can remove disease.

If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the LORD that healeth thee (Ex 15:26).


Offline Arachne

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2019, 06:52:27 PM »
Is depression a physical malady to be cured by drugs and antidepressants?

or a spiritual malady to be cured by faith, prayer and confession?

Yes.
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2019, 08:01:53 PM »
Is depression a physical malady to be cured by drugs and antidepressants?

or a spiritual malady to be cured by faith, prayer and confession?

Yes.

+1
OC.NET is full of temptations, but in temptations we are enforced, remember about the thread "Temptation in the Desert: Rachel Weisz and the Undoing of Mor Ephrem". OC.NET helps in becoming unpassionate.

Quote
Oh you Greeks, you are all dumb!

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Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #34 on: December 02, 2019, 08:43:39 PM »
You guys might enjoy this Orthodox Talk by Priestmonk Kosmas about (The Healing of Physical, Mental and Spiritual Sicknesses )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=-2kSr0xKhmk&feature=emb_title

Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #35 on: December 03, 2019, 10:27:00 PM »
A few more points :

There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, Anyone Who Practices Divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or A Sorcerer a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead,
• Deuteronomy 18:10-11


• St. Ephraim the Syrian (306-373 A.D):
"Regard Not Spells and Divinations, for that is communion with Satan."


• St. Cyril of Jerusalem (313-386 A.D.):
"Also give heed neither to observations of the stars nor auguries, nor omens, nor to the fabulous Divinations of the Greeks. Witchcraft, and Enchantment, and The Wicked Practices of Necromancy, admit not even to a hearing."


• St. Cyril of Jerusalem (313-386 A.D.) :
"The watching of birds, Divination, omens, or amulets, or charms written on leaves, Sorceries, or Other Evil Arts, And All Such Things, are services of the devil; Therefore Shun Them."


• Canon 36 of The Council of Laodicea (363–364 A.D.) states:
"That members of the Sacerdocy and Clerics Must Not Be Magicians Or Enchanters, or mathematicians (i.e., numerologists), or astrologers, or make what are called amulets, which are shackles for their souls; accordingly, we have bidden those wearing these things to be thrown out of the Church."
 http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3806.htm



• St. Basil's canon 65 (330-379 A.D.) states:
"As for Anyone Practicing Incantation Or Sorcery, he shall be allotted the time of A Murderer, it being proportioned to him in such a manner as though he had convicted himself of each sin for a year."


• St. Basil's canon 72 (330-379 A.D.) states:
"Anyone who places himself in the hands of fortune-tellers or any other such persons professing to foresee future events or to discover the whereabouts of lost property, of persons in hiding, etc., he shall be sentenced to the same penalty as is prescribed for murderers and shall do the same length of time and the same penances."


• Canon 24 of The Council of Ancyra (314 A.D.) states:
"As for those who are Practicing Divination and continuing the customs of the heathen, and who are introducing persons into their homes with a view to Discovering Sorceries, or even with a view to purification, let them fall under the Canon of five years in accordance with the fixed degrees; three years of kneeling, and two years of prayer, without oblation."
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3802.htm
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 10:38:40 PM by Jude1:3 »

Offline Jude1:3

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #36 on: December 03, 2019, 10:40:33 PM »
edit
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 10:40:51 PM by Jude1:3 »

Offline SolEX01

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Re: How Kanye West put Joel Osteen's Prosperity Gospel under Spotlight
« Reply #37 on: December 03, 2019, 10:51:18 PM »
I don't have my Greek coffee grounds read even though my family and friends jokingly read them.