Author Topic: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?  (Read 2045 times)

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Offline MBZ

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Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« on: November 28, 2005, 09:39:14 AM »
Hi all!

I know that Islam teaches that we Jews & Christians have either outright falsified, or badly garbled, parts of the Tanakh (what we call what Christians call the "Old Testament") and the Gospels. This isn't new to me. However, I was still interested to see the extent to which some Muslims will go to deny/dispute what is in the Tanakh and the Gospels and what we Jews and Christians accept as a given. This http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/650192.html (or http://tinyurl.com/d9wa5) was in last Friday's Ha'aretz newspaper.

Comments?

Be well!

MBZ
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2005, 10:05:18 AM »
Hi MBZ,

I skimmed the article to get a good idea of it but don't have time to read it completely now. What struck me is how similar fundamentalists of all religions can be when it comes to archeaology. From young-earth creationism to Islamists trying to deny Jewish history, to Mormons creating fanciful pre-Columbian civilizations in America.ÂÂ  What is quite ironic is that in India, where Islam is quite moderate and respectable (I much enjoyed being in Muslim company there), the Hindus are doing the same thing in saying that many venerable (from an architectural and historical pov in my book) Muslim mosques are actually built on the site of Hindu temples.ÂÂ  In 1992, they destroyed the Mosque in Ayodhya saying it was on the birthplace of Ram; if you go to Vrindavan, the alleged birthplace of Krishna, the fanatical RSS (no, it's not just a feed for computers ;)) is always clamoring to get the mosque there destroyed. In fact, they have guards armned with machine guns there and you can't take pictures.ÂÂ  (related article: http://www.geocities.com/indiafas/Hindu/ram_myth.htm

There's an interesting parallel Hindu tract, which even claims the Vatican is built on the site of a Hindu god's temple!! (wish I could find the link for that; saw it once).

Anastasios
« Last Edit: November 28, 2005, 11:08:06 AM by Anastasios »
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2005, 10:37:39 AM »
What struck me is how similar fundamentalists of all religions can be when it comes to archeaology.

Excellent observation. If you want to feed people tripe, you can't let them know what tripe actually is.
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Online Justin Kissel

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2005, 11:21:29 AM »
I just think that some people are willing to allow logical inconsistencies in their belief system, while other people go to extreme lengths to stamp out any appearance of inconsistency. Whether it be Samaritans, Muslims, or Orthodox Christians, just about everyone are willing to swallow a lot of tripe if it means they also get a mouthful of sweet-tasting, life-sustaining food. Fundamentalists are just better at being more consistent, though they are often further from the truth as a result of their pursuit of consistency. On the other hand, "normal" people swallow a lot of tripe as well (it's just not usually as obvious), so they shouldn't throw stones. ;)

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2005, 04:38:59 PM »
True, but I guess the difference is that in the case of someone who isn't a fundamentalist, there is some tripe they just wont eat- no matter who tries to feed it to them. And the tripe they do eat has to be well cooked and heavy on the sauce so as not to be immediately recognisable as tripe;)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2005, 05:03:29 PM by ozgeorge »
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2005, 12:50:19 PM »
Fascinating, yet depressing to read this story.  Thank you for the link, MBZ

I suppose that the Romans destroying Jerusalem (Titus) was just because they had nothing else to do, and building Aelia Capitolina while forbidding Jews to go there, is a mere coincidence. Rather then that the city and temple were regarded as trouble to the Empire. 

Sigh.
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2005, 12:53:11 PM »
Whether it be Samaritans, Muslims, or Orthodox Christians, just about everyone are willing to swallow a lot of tripe if it means they also get a mouthful of sweet-tasting, life-sustaining food.

Ah, but if one gets lots of 'tripe' how does one distinguish what is real "life-sustaining" food?ÂÂ  How does one know if it is there at all?ÂÂ  

I think this illustration needs some work.  ÃƒÆ’‚ ;)

If nothing else, there are people who do like things like Tripes a la mode de Caen after all, or chittlins.

Ebor
« Last Edit: December 02, 2005, 12:53:34 PM by Ebor »
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2005, 01:29:30 PM »
Also, there are "logical inconsistances" and then there are out-right fabrications and lies.  To say that something is true that isn't (like there was no temple) is a Lie.

Ebor
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Offline MBZ

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Re: Did the Temple in Jerusalem exist or not?
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2005, 09:24:14 AM »
Hi all!

Quote
Fascinating, yet depressing to read this story.  Thank you for the link, MBZ

I suppose that the Romans destroying Jerusalem (Titus) was just because they had nothing else to do, and building Aelia Capitolina while forbidding Jews to go there, is a mere coincidence. Rather then that the city and temple were regarded as trouble to the Empire.

Very depressing (but you're welcome anyway! :) ).

And the Bar Kokhba revolt (http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/revolt1.html & http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/biography/Kokhba.html) took place because we & the Romans were bored.

And Emperor Julian (http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=716&letter=J&search=Julian) promised to rebuild a building that never existed.

Making peace with such people is going to be...a challenge.  Deny the Temple & you deny our rights in/to Jerusalem; heck, you deny us.

Be well!

MBZ
"Peace, peace to him that is far off and to him that is near." [Isaiah 57:19]

"Gather your wits and hold on fast..." [The Who]

"Lose your dreams and you could lose your mind." [The Rolling Stones]

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