Author Topic: Who are the Old Believers?  (Read 2135 times)

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Offline Matthew777

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Who are the Old Believers?
« on: November 02, 2005, 09:38:26 PM »
I found this interesting article on Wikipedia:

The Old Believers (Russian: старове́ры or старообря́дцы) are a schismatic group of the Russian Orthodox Church.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_believers

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Offline choirfiend

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2005, 10:50:50 PM »
yup. We knew.
Qui cantat, bis orat

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2005, 10:51:51 PM »
But seriously, who the heck are they?

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Online Justin Kissel

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2005, 11:12:41 PM »
I don't think that there's much to add.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 11:13:07 PM by Asteriktos »

Offline Beavis

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2005, 02:55:43 AM »
I'll tell you.....there where I'd like to be in about 2 years.
"Every entity is what it loves"----Vladimir Solovyov

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2005, 03:30:20 AM »
I'll tell you.....there where I'd like to be in about 2 years.

You'd like to be a schismatic?

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline Beavis

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2005, 03:32:01 AM »
Maybe it's the majority, rather than the minority, who are the schismatics.
"Every entity is what it loves"----Vladimir Solovyov

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2005, 03:35:41 AM »
Maybe it's the majority, rather than the minority, who are the schismatics.

Woah, that's uncool.   ???

Peace.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 03:36:13 AM by Matthew777 »
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline Beavis

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2005, 03:38:58 AM »
When people start saying that Nestorius is "okay" (cuz obviously, being a "nice guy" makes one Orthodox), then it's time to start re-thinking ecclesiology.
"Every entity is what it loves"----Vladimir Solovyov

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2005, 03:43:57 AM »
I don't like all this talk of schismatics in the first place. I'm a non-Chalcedonian and there is nothing of the Oriental Orthodox Churches that is "unOrthodox".

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline Beavis

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2005, 03:46:31 AM »
Well, there is enough evidence that teh Christology of the OO Church is Orthodox (though the question of their being schismatic still remains).ÂÂ  But Nestorius is a whole new can of worms......
« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 03:46:49 AM by Beavis »
"Every entity is what it loves"----Vladimir Solovyov

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2005, 03:57:57 AM »
The Assyrian Church of the East, as far as I know, is no longer Nestorian.

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Offline Beavis

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2005, 04:00:30 AM »
Good.  Then why haven't we re-united already? ???
"Every entity is what it loves"----Vladimir Solovyov

Offline Matthew777

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2005, 04:01:44 AM »
Haven't we?

Peace.
He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how. - Friedrich Nietzsche
www.aramaicpeshitta.com
http://www.mechon-mamre.org/e/et/et0.htm

Offline choirfiend

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2005, 07:35:04 AM »
Couldnt Nestorius have been a really nice heretic? I mean, dont we all know really nice people in our lives who believe heretical things?

In the past, when there was a problem either politically or theologically with an erroneous practice in the Church, those who opposed it might have been in minority. They also never, ever LEFT the Church in protest, but worked and prayed within her gates. And the Truth will prevail; it always has and it always will. Those who leave the Church are removing themselves from the Body and allowing the gates of Hell to prevail against them. God help schismatics.
Qui cantat, bis orat

Offline germanus

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2005, 04:25:30 PM »
Amen choirfiend. We must not allow our lack of knowledge to conflict with God's will for the church. We are ignorant and retched and the Holy Fathers knew much more than us. Let us aspire in constant struggle and humility against ourselves when we find ourselves ignorant of certain knowlege, rather than making a fuss at everything that we don't agree with.
Heaven is full of people who do not deserve to be there and oddly absent of those who think they do.

Offline germanus

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Re: Who are the Old Believers?
« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2005, 04:27:32 PM »
Although I have heard that some of the Old Believers go to other churches as well. I don't think they typically can take communion with us though. Hence the term Schizmatic.
Heaven is full of people who do not deserve to be there and oddly absent of those who think they do.