Author Topic: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd  (Read 3980 times)

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Offline Alxandra

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #90 on: February 10, 2019, 03:46:26 AM »
I hope and pray we can think for ourselves for this issue, it doesn't have to be one extreme or the other. Vaccines are life saving, but they are not healthy and have ethical issues. With this in mind, we only give our babies the important ones, not every one they market like the flu vaccine... The important ones are thank God available for those in the world that are vulnerable, like sick children, elderly, pregnant women and more. However, if the Church were to come out and verify the use of aborted children in the making of vaccines and advise us not to get them, we would absolutely stop. The soul is more important than the body of course and we will not lose our soul for the sake of preserving the body.

By the way, the strongest way to give your child life long immunity is through breastfeeding...which oddly enough has been reduced by very influential formula companies and instead we are replacing natural immunity with unnecessary vaccines and medications...

Vaccines are healthy.

Medicine is necessary.

They do not use aborted children in vaccines.

The Church should say that people should not believe uneducated garbage on the Internet.

St. Luke and St. Pantaleimon were doctors. They did not only pray, they treated people.

If God let them do that, God wants us to as well.

Neither God nor Ss Luke and Panteleimon used vaccines.

I do not mean in any way that medications and such are not good, they are very blessed when needed. It's important however to use discretion and give everything a bit of second thought.  :) Some things in the medical field are a result of business, not our best interest, and we must not forget that. Some examples are: the over prescribing of opiates in the states, pushing formula in hospitals, doctors giving unnecessary inductions and C sections in order to plan their schedules (the WHO recently spoke out against this),  and much more. The vaccination industry is very much involved in business as well, so I would just use discretion in getting ones you feel are well researched and very important for your children and those around you. Also, as I mentioned before, let us not turn a blind eye to the possible connections with aborted children. In that case it is absolutely unacceptable to be involved with them as Orthodox Christians.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #91 on: February 10, 2019, 07:53:46 AM »
Now, in my infancy I had a severe fever due to the Pertussis vaccine from the DPT series, which required a trip to the ER, but fortunately there was no damage (unless per chance aforesaid virus resulted in my becoming a bit eccentric, but I enjoy being eccentric).  So I never contracted whooping cough, and as I see it the worst thing that might stem from vaccinations is, if poorly administered, some of them leave a scar at the injection site (every Ghanaian adult I’ve met has a small dent on their arm from the vaccine, which looks kind of like the scar from a wasp sting, except its larger and never goes away; in the US I believe that particular injection is given in the mouth to avoid external scarring, whereas in Ghana they probably do it on the arm so the authorities can quickly visually ascertain whether or not a child has been accident).

Had chickenpox vaccine been available, I would have avoided an unpleasant experience when I was 3-4 years old; fortunately my mother carefully administered the calomine lotion and I have no scarring at all that I am aware of, which is good, but as Arachne pointed out I face Shingles later in life as a possible disease, and that’s obviously not a prospect I relish.

So as I see it Arachne the worst thing that might happen is your child winds up becoming a dapper and eccentric Anglophile intellectual like myself with a tendency towards condescension and referring to people as “Old chap.”  In which case I should be happy to serve as his Godfather to ensure a smooth integration into society.  :P

I'm glad I caught autism instead.
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Offline Arachne

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #92 on: February 10, 2019, 08:50:55 AM »
By the way, "there is no benefit to a breastfed child beyond 6 months"? Forgive me, but that is absolutely not true and no research has ever shown that :) The benefits to a child from breastfeeding are life-long in terms of strengthened immunity, brain function, gut health, mental health and more. If I wasn't on my phone I would link the countless research that undoubtedly shows this. Of course it does, breastmilk is what a baby was meant to eat, and no formula can copy the nutrients in it. Thank God formula is available for those who need it, but it has only become the majority norm through intense marketing and lack of knowledge and support given to new mothers. A formula created by Nestle should not be the norm over the complex and extremely nutritious milk from ones mother, that was created specifically for that baby.

Improved gut health, mental health etc are all well and good, but they don't help much with transmissible diseases. Plenty of exclusively breastfed infants have died of measles, scarlet fever and such kiddie diseases throughout history. (As late as 2000, there were 545,000 deaths from measles worldwide; by 2017 we were down to 109,000, which is still shameful.) As soon as breastfeeding stops, the antibodies disappear very quickly, and unless the child has already been vaccinated, they are defenceless.

As an aside, all this is valid only in the case the mother has herself been vaccinated or exposed to this or that disease. She cannot transmit any immunity she doesn't have. With more unvaccinated people old enough to have children of their own, this is going to be a real problem soon.
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Offline Alxandra

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #93 on: February 10, 2019, 03:02:03 PM »
By the way, "there is no benefit to a breastfed child beyond 6 months"? Forgive me, but that is absolutely not true and no research has ever shown that :) The benefits to a child from breastfeeding are life-long in terms of strengthened immunity, brain function, gut health, mental health and more. If I wasn't on my phone I would link the countless research that undoubtedly shows this. Of course it does, breastmilk is what a baby was meant to eat, and no formula can copy the nutrients in it. Thank God formula is available for those who need it, but it has only become the majority norm through intense marketing and lack of knowledge and support given to new mothers. A formula created by Nestle should not be the norm over the complex and extremely nutritious milk from ones mother, that was created specifically for that baby.

Improved gut health, mental health etc are all well and good, but they don't help much with transmissible diseases. Plenty of exclusively breastfed infants have died of measles, scarlet fever and such kiddie diseases throughout history. (As late as 2000, there were 545,000 deaths from measles worldwide; by 2017 we were down to 109,000, which is still shameful.) As soon as breastfeeding stops, the antibodies disappear very quickly, and unless the child has already been vaccinated, they are defenceless.

As an aside, all this is valid only in the case the mother has herself been vaccinated or exposed to this or that disease. She cannot transmit any immunity she doesn't have. With more unvaccinated people old enough to have children of their own, this is going to be a real problem soon.

Yes, I don't deny that! :) Vaccines have done a great job of eradicating those dangerous childhood diseases.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #94 on: February 11, 2019, 06:40:13 PM »
Some vaccinations are linked to down syndrome and people are hesitant to immune there children because of it.

Acclaimed Journalist Sheryl Atkinson has a good short 10 minute video she recently released.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1XUM2gvfbW8

Has she acquired any medical credentials yet?

Shes a journalist, you'd know that if you'd click on the link

In other words, no.

What does that line of questioning mean anyway? That a journalist cant discuss vaccines because she isnt a doctor?


Offline Arachne

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #95 on: February 11, 2019, 07:08:27 PM »
Some vaccinations are linked to down syndrome and people are hesitant to immune there children because of it.

Acclaimed Journalist Sheryl Atkinson has a good short 10 minute video she recently released.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1XUM2gvfbW8

Has she acquired any medical credentials yet?

Shes a journalist, you'd know that if you'd click on the link

In other words, no.

What does that line of questioning mean anyway? That a journalist cant discuss vaccines because she isnt a doctor?

Is that what passes for discussion these days?
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Offline LBK

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #96 on: February 11, 2019, 07:21:23 PM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #97 on: February 11, 2019, 07:41:57 PM »
I love dogs more than most children.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #98 on: February 11, 2019, 09:10:15 PM »
Some vaccinations are linked to down syndrome and people are hesitant to immune there children because of it.

Acclaimed Journalist Sheryl Atkinson has a good short 10 minute video she recently released.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1XUM2gvfbW8

Has she acquired any medical credentials yet?

Shes a journalist, you'd know that if you'd click on the link

In other words, no.

What does that line of questioning mean anyway? That a journalist cant discuss vaccines because she isnt a doctor?

Is that what passes for discussion these days?

So make a video that debunks what she exposes then. Since you are so smart on the subject, what does she say that's wrong? Or did you just not like the way her show is layed out (just like 60minutes, dateline, other investigation shows)

Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #99 on: February 11, 2019, 09:18:10 PM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?


Offline Rhinosaur

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #100 on: February 11, 2019, 09:47:15 PM »

Offline Arachne

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #101 on: February 12, 2019, 04:23:15 AM »
Some vaccinations are linked to down syndrome and people are hesitant to immune there children because of it.

Acclaimed Journalist Sheryl Atkinson has a good short 10 minute video she recently released.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1XUM2gvfbW8

Has she acquired any medical credentials yet?

Shes a journalist, you'd know that if you'd click on the link

In other words, no.

What does that line of questioning mean anyway? That a journalist cant discuss vaccines because she isnt a doctor?

Is that what passes for discussion these days?

So make a video that debunks what she exposes then. Since you are so smart on the subject, what does she say that's wrong? Or did you just not like the way her show is layed out (just like 60minutes, dateline, other investigation shows)

LOL - I'm not paid to debate people too in love with their own voices to learn anything over decades of muckraking. But hey, whatever, enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urZLTobAfJc
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Offline Arachne

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #102 on: February 12, 2019, 04:24:21 AM »


 ;D The collective noun for antivaxxers is 'a murder of Karens'.
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

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Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #103 on: February 12, 2019, 05:03:42 AM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?

The government does not do any of those things.
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Offline Alpha60

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #104 on: February 12, 2019, 07:09:51 AM »
I love dogs more than most children.

Then alas I feel rather sorry for you old chap.
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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #105 on: February 12, 2019, 07:12:44 AM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?

The government does not do any of those things.

That said, mandatory flu shots for people without egg or poultry allergies sounds like a good idea.
“Moreover, Carthage must be destroyed.”
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- The computer Alpha 60, from the film Alphaville.

Offline hecma925

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #106 on: February 12, 2019, 08:19:33 AM »
I love dogs more than most children.

Then alas I feel rather sorry for you old chap.

It's your prerogative to feel sorry.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #107 on: February 12, 2019, 12:09:15 PM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?

The government does not do any of those things.

New york just passed abortion up to the due date.
The government allows assisted suicide.
Tuskegee syphilis experiment.


Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #108 on: February 12, 2019, 12:20:08 PM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?

The government does not do any of those things.

That said, mandatory flu shots for people without egg or poultry allergies sounds like a good idea.

https://www.dmlawfirm.com/flu-vaccine-deaths-mount/

https://www.nationalnursesunited.org/press/largest-national-nurses-union-opposes-mandatory-flu-vaccination-condition-employment

Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #109 on: February 12, 2019, 12:31:50 PM »
We seem to have another fella on here who unquestionably believes anything he sees on You Tube.

The last such person we had was Yeshuaisiam.

You know how that turned out.
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works


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Offline Alpha60

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #110 on: February 12, 2019, 12:48:26 PM »
It beggars belief that in some states, schools don't make kids get vaccinations so it's safe for other kids. But God forbid if there's a peanut allergy in the building. No more peanut butter and jelly for anyone, ever! If parents aren't allowed to endanger one group of kids, why is it ok to endanger another?

Also, in many states, counties and cities, rabies vaccinations are mandatory for pets, with fines for non-compliance.  Most boarding kennels and pet day care facilities insist on certain vaccinations for a pet to be boarded or be in pet day care. It is incomprehensible that laws and regulations for the vaccination of pets are more strict than those for vaccination of children.

It boggles the mind that people want the government to be able to make every decision.
Personally i dont want an institution that kills babies, allows eugenics for the elderly, or has a track record for human atrocities, having any choice in my childs health.

Whats next, Demanding anyone who doesnt get the flu shot be arrested?

The government does not do any of those things.

That said, mandatory flu shots for people without egg or poultry allergies sounds like a good idea.

https://www.dmlawfirm.com/flu-vaccine-deaths-mount/

https://www.nationalnursesunited.org/press/largest-national-nurses-union-opposes-mandatory-flu-vaccination-condition-employment

A law firm and a labor union are not credible sources of information.  At any rate, we do know the flu shot can have adverse effects, which is why I proposed exemptions for people with allergies.  Also in some years there is a shortage of the vaccine and in those years it should be reserved for the vulnerable.

My father always got a flu shot and never got the flu; I had always been skeptical of the flu shot, but a severe case of Aussie Flu last year that left me incapacitated for six months changed my mind.
“Moreover, Carthage must be destroyed.”
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #111 on: February 12, 2019, 03:01:42 PM »
“My body, my choice.”

Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #112 on: February 12, 2019, 03:15:27 PM »
Wrong.

If you don't get the vaccine, thousands of people around you will die.
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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #113 on: February 12, 2019, 04:43:15 PM »
Wrong.

“My body, someone else’s choice.”  Got it.

Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #114 on: February 12, 2019, 05:00:57 PM »
We seem to have another fella on here who unquestionably believes anything he sees on You Tube.

The last such person we had was Yeshuaisiam.

You know how that turned out.

Curious if you're pro choice?
I ask because i see alot of pro choice people saying, "The government cant tell women what to do with their bodies", and then in the next breath they say, "We should force people to vaccinate".
Which is clearly a conflict, imo that is.

So far, ive posted a link to a youtube video Sheryl Attkisson, who is a renowned Journalist. She reports on all sorts of topics, look up her channel if you want.
Her bio reads:
"Attkisson is an Emmy award winning investigative journalist, host of Sinclair’s Sunday morning news program “Full Measure,” and author of the New York Times bestsellers: “The Smear” and Stonewalled.”

She was a correspondent for CBS News from 1993-2014. Before joining CBS, Attkisson was an anchor and correspondent for CNN (1990-1993). From 1996-2001, in addition to her CBS News duties, Attkisson hosted a half-hour weekly medical news magazine on PBS entitled “HealthWeek.”

Prior to working on the national news, Attkisson was a reporter, anchor and/or producer at WTVT Tampa (1986-1990), WBNS Columbus, Ohio (1985-1986) and WTVX Ft. Pierce (1982-1985)"

So lik i told the other person, if you can prove what she said was false, then by all means do so. Attacking her because i posted a youtube clip of her show, shows that you cant counter whats said in it.
The old saying, "If ya cant prove someone wrong, attack their character" applies here

Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #115 on: February 12, 2019, 05:01:19 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.
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Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #116 on: February 12, 2019, 05:02:32 PM »
And let's all note how Mor sailed right by my statement that thousands of people around you will die, if you don't get vaccinated.

It's true.

But he doesn't care, because he wants his choice.

Fine.

Choose to get measles.

Lucky you don't have children.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #117 on: February 12, 2019, 05:02:47 PM »
Wrong.

If you don't get the vaccine, thousands of people around you will die.

Then why arent you dead yet?

Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #118 on: February 12, 2019, 05:03:46 PM »
Rubric is anti-science, and believes in hilarious conspiracy theories.

They should make an anti-science section of the board. Go laugh at yourselves.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #119 on: February 12, 2019, 05:09:10 PM »
And let's all note how Mor sailed right by my statement that thousands of people around you will die, if you don't get vaccinated.

It's true.

But he doesn't care, because he wants his choice.

Fine.

Choose to get measles.

Lucky you don't have children.

Phillipines measles outbreak.

Infant mortality rate: total: 21.4 deaths/1,000 live births
male: 24.3 deaths/1,000 live births
female: 18.3 deaths/1,000 live births (2017 est.)

https://www.indexmundi.com/philippines/infant_mortality_rate.html


As of 26 January there have been 1,813 measles cases and 26 deaths, according to the Department of Health Epidemiology Bureau. That is a 74% increase from 2018.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-47153817


Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #120 on: February 12, 2019, 05:09:24 PM »
And let's all note how Mor sailed right by my statement that thousands of people around you will die, if you don't get vaccinated.

It's true.

But he doesn't care, because he wants his choice.

Fine.

Choose to get measles.

LOL.  I was vaccinated and have no opposition to vaccination, so try again.

Quote
Lucky you don't have children.

Yeah, my friends don’t have to hear me talk about their pooping all day every day for years.


Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #121 on: February 12, 2019, 05:10:58 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

No, I think that Mor and Nigel raise a good point here. If the government can force people to do one thing (vaccinate) for an alleged greater good, then it seems like forcing someone to not get an abortion for an alleged greater good is also an option on the table.

I believe in mandatory vaccination for the same reasons that you do. So it would seem that the logic of my own highly qualified pro-choice leanings are also suspect, I admit it. It's still something that I'm trying to work through and pray about.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #122 on: February 12, 2019, 05:12:00 PM »
Rubric is anti-science, and believes in hilarious conspiracy theories.

They should make an anti-science section of the board. Go laugh at yourselves.

So thats a yes on pro choice?



Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #123 on: February 12, 2019, 05:24:00 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #124 on: February 12, 2019, 05:25:24 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

It’s easier to care about thousands of people than to care about one.

Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #125 on: February 12, 2019, 05:27:29 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

Just so I don't appear to be picking on biro, I'll also say that I think that you're being inconsistent with your own position here.

If refusing to vaccinate causes deaths, which seems to be pretty well in evidence, then people shouldn't have a choice in the matter at the very least by the same measure that they aren't given a choice in whether or not they're allowed to abort.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 05:31:14 PM by Volnutt »
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #126 on: February 12, 2019, 05:29:36 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

It’s easier to care about thousands of people than to care about one.

Thousands of unvaxxinated kids vs. one aborted fetus and/or zygote and/or blastocyst and/or baby; or thousands of aborted babies vs. one unvaxxinated child? It can be looked at either way.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #127 on: February 12, 2019, 05:30:57 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

No, I think that Mor and Nigel raise a good point here. If the government can force people to do one thing (vaccinate) for an alleged greater good, then it seems like forcing someone to not get an abortion for an alleged greater good is also an option on the table.

I believe in mandatory vaccination for the same reasons that you do. So it would seem that the logic of my own highly qualified pro-choice leanings are also suspect, I admit it. It's still something that I'm trying to work through and pray about.

Wow, i never thought id see someone admit the hypocrisy.

Me and you and have opposing views on abortion & homosexuality, but i think we can agree that the goobermit having power to force us to vaccinate is not a good thing. Nor is their power to spy, or harass people for their free speech.

I remember when Obama passed executive orders that republicans hated. I said, "The president shouldnt have such powers", and the democrats loved it. Well time passed and Trump has that power, and the Democrats scream about it.
I dont think anyone should have that power, but my point is this, politics change, and in the future a regime might force us to get vaccines that people who WANT mandatory vaccines today, will not want then.


Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #128 on: February 12, 2019, 05:35:52 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

Just so I don't appear to be picking on biro, I'll also say that I think that you're being inconsistent with your own position here.

If refusing to vaccinate causes deaths, which seems to be pretty well in evidence, then people shouldn't have a choice in the matter at the very least by the same measure that they aren't given a choice in whether or not they're allowed to abort.

No, abortion is murder.
Me being unvaccinated doesnt cause you to drop dead if we shake hands, do you even know the statistics on unvaccinated people inadvertently killing someone is?

Abortion isnt a "chance" at getting a disease, its a 100% death sentence.
And besides that, a baby isnt the same person as the mother, therefore she shouldnt have the choice to kill him/her.

Numberofabortions.com

1,500,000,000 dead babies in less than a century. More than all wars combined.

How many people have died because of the unvaccinated? My guess is under 1,000,000.
No comparrison

Offline biro

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #129 on: February 12, 2019, 05:38:05 PM »
And this thread has mostly turned into a conversation between two anti-science people.

 :o
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #130 on: February 12, 2019, 05:39:21 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

No, I think that Mor and Nigel raise a good point here. If the government can force people to do one thing (vaccinate) for an alleged greater good, then it seems like forcing someone to not get an abortion for an alleged greater good is also an option on the table.

I believe in mandatory vaccination for the same reasons that you do. So it would seem that the logic of my own highly qualified pro-choice leanings are also suspect, I admit it. It's still something that I'm trying to work through and pray about.

Wow, i never thought id see someone admit the hypocrisy.

Me and you and have opposing views on abortion & homosexuality, but i think we can agree that the goobermit having power to force us to vaccinate is not a good thing. Nor is their power to spy, or harass people for their free speech.

I remember when Obama passed executive orders that republicans hated. I said, "The president shouldnt have such powers", and the democrats loved it. Well time passed and Trump has that power, and the Democrats scream about it.
I dont think anyone should have that power, but my point is this, politics change, and in the future a regime might force us to get vaccines that people who WANT mandatory vaccines today, will not want then.

No, I generally favor mandatory vaxxing- at least to the same extent as I favor policing, prison, and the draft for a big enough just war.

All of them are unfortunate abridgments of an individual's bodily autonomy that are in theory open to reexamination, but at the moment would appear from all evidence to be necessities. Surveilling somebody who has done nothing but speak a certain way, on the other hand, doesn't have that clear and present danger element to it.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 05:40:09 PM by Volnutt »
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #131 on: February 12, 2019, 05:51:58 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

Just so I don't appear to be picking on biro, I'll also say that I think that you're being inconsistent with your own position here.

If refusing to vaccinate causes deaths, which seems to be pretty well in evidence, then people shouldn't have a choice in the matter at the very least by the same measure that they aren't given a choice in whether or not they're allowed to abort.

No, abortion is murder.
Me being unvaccinated doesnt cause you to drop dead if we shake hands, do you even know the statistics on unvaccinated people inadvertently killing someone is?

It wouldn't cause me to drop dead because I'm vaccinated. Babies, the elderly, those whose bodies can't tolerate vaccines, and your own children- maybe not so much.

Abortion isnt a "chance" at getting a disease, its a 100% death sentence.
And besides that, a baby isnt the same person as the mother, therefore she shouldnt have the choice to kill him/her.

Numberofabortions.com

1,500,000,000 dead babies in less than a century. More than all wars combined.

How many people have died because of the unvaccinated? My guess is under 1,000,000.
No comparrison

The prisoner isn't the same person as the judge or the cop, and yet we take his life away (directly or indirectly) for a greater good. Life is full of gut-wrenching trade-offs.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Volnutt

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #132 on: February 12, 2019, 05:53:05 PM »
And this thread has mostly turned into a conversation between two anti-science people.

 :o

Moi? Pourquoi?


Translation: Me? Why?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 05:59:08 PM by Volnutt »
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #133 on: February 12, 2019, 06:28:17 PM »
And this thread has mostly turned into a conversation between two anti-science people.

 :o

You arent conversing, you simply side step questions you dont like then demand we listen to you.
If anyone isnt conversing, ITS YOU.

Still waiting on your abortion stance.
Or you just gonna not answer? Funny how you attack other peoples beliefs, but when questioned about yours you dont answer.
I assume you are pro murder (pro choice) then.

So let me say something to you.
"Biro is anti-baby, and believes in killing babies is morally ok.

They should make an anti-baby section of the board. Go laugh at yourselves."


Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: One for the anti-vaxxer crowd
« Reply #134 on: February 12, 2019, 06:30:21 PM »
Yeah, because let's not try to govern treatable diseases, and let's let everybody catch polio again, and let's let everybody's children die in iron lungs.

Abortion is not communicable.

Measles, mumps, and rubella, as well as many other diseases, are.

You can be mandated to buy car insurance.

We should mandate vaccinations.

The only doctor on this board, Mina, doesn't come around anymore, which is why you get away with your dangerous, smarmy garbage.

Kids are already dying from outbreaks of very old diseases.

They don't have to.

I find it funny how people like you dont see the irony in forcing people to be vaccinated. When you scream and yell that its a womens right to kill her baby, and we cant tell her what to do with HER body.

If people want to get vaccinated, thats their choice.

You are right abortions arent communicable, but it is murder. And if you cant see that a human being in a mothers stomach is a baby, you have no moral ground to stand on.

Just so I don't appear to be picking on biro, I'll also say that I think that you're being inconsistent with your own position here.

If refusing to vaccinate causes deaths, which seems to be pretty well in evidence, then people shouldn't have a choice in the matter at the very least by the same measure that they aren't given a choice in whether or not they're allowed to abort.

No, abortion is murder.
Me being unvaccinated doesnt cause you to drop dead if we shake hands, do you even know the statistics on unvaccinated people inadvertently killing someone is?

It wouldn't cause me to drop dead because I'm vaccinated. Babies, the elderly, those whose bodies can't tolerate vaccines, and your own children- maybe not so much.

Abortion isnt a "chance" at getting a disease, its a 100% death sentence.
And besides that, a baby isnt the same person as the mother, therefore she shouldnt have the choice to kill him/her.

Numberofabortions.com

1,500,000,000 dead babies in less than a century. More than all wars combined.

How many people have died because of the unvaccinated? My guess is under 1,000,000.
No comparrison

The prisoner isn't the same person as the judge or the cop, and yet we take his life away (directly or indirectly) for a greater good. Life is full of gut-wrenching trade-offs.

Like i said, we are at complete opposites on abortion, so no sense in debating it here. Since we've had this debate on several occasions.