Author Topic: Why do you believe in God?  (Read 1133 times)

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Offline LivenotoneviL

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Why do you believe in God?
« on: March 19, 2018, 01:45:26 AM »
Question.
"Вознеслся еси во славе, Христе Боже наш, радость сотворивый учеником, обетованием Свтаго Духа, извещенным им бывшим благословением, яко Ты еси Сын Божий, Избавитель мира."

May God one day unite me with the Holy Orthodox Catholic Church. And may God forgive me for my consistent sins of the flesh and any blasphemous and carnal desire, as well as forgive me whenever I act prideful, against the desire of my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, to be a Temple of the Holy Spirit.

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2018, 01:59:28 AM »
I guess the most straightforward way of explaining it is: I used to not believe because I just didn't, but nowadays my gut says nah go ahead, so now I do believe. I wanted to fully believe for a long time, and the process kinda sucked at times, so it's nice to have arrived completely. There's also a lot of personal things that go along with believing which are really nice but have nothing to do with whether God actually exists, like having less anxiety, and also when I'm non-religious I can't escape the conclusion that we humans are horrible at our core and that nothing will change about that any time soon.

Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2018, 02:17:19 AM »
If by "believe" you mean give mental assent to His "existence," then I can say I've always believed and everything I've learned or experienced has fit well together built on that, giving me no reason to doubt. And as an outside observer of "unbelieving" worldviews, I can say they seem incoherent and intellectually unsatisfying as well as morally noxious.

If by "believe" you mean trust Him, then I can say this is much more difficult for me, not from a lack of assent or desire, but just from habitual egoism and anxiety. But whom would I trust instead?
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 02:18:39 AM by Porter ODoran »
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

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Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Jackson02

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2018, 02:34:38 AM »
I believe In God because of the Orthodox church and its promise that the gates of Hades will not prevail against it. Not to mention the various biblical archaeology that proves the accounts in the bible.  ;)
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 02:36:36 AM by Jackson02 »
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Offline Hawkeye

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2018, 02:59:09 AM »
For me it's about the same as Porter's whole response. I believe, and everything else pales in comparison.

Though I've oft wondered how wide the gulf is between believing and wanting to believe, and whether I can tell the difference.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 03:00:35 AM by Hawkeye »
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2018, 03:07:06 AM »
I think that theism is more likely than atheism by default because it's been the majority view of humanity, across cultures, for most of history (though I tend to view Buddhism as mostly theistic and consider animism to be much closer to theism than atheism, so YMMV on that).

Unless we're talking about something that's been conclusively or near-conclusively disproved like magick or Geocentrism, I don't think there's anything wrong with giving weight to the ancients (so, no, I don't think that the idea of God is comparable to Santa Claus or Russel's Teapot or an Invisible Pink Unicorn). In this light, I don't know what could convince me of atheism in theory, but I've not seen it yet. Sometimes the Problem of Evil inclines me towards misotheism, but that's a different issue...

I can also kind of buy into Pascal's Wager. But I don't consider it a positive argument for God. It's more of a pot sweetener, as it were.

In terms of positive reasons to believe in God, in addition to finding a lot of resonance in what Asteriktos said, my main one at this point in my life is probably more the beauty of Nicene Christianity, specifically. The Trinity, the Incarnation, the Theotokos, the Atonement, the Harrowing of Hell, the Liturgy, the Eucharist, the Communion of the Saints, all of it just flows together and makes such sweet poetry- the best in the world imo. Of course, I don't expect this to convince everybody from every background (especially somebody who's suffered a lot in their life) nor am I unaware that there's a lot of cultural conditioning going into why I think this way. And obviously I wouldn't be able to hold onto this if they found the skeleton of Christ or something. But I think it works for me as a weak reason to believe.

I can also see a certain general argument from the beauty of the universe for their being at least a Deistic God- something about how beauty that won't transcend the heat death of the universe is not really beauty (almost an ontological argument, I guess). But my thoughts are pretty unformed there.


I have a lot of problems with most more traditional arguments for God. I can kind of jibe with the design argument in a broad, almost Gestalt sense, but I'm not very confident in it nor do I think that you can start from neutrality and prove irreducible complexity or anything like that. I believe God is my Creator first and foremost because I believe He is my Savior.

I do kind of like the argument from morality (I think there's a natural law, which presupposes a lawgiver, even if turns out to be a lot more minimalistic than Thomists would like). Sometimes I also wonder whether the atrocities and wickedness of man, in themselves, necessitate that there be a devil even if there's no God (shout out to Vince Gilligan). But I'm not sure how to go about convincing a skeptic of that sort of thing- or of anything in this post, really. It's more of a series of intuitions, I guess.
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Offline Ainnir

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2018, 09:15:58 AM »
If by "believe" you mean give mental assent to His "existence," then I can say I've always believed and everything I've learned or experienced has fit well together built on that, giving me no reason to doubt. And as an outside observer of "unbelieving" worldviews, I can say they seem incoherent and intellectually unsatisfying as well as morally noxious.

If by "believe" you mean trust Him, then I can say this is much more difficult for me, not from a lack of assent or desire, but just from habitual egoism and anxiety. But whom would I trust instead?

This. 
With the additional observation that believing God exists and obeying Him are vastly different and it's completely possible to believe and then live like one doesn't... 
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 09:22:21 AM by Ainnir »
Is any of the above Orthodox?  I have no clue, so there's that.

Offline recent convert

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2018, 09:58:47 AM »
Because I believe God gave us a conscience and it needs to be reunited to God.
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2018, 10:33:00 AM »
My inborn craving for beauty and goodness, which I share with my fellow man, combined with the great dissatisfaction and inadequacy of this earthly life, tell me that the Beautiful and the Good is something far beyond and greater than the world and it must be personal.
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2018, 01:41:49 PM »
Because I believe God gave us a conscience and it needs to be reunited to God.

Ah.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2018, 06:59:19 PM »
My inborn craving for beauty and goodness, which I share with my fellow man, combined with the great dissatisfaction and inadequacy of this earthly life, tell me that the Beautiful and the Good is something far beyond and greater than the world and it must be personal.

I tend to agree, but why must it therefore be personal?


I have my own possible answer, but first I'd like to hear yours.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 06:59:39 PM by Volnutt »
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2018, 11:20:22 AM »
My inborn craving for beauty and goodness, which I share with my fellow man, combined with the great dissatisfaction and inadequacy of this earthly life, tell me that the Beautiful and the Good is something far beyond and greater than the world and it must be personal.

I tend to agree, but why must it therefore be personal?


I have my own possible answer, but first I'd like to hear yours.

Because personality is inextricable from beauty, goodness, and wisdom- these are not qualities that arise from impersonal forces but are the work of a mind and a will. An impersonal absolute would be inferior to man, which is absurd; or would lead us to view rocks and wind as superior to man, which would be insane.
Quote
When a time revolts against eternity, the only thing to set against it is genuine eternity itself, and not some other time which has already roused, and not without reason, a violent reaction against itself.
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2018, 10:51:57 PM »
My inborn craving for beauty and goodness, which I share with my fellow man, combined with the great dissatisfaction and inadequacy of this earthly life, tell me that the Beautiful and the Good is something far beyond and greater than the world and it must be personal.

I tend to agree, but why must it therefore be personal?


I have my own possible answer, but first I'd like to hear yours.

Because personality is inextricable from beauty, goodness, and wisdom- these are not qualities that arise from impersonal forces but are the work of a mind and a will. An impersonal absolute would be inferior to man, which is absurd; or would lead us to view rocks and wind as superior to man, which would be insane.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense to me. Even an atheist has to acknowledge that rational beings, not matter how physically puny they might be compared to the sheer scope of nature, are still the only way for the universe to look back on and comprehend itself.

Though, I also like CS Lewis's point about God being "beyond personality." Just as a cube is made up of squares but is on a different dimension than a square, so God is "made up of" traits that we would call personal, but as a whole is on a whole other level.
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Offline Rubricnigel

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2018, 09:53:00 PM »
I had a whole in my soul that was filled with religion, and after searching i found orthodoxy (hard to find it in the usa, 10,000 varieties of protestantism) Also, Seeing the rich/powerful believe in gnostic/luciferain/pagan deities made me wonder about the good.
Evil can only exist if theres good, and where is the good?

I think modern man has a very hard time finding god, especially if he isnt brought up in a church. The whole established world order is atheist and uses all its power to attack the faith in modern man/womem

Offline Tzimis

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2018, 10:28:14 PM »
As for me. I believe in Christ's promise of eternal life. 

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2018, 11:03:10 PM »
I just know it, there's nothing to believe
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Offline Jackson02

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2018, 11:39:55 PM »
I just know it, there's nothing to believe
I feel the same way. I tried to become an atheist for awhile but I just couldn't do it.
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Offline Sethrak

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2018, 02:11:28 PM »
Because ~ He ~ is always ~ has always been  ~ knowing ~ who I am ~ no matter what I said or did ~ half a century ago I ~ became angry ~ with our Lord ~ blaming him ~ for my stupidity ~ spoke against him ~ denied I knew him ~ I'm so ashamed to admit this ~ never for a moment ~ did I not feel his presents ~ Never ~ `never ~ when I needed to ~ feel our Lords love and comfort ~ hand on my shoulder ~ it did not come ~ when I spoke to him ~ prayed ~ it was not as before ~ didn't feel his ~ turning toward me ~ I begged him to forgive ~ to believe in me ~ as I knew and believed him ~ I have nothing without our Lord ~ our God ~ so ashamed ~ he deserves better ~ so too ~ my parents ```

Well ~ that ~ is a lot said ~ I'll read the above ~ to see if ~ it dare be posted ```
« Last Edit: April 11, 2018, 02:14:27 PM by Sethrak »

Offline Lepanto

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2018, 03:31:50 PM »
The most honest answer would be:
Because I was indoctrinated by my parents  ;D
Apart from that, it is a lot of things, such as the witness of other people, martyrs, beauty of life and nature, the liturgy.
Tough question if you think about it and try to put it in words.
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Offline Vanhyo

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2018, 04:29:37 PM »
It is like awareness of a fact

like 2+2=4, you are aware that it equals 4

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2018, 04:36:37 PM »
Well aren't you just Prophet, Seer, and frickin Revelator?

Excuse me while my eyeballs role so hard that they pop out of my skull...
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2018, 05:49:46 PM »
Well aren't you just Prophet, Seer, and frickin Revelator?

Excuse me while my eyeballs role so hard that they pop out of my skull...

Cool it or be cooled.
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Offline Tzimis

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2018, 07:47:21 PM »
Well aren't you just Prophet, Seer, and frickin Revelator?

Excuse me while my eyeballs role so hard that they pop out of my skull...

Cool it or be cooled.
That dirty evangelical.  Lol.

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2018, 12:15:47 AM »
Well aren't you just Prophet, Seer, and frickin Revelator?

Excuse me while my eyeballs role so hard that they pop out of my skull...

Cool it or be cooled.
That dirty evangelical.  Lol.

Tzimis,

I deem your attempt at humour in response to my green-text warning of another member to be a public demonstration of disrespect toward moderation, which is against forum rules.  So is directly attacking that member in this section.  Therefore, I am imposing upon you a warning of thirty (30) points. 

If you would like to appeal this decision, please PM Dominika, the global moderator overseeing this section. 

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Mor Ephrem is a nice guy.  Just say sorry and it will all be ok. Say I had things that were inside troubling me but I didn't know how to express appropriately. I will not behave that way again but I am seeking help.

thank you so much Mor ephrem you are a hero!

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2018, 02:21:02 AM »
It is like awareness of a fact

like 2+2=4, you are aware that it equals 4

Stated in a more irenic manner, I think this post is kind of glib or hubristic. Nobody can have that sort of absolute confidence in the existence of God, at least not without years of asceticism and experience of His presence.
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Offline Jackson02

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2018, 11:20:40 AM »
It is like awareness of a fact

like 2+2=4, you are aware that it equals 4

Stated in a more irenic manner, I think this post is kind of glib or hubristic. Nobody can have that sort of absolute confidence in the existence of God, at least not without years of asceticism and experience of His presence.

One can have it with blind faith, but that in my opinion isn't beneficial to the soul.
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Offline Vanhyo

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2018, 02:01:48 PM »
One can have it with blind faith, but that in my opinion isn't beneficial to the soul.
Neither is being a member of a "genuine sect"

Blind faith in the Lord Jesus Christ is the best faith, it signifies very high level of purity of heart.

Blind faith in falsehood signifies a curse.

Both are consequences of the state of the heart.

Edit: My faith is not a blind faith. My faith is very much reason based, by the help of God without whom i couldn't come to my conclusions.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2018, 02:08:11 PM by Vanhyo »

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2018, 02:04:59 PM »
It's been years that my belief in Christ God is stronger than me even when my faith is at worst and poorest, I can't explain, maybe he ties my heart this way so no tribulation can make me give up, no matter how long or tedious. There cannot be, however, anything more rational, clarifying and wonderful, even if some made a new Christ up.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2018, 02:07:44 PM by RaphaCam »
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Why do you believe in God?
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2018, 05:58:54 PM »
Thread locked pending review.
Mor Ephrem is a nice guy.  Just say sorry and it will all be ok. Say I had things that were inside troubling me but I didn't know how to express appropriately. I will not behave that way again but I am seeking help.

thank you so much Mor ephrem you are a hero!