Author Topic: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.  (Read 1842 times)

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Offline Xavier

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Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« on: March 13, 2018, 03:44:28 AM »
Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI affirmed that a careful study by 11 different authors of Pope Francis' theology shows that his thought is in continuity with the Pope Emeritus and with his predecessors.

https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2018/03/12/pope-benedict-rejects-foolish-prejudice-rupture-francis/

Quote
ROME - In excerpts of a new letter released Monday, Pope emeritus Benedict XVI said he sees clear “interior unity” between his papacy and that of his successor, Pope Francis, and described impressions to the contrary as a “foolish prejudice.”
Brief sections of the letter were presented at a Vatican news conference on Monday to showcase “The Theology of Pope Francis,” a series of 11 books written by 11 different authors.
“I applaud this initiative,” wrote Pope Benedict.
“It contradicts the foolish prejudice of those who see Pope Francis as someone who lacks a particular theological and philosophical formation, while I would have been solely a theorist of theology with little understanding of the concrete lives of today’s Christian.”
Presentation of the new volumes coincide with the fifth anniversary tomorrow of Francis’s election to the papacy in March 2013 ...
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2018, 03:51:13 AM »
Kind of hard for me to take much stock in the honesty of conclusions like this when the authors are under the gun to say that due to Papal claims.

I mean, what do you expect Pope Benedict to say? "Oops! Sorry, I guess we have had a heretic Pope for five years! Well, don't that beat all?"
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Offline Xavier

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2018, 04:55:22 AM »
Hi Volnutt. You have to look at the whole corpus, not just an isolated statement here and there. Imo, Pope Benedict XVI was a great thinker - he even helped journalist Peter Seewald come home to the Church. Pope Francis develops in many areas the thought of Pope Benedict and Pope John Paul II. He's also taken forward the normalization of canonical status of the SSPX. Pope Francis is arguably a little weak in defending the Faith, as in his conversations with the leftist journalist Scalfari. But his Encyclical Lumen Fidei for e.g is very much in line with Benedictine thought. If Pope Benedict XVI had had observations to make about radical differences, I think he would have done so.
"My daughter, look at My Heart surrounded with thorns with which ungrateful men pierce it at every moment by their blasphemies and ingratitude. You, at least, try to console Me, and say that I promise to assist at the hour of death, with all the graces necessary for salvation, all those who, on the first Saturday of five consecutive months go to confession and receive Holy Communion, recite five decades of the Rosary and keep Me company for a quarter of an hour" - The Theotokos to Sr. Lucia.

Offline LivenotoneviL

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2018, 06:14:10 PM »
Hi Volnutt. You have to look at the whole corpus, not just an isolated statement here and there. Imo, Pope Benedict XVI was a great thinker - he even helped journalist Peter Seewald come home to the Church. Pope Francis develops in many areas the thought of Pope Benedict and Pope John Paul II. He's also taken forward the normalization of canonical status of the SSPX. Pope Francis is arguably a little weak in defending the Faith, as in his conversations with the leftist journalist Scalfari. But his Encyclical Lumen Fidei for e.g is very much in line with Benedictine thought. If Pope Benedict XVI had had observations to make about radical differences, I think he would have done so.

How can you write this with a straight face? Unless your eye is twitching while you write this.

This guy has called anybody who adheres to Traditional Catholicism as "Pharisaical Pelagians," he has - from what I can tell - supported child molesting bishops in Chile, he has turned over the Catholic bishops to the Chinese government, he publicly married people on a plane, additionally, who were cohabitating before then for several years, and he has had sacreligious Masses in the Vatican, including putting a beach ball on the altar and having emotionalistic and secular music in the Vatican. He also canonized Pope John XXIII, Pope John Paul II, and he wants to canonize Pope Paul VI, he pushed forward the idea that divorce and remarried couples could receive communion, he has pushed forward the most liberal people in your church like Mahoney, and he tried to declare the Vatican II reforms as "magisterially irreformable."

What will make him a "bad Pope?"

Will he have to organize a homosexual orgy and sacrifice three cardinals publicly to Lucifer, praying for genocide against starving African children?

The kind of theology he has pushed forward has even led me to sin, because it is INCREDIBLY difficult to not hold a grudge against the Roman Catholic Church and view it with antagonistic eyes, because of him and his army of Washed-Down Catholic soldiers, who have bullied me whenever I put forward any orthodox theological idea, and particularly because people like you want to destroy one of the last bastions of orthodox ideas that still exist by subjecting the Holy Orthodox Church to your tyranny with a warm smile.

Do you want us to deal with your cognitive dissident mindset?
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 06:26:28 PM by LivenotoneviL »
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2018, 06:38:31 PM »
I think you folks give Xavier too much credit. The apologetics he broadcasts in this forum is always too pat and sophistical to have originated with him.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2018, 06:54:25 PM »
Although this is the Orthodox-Catholic forum, I don't think he's going to convert anyone, and I'm not sure why he keeps trying. "Pope agrees with other Pope." You don't say.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2018, 07:01:29 PM »
Although this is the Orthodox-Catholic forum, I don't think he's going to convert anyone, and I'm not sure why he keeps trying. "Pope agrees with other Pope." You don't say.

*Shrug* Maybe he has, I don't know. Conversations like that tend to only continue and get serious in PMs.

« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 07:02:34 PM by Volnutt »
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2018, 07:06:09 PM »
Although this is the Orthodox-Catholic forum, I don't think he's going to convert anyone, and I'm not sure why he keeps trying. "Pope agrees with other Pope." You don't say.

*Shrug* Maybe he has, I don't know. Conversations like that tend to only continue and get serious in PMs.

In this specific case, I suspect it's more a matter of "troll that Orthodox forum for responses to post on my Catholic forum and look like a hero."
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline LivenotoneviL

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2018, 07:16:57 PM »
I should also post the fact that not EVERYTHING Pope Francis has done is bad - in fact, the focus on social issues is something that I think many Catholics (and Orthodox) underplay, viewing economics through an almost prosperity-gospel mindset, as well the kindness he has shown for refugees - which is something that I think that Christians as a whole need to do. I think that if your family has been bombed, you should have some sympathy shown for you - especially considering that it is the "civilized Christian" nations of the USA and Russia which are perpetuating a lot of these conflicts, particularly in Yemen and Syria.

Nonetheless, I still think that some of the fundamental moral and theological ideas being attacked are grossly offensive to my eyes.

So hopefully, I don't come across as "merely" conservative.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 07:18:36 PM by LivenotoneviL »
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Offline LivenotoneviL

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2018, 07:22:43 PM »
I think Cardinal Humbert would be jealous of my temper  :-\

If anyone has read my posts, please pray for me. Wrath is just one of the many Deadly sins that I still need to overcome, hopefully before (God-willing) I become a catechumen.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 07:24:33 PM by LivenotoneviL »
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2018, 07:32:02 PM »
Although this is the Orthodox-Catholic forum, I don't think he's going to convert anyone, and I'm not sure why he keeps trying. "Pope agrees with other Pope." You don't say.

*Shrug* Maybe he has, I don't know. Conversations like that tend to only continue and get serious in PMs.

In this specific case, I suspect it's more a matter of "troll that Orthodox forum for responses to post on my Catholic forum and look like a hero."

Ah. I didn't know that.
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Offline Asteriktos

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2018, 09:07:21 PM »
I find Pope Francis inspiring (serious).

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2018, 10:09:05 PM »
Hi Volnutt. You have to look at the whole corpus, not just an isolated statement here and there. Imo, Pope Benedict XVI was a great thinker - he even helped journalist Peter Seewald come home to the Church. Pope Francis develops in many areas the thought of Pope Benedict and Pope John Paul II. He's also taken forward the normalization of canonical status of the SSPX. Pope Francis is arguably a little weak in defending the Faith, as in his conversations with the leftist journalist Scalfari. But his Encyclical Lumen Fidei for e.g is very much in line with Benedictine thought. If Pope Benedict XVI had had observations to make about radical differences, I think he would have done so.

1.  Francis doesn't think.  He speaks "off the cuff" which requires numerous clarifications and walk backs by the Vatican PR machine.  He's a no-weight compared to Benedict and JP II.

2.  Benedict is an old man and, according to many reports, probably hasn't got much longer to live.  I think he wants to live his final days in peace and in prayer, things which would definitely NOT happen were he to actually say that Pope Francis was wrong on a number of things.  The press wouldn't stop hounding him.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2018, 06:18:35 AM »
A well-known traditional Catholic Blog said things differently last year:

http://pro-tridentina-malta.blogspot.com.mt/2017/09/the-rupture-has-occurred-francis-vs.html

Confusing times for the Roman Catholic Church.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2018, 07:42:35 AM »
2.  Benedict is an old man and, according to many reports, probably hasn't got much longer to live.  I think he wants to live his final days in peace and in prayer, things which would definitely NOT happen were he to actually say that Pope Francis was wrong on a number of things.  The press wouldn't stop hounding him.
He's a good thinker, was trying to bring some traditionality back but... I don't know if that's his decision that "he can't fulfill the task" or he was forced to do it - anyway, it makes me feeling sorry for him. Especially, that he can't say nothing nor do anything despire so... Strange words and some actions of the pope Francis.


A well-known traditional Catholic Blog said things differently last year:

http://pro-tridentina-malta.blogspot.com.mt/2017/09/the-rupture-has-occurred-francis-vs.html

Confusing times for the Roman Catholic Church.
Oh yes, starting from the decision of the pope Benedict, and then having in some two popes, question about infability regarding pope Francis etc.
I know at least one ex-Roma Catholic, who discovered Orthodoxy in all this mess.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2018, 10:39:10 AM »
The Mrs. read some of Pope Benedict's writings and liked them.  She understands why Pope Francis would want to emphasize mercy, but she hates that he throws traditions away.

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2018, 04:42:05 PM »
I don't want to start a new thread and this seems related. I stumbled upon apparently a new movie coming:

Pope Francis - A Man of His Word
https://youtu.be/MOmY8i-uBcY

Anyone know what this is? And especially, why this soon? Why would anyone make a movie of a pope reigned this little time?
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2018, 05:01:10 PM »
I don't want to start a new thread and this seems related. I stumbled upon apparently a new movie coming:

Pope Francis - A Man of His Word
https://youtu.be/MOmY8i-uBcY

Anyone know what this is? And especially, why this soon? Why would anyone make a movie of a pope reigned this little time?

To try to continue to push Francis's ideologies among Roman Catholics.

It's the same reason why "The Young Pope" was pushed out under Pope Francis; to try to undermine ideological opponents of Francis.

It's also the same reason why there was basically a cult following of Pope John Paul II near the end of his reign and shortly after his death. To dismantle ideological opponents.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2018, 05:04:02 PM »
I find Pope Francis inspiring (serious).


Could you explain why? I personally disagree (if you couldn't tell), but I would like to hear your perspective.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2018, 05:04:46 PM »
A well-known traditional Catholic Blog said things differently last year:

http://pro-tridentina-malta.blogspot.com.mt/2017/09/the-rupture-has-occurred-francis-vs.html

Confusing times for the Roman Catholic Church.

There have been confusing times for the Roman Catholic Church since the Medieval Period, and before then.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 05:06:14 PM by LivenotoneviL »
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Offline Sharbel

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2018, 12:20:07 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2018, 12:23:41 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

That's ... amazing. It's like something out of The Count of Monte Cristo.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Asteriktos

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2018, 01:04:31 AM »
I find Pope Francis inspiring (serious).


Could you explain why? I personally disagree (if you couldn't tell), but I would like to hear your perspective.

I think he cares. It's easy to pick apart stuff he says and does... people could do the same to St. Peter with quite a bit less material to work with (Matt. 15:15-16; 16:23; 26:74; Mark 16:9-11; Gal. 2:11)... and I guess people did do that, since pagan and Jewish apologists said that the apostles were too clueless and theologically/philosophically unsophisticated to be taken seriously. I think Pope Francis is too uncareful for a man with such immense responsibilities, but I also think he embodies true religion (James 1:27) to an extent that is rare. And when Scripture speaks of two things which "cover a multitude of sins"--love and helping the needy--that also seems to describe him well.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 01:05:26 AM by Asteriktos »

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2018, 01:05:17 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

Wow.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2018, 01:51:12 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

Wow.

Yeah, I'm really starting to think this Pope was secretly deposed and is basically under house arrest. And I never pay attention to conspiracy theories.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Vanhyo

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2018, 03:02:33 AM »
Although this is the Orthodox-Catholic forum, I don't think he's going to convert anyone, and I'm not sure why he keeps trying. "Pope agrees with other Pope." You don't say.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2018, 04:21:17 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

Wow.

Yeah, I'm really starting to think this Pope was secretly deposed and is basically under house arrest. And I never pay attention to conspiracy theories.

While the history of dirty politics at the Vatican certainly doesn't rule something like that out, I'm not sure a blurred out couple of lines is evidence of anything other than embarrassed PR men who need Pope Francis to look as clean as possible.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 04:21:47 AM by Volnutt »
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2018, 05:03:02 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

Wow.

Yeah, I'm really starting to think this Pope was secretly deposed and is basically under house arrest. And I never pay attention to conspiracy theories.

While the history of dirty politics at the Vatican certainly doesn't rule something like that out, I'm not sure a blurred out couple of lines is evidence of anything other than embarrassed PR men who need Pope Francis to look as clean as possible.

Maybe, but look at what those lines say and imply.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2018, 05:18:14 AM »
Depends on what those "other obligations" are. I don't see a point in assuming it's something sinister just yet.

If he were being entirely coerced, then the very presence of those lines seems kind of strange to me.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2018, 05:47:01 AM »
Depends on what those "other obligations" are. I don't see a point in assuming it's something sinister just yet.

If he were being entirely coerced, then the very presence of those lines seems kind of strange to me.

I didn't say they have snipers trained on him 24/7 or something.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #30 on: March 16, 2018, 06:41:59 AM »
Vatican doctors photo of Benedict’s praise for Francis
Quote
The Vatican admitted Thursday that it blurred the two final lines of the page where Benedict begins to explain that he didn’t read the books and cannot contribute a theological assessment of Francis as requested because he has other projects.
(v. https://is.gd/7vsXfL)

The lines blurred by the Vatican:
Quote from: Pope Benedict XVI
Nonetheless, I do not feel that I can write a brief and dense theological page about them because for my whole life it has always been clear that I would write and express myself only on books that I had also truly read. Unfortunately, even if only for physical reasons, I am not able to read the eleven little volumes in the near future, all the more so in that I am under other obligations to which I have already agreed.

Wow.
Exactly: wow.


Yeah, I'm really starting to think this Pope was secretly deposed and is basically under house arrest. And I never pay attention to conspiracy theories.

Well, unfortunately sometimes I'm into conspiracy theories, that's one of these cases.
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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2018, 11:09:14 AM »
Vatican bows to pressure, releases retired pope’s letter

...In addition to saying he didn’t have time, Benedict noted that one of the authors involved in the project had launched “virulent,” ‘’anti-papist” attacks against his teaching and that of St. John Paul II. He said he was “surprised” the Vatican had chosen the theologian to be included in the 11-volume “The Theology of Pope Francis.” “I’m certain you can understand why I’m declining,” Benedict wrote...

Offline Čtec

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2018, 03:15:01 PM »
Well that is too bad. Pope Benedict XVI is very old and is probably thinking that he has very little time left and does not want a sin of schism on his back.
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Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2018, 02:07:22 PM »
[H]e pushed forward the idea that divorced and remarried couples could receive communion...

You do realize that all Orthodox churches commune remarried people, right?

I'm starting another thread on the topic of remarriage in Orthodoxy to not go off topic in this thread.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2018, 02:14:16 PM by Alveus Lacuna »

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2018, 02:19:10 PM »
[H]e pushed forward the idea that divorced and remarried couples could receive communion...

You do realize that all Orthodox churches commune remarried people, right?

There are canons that address remarried persons as having to repent of the sin of adultery before communion can be received, the main one being Trullo canon 87, where after separating from their illegitimate spouse they are excommunicated for seven years -

"He who leaves the wife lawfully given him, and shall take another is guilty of adultery by the sentence of the Lord. And it has been decreed by our Fathers that they who are such must be weepers for a year, hearers for two years, prostrators for three years, and in the seventh year to stand with the faithful and thus be counted worthy of the oblation [if with tears they do penance]."

By the way, I have tried to talk to the leading canonist in my church on this matter and have only gotten one unfortunately irrelevant reply. Does anyone else have any insight on the matter?

There's quite a moral difference to abstaining for a set amount of time to reflect on your sin and to repent, especially in the context of official ecclesiastically recognized separation in comparison to "Willy nilly, it's no big deal, it's no big sin that you got a separation avoiding your priest - take communion!"

The RCC already is lenient enough with granting separations for any said reason in my opinion, and there is already such a low standard in the RCC for who is worthy to receive communion (unofficially; confession is nonexistent nowadays) among the people such that it makes little sense why the bar needs to be lowered.

It's not my church, but the argument of "it's a great thing that we have removed the judgmental, pharisaical barriers" is a stupid argument that is in glaring contrast to their own church's history, such that anybody who has read the writings of their saints or The Saints would see the immediate contradiction.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2018, 02:24:28 PM by LivenotoneviL »
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2018, 03:47:52 PM »
[H]e pushed forward the idea that divorced and remarried couples could receive communion...

You do realize that all Orthodox churches commune remarried people, right?

I'm starting another thread on the topic of remarriage in Orthodoxy to not go off topic in this thread.

You do realize that, contrary to your stated wishes elsewhere, the Orthodox is not the Catholic church?
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Sharbel

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Re: Pope Benedict XVI: No rupture with Pope Francis.
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2018, 10:51:29 PM »
You do realize that all Orthodox churches commune remarried people, right?
Do the Orthodox Churches commune people remarried outside the Church?
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