Author Topic: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?  (Read 683 times)

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Offline Al Masihi

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Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« on: February 16, 2018, 10:01:13 AM »
I've already shared this piece information on the reality of Muslim apologists like Deedat with many Christians and now I will share it with my Orthodox brothers. Muslims always try to quote their prized scholar, their big winner Ahmed Deedat whenever Christianity seems to snuff out Islam in all forms of theology. I even happen to have the book of Ahmed Deedat (The Choice Islam and Christianity) which seems to mock Christianity and Judaism more then actually prove it wrong. The shamelessness of Ahmed Deedat it seems has no bounds when he called the Bible a book of incest and other horrendous words and would quote proudly from the Bible to prove Mohammed was prophecized in there yet at the same time preach the Bible was changed. But it seems the best of the Muslims was not the best Deedat could not explain one theory which until now shakes the very foundations of Islam the satanic verses, Mohammed according to all the great and ancient scholars of Islam (Al Tabari, Ibn Ishaq, Ibn Saad, Waqidi, Bukhari, and many more) preached that Allat, Manat and Al Uzza pagan goddess could intercede on behalf of Allah and as soon as Mohammeds pagan enemies heard this they reconciled with him for a brief while and prostrated with him. But as soon as Mohammed revealed this revelation Jebreil (Gabriel) came down and told Mohammed that he had made a grave mistake and Mohammed now corrected his earlier revelation by condemning the polytheism of his people. Many Muslims will say this is a fake account but let's go to the Quran don't Muslims always bring us the challenge to produce something like the Quran well no need to because if this is a fabricated event then that means someone was able to conjure up a false Quranic Surah which would technically mean Allah lied since he said no one can make something like the Quran. So Muslims will either have to choose one of the following:
1. Mohammed said the satanic verses and Islam is false since it kind of destroys the whole concept of Tawheed in Islam.
2. Mohammed did not say this and this is fabricated and the Quran is false since Allah lied when he said no one can produce something like the Quran
So clearly we can conclude Muslims have no way out of this argument.
PS sorry for the long piece of writing tried to shorten it as much as possible.

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2018, 05:12:09 PM »
Heard of him, never read any of his material. The idea that the Bible can both be altered and yet predict Muhammad has always been a confusing argument to me, though.
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Offline Al Masihi

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2018, 06:15:54 PM »
Practically no one except Muslims would believe that the Bible contains Mohammeds name and is still corrupt. Wouldn't bother reading Ahmed Deedats material I happen to have his book the choice Islam and Christianity, its filled with hate against Christians and Jews. He claimed to respect Jesus while at the same time calling the Bible a book of incest despite his own God claiming in the Quran that he sent down the gospel and he would make the Christians higher then then the disbelievers Allah it seems never specified the date in the Quran of how long such divine favor will last for the Christians and along came Mohammed with a new book 600s later. With Islam the clerics basically wanted me to close my eyes to facts and just follow blindly because in Islam that's how it works.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 06:17:24 PM by Al Masihi »

Offline augustin717

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2018, 08:42:47 PM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person and the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2018, 09:43:30 PM »
Practically no one except Muslims would believe that the Bible contains Mohammeds name and is still corrupt. Wouldn't bother reading Ahmed Deedats material I happen to have his book the choice Islam and Christianity, its filled with hate against Christians and Jews. He claimed to respect Jesus while at the same time calling the Bible a book of incest despite his own God claiming in the Quran that he sent down the gospel and he would make the Christians higher then then the disbelievers Allah it seems never specified the date in the Quran of how long such divine favor will last for the Christians and along came Mohammed with a new book 600s later. With Islam the clerics basically wanted me to close my eyes to facts and just follow blindly because in Islam that's how it works.

I thought the argument was that Muhammad is the Paraclete of John 14, not that he's mentioned by name in the Bible somewhere (which of course he isn't). Blatant eisegesis though, you're right about that.

Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person and the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?

Sounds familiar to me.

St. John of Damascus thought IIRC that Muhammad just plagiarized from Arians that he met in Arabia.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Al Masihi

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2018, 03:33:19 AM »
The verse of John is just one of the Bibical verses Muslim apologists twist to fit their agenda. While Jesus said the comforter will come in my name while it would be shirk (Polytheism) in Islam to say Mohammed came in the name of Jesus since that would mean Jesus is the God of Mohammed. Musliksmdont bother to read the verses themselves they just parrot their apologists.

Offline Al Masihi

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2018, 03:34:37 AM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person and the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?
As someone who knows some history of the Middle East it's highly possible since no one except Islamic sources document Mohammeds life. Infact new discoveries have found Syriac and Persian words in the Quran.

Offline Alpo

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2018, 04:22:26 AM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person and the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?

AFAIK compared to the Bible there's very little exegetics done on the Quran so I would be wary on any sensational theories. It's an interesting hypothesis though.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 04:22:58 AM by Alpo »
I just need to find out how to say it in Slavonic!

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2018, 04:35:19 AM »
The verse of John is just one of the Bibical verses Muslim apologists twist to fit their agenda. While Jesus said the comforter will come in my name while it would be shirk (Polytheism) in Islam to say Mohammed came in the name of Jesus since that would mean Jesus is the God of Mohammed. Musliksmdont bother to read the verses themselves they just parrot their apologists.

Makes sense.

They also have no way of proving that this one of genuine sayings of Jesus in a document that they claim has been so corrupted.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Online WPM

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2018, 08:50:39 AM »
No.
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Offline Nicodemusz138

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2018, 10:58:38 AM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person

Yes, I heard, the consensus is that he was indeed a historical person, but some historical aspects are dubious, overall, let us avoid creating our own christian equivalent of the "X Religious Figure Myth" theory.

the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?

In a certain way, it is.
As of 2018, I do not post or read here as often as I did.

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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2018, 04:11:58 PM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person

Yes, I heard, the consensus is that he was indeed a historical person, but some historical aspects are dubious, overall, let us avoid creating our own christian equivalent of the "X Religious Figure Myth" theory.

Augustin is an atheist.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline augustin717

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2018, 04:33:04 PM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person

Yes, I heard, the consensus is that he was indeed a historical person, but some historical aspects are dubious, overall, let us avoid creating our own christian equivalent of the "X Religious Figure Myth" theory.

Augustin is an atheist.
Only insofar as I don't believe in special revelations. Other than that I'm an agnostic.
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Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2018, 05:08:14 PM »
Practically no one except Muslims would believe that the Bible contains Mohammeds name and is still corrupt.
The Bible has "desirable", a cognate of Muhammad's name (Arabic and Hebrew are probably closer than two different Berber "dialects"). It's no big deal it pops up in a text with hundreds of thousands of Hebrew words.

Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person and the Quran is an adaptation of various heretical syriac Christian texts?
I find the bolded part extremely dubious, but I'm convinced that Islam or at least "proto-Islam" existed before him.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 05:08:34 PM by RaphaCam »
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2018, 05:15:44 PM »
Has anybody heard the theory that Muhamed might not have been an actual historical person

Yes, I heard, the consensus is that he was indeed a historical person, but some historical aspects are dubious, overall, let us avoid creating our own christian equivalent of the "X Religious Figure Myth" theory.

Augustin is an atheist.
Only insofar as I don't believe in special revelations. Other than that I'm an agnostic.

Ah, ok.
Christ my God, set my heart on fire with love in You, that in its flame I may love You with all my heart, with all my mind, and with all my soul and with all my strength, and my neighbor as myself, so that by keeping Your commandments I may glorify You the Giver of every good and perfect gift. Amen.

Offline Al Masihi

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2018, 07:40:05 AM »
Mohammed pretty much merged his religion with his native religion (Arab Paganism), heretical Syriac Christianity (Nestorians, Monophysites, and Arians), Jewish Talmudic law and some parts of the Old Testament, and even from Zoroastrianism since many verses in the Zoroastrian holy book are almost exactly the same to certain verses in to the Quran in a way that it seems to similar to not be plagiarism. Infact Ahmed Deedat and Muslim apologists say we Christians plagiarized from the Quran when we made the Arabic translation of the Holy bible but actually many words in the Quran such as this title lord of the heavens and the earth seems to have been plagiarized from the Syriac and Greek Bible. Deedat in his book accused us of plagiarizing the Quran when we added the word bismillah to the Arabic Bible while this was in use by Christians before Mohammed even made up his quran of copy paste. I'd urge any Christian here to buy the book of Ahmed Deedat the choice Islam and Christianity it's a good comedy and comic book.

Offline Green

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Re: Anyone know Ahmed Deedat?
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2018, 01:11:02 AM »
I once watched a video of him on the Trinity and he one minute in explained the Trinity as 3 person as 1 person so I dropped it.