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Author Topic: Is smoking marijuana a sin?  (Read 39053 times) Average Rating: 0
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« Reply #720 on: August 03, 2013, 09:58:20 AM »

Not sure I would want to pin whether pot is good or bad on the complex life of one man, or jump to conclusions about why his life was cut short. Judgement on him is reserved to the Day of Judgement and not here.

Some of his music was good listening though.

Indeed.  Although I wasn't using him as an example of why pot is good, just showing that it is not turn people into monsters.  Still, can't imagine how much worse his life would have been if he was drunk instead of high.
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« Reply #721 on: August 03, 2013, 11:10:23 AM »

Drinking- can make you feel over-confident
Marijuana- can make you feel overly self conscious. 

Both are not desirable, but if I were to pick one over the other, I would rather be overly self-conscious.  No hang-over with weed.

If you drink, don't become a drunk.  If you smoke pot, don't become a pot-head.  Why do we need to make it any more complicated than this?
boom. drop the mic.  you nailed it.

Unfortunately that makes too much sense for the morality police around here.
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« Reply #722 on: August 04, 2013, 03:18:45 AM »

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« Reply #723 on: August 04, 2013, 08:19:58 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?
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« Reply #724 on: August 04, 2013, 12:40:10 PM »


Also, Bob Marley died of cancer. He smoked a lot of pot before he died, and yet he didn't see 40 in life. I have outlived him.

Why?


There is absolutely no evidence to support the insinuation that Bob Marley's cancer was caused by his marijuana use. The cancer began in his toe, after he injured it playing soccer, then spread from there. I'm glad you have lived as long as you have, but it seems a bit judgmental and self-righteous to imply Bob died because he smoked herb.


Selam

Look, the point is that Bob smoked pot and was therefore selfish, aggressive, unmotivated and disorganized.  He was rude to people and frequently lept to judgement.  Oh no... wait...

It turns out that he was a deeply inspiring individual who wrote and recorded timeless music and went on world tour consistently while fervently advocating for peace.  Apparently he was also incredibly faithful.  All this while being one of the most well-known marijuana smokers in history!  He even had the drive to perform live shortly after being shot in an assassination attempt.  Not bad!

Yeah, but he smoked a lot of pot and it didn't cure him of cancer. Sorry.

I'm not saying that cancer was his judgement. I'm just stating a fact which pot enthusiasts often ignore: he still died of cancer. Pot advocates claim pot cures or takes away most ill effects from so many diseases... and yet pot failed in this case.

Sorry, it's still true. Quit being smarmy and pay attention to the fact, instead of trying to change the subject.

If pot's so good for you, why didn't it work?

I don't think I deserve to have outlived Bob Marley. I haven't done .00000001% as much as he did to make people happy. I am in no way better than him. It's just that pot users sometimes make very specific claims about how effective pot is, and it didn't work for him. Made him high, which was probably fun. Nothing wrong with fun, but let's just knock off the unscientific idea that pot is some magic cure-all. It's not.

Would pot advocates just admit they want to smoke it because it makes them feel good? I'd respect them a lot more if they would stop trying to hide behind the cure-all theories and say, you know what, it's just fun at parties. That's much more honest.

That's all.
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« Reply #725 on: August 04, 2013, 12:42:44 PM »

Not sure I would want to pin whether pot is good or bad on the complex life of one man, or jump to conclusions about why his life was cut short. Judgement on him is reserved to the Day of Judgement and not here.

Some of his music was good listening though.

Indeed.  Although I wasn't using him as an example of why pot is good, just showing that it is not turn people into monsters.  Still, can't imagine how much worse his life would have been if he was drunk instead of high.

Again: change the subject and blame it all on alcohol. The other favorite tactic of pot advocates.

Person A: Let's talk about apples...

Person B: No way, oranges!!


But I'm the jerk, because I pointed out that people can smoke pot and still die. Jimony, tough crowd.
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« Reply #726 on: August 04, 2013, 12:43:52 PM »

Are you seriously think marijuana cures cancer?

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« Reply #727 on: August 04, 2013, 12:54:59 PM »

I don't. I've heard from lots of pot advocates who say it does, though.
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« Reply #728 on: August 04, 2013, 01:02:19 PM »

I don't. I've heard from lots of pot advocates who say it does, though.

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« Reply #729 on: August 04, 2013, 01:04:20 PM »

But I'm the jerk, because I pointed out that people can smoke pot and still die.

Of course. Pot doesn't make one immortal.
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« Reply #730 on: August 04, 2013, 01:06:06 PM »

Okay, well, if I'm wrong then I'm wrong. The government certainly isn't going to listen to one person like me. Whether or not the law changes, isn't up to just me. Also, whether it's a sin to smoke pot or not, is not up to me.

But I've repeated myself enough, so I'll just go do something else now. Thanks.
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« Reply #731 on: August 04, 2013, 01:07:39 PM »

Are you seriously think marijuana cures cancer?
I don't. I've heard from lots of pot advocates who say it does, though.

I'm all for legalization of marijuanas but ideas like this make me reconsider my stance. Maybe we could legalize marijuana but send hippies into gulags.
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« Reply #732 on: August 04, 2013, 01:09:36 PM »

I don't. I've heard from lots of pot advocates who say it does, though.

I've heard varying accounts of how much it helps with the pain (from wonderful to 'not really'), but never a claim that it was a cure.
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« Reply #733 on: August 04, 2013, 03:58:49 PM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.

Also, if you read back, I have contributed a lot to the thread if you've actually paid attention and read what I wrote I make some very compelling arguments. Looks like those didn't catch your attention, but visual stimuli did, that alone shows that some people who make excuses only read what they want to read and get offended easy when people tell them what they are doing is wrong.

I am saddened to see so many of my brothers and sisters in Christ argue over something so stupid as a drug. Put the pot down and pick up a psalter or something.

If you don't read any of that at least read this. As for the arguments over pot vs beer. I live in WA, a state that made pot legal. During Holy Pascha every year my parish has beer and sometimes ouzo alone with all the food "Psalm 104:15 wine that gladdens human hearts" but would the parish serve pot to people....... no, that alone should say something.
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« Reply #734 on: August 04, 2013, 04:10:41 PM »

I make some very compelling arguments.

Not really.

Quote
As for the arguments over pot vs beer. I live in WA, a state that made pot legal. During Holy Pascha every year my parish has beer and sometimes ouzo alone with all the food "Psalm 104:15 wine that gladdens human hearts" but would the parish serve pot to people....... no, that alone should say something.

They should. Ouzo is awful. BTW ouzo is not wine and was not present at the times of Christ. And He didn't drink it. So how do you justify Christians drinking it (but the fact they do not have taste buds).
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« Reply #735 on: August 04, 2013, 04:23:52 PM »

I find my Bible reading much more intense and come to life when I get a little pot circulating in my body.
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« Reply #736 on: August 04, 2013, 05:00:20 PM »

I make some very compelling arguments.

Not really.

Quote
As for the arguments over pot vs beer. I live in WA, a state that made pot legal. During Holy Pascha every year my parish has beer and sometimes ouzo alone with all the food "Psalm 104:15 wine that gladdens human hearts" but would the parish serve pot to people....... no, that alone should say something.

They should. Ouzo is awful. BTW ouzo is not wine and was not present at the times of Christ. And He didn't drink it. So how do you justify Christians drinking it (but the fact they do not have taste buds).

Wasn't saying it was wine, was comparing. Was making a point that it's okay to have at Church and pot isn't.
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« Reply #737 on: August 04, 2013, 05:02:20 PM »

Was making a point that it's okay to have at Church and pot isn't.

Because you say so?
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« Reply #738 on: August 04, 2013, 05:10:59 PM »

Was making a point that it's okay to have at Church and pot isn't.

Because you say so?

-_-  hello McFly, yes, yes because I am the one who makes the decisions at all the Churches in this city.....are you serious or just trolling because wow
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« Reply #739 on: August 04, 2013, 10:44:56 PM »


Also, Bob Marley died of cancer. He smoked a lot of pot before he died, and yet he didn't see 40 in life. I have outlived him.

Why?


There is absolutely no evidence to support the insinuation that Bob Marley's cancer was caused by his marijuana use. The cancer began in his toe, after he injured it playing soccer, then spread from there. I'm glad you have lived as long as you have, but it seems a bit judgmental and self-righteous to imply Bob died because he smoked herb.


Selam

Look, the point is that Bob smoked pot and was therefore selfish, aggressive, unmotivated and disorganized.  He was rude to people and frequently lept to judgement.  Oh no... wait...

It turns out that he was a deeply inspiring individual who wrote and recorded timeless music and went on world tour consistently while fervently advocating for peace.  Apparently he was also incredibly faithful.  All this while being one of the most well-known marijuana smokers in history!  He even had the drive to perform live shortly after being shot in an assassination attempt.  Not bad!

Yeah, but he smoked a lot of pot and it didn't cure him of cancer. Sorry.

I'm not saying that cancer was his judgement. I'm just stating a fact which pot enthusiasts often ignore: he still died of cancer. Pot advocates claim pot cures or takes away most ill effects from so many diseases... and yet pot failed in this case.

Sorry, it's still true. Quit being smarmy and pay attention to the fact, instead of trying to change the subject.

If pot's so good for you, why didn't it work?

I don't think I deserve to have outlived Bob Marley. I haven't done .00000001% as much as he did to make people happy. I am in no way better than him. It's just that pot users sometimes make very specific claims about how effective pot is, and it didn't work for him. Made him high, which was probably fun. Nothing wrong with fun, but let's just knock off the unscientific idea that pot is some magic cure-all. It's not.

Would pot advocates just admit they want to smoke it because it makes them feel good? I'd respect them a lot more if they would stop trying to hide behind the cure-all theories and say, you know what, it's just fun at parties. That's much more honest.

That's all.
Who ever said that pot can cure cancer? Huh
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« Reply #740 on: August 04, 2013, 10:53:48 PM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.
Okay, so I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Kerdy. What evidence do you have that smoking marijuana even once is a sin?

Also, if you read back, I have contributed a lot to the thread if you've actually paid attention and read what I wrote I make some very compelling arguments.
An argument you make isn't compelling just because you think it is. The goal of an argument is to convince someone else, not to convince yourself. If no one is convinced by your arguments, then they're not compelling.

Looks like those didn't catch your attention, but visual stimuli did, that alone shows that some people who make excuses only read what they want to read and get offended easy when people tell them what they are doing is wrong.
I've actually been following this thread quite closely. I find the few arguments you've made on this thread to be of the same substance as Kerdy's arguments: too much based on emotion and bare assertion fallacies ("because I say so") to be of any real substance. The one argument you've posted that could be considered compelling, the one about the detailed physiological impacts of pot smoke, cites no corroborating sources, which makes even that argument look like a bare assertion.

I am saddened to see so many of my brothers and sisters in Christ argue over something so stupid as a drug. Put the pot down and pick up a psalter or something.
You might want to take your sanctimonious hypocrisy somewhere else, especially if you haven't been Orthodox all that long.

If you don't read any of that at least read this. As for the arguments over pot vs beer. I live in WA, a state that made pot legal. During Holy Pascha every year my parish has beer and sometimes ouzo alone with all the food "Psalm 104:15 wine that gladdens human hearts" but would the parish serve pot to people....... no, that alone should say something.
The only thing that says is that your parish does not serve pot to people. For several years, my parish forbade the consumption of distilled liquors on parish grounds during the Paschal festivities. Does that make liquor evil?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 11:09:31 PM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
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« Reply #741 on: August 05, 2013, 02:17:18 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.
Okay, so I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Kerdy. What evidence do you have that smoking marijuana even once is a sin?

And what evidence do you have that it isn't? Only God knows, but why take that chance when you can play it safe.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 02:17:36 AM by Peacemaker » Logged

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« Reply #742 on: August 05, 2013, 02:38:22 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.
Okay, so I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Kerdy. What evidence do you have that smoking marijuana even once is a sin?

And what evidence do you have that it isn't?
You are saying it is. That puts the burden of proof on you to prove yourself right. I bear no burden to prove you wrong. I will therefore not answer your question until you first answer mine. (That's what you get for trying to dodge a question by answering  it with a question.)

Only God knows, but why take that chance when you can play it safe.
Earlier you said definitively that smoking marijuana is a sin. Now you say only God knows. How can anyone discuss this with you if you keep equivocating?
« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 02:44:54 AM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
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« Reply #743 on: August 05, 2013, 03:14:01 AM »

Not sure I would want to pin whether pot is good or bad on the complex life of one man, or jump to conclusions about why his life was cut short. Judgement on him is reserved to the Day of Judgement and not here.

Some of his music was good listening though.

Indeed.  Although I wasn't using him as an example of why pot is good, just showing that it is not turn people into monsters.  Still, can't imagine how much worse his life would have been if he was drunk instead of high.

Again: change the subject and blame it all on alcohol. The other favorite tactic of pot advocates.

Person A: Let's talk about apples...

Person B: No way, oranges!!


But I'm the jerk, because I pointed out that people can smoke pot and still die. Jimony, tough crowd.

Biro, nobody is saying you are a jerk.  If you feel, though, that your argument isn't being well received, it could be because it is not deserving of as much credit as you think it is.  Here's why: we weren't arguing that pot is great for your health to begin with.  So you coming around and saying it is a sin because one guy who smoked weed happened to get cancer, is not compelling stuff.  

Consider how many weed-smokers didn't get cancer.  Willie Nelson is a famous pot head who is still touring and is 80.  Does that make cancer healthy? No.  But neither does Bob Marley make it unhealthy.

If you want to contribute to this argument, I suggest you explain why you think pot and alcohol are "apples and oranges" as you said.

Oh yes, and we are not "pot advocates", at least I'm not.  I'm not trying to get people to consume marijuana.  All we are saying is that it is not a sin.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 03:33:20 AM by john_mo » Logged

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« Reply #744 on: August 05, 2013, 03:31:05 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.

Also, if you read back, I have contributed a lot to the thread if you've actually paid attention and read what I wrote I make some very compelling arguments. Looks like those didn't catch your attention, but visual stimuli did, that alone shows that some people who make excuses only read what they want to read and get offended easy when people tell them what they are doing is wrong.

I am saddened to see so many of my brothers and sisters in Christ argue over something so stupid as a drug. Put the pot down and pick up a psalter or something.

This is the type of emotional rantings from the anti-pot crowd that I was complaining about.  So much judgement and no actual grappling with the issues.  Posting in this thread is not simply about giving your opinion.  It requires that you read what other people have written and explaining how your opinion fits in.  If you feel people have stopped responding to you, the solution isn't to post insulting pics, or resorting to judgement.

Quote
If you don't read any of that at least read this. As for the arguments over pot vs beer. I live in WA, a state that made pot legal. During Holy Pascha every year my parish has beer and sometimes ouzo alone with all the food "Psalm 104:15 wine that gladdens human hearts" but would the parish serve pot to people....... no, that alone should say something.

No, this alone says nothing.  There could be any number of reasons that pot wasn't smoked in this situation without any implication that it is sinful, and I'm sure you are capable of coming up with some on your own.  For example:

1) Pot is illegal (so was alcohol at times)
2) Pot is hard to obtain (see point 1) and therefore nobody had any
3) They don't like pot
4) Pot isn't traditionally accepted in a liturgical setting (neither are fireworks. Also not a sin)
5) They might not like the smell of pot when it is smoked
6) They want to avoid the appearance of wrongdoing (relates to point 1 and 4)

Also, by your logic riding a uni-cycle is a sin.  Was anyone in your parish riding a uni-cycle during the Paschal celebration?  




« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 03:53:30 AM by john_mo » Logged

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« Reply #745 on: August 05, 2013, 08:05:08 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.
Okay, so I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Kerdy. What evidence do you have that smoking marijuana even once is a sin?

And what evidence do you have that it isn't?
You are saying it is. That puts the burden of proof on you to prove yourself right. I bear no burden to prove you wrong. I will therefore not answer your question until you first answer mine. (That's what you get for trying to dodge a question by answering  it with a question.)

Only God knows, but why take that chance when you can play it safe.
Earlier you said definitively that smoking marijuana is a sin. Now you say only God knows. How can anyone discuss this with you if you keep equivocating?

I have, numerous times in this thread.
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« Reply #746 on: August 05, 2013, 11:52:40 AM »


Peacemaker, I've seen you do this before. Are you actually going to contribute something of substance to this thread, or do you prefer to just spam the thread with vacuous pot shots?

Trying to make a statement that this thread will never be settled because people are to set in their ways. I'm flabbergasted that people are so hung up on their fleshly passions and try to make any excuse to enjoy themselves then they are to live for Christ. This thread is a roller coaster of people who understand vs people who make excuses for the passions.
Okay, so I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Kerdy. What evidence do you have that smoking marijuana even once is a sin?

And what evidence do you have that it isn't?
You are saying it is. That puts the burden of proof on you to prove yourself right. I bear no burden to prove you wrong. I will therefore not answer your question until you first answer mine. (That's what you get for trying to dodge a question by answering  it with a question.)

Only God knows, but why take that chance when you can play it safe.
Earlier you said definitively that smoking marijuana is a sin. Now you say only God knows. How can anyone discuss this with you if you keep equivocating?

I have, numerous times in this thread.
You have equivocated, I can say that much. Wink
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« Reply #747 on: August 05, 2013, 12:39:56 PM »

The real question is: Is it a sin to NOT smoke marijuana?

Clearly, the answer is yes.
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« Reply #748 on: August 05, 2013, 12:52:33 PM »

Wrong.  Whatever the final verdict on marijuana is, you are wrong on this one. 
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« Reply #749 on: August 05, 2013, 02:08:52 PM »

Wrong.  Whatever the final verdict on marijuana is, you are wrong on this one. 
Who, me?
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« Reply #750 on: August 05, 2013, 02:12:20 PM »

Wrong.  Whatever the final verdict on marijuana is, you are wrong on this one. 

Well, well well.  Looks like we've got ourselves a fatalist.
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« Reply #751 on: August 05, 2013, 02:31:07 PM »

Who, me?

Yes.  Whether or not the Church ever comes out in any meaningful way teaching that recreational marijuana use is not sinful, the Church will not say that to not use it is a sin. 

Well, well well.  Looks like we've got ourselves a fatalist.

"Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit amphetamines." 
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« Reply #752 on: August 05, 2013, 07:30:06 PM »

Warning: Thomism  Wink

http://taylormarshall.com/2013/08/is-marijuana-smoking-sinful-for-christians-a-thomistic-analysis.html#more-3099

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« Reply #753 on: August 05, 2013, 07:41:11 PM »

The real question is: Is it a sin to NOT smoke marijuana?

Clearly, the answer is yes.
Proof?
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« Reply #754 on: August 05, 2013, 08:11:43 PM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
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« Reply #755 on: August 05, 2013, 08:12:30 PM »

might be asking too much for a forum of wannabe monastics, though.
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« Reply #756 on: August 05, 2013, 08:14:38 PM »

might be asking too much for a forum of wannabe monastics, though.
Technical term is monkabees
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« Reply #757 on: August 05, 2013, 08:15:05 PM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
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« Reply #758 on: August 05, 2013, 08:17:10 PM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
that would help no doubt
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« Reply #759 on: August 05, 2013, 08:19:22 PM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
that would help no doubt
Help who?  God or Satan?
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« Reply #760 on: August 05, 2013, 08:20:58 PM »

might be asking too much for a forum of wannabe monastics, though.

Wannabe monastic = doesn't think marijuana is the 8th sacrament?  OK. 
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« Reply #761 on: August 05, 2013, 11:47:16 PM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
Only if what you call sin really is sin.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 11:47:33 PM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
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« Reply #762 on: August 06, 2013, 01:33:34 AM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
Only if what you call sin really is sin.
As you seem to regularly do lately, you read what you wanted to read and ignored the core.  He mentioned sin and a send of humor over it.
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« Reply #763 on: August 06, 2013, 01:54:38 AM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
Only if what you call sin really is sin.
Perhaps those who make claim something is not sin should be equally prepared to prove their claim rather than play at deflection.  It's like chess, you don't win if you are always on the defensive.  You also can't claim "not sin" by pretending all burden of proof is in the lap of others.   
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« Reply #764 on: August 06, 2013, 02:03:36 AM »

you all need to get a sense of humor.
You think people should develop a sense of humor about sin?
Only if what you call sin really is sin.
As you seem to regularly do lately, you read what you wanted to read and ignored the core.
If you don't know what I mean by my words, then how can you conclude such a thing? Seems to me you're projecting again.

He mentioned sin and a send of humor over it.
Yes, I know what he said. Do you? (I would guess not, since Deep Roots never said anything about developing a sense of humor over sin. You are the one who constructed that concept.)
« Last Edit: August 06, 2013, 02:10:40 AM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
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