Author Topic: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??  (Read 2263 times)

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Offline jlerms

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??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« on: September 27, 2005, 09:27:37 PM »
Ok, this is an absolutely ridiculous article that my husband sent me.  What is the deal???

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050926/od_afp/russiareligionmilitaryoffbeat_050926150901

 :-\  Juliana

Offline GiC

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2005, 09:47:33 PM »
Ok, this is an absolutely ridiculous article that my husband sent me.ÂÂ  What is the deal???

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050926/od_afp/russiareligionmilitaryoffbeat_050926150901

 :-\ÂÂ  Juliana

Well, well, it's a good thing this didn't happen before I entered into the Orthodox Church, or I may be stuck with the name Fyodor today ;) Though the Russians may have many strange practices and customs, at least they preserve some of the traditions of the Church-State relations of Byzantium.
"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry

Offline jlerms

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2005, 09:55:53 PM »
 GiC,     But is this article for real?  Or is this a made up story?   J

Offline Silouan

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2005, 11:48:50 PM »
I think the article was written in a way to sensationalize an otherwise normal story.  There have always been patron saints of soldiers, this is making someone a patron saint of a particular type of soldier - but that doesn't mean the church condones their particular actions in any given conflict. 

Offline Stamfordguy

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2005, 12:14:31 AM »
Yes, it's real all right. I've recently read several books about the last Romanovs to rule Russia and the picture that emerges is not a pretty one. In addition, the canonization of Seraphim of Sarov was quite questionable, given the reasons for Alexandra bull-dozing it and the superstition that accompanied her pilgrimmage moonlight bathing. I tend to agree that some Russian practices are strange to say the least. But what to make of it??? While I'm in no position to judge them I must say that I personally find the idea repugnant. ???

Offline bergschlawiner

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2005, 01:09:27 PM »
 >:(
Quote
Moscow chapel of the Russian Air Force's 37th Air Army in Moscow,ÂÂ  
There is nothing in this article to imply that this is a patron saint of nuclear bombs other that the misleading headline.ÂÂ  As a career military guy my impression is that this is just the patron saint of the air forces and not of nuclear bombs.ÂÂ  Very bad reporting to give this impression.ÂÂ  The thousands of men in the Russian Air Force can use a patron saint as much as the USAF.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2005, 01:11:20 PM by bergschlawiner »

Offline Stamfordguy

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2005, 08:52:21 PM »
Here's another reporting from Yahoo News:

MOSCOW (AFP) - Historic Russian admiral Fyodor Ushakov -- a hero of Russia's wars against Turkey and Napoleon Bonaparte -- was designated the patron saint of nuclear-armed, long-distance Russian bombers by the Orthodox Church.

Russian Patriarch Alexei II, head of the Russian Orthodox Church, carried a reliquary and an icon of the admiral, who was canonised in 2004, into the Moscow chapel of the Russian Air Force's 37th Air Army in Moscow, Russia's RIA Novosti news agency said Monday.

"I am sure he will become your intermediary as you fulfil your responsible duties to the fatherland in the long-range air force," the patriarch said.

"His strong faith helped Saint Fyodor Ushakov in all his battles," the religious leader said, reminding his audience that the famous admiral of the 18th and 19th centuries never lost a battle.

Fyodor Ushakov distinguished himself in numerous naval battles in the Black Sea and the Mediterranean, most notably in the Russo-Turkish war between 1787 and 1791.

But his reforms of the navy were not popular in the upper echelons of the Russian imperial administration and Tsar Alexander I forced Ushakov to retire to Tambov province south-east of Moscow in 1807, where he died in 1817 aged 73.

Ushakov's canonisation as a saint in 2004 follows a strong tradition in Russia of close relations between the Orthodox Church and the state, which was revived after the 1991 collapse of the Soviet Union.
-------

Frankly, I find it a bit disturbing to say the least. :(

Offline Veniamin

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2005, 06:52:44 AM »
Frankly, I find it a bit disturbing to say the least. :(

Right, because everyone knows that because St. Maurice is the patron of the infantry, he intercedes for the rifles rather than the troops carrying them, and St. George prays for the cav's tanks, not the soldiers manning them.  The only disturbing thing going on here is the poor reporting going into the article.

FYI, that's the exact same article that was linked in the original post.
Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. ~Frederick the Great

Offline StephenG

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2005, 08:10:30 AM »
All arms of an armed service may have a particular patron saint, regardless of which arm. The journalist has sought and found a twist and consequently achieved the very thing journalists do, reaction and readership.

And just because the journalist has built a castle in the air, we don't have to try and live in it!

Offline Stamfordguy

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2005, 08:57:25 AM »
I'll concede you that point. But deep down... it still disturbs me (but not to the point of arguing it anymore). Peace.  :-\

Offline observer

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2005, 12:36:01 PM »
And don't forget the Great Martyr Barbara, patron saint of the Royal Regiment of Artillery.  Why shouldn't the 'BBC' have a patron saint of its own? (Voennaya Vozdushnaya Sluzhba).
Thou shalt not prefer one thing to another (Law of Liberalism)

Offline StephenG

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2005, 01:09:49 PM »
And choosing one might arouse all sort of problems. After all they have to impartial. And many are opening atheist if not actually anti-religious. Just too dificult and probably would be though inappropriate.

Offline Irish Hermit

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Catholic Patron Saint of Chemical Warfare
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2005, 05:49:36 PM »
I see that Roman Catholics are in the process of creating a Patron Saint for Chemical Warfare.ÂÂ  Kaiser Karl has been beatified already.

Pope prepares 'sinner' Karl I for sainthood

By Kate Connolly in Berlin (Filed: 02/10/2004)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/02/wkarl02.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/10/02/ixworld.html

The last emperor of Austria, Karl I, will be beatified by the Pope tomorrow amid fierce political and religious argument over how saintly he really was.

While Austrian monarchists are delighted to see the first member of the defunct Habsburg dynasty set on the path to sainthood, critics claim that Karl I was an alcoholic adulterer who advocated the use of poison gas in the First World War.

But the Vatican insists that he performed a miracle - the requirement for beatification. In 1960 a Polish nun based in Brazil was cured of severe leg sores and varicose veins after praying to him.

In addition, when his coffin was opened in 1972, despite a hasty embalming procedure, his corpse was almost completely intact, another important sign of saintliness.

The decision to beatify him follows a campaign by a prayer league lasting more than half a century and constant lobbying of the Vatican by Austrian dignitaries.

There will be three days of celebrations in Rome attended by members of the Austrian and Hungarian governments, 200 descendants of the Habsburg family and about 4,000 pilgrims.

The Vatican's Congregation of the Causes of Saints argues that Karl "served his people with justice and charity" and helped the poor. But critics - including President Heinz Fischer of Austria, who has said he will stay away in protest - argue that the Vatican is ignoring the fact that he commanded troops who were authorised to use poison gas on the Italian front.

Others accuse him of causing dozens of deaths in street fights during two attempts to regain power by force after the abolition of the monarchy.

"He was involved in atrocities and chose never to recognise the republic of Austria," said Josef Cap of the Social Democrats. "Any suggestion otherwise is misrepresentation." Habsburg family members put the claims down to age-old "German propaganda" which was used in an attempt to discredit the emperor. They say Karl, a Freemason, was a peace lover who tried to stop the war and limit the use of poison gas.

...

The Habsburg empire ruled much of central Europe for 640 years until 1918.

Karl I took the throne in 1916, but abdicated in 1918. After being escorted out of the country by the British, he died in exile on Madeira in 1922 at the age of 34.

His beatification is the 1,340th of the Pope's 26-year tenure - more than all his predecessors combined.

• Sister Anne Catherine Emmerick, a German nun dubbed "Mel's Muse" for the inspiration her writings gave Mel Gibson for his film The Passion of the Christ, is to be beatified tomorrow, despite accusations of anti-semitism.

Gibson took ideas from her book The Dolorous Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ for his crucifixion scenes.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2005, 06:30:43 PM by Irish Hermit »

Offline StephenG

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2005, 07:41:43 PM »
Without wishing to be either flippant or provocative, does that mean if the devil performs a convincing 'conjuring' trick, some follower of his or some spiritually deceived person might end up being declared a saint, simply on the back of a 'supposed' miracle.

Is Christianity about The Truth or magic?

Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2005, 09:32:37 PM »
This was written by a young Ukrainian.  It gives an idea of the devotion to this new Saint In Russia.

Feodor Ushakov was nephew of Feodor Sanakarskij, starets (Holy Monk) who had also been in Russian military service. . Feodor Feodorovich Ushakov's parents were very devoted Christians - Feodor and Paraskeva. He came to be named after famous ancient military martyrs St. Feodor Stratoplat and St Feodor Tiron.

While he served in Russian Float in Krim he was very famous for his concern for the sick. During "chuma epidemia" (plague, pox?) in Kherson he took great care of sick and brought end to outbreak quickly. While living in Sevastopol he built many churches, roads and hospitals for people. He attended daily utrenja, obednja and vechernja. He was even being told critically by other officials because of his merciful and kind treatment of French prisoners, and to kind treatment of those who had oppressed by Turk Ali Pasha.

After retiring he was to raise his orphan nephews, donated money to have built and furnished hospitals for soldiers wounded in war with Napoleon. He lived closed to Nativity Mother of God monastery Sanakarskij. Then he lived strict fasts. He was always known as a devote Christian who took great care of marines in his care, citizens of towns where fleet was and the sick, wounded and prisoners. . He was also remarkable brave man who did win many victories for Russia. . Love of his Otjechjestvo (Father Country) is really kind of virtue called Patriotism - well known in many countries. But he had great love of fellow people whereever he meets them.

Here is the icon painted for his canonisation (i.e., his addition to the canon of the Saints):

http://saints.oca.org/IconDirectory/LG/october/1002admiraltheodoreushakov.jpg


Offline prodromos

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Re: ??Russian Patron Saint of Nuclear Bombs??
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2005, 02:22:44 AM »
Quote

MOSCOW (AFP) - Historic Russian admiral Fyodor Ushakov -- a hero of Russia's wars against Turkey and Napoleon Bonaparte -- was designated the patron saint of nuclear-armed, long-distance Russian bombers by the Orthodox Church.


I think it is noteworthy that Russia has never dropped a nuclear bomb on another country (unlike another country which will remain nameless). Hopefully through the prayers of Saint Fyodor, they never will. Remember that the main purpose of such weapons is to act as a deterrent (and a powerful one it is thanks to its demonstration by the unnamed country). Surely something that makes nations think twice about going to war is worth a little blessing?

John.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2005, 02:23:21 AM by prodromos »