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AncientFaith
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« on: June 29, 2006, 10:30:23 AM »

I was just listening to the new presiding "bishop" of the ECUSA who is asserting that there is good evidence that women in the early church held positions of ordained leadership, but that they were excluded after Constantine since Roman culture was uncomfortable with women in public office.  Does anyone have any idea what she's referring to?
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Patrick
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« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2006, 10:36:03 AM »

If anyone wants to be sickened, you should listen to her interview.  She's on the 10 a.m. segment for today.
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Patrick
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metron ariston


« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2006, 10:51:30 AM »

Sounds like Mrs. Bishop's argument is based on the publications of scholars like Karen J. Torjesen.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0060686618/103-3267059-6579009?v=glance&n=283155
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But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
AncientFaith
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« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2006, 11:20:11 AM »

Oh my.

I just read the first couple of pages.  I take it the author has never met a Presbytera, or knows what that is.
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Patrick
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« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2006, 12:35:18 PM »

Nope. As it turns out, her interpretation of the mosaic in question is even more faulty than that. Sts. Praxedes and Pudentiana, which I've had the good fortune to visit, was built by Pope Paschal I in the 9th century. Now, St. Paschal (who obviously was an episcopus!) installed the mosaic in the Church chapel because such was scheduled to hold the tomb of his mother, whose name was Theodora. This alone probably accounts for the Episcopa Theodora in question.

And that's not to mention other obvious things about the mosaic, i.e. Episcopa Theodora is not wearing a pallium and her square nimbus indicates she was alive at the time of the mosaic's completion (nothing more sexy or controversial!).
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But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
aserb
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« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2006, 12:57:41 PM »

Truth is that she is looking backward from the 21st century to interpret history. She needs to to bolster her position as bishop as she will have many deteractors both in and out of the Anglican community. Her elevation to the episcopacy only bodes well for traditional churches such as we Orthodox. It will only further divide the Anglican camp.
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« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2006, 02:36:43 PM »

Nope. As it turns out, her interpretation of the mosaic in question is even more faulty than that. Sts. Praxedes and Pudentiana, which I've had the good fortune to visit, was built by Pope Paschal I in the 9th century. Now, St. Paschal (who obviously was an episcopus!) installed the mosaic in the Church chapel because such was scheduled to hold the tomb of his mother, whose name was Theodora. This alone probably accounts for the Episcopa Theodora in question.

And that's not to mention other obvious things about the mosaic, i.e. Episcopa Theodora is not wearing a pallium and her square nimbus indicates she was alive at the time of the mosaic's completion (nothing more sexy or controversial!).

Wow! You rock with the ole History of the Church. I'm impressed although that is not saying much.

Neat!
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For whoever does the will of God is my brother and sister and mother. - Mark 3:35
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