Poll

What service should Mor attend on Monday evening, 14 August?

Vigil for Dormition (Vespers, Matins)
6 (17.1%)
Hierarchical Great Vespers and the Lamentations for Dormition
18 (51.4%)
Vesperal Divine Liturgy
2 (5.7%)
Mor should read whatever service he wants at home in front of his icons because the faithful are not worthy of his presence in their churches
4 (11.4%)
Don't bother going to church, Mor
5 (14.3%)

Total Members Voted: 35

Author Topic: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision  (Read 827 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« on: August 12, 2017, 02:53:55 PM »
(A small part of) My spiritual life is in your hands.
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline Dominika

  • Troublesome Sheep
  • Global Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,441
  • Serbian/Polish
    • My youtube channel
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: POC, but my heart belongs to Antioch
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2017, 03:03:16 PM »
I voted for "Hierarchical Great Vespers and the Lamentations for Dormition"
Because it's actually an extended version of the first option (Vespers plus Lamentations being put into the Matins, I suppose).
Not because of  "hierarchical", but Lamentations are a beautiful service, especially dones before this feast; on the day of the feast you can feel it's a real "Summer Pascha".
Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria

My Orthodox liturgical blog "For what eat, while you can fast" in Polish (videos featuring chants in different languages)

Offline lovesupreme

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,451
  • Faith: Orthodox
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2017, 03:38:59 PM »
I played the devil's advocate, hoping that you would fall for reverse psychology and go to church doubly hard.

Offline Porter ODoran

  • PHILIA NIKA
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 11,612
  • St. John the Beloved, pray for me
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOAA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2017, 03:59:03 PM »
Lamentations!
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Asteriktos

  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 36,248
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2017, 04:52:08 PM »
The correct answer is not yet winning.

Offline augustin717

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,456
  • Faith: Higher Criticism
  • Jurisdiction: Dutch
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2017, 10:43:32 PM »
We had a parish priest back home that kinda hated these Dormition lamentation. They are anyways inferior and ii nepierdut compared to their model.
She hears, upon that water without sound,
A voice that cries, “The tomb in Palestine
Is not the porch of spirits lingering.
It is the grave of Jesus, where he lay.”
We live in an old chaos of the sun,
Or old dependency of day and night,
Or island solitude, unsponsored, free,
Of that wide water, inescapable.

Offline scamandrius

  • A man of many, many turns
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,196
  • Faith: Greek Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: DOWAMA of AANA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2017, 11:32:39 PM »
We had a parish priest back home that kinda hated these Dormition lamentation. They are anyways inferior and ii nepierdut compared to their model.

The Typikon of the Great Church of the Christ says they are inelegant and forbids their use.
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2017, 11:50:02 PM »
We had a parish priest back home that kinda hated these Dormition lamentation. They are anyways inferior and ii nepierdut compared to their model.

The Typikon of the Great Church of the Christ says they are inelegant and forbids their use.

Plot twist: the church offering that service is stavropegial (EP). 
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline scamandrius

  • A man of many, many turns
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,196
  • Faith: Greek Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: DOWAMA of AANA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2017, 11:50:58 PM »
We had a parish priest back home that kinda hated these Dormition lamentation. They are anyways inferior and ii nepierdut compared to their model.

The Typikon of the Great Church of the Christ says they are inelegant and forbids their use.

Plot twist: the church offering that service is stavropegial (EP).

Interesting. 
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Offline Alveus Lacuna

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,280
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2017, 12:42:47 AM »
I've never even heard of Dormition lamentations. Any historical background to it? Is it only used in certain places?

Offline hecma925

  • Non-clairvoyant, but you can call me Elder
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 14,227
  • Unbreakable! He's alive, dammit! It's a MIRACLE!
  • Faith: Truthful Chalcedonian Truther
  • Jurisdiction: Candle-lighting Cross Kisser
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2017, 12:58:24 AM »
Rachel wants to read in bed.
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline Dominika

  • Troublesome Sheep
  • Global Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,441
  • Serbian/Polish
    • My youtube channel
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: POC, but my heart belongs to Antioch
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2017, 07:31:57 AM »
I've never even heard of Dormition lamentations. Any historical background to it? Is it only used in certain places?

You can read about it here: http://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2011/08/lamentations-of-theotokos-in-worship.html

It's popular service in Greece, Bulgaria, Macedonia, Romania, among Arabs, I suppose in Albania too.
It's sometimes served among Eastern Slavs. This year it's going to be served first time at my parish (but, unfortunately, according to the old calendar) - in Polish Church only some parishes serve it, and rather not on the vigil, but on the 3rd day of the Dormition. Such practice doesn't make sense for me, since the serivce is very paralle to Great Saturday Matins, and Dormition is called "Summer Pascha", so how lamentations and sadness and reflection of the Great Saturday can be on the 3rd day of Pascha?...
Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria

My Orthodox liturgical blog "For what eat, while you can fast" in Polish (videos featuring chants in different languages)

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2017, 06:00:23 PM »
This year it's going to be served first time at my parish (but, unfortunately, according to the old calendar) - in Polish Church only some parishes serve it, and rather not on the vigil, but on the 3rd day of the Dormition. Such practice doesn't make sense for me, since the serivce is very paralle to Great Saturday Matins, and Dormition is called "Summer Pascha", so how lamentations and sadness and reflection of the Great Saturday can be on the 3rd day of Pascha?...

Maybe it's connected with the tradition that the apostles visited her tomb on the third day after her death and saw it was empty?  There are different layers of symbolism that probably do not mesh neatly, but it is a recent innovation.  ;)
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline mcarmichael

  • Novice
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,637
  • No cocaine
  • Faith: Christian
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2017, 09:04:30 PM »
This year it's going to be served first time at my parish (but, unfortunately, according to the old calendar) - in Polish Church only some parishes serve it, and rather not on the vigil, but on the 3rd day of the Dormition. Such practice doesn't make sense for me, since the serivce is very paralle to Great Saturday Matins, and Dormition is called "Summer Pascha", so how lamentations and sadness and reflection of the Great Saturday can be on the 3rd day of Pascha?...

Maybe it's connected with the tradition that the apostles visited her tomb on the third day after her death and saw it was empty?  There are different layers of symbolism that probably do not mesh neatly, but it is a recent innovation.  ;)

Ah! So the Oriental Orthodox tradition differs how?
To my shame, I may have been very drunk when I wrote this.

"Learn meditation." - Anonymous

Offline scamandrius

  • A man of many, many turns
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,196
  • Faith: Greek Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: DOWAMA of AANA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2017, 01:11:30 AM »
So, what did you end up doing?
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Offline Dominika

  • Troublesome Sheep
  • Global Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,441
  • Serbian/Polish
    • My youtube channel
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: POC, but my heart belongs to Antioch
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2017, 04:27:08 AM »
This year it's going to be served first time at my parish (but, unfortunately, according to the old calendar) - in Polish Church only some parishes serve it, and rather not on the vigil, but on the 3rd day of the Dormition. Such practice doesn't make sense for me, since the serivce is very paralle to Great Saturday Matins, and Dormition is called "Summer Pascha", so how lamentations and sadness and reflection of the Great Saturday can be on the 3rd day of Pascha?...

Maybe it's connected with the tradition that the apostles visited her tomb on the third day after her death and saw it was empty?  There are different layers of symbolism that probably do not mesh neatly, but it is a recent innovation.  ;)

Ah! So the Oriental Orthodox tradition differs how?

OOs don't have tradition of Lamentations diveded on 3 stations, neitehr on Holy Saturday nor on Dormition. It's a typical Byzantine rite thing. Well, some pieces of Great Saturday lamentations may be chanted by Copts or Maronites, because of Holy Week album recored by Fairuz ;)
Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria

My Orthodox liturgical blog "For what eat, while you can fast" in Polish (videos featuring chants in different languages)

Offline minasoliman

  • Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
  • Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 20,000
  • Pray for me Sts. Mina & Kyrillos for my interviews
  • Faith: Oriental Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Coptic
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2017, 09:29:58 AM »
We do offer optional lamentations for marriage...
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline scamandrius

  • A man of many, many turns
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,196
  • Faith: Greek Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: DOWAMA of AANA
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2017, 11:08:22 AM »
We do offer optional lamentations for marriage...

You got a link to those?
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Offline minasoliman

  • Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
  • Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 20,000
  • Pray for me Sts. Mina & Kyrillos for my interviews
  • Faith: Oriental Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Coptic
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #18 on: August 21, 2017, 08:59:19 PM »
I was joking... :P
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2017, 09:50:01 PM »
So, what did you end up doing?

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria! 
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2017, 09:50:19 PM »
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline mcarmichael

  • Novice
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,637
  • No cocaine
  • Faith: Christian
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2017, 09:56:37 PM »
So, what did you end up doing?

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria!

Are you going to blog about it, Mor?
« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 09:56:57 PM by mcarmichael »
To my shame, I may have been very drunk when I wrote this.

"Learn meditation." - Anonymous

Offline Porter ODoran

  • PHILIA NIKA
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 11,612
  • St. John the Beloved, pray for me
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOAA
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline RaphaCam

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,597
  • It is honourable to reveal the works of God
    • Em Espírito e em Verdade
  • Faith: Big-O Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Exarchate of Gotham City
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2017, 11:13:39 PM »
We do offer optional lamentations for marriage...
:laugh:
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

Check my blog "Em Espírito e em Verdade" (in Portuguese)

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2017, 11:14:43 PM »
So, what did you end up doing?

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria!

Are you going to blog about it, Mor?

No.
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Strategos
  • ******************
  • Posts: 41,204
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #25 on: August 21, 2017, 11:15:15 PM »
So, what did you end up doing?

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria!
And your aunt in health!
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline mcarmichael

  • Novice
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,637
  • No cocaine
  • Faith: Christian
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2017, 11:32:09 PM »

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria!

Are you going to blog about it, Mor?

No.

If I said please? Or what if somebody else asked you? 
« Last Edit: August 22, 2017, 12:31:01 AM by mcarmichael »
To my shame, I may have been very drunk when I wrote this.

"Learn meditation." - Anonymous

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Ο προκαθήμενος της Ορθοδοξίας - The President of Orthodoxy
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 33,221
  • Two half-eggs
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: The Ancienter Faith
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Help Mor Ephrem Make a Minor Life Decision
« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2017, 11:58:11 PM »
So, what did you end up doing?

I ended up going to Vigil.  Turns out my aunt had had some medical procedure and had some complications, so it was easier to go to the Vigil near her house than to drive around like a crazy person. 

Next year (or in six days?) in Jerusalem Astoria!
And your aunt in health!

Thanks!  She'll be fine.  She had complications, but she's prone to melodrama so they were not as bad as the end-of-days description she gave us.
How this relates to the coming Antichrist? I don't know...

Quote
The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).