Author Topic: Orthodox Church of China  (Read 280 times)

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Offline Alpo

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Orthodox Church of China
« on: August 23, 2016, 01:37:24 PM »
What's the point of having a patriarch over a country with hardly any Christians?

Ask the Church of China.
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:34

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2016, 02:04:44 PM »
What's the point of having a patriarch over a country with hardly any Christians?

Ask the Church of China.

There's no China Patriarchate.
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline Alpo

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2016, 02:39:26 PM »
What's the point of having a patriarch over a country with hardly any Christians?

Ask the Church of China.

There's no China Patriarchate.

An autonomous church is a local church.
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:34

Offline mike

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2016, 02:42:56 PM »
There was Church of China.
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2016, 02:52:23 PM »
What's the point of having a patriarch over a country with hardly any Christians?

Ask the Church of China.

There's no China Patriarchate.

An autonomous church is a local church.


At one point, the Church of China had bishops and considerable laity. Obviously, nowadays it doesn't, but I have yet to see anyone seriously invoke the autonomy of the Church of China today.
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline Alpo

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2016, 02:57:50 PM »
Has the MP officially revoked autonomy and instituted regular dioceses instead?
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:34

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2016, 03:00:58 PM »
There are no bishops, just a few priests scattered around. I believe, to maintain the toleration of the PRC, the bishops will need to be Chinese, so it may be quite a while before we see a Chinese bishop.
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline mike

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2016, 03:01:07 PM »
Has the MP officially revoked autonomy and instituted regular dioceses instead?

How a Church without bishops, priests, faithful and churches can be autonomous? How can it be a Church? It exists only in wikipedia.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2016, 03:01:37 PM by mike »
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2016, 02:38:30 PM »
Has the MP officially revoked autonomy and instituted regular dioceses instead?

How a Church without bishops, priests, faithful and churches can be autonomous? How can it be a Church? It exists only in wikipedia.

Not quite:

http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/93035.htm

But, yes, without bishops, they can only be some sort of MP mission and not a local church.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2016, 02:39:02 PM by Iconodule »
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline kijabeboy03

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2016, 09:10:11 AM »
Has the MP officially revoked autonomy and instituted regular dioceses instead?

How a Church without bishops, priests, faithful and churches can be autonomous? How can it be a Church? It exists only in wikipedia.

Not quite:

http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/93035.htm

But, yes, without bishops, they can only be some sort of MP mission and not a local church.

Indeed. I think legally (vis-a-vis the government of the PRC) the Chinese Orthodox Church still exists, but in the services the parishes here only commemorate Patriarch Cyril - there are no diocesan bishops anymore, after all. And even if there were, it would be hard to justify even having one diocesan bishop given that there are only five parishes with weekly or semi-weekly services :-/. (And of those five, one has a rector who is a citizen of the PRC and another has an assistant priest who is from the PRC - even if they were hieromonks it would be a small pool to be pulling from.)
"This is the Apostolic Faith, the Orthodox Faith, and the Faith of the Fathers. Having this wonderful treasure, let us preserve it, let us keep it, and let us also use it in such a way that this treasure becomes the victory of Christ in us and in His Church." ~ St. Severus of Antioch ~

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2016, 03:25:11 PM »
Has the MP officially revoked autonomy and instituted regular dioceses instead?

How a Church without bishops, priests, faithful and churches can be autonomous? How can it be a Church? It exists only in wikipedia.

Not quite:

http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/93035.htm

But, yes, without bishops, they can only be some sort of MP mission and not a local church.

Indeed. I think legally (vis-a-vis the government of the PRC) the Chinese Orthodox Church still exists, but in the services the parishes here only commemorate Patriarch Cyril - there are no diocesan bishops anymore, after all. And even if there were, it would be hard to justify even having one diocesan bishop given that there are only five parishes with weekly or semi-weekly services :-/. (And of those five, one has a rector who is a citizen of the PRC and another has an assistant priest who is from the PRC - even if they were hieromonks it would be a small pool to be pulling from.)

My impression from some articles a few years back is that there were a number of Chinese seminarians currently on the ordination path in Russia, and that China would have more native priests in a few years. Have you heard anything recently of this?
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline Dominika

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Re: Orthodox Church of China
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2016, 07:40:47 AM »
My impression from some articles a few years back is that there were a number of Chinese seminarians currently on the ordination path in Russia, and that China would have more native priests in a few years. Have you heard anything recently of this?

Well, such info was give last year: that two Chinese (not counting the one being ordinated) are allowed to study in Russia, to receive the ordination of the priesthood in future.
The article is in Polish, but it was based on Russian websites:
http://www.typo3.cerkiew.pl/index.php?id=79&tx_ttnews%5Btt_news%5D=22156&tx_ttnews%5BbackPid%5D=79&cHash=ae8fc93eea20e1881b694ff1df749d13

There is also a native priest from Hong Kong, but serving in the Ecumenical Patriarchate
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