Author Topic: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church  (Read 20286 times)

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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #675 on: March 16, 2017, 11:31:41 AM »
As far as I can tell, in the usual Catholic teaching, the taint of original sin has to do with concupiscence, corruption, etc and does not in itself constitute a personal sin. The idea seems to float around that Mary died a natural death only because doing so was necessary to participate in the resurrection.
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline Xavier

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #676 on: March 17, 2017, 10:43:34 AM »
Well, yes, in response to the claim that this is mainly due to the influence of western theology, the article clearly shows that there is an indisputable Tradition within the Greek and the Eastern Churches itself regarding the Panagia's perfect sinlessness; and this, perhaps, is established by nothing so much as the testimony of Patriarchs known to be anti-Latin and who therefore would never have asserted it unless it were already considered sound doctrine within their own local Tradition. As the article notes,

1. "George Scholarios (+1456), the last Patriarch of the Byzantine Empire, has also left us a homily on the Dormition and an explicit affirmation of the Immaculate Conception. He says that Mary was “all pure from the first moment of her existence” (gegne theion euthus). (6) It is rather strange that the most precise Greek affirmation of the Immaculate Conception should come from the most anti-Latin, the most “Protestantizing” of the patriarchs of Constantinople, Cyril Lukaris (+1638). He too gave a sermon on the Dormition of Our Lady. He said that Mary “was wholly sanctified from the very first moment of her conception (ole egiasmene en aute te sullepsei) when her body was formed and when her soul was united to her body”; and further on he writes: “As for the Panaghia, who is there who does not know that she is pure and immaculate, that she was a spotless instrument, sanctified in her conception and her birth, as befits one who is to contain the One whom nothing can contain?”

Archbishop St. Proclus of Constantinople had said over a millenia ago, [Homily 1:3 in PG 65:683B]: "As He formed her without any stain of her own, so He proceeded from her contracting no stain" See http://catholicpatristics.blogspot.in/2009/03/immaculate-conception.html Jesus and Mary alone were stainless and sinless from the moment of their conception.

2. It's not true that everyone is immaculately conceived after Adam's fall - Original sin is taught in the synod of orange, "Canon 2 (529 A.D) If anyone asserts that Adam's sin affected him alone and not his descendants also, or at least if he declares that it is only the death of the body which is the punishment for sin, and not also that sin, which is the death of the soul, passed through one man to the whole human race, he does injustice to God and contradicts the Apostle" and it means simply that we are born deprived of indwelling grace until we are born again in Baptism. http://www.ewtn.com/library/Councils/Orange.htm Original sin, says St. Thomas Aquinas, is formally, the privation of sanctifying grace. Original sin is very clear in early Councils.

"Council of Carthage, Canon 2 (418 A.D) Likewise it seemed good that whosoever denies that infants newly from their mother’s wombs should be baptized, or says that baptism is for remission of sins, but that they derive from Adam no original sin, which needs to be removed by the laver of regeneration, from whence the conclusion follows, that in them the form of baptism for the remission of sins, is to be understood as false and not true, let him be anathema. For no otherwise can be understood what the Apostle says, “By one man sin is come into the world, and death through sin, and so death passed upon all men in that all have sinned,” than the Catholic Church everywhere diffused has always understood it. http://www.earlychurchtexts.com/public/carthage_canons_on_sin_and_grace.htm
« Last Edit: March 17, 2017, 10:46:03 AM by Xavier »
The All-Holy Theotokos, the Panagia, is the perfect model of theosis, an image of the Church, Bride of God without "stain or blemish" (cf. Eph 5:27, SoS 4:7)

St. Ephraem of Syria, Thou alone and Thy Mother are in all things fair; there is no flaw in Thee and no stain in Thy Mother

St. Proclus of Constantinople, As He formed Her without any stain of Her own, so He proceeded from Her contracting no stain.

St. Sophronius of Jerusalem, No one has been purified in advance as Thou (Mary) hast been

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #677 on: March 20, 2017, 07:47:12 PM »
The whole Immaculate Conception debate between Orthodox and RC's is really hard to grasp, I imagine Melkites may have wrapped settled down a combination of both.

Melkites believe what the EOC believes.
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Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #678 on: March 20, 2017, 07:47:48 PM »
apparently OOs don't teach that Mary is sinless.

Do EOs teach this?
I know we sing Ever Virgin and Most Pure.

I'm surprised you're asking him about what EO teaching is.  It wasn't that long ago you were teaching him your take on it.

I know, isn't it funny?  But to answer his question, EOs and Melkite teach that Mary was sinless throughput her entire life, but we haven't dogmatized it.

Melkites are Roman Catholics, they are supposed to believe in the dogmas of Rome. Don't lump Melkites in with Orthodox.

Nope they are not.
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Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #679 on: March 20, 2017, 07:48:46 PM »
Melkites are Roman Catholics [in faith], they are supposed to believe in the dogmas of Rome. Don't lump Melkites in with Orthodox.
They are different rites of the same communion and RC theology.

Same communion, different theology.
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #680 on: March 20, 2017, 07:49:43 PM »
The whole Immaculate Conception debate between Orthodox and RC's is really hard to grasp, I imagine Melkites may have wrapped settled down a combination of both. Just ignored the whole issue.

Fixed.
Mostly yes, apparently, lol

But I've debated with an Eastern Catholic who showed the weirdest mixed theories, I imagine the most intellectualised Melkites have tried hard to sort it out.

Not all Eastern Catholics are Melkites.  Many ECs have been Latinized.  Melkites have not.
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Online rakovsky

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #681 on: March 20, 2017, 08:08:56 PM »
Melkites are Roman Catholics [in faith], they are supposed to believe in the dogmas of Rome. Don't lump Melkites in with Orthodox.
They are different rites of the same communion and RC theology.

Same communion, different theology.
If you teach that the RC Councils are ecumenical, it means you accept the RC Councils' theology, eg. Council of Trent and Vatican II.
Same communion, same basic post schism papal theology.
Once you say the RC councils are ecumenical, you can't get out of that except in make believe world.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 08:09:21 PM by rakovsky »
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Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #682 on: March 20, 2017, 08:53:54 PM »
Melkites are Roman Catholics [in faith], they are supposed to believe in the dogmas of Rome. Don't lump Melkites in with Orthodox.
They are different rites of the same communion and RC theology.

Same communion, different theology.
If you teach that the RC Councils are ecumenical, it means you accept the RC Councils' theology, eg. Council of Trent and Vatican II.
Same communion, same basic post schism papal theology.
Once you say the RC councils are ecumenical, you can't get out of that except in make believe world.

The Antiochian OC of NA and I disagree with you.
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

Online rakovsky

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #683 on: March 20, 2017, 09:04:06 PM »
The Antiochian OC of NA and I disagree with you.
I am fully aware by now that you are in make believe world about Melkites being "orthodox".
Also, it looks like maybe you did not have proper conversion since you are still teaching this insanity about rejecting Rome theology while accepting Rome's Councils and making up that the AOCNA calls Melkites full "Orthodox".

I get it.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 09:26:55 PM by rakovsky »
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

Online Asteriktos

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #684 on: March 20, 2017, 09:04:39 PM »
I once asked on byzcath about the Photian councils, how Rome seemed to consider the 8th Ecumenical Council to be the one held in Constantinople in 869-870 condemning St. Photius, whereas the Orthodox consider the one in 879-880 which cleared St. Photius to be the valid one (and some consider it Ecumenical). I was told that the 2nd one was accepted by both Orthodox and Catholics (and Eastern Catholics), and that the idea that Rome considered the first council and not the second one as Ecumenical/valid was a mistaken view as a result of historical haziness, and was cleared up in the 20th century. Wiki still indicates otherwise--that Catholics and Orthodox still accept different councils--but I certainly wouldn't take their word for it.

So... is there any official or at least generally accepted list of ecumenical councils in Catholicism, and also in Eastern Catholicism, or even some kind of overview/text that gets into the details of this?

--EDIT--I think the post at byzcath mentioned a book by... Dvornak?  .. I'll try to look that up, though I'm certainly open to other sources
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 09:06:45 PM by Asteriktos »
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #685 on: March 20, 2017, 09:12:16 PM »
So... is there any official or at least generally accepted list of ecumenical councils in Catholicism, and also in Eastern Catholicism, or even some kind of overview/text that gets into the details of this?
Well, the Melkites participated in Vatican I and II and gave approval..... and they teach that they accept the RC Councils....

Quote
Must we Eastern Catholics consider the post-schism General Councils of the Roman Church Ecumenical

The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.

Bp. John
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:XyiWeFTkF48J:https://melkite.org/eparchy/bishop-john/what-is-the-melkite-view-of-the-post-schism-ecumenical-councils+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #686 on: March 20, 2017, 09:15:46 PM »
From the Melkite Side this:
Quote
Bishop John

Are we Orthodox united with Rome?

The Melkite Church is a hundred per cent Catholic, but not a hundred per cent Orthodox.

The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #687 on: March 20, 2017, 09:22:11 PM »
Bp. John is the Bp. of Newton, your Melkite Eparchy. he explains:
Quote
Are we Orthodox united with Rome?

Bishop John's Answer

To be an Orthodox Christian means that one does not recognize the primacy of the Pope of Rome, but considers him as "first among equals."

The Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches states it in these terms: "The bishop of the Church of Rome, in whom resides the office (munus) given in a special way by the Lord to Peter, first of the Apostles and to be transmitted to his successors, is head of the college of bishops, the Vicar of Christ and Pastor of the entire Church on earth; therefore in virtue of his office (munus) he enjoys supreme, full, immediate and universal ordinary power in the Church which he can always freely exercise." (Canon 43 of the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches)

If an Orthodox subscribes to the Canon quoted above, he/she can be called Catholic and be considered "united to Rome" or in full communion with the Catholic Church.

The Melkite Church is a hundred per cent Catholic, but not a hundred per cent Orthodox.

the Melkite Church has chosen dependency as a price for unity,
https://melkite.org/tag/rome

Melkites are under the RC Church's "Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches" whereby Melkites teach Papal Full Unilateral Vertical Supremacy.
The Melkite Epharchy teaches they are dependents of the superior status of Rome and not full Orthodox because of their own proclaimed inferior status.
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #688 on: March 20, 2017, 09:28:07 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 09:28:23 PM by rakovsky »
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #689 on: March 20, 2017, 11:51:51 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #690 on: March 21, 2017, 12:07:33 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

IIRC Monachos has a policy of members using their real names (not necessarily their full names), not monikers like on other forums. If you signed up using a name like urg8rb8t, it may have been marked as spam.
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #691 on: March 21, 2017, 12:39:08 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha

The Bishop of Antioch doesn't accept Rome.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #692 on: March 21, 2017, 07:59:11 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #693 on: March 21, 2017, 01:52:29 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker
The whole forum is Mor. We're emanations of his godlike mind.

Actually, Mor's face shineth like the Sun.

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #694 on: March 21, 2017, 10:07:45 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

IIRC Monachos has a policy of members using their real names (not necessarily their full names), not monikers like on other forums. If you signed up using a name like urg8rb8t, it may have been marked as spam.

Hmmmm maybe.  I'll check it out.  Thanks for the suggestion.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #695 on: March 22, 2017, 10:17:56 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"
« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 10:21:51 AM by Iconodule »
Quote
“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
- from The King of Ireland's Son, by Padraic Colum

Offline Antonious Nikolas

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #696 on: March 22, 2017, 10:54:33 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"

 ;D ;D ;D
Now accepting brief PMs.

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #697 on: March 22, 2017, 11:06:52 AM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"

 ;D ;D ;D

Indeed!  Still, I will admit a twinge of sadness when I realised that there was not even a single quote from the Dcn. Kuraev forum. 
The whole forum is Mor. We're emanations of his godlike mind.

Actually, Mor's face shineth like the Sun.

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #698 on: March 22, 2017, 06:11:24 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha

The Bishop of Antioch doesn't accept Rome.

But he accepts Melkites.
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #699 on: March 22, 2017, 06:13:14 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"

Hahaha

The funny thing is that someone here, don't remember who, already made that call to the Metropolitan in the US.  And the answer was that Melkites are accepted. Lol
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #700 on: March 22, 2017, 07:57:44 PM »
"Melkites are accepted" is meaningless in this context. 
The whole forum is Mor. We're emanations of his godlike mind.

Actually, Mor's face shineth like the Sun.

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #701 on: March 22, 2017, 09:18:59 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"

 ;D ;D ;D

Indeed!  Still, I will admit a twinge of sadness when I realised that there was not even a single quote from the Dcn. Kuraev forum.

Me too.  Except I was hoping for a citation from mospat.ru.
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Offline Antonious Nikolas

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #702 on: March 22, 2017, 09:26:45 PM »
Did you ever sign up with Monachos Orthodox forum like you said you would, URG8RB8?

I did but the account was never approved for some reason.  I can check it again.

Btw we should shut down the AEOC because they are allowing the Melkites to fully join the church without much of anything.  They must be very confused, I think you need to  theologically become the Metropolitan and ultimately the Bishop of Antioch and unconfused the church. Haha
I think most times there is no problem because the converts don't keep saying Mel kites are right fully and full orthodox.
If you give me your parish name I can help sort things out if you want.

#stalker

I'm trying to imagine this conversation...

"Hello, thank you for calling Saint George's Antiochian Orthodox Church, this is Aliya, how may I direct your call?"

"Hello Aliya- according to the website of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton,
Quote
The Melkite Church participated fully in Vatican I and Patriarch Gregory spoke clearly to his affirmation of the fullness of power enjoyed by the Petrine Office. The Patriarch was very concerned that the exercise of papal powers be “in harmony with the rights of the other Patriarchal Sees.” The second Vatican Council is seen to have completed the unfinished business of Vatican I with its special emphasis on ecclesiology, specifically on the nature of the Church. It would be a simple rekindling of the old controversy of conciliarism to suggest that some councils are less ecumenical than others. With the promulgation of the Holy Father, the doctrinal content of the various councils is a part of the sacred magisterial teaching of the Church to which Melkites in full communion with the See of Rome give wholehearted assent.
In light of this fact, do you consider it proper for your church to be communing a member of the Melkite Catholic Church? "

"Who are you again?"

 ;D ;D ;D

Indeed!  Still, I will admit a twinge of sadness when I realised that there was not even a single quote from the Dcn. Kuraev forum.

Me too.  Except I was hoping for a citation from mospat.ru.

Let me just preemptively do this now, like a controlled burn...

"Don't you find the opinion of the Moscow Patriarchate to be worth noting Antonious?  I am merely stating the official position of the EO Church.  If the Moscow Patriarchate supports my contentions noting that here here would be the normal thing to do."
« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 09:29:23 PM by Antonious Nikolas »
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Offline beebert

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #703 on: April 04, 2017, 09:49:00 AM »
I'm not sure how widespread this was, but people like St. Gregory of Nyssa seem, at least sometimes, to say that every baby is born without the taint of sin, and that they go on like that into life for some time, before they start growing up and being able to make decisions and know right from wrong. He seemed to think diseases and suffering and whatnot that young ones deal with didn't have to do with anything sinful on their part, but rather as something allowed by God so as to bring about a greater good (or avoid a greater evil).
This sounds logical to me and Fair
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #704 on: April 04, 2017, 12:54:39 PM »
There are some dangers of receiving Holy Communion from the Church without proper preparation and being a member.

This is a story which was made known to me some time ago, forgive me if i don't retell it with exactness

There was some person who was getting in line for Holy Communion, as he did, he said something aloud and move in to receive the precious Body and Blood of our Lord, few moments later the priest noticed that he spate in his hand and froze, starring at the icon of the most holy Theotokos. The priest quickly dispatched the deacon to check out what is going on or if  there is a sacrilege. When the deacon look up close, he noticed that person's mouth burned up, he was shaking and holding something burned up in his hand.

It turned out, that he was a member of a schismatic group, and didn't go to confession...
« Last Edit: April 04, 2017, 01:05:23 PM by Vanhyo »

Offline urg8rb8

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #705 on: April 04, 2017, 05:50:13 PM »
There are some dangers of receiving Holy Communion from the Church without proper preparation and being a member.

This is a story which was made known to me some time ago, forgive me if i don't retell it with exactness

There was some person who was getting in line for Holy Communion, as he did, he said something aloud and move in to receive the precious Body and Blood of our Lord, few moments later the priest noticed that he spate in his hand and froze, starring at the icon of the most holy Theotokos. The priest quickly dispatched the deacon to check out what is going on or if  there is a sacrilege. When the deacon look up close, he noticed that person's mouth burned up, he was shaking and holding something burned up in his hand.

It turned out, that he was a member of a schismatic group, and didn't go to confession...

That's crazy!
"Open my lips, Lord, and my mouth will declare your praise." - Psalm 51:15

Offline servulus

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #706 on: April 05, 2017, 07:44:42 AM »
Not all Eastern Catholics are Melkites.  Many ECs have been Latinized.  Melkites have not.
Having a Catholic pope is not a latinization?

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #707 on: April 05, 2017, 02:04:04 PM »
The whole Immaculate Conception debate between Orthodox and RC's is really hard to grasp, I imagine Melkites may have wrapped settled down a combination of both. Just ignored the whole issue.

Fixed.
Mostly yes, apparently, lol

But I've debated with an Eastern Catholic who showed the weirdest mixed theories, I imagine the most intellectualised Melkites have tried hard to sort it out.

Not all Eastern Catholics are Melkites.  Many ECs have been Latinized.  Melkites have not.

Beardless bishops


Vesments on nuns are certainly not EO ones
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #708 on: April 05, 2017, 02:16:11 PM »
The whole forum is Mor. We're emanations of his godlike mind.

Actually, Mor's face shineth like the Sun.

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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #709 on: April 05, 2017, 02:22:42 PM »
^^ that's simply a result of not having monasteries by the Antiochian Archidiocese in the Americas.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #710 on: April 05, 2017, 02:38:09 PM »
^^ that's simply a result of not having monasteries by the Antiochian Archidiocese in the Americas.

Perhaps.  I think bishops look weird without beards, but I feel that way about most men.  ^His Grace is no exception.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #711 on: April 05, 2017, 02:43:19 PM »
^^ that's simply a result of not having monasteries by the Antiochian Archidiocese in the Americas.

Perhaps.  I think bishops look weird without beards, but I feel that way about most men.  ^His Grace is no exception.
+1 And really, not only bishops, but men in general - I hardly find any attraction toward beardless men :P
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #712 on: April 05, 2017, 02:48:50 PM »
^^ that's simply a result of not having monasteries by the Antiochian Archidiocese in the Americas.

Perhaps.  I think bishops look weird without beards, but I feel that way about most men.  ^His Grace is no exception.
+1 And really, not only bishops, but men in general - I hardly find any attraction toward beardless men :P

Only women should be beardless.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #713 on: April 06, 2017, 12:46:11 AM »
^^ that's simply a result of not having monasteries by the Antiochian Archidiocese in the Americas.

Perhaps.  I think bishops look weird without beards, but I feel that way about most men.  ^His Grace is no exception.
+1 And really, not only bishops, but men in general - I hardly find any attraction toward beardless men :P

Only women should be beardless.
I can kind of cope with the sight of beardless young boys, but if they reach 16 without at least some hair, they may have been misgendered.
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Re: Can I, a Melkite, receive communion at an Antiochian Orthodox church
« Reply #714 on: April 06, 2017, 04:38:05 AM »
I can kind of cope with the sight of beardless young boys, but if they reach 16 without at least some hair, they may have been misgendered.
US Military & Firefighters require beardlessness.

I can agree though that beardless priests to me look like their hair treatment is coming from the Western Tradition or influence.
Other examples are pews, church organs, High Protestant-style choir gowns, baroque-period 3D style ikons, white collars like Protestants and Catholics wear. These features are common or occasional among Orthodox in the US.




Bp. Chornock, 1938 (not sure if he has a beard, but the garb could be found not infrequently at the time)

These practices started fairly early in the post-Alaska phase of the US immigrant churches here.
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