Author Topic: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text  (Read 3032 times)

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Offline HaydenTE

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Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« on: February 26, 2016, 03:49:36 PM »
I've recently ordered an icon of the Prophet Moses, and I'd like to know what's written on the scroll hanging over his arm.

If anyone could translate, I'd be much obliged.
"For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul?" - Mark 8:36 (DRA)

Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2016, 05:06:23 PM »
That's Deuteronomy 32:43

"εὐφράνθητε οὐρανοί ἅμα αὐτῷ καὶ προσκυνησάτωσαν αὐτῷ πάντες ἄγγελοι"

From Brenton's:

"Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him."

Except that the icon omitted the next word of the Greek text, "Θεοῦ", which translates to "of God".
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

Check my blog "Em Espírito e em Verdade" (in Portuguese)

Offline HaydenTE

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2016, 05:51:32 PM »
That's Deuteronomy 32:43

"εὐφράνθητε οὐρανοί ἅμα αὐτῷ καὶ προσκυνησάτωσαν αὐτῷ πάντες ἄγγελοι"

From Brenton's:

"Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him."

Except that the icon omitted the next word of the Greek text, "Θεοῦ", which translates to "of God".

Thank you!
"For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul?" - Mark 8:36 (DRA)

Offline Cognomen

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2016, 11:20:07 PM »
Hope you don't mind if I jump in too, HaydenTE.

Would the writing in the first icon be a segment of the writing in the second? If so, which parts specifically are shown in the top one?

I apologize for the massive second picture.




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Online MalpanaGiwargis

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2016, 06:43:37 AM »
It is not the same text, but it follows the text in your second icon. The second icon is from Jonah 2:3; the first icon appears to be the second half of that verse. The first line and the first word of the second line say "from the womb of Hades." I'm having trouble parsing the rest of it.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2016, 06:43:54 AM by MalpanaGiwargis »
Woe is me, that I have read the commandments,
   and have become learned in the Scriptures,
and have been instructed in Your glories,
   and yet I have become occupied in shameful things!

(Giwargis Warda, On Compunction of Soul)

Offline Cognomen

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2016, 12:28:44 PM »
Thanks very much for giving it a crack, MalpanaGiwargis. That is helpful to know.
If anything I have posted has been illuminating, please remember that I merely reflect the light of others...but also it's me.

Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2016, 11:04:53 PM »
Cognomen PM'd me into the thread but I can't really help. I'm cracking my head on the rest of St. Jonah's icon too.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 11:05:11 PM by RaphaCam »
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

Check my blog "Em Espírito e em Verdade" (in Portuguese)

Offline Romaios

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2016, 09:14:50 AM »
The Greek spelling is somewhat mistaken (ι is written instead of η and even ε). It should read: Ὁ προφήτης Ἰωνὰς ἐν τῷ κήτει. Ἐκ κοιλίας ᾄδου ἐῤῥύσατό με. ("The prophet Jonah in the whale - From the womb of Hades <He> delivered me").

The declension of κῆτος,-ους is also wrong (the dative is κήτει - 3rd declension, not κίτῳ - 2nd declension).

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2016, 10:43:40 AM »
Romaios!!!
The whole forum is Mor. We're emanations of his godlike mind.

Actually, Mor's face shineth like the Sun.

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2016, 10:48:39 AM »
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2016, 09:16:16 PM »
The Greek spelling is somewhat mistaken (ι is written instead of η and even ε). It should read: Ὁ προφήτης Ἰωνὰς ἐν τῷ κήτει. Ἐκ κοιλίας ᾄδου ἐῤῥύσατό με. ("The prophet Jonah in the whale - From the womb of Hades <He> delivered me").

The declension of κῆτος,-ους is also wrong (the dative is κήτει - 3rd declension, not κίτῳ - 2nd declension).

Thanks! I'm used to respelling Greek words when working with Coptic, but it didn't occur to me to try that in Greek!
Woe is me, that I have read the commandments,
   and have become learned in the Scriptures,
and have been instructed in Your glories,
   and yet I have become occupied in shameful things!

(Giwargis Warda, On Compunction of Soul)

Offline Cognomen

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Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2017, 08:04:39 AM »
Translation appreciated:

« Last Edit: February 04, 2017, 08:07:09 AM by hecma925 »
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline Apostolos

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2017, 11:00:51 AM »
St. Pelagia:
Ὅστις σῶμα ἐνίκησεν, οὗτος φύσιν ἐνίκησεν· ὁ δὲ (τὴν) φύσιν νικήσας, οὗτος ὑπὲρ φύσιν ἐγένετο.
He who has conquered his body has conquered nature; and he who has conquered nature has
certainly risen above nature.
St. John Climacus, The Ladder of Divine Ascent, Step 15:7

St. James the Ascetic's scroll is probably an extract from his personal prayer from within the sepulcher where he spent 15 years:
Ὁ Θεός ὁ τοὺς κατεῤῥαγμένους ἐξανιστῶν καὶ παρασκευάζων τοὺς ἐχθροὺς ἡμῶν κόπτεσθαι ἡνίκα ἄν μετανοῶμεν
God, who rises the contrite and provides for our enemies, mourns whether we repent (or not)...or something like that
Ἦχος Βαρύς

Ὁπλιτικῆς φάλαγγος οἰκεῖον μέλος
ὁ τοῦ βάρους σὺ κλῆσιν εἰληφῶς φέρεις.
Ἧχον τὸν ἁπλοῦν τὸν βάρους ἐπώνυμον
ὁ τοὺς λογισμοὺς ἐν βοαῖς μισῶν φιλεῖ.
Ἀνδρῶν δὲ ἄσμα δευτερότριτε βρέμεις.
Ὧν ποικίλος δὲ τοὺς ἁπλούς ἔχεις φίλους.

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2017, 02:09:19 AM »
Thank you.
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline HaydenTE

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2017, 11:29:10 PM »
I am well aware of the icon's less than orthodox origins and that this is the Greek forum, but I would like to know what the Arabic means.
"For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul?" - Mark 8:36 (DRA)

Online MalpanaGiwargis

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2017, 12:08:33 AM »
I am well aware of the icon's less than orthodox origins and that this is the Greek forum, but I would like to know what the Arabic means.


Mother of God

and

Jesus Christ
Woe is me, that I have read the commandments,
   and have become learned in the Scriptures,
and have been instructed in Your glories,
   and yet I have become occupied in shameful things!

(Giwargis Warda, On Compunction of Soul)

Offline rakovsky

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2017, 12:39:03 AM »
MalpanaGiwargis,

Can I ask what is your church?
Your knowledge is impressive.
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

Online MalpanaGiwargis

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2017, 09:12:40 AM »
MalpanaGiwargis,

Can I ask what is your church?
Your knowledge is impressive.

Canonically Roman Catholic, attend a Byzantine Catholic parish, admirer of Orthodoxy, Eastern and Oriental. Generally confused about where I belong.
Woe is me, that I have read the commandments,
   and have become learned in the Scriptures,
and have been instructed in Your glories,
   and yet I have become occupied in shameful things!

(Giwargis Warda, On Compunction of Soul)

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2017, 02:48:25 AM »
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline rakovsky

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2017, 10:02:55 AM »
The ocean, impassable by men, and the world beyond it are directed by the same ordinances of the Master. ~ I Clement 20

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2017, 12:15:52 PM »
I know who he is.  Can you translate what is on the scroll?
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2017, 12:30:41 PM »
I think it's "Children, be in peace with yourselves and do not be arrogant!"
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

Check my blog "Em Espírito e em Verdade" (in Portuguese)

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2017, 03:16:38 AM »
Thanks!
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #24 on: July 02, 2017, 02:36:20 AM »
Ss. John Chrysosotom and Basil the Great
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline Apostolos

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #25 on: July 02, 2017, 07:53:03 AM »
^^The scroll in the hands of st. John Chrysostom has the prayer of oblation: "Ὁ Θεός, ὁ Θεὸς ἡμῶν, ὁ τὸν οὐράνιον ἄρτον, τὴν τροφὴν τοῦ παντὸς κόσμου, τὸν Κύριον ἡμῶν καὶ Θεὸν Ἰησοῦν Χριστόν, ἐξαποστείλας σωτῆρα καὶ λυτρωτὴν καὶ εὐεργέτην, εὐλογοῦντα καὶ ἁγιάζοντα ἡμᾶς".
"O God, our God, Who didst send forth the Heavenly Bread, the food of the whole world, our Lord and God, Jesus Christ, the Savior and Redeemer and Benefactor Who blesseth and sanctifieth us".

The st Basil's scroll (on the right) has the prayer recited by the priest during the Cherubic hymn: "Οὐδεὶς ἄξιος τῶν συνδεδεμένων ταῖς σαρκικαῖς ἐπιθυμίαις καὶ ἡδοναῖς προσέρχεσθαι ἢ προσεγγίζειν ἢ λειτουργεῖν σοι, Βασιλεῦ τῆς δόξης".
"None is worthy among those that are bound with fleshly desires and pleasures, to approach, or draw near, or minister to thee, O King of glory".
Ἦχος Βαρύς

Ὁπλιτικῆς φάλαγγος οἰκεῖον μέλος
ὁ τοῦ βάρους σὺ κλῆσιν εἰληφῶς φέρεις.
Ἧχον τὸν ἁπλοῦν τὸν βάρους ἐπώνυμον
ὁ τοὺς λογισμοὺς ἐν βοαῖς μισῶν φιλεῖ.
Ἀνδρῶν δὲ ἄσμα δευτερότριτε βρέμεις.
Ὧν ποικίλος δὲ τοὺς ἁπλούς ἔχεις φίλους.

Offline hecma925

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Re: Need Help Translating an Icon's Text
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2017, 07:54:18 AM »
Thank you, Apostolos!
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"