Author Topic: Landmark Forum, est  (Read 1541 times)

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Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Landmark Forum, est
« on: January 25, 2015, 09:26:47 PM »
Hey y'all,

 My wife signed us up for Netflix last week and I've been glued to the Documentary section.  One of the docu's I watched was on Werner Erhard and his "est" training.  He later skipped the country, selling est before he left and out of his teachings grew the Landmark Forum.  From what I can gather, from it proponents and opponents both, is that it is a boot camp for self-help and personal transformation. 

 Any y'all heard of it?  I'm really intrigued about it.
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Offline Minnesotan

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2015, 09:35:22 PM »
I do know that some people have compared Landmark and est to a cult.
I'm not going to be posting as much on OC.Net as before. I might stop in once in a while though. But I've come to realize that real life is more important.

Offline Georgii

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2015, 09:39:48 PM »
Back in the 1970s I was staying with my Dad in the same hotel complex in either New Hampshire or Vermont where some est activities were going on, and even without seeing or hearing what was happening in that building my sixth sense or whatever was screaming: "Danger! Cult!"

That's not very factual or verifiable, but it is a strong memory.
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Offline biro

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2015, 09:48:10 PM »
Very New Age and unsafe. They may have tried to put a better face on themselves these days, but they certainly did start out as a cult.
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Offline LBK

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2015, 11:02:05 PM »
I second all of the responses. It's at best a worthless exercise, at worst dangerous.
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Offline minasoliman

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2015, 01:13:50 AM »
Dear all,

Please when you start a new thread in FFA, you must choose to put it in non-religious or religious topics.  I'm moving this to non-religious topics, but please try to remember that next time.

God bless.

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Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2015, 09:17:03 PM »
For anyone-  What in particular is dangerous, New Age, or cult like about it?  I've been reading quite a few articles on it, both pro's and con's.  The con's seem to have not been involved first hand and reacting only upon hearsay. 
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Offline biro

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2015, 09:30:15 PM »
Not true. Stephen Pressman spoke to a lot of people who were at the original lectures. He wrote "Outrageous Betrayal" about those experiences. Fr. Mitch Pacwa, a Roman Catholic priest and writer who appears on EWTN, wrote in his book "Catholics and the New Age," that at the EST conferences, people were locked in and harangued for hours, not even allowed to get up to use the restroom - with the result that they went to the bathroom all over themselves. They reported physical pain and hallucinations.

The documentary you saw was probably made by his supporters.

I strongly suggest that you read Pressman and Pacwa before you decide this person was a sweet little lamb who just happens to have some ticked-off former friends. It is a lot worse than that.
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Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2015, 10:26:58 PM »
The documentary didn't seem one-sided to me.  I've tried to look up Fr. Pacwa's comments on it to no avail; haven't been able to find it.   But, I did plenty of online articles written by skeptics-turned-believers who didn't seem "cultish".  Seems to me that the detractors were either Scientologists who lost potential members from folks who took the Landmark class (which is only one weekend), or from folks who didn't get out of it what they'd hoped to.  After a little more studying up on it, it seems that all it is is Cognitive Behavioral Therapy.  Now, maybe the EST sessions with Werner Erhard were a little hardcore, but since he's voluntarily sold it to his team, the 'cultishness' has disappeared.

But, anything's possible I reckon.  I was hoping for first hand info on it, but so far all I've got is hearsay, which is just a fancy way of saying 'gossip'. 

"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying

Offline NicholasMyra

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Re: Landmark Forum, est
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2015, 10:30:57 PM »
One of the docu's I watched was on Werner Erhard and his "est" training.  He later skipped the country, selling est before he left and out of his teachings grew the Landmark Forum.  From what I can gather, from it proponents and opponents both, is that it is a boot camp for self-help and personal transformation. 

Based on these three sentences I will hedge my bets against it.
Quote from: Fr. Thomas Hopko, dystopian parable of the prodigal son
...you can imagine so-called healing services of the pigpen. The books that could be written, you know: Life in the Pigpen. How to Cope in the Pigpen. Being Happy in the Pigpen. Surviving in the Pigpen. And then there could be counselling, for people who feel unhappy in the pigpen, to try to get them to come to terms with the pigpen, and to accept the pigpen.