Author Topic: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"  (Read 1337 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Inquirer

  • Antihyperaphthartodocetist
  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 326
Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« on: November 03, 2014, 04:26:36 PM »
I think if you asked the average person on the street in the USA if the Bulgarian Orthodox and Greek Orthodox were different religions or believed greatly different things, he would likely say yes. (Of course, he likely wouldn't be able to find Greece or Bulgaria on a map, but that's beside the point.)

I also read frequently that there's some problem with perceived ethnocentrism in the various Orthodox traditions, true or not.

So how about instead of calling your home church "St. Graphite the Pencilhealer Russian Orthodox Church", you call it "St. Graphite Orthodox Church of Russian Tradition" or "St. Graphite Orthodox Church under authority of the ROCOR"?

I mean, it's a mouthful, but it immediately liquidates the problems of (a) bad PR and (b) perceived ethnocentrism.

« Last Edit: November 03, 2014, 04:27:33 PM by Inquirer »
"[The Sacred Congregation of Rites'] decisions are made by a crowd of dirty little Monsignori at Rome in utter ignorance of the meaning or reason of anything. To the historian their decisions are simply disgusting nonsense, that people of my kind want simply to ignore." -- Fr. Adrian Fortescue

Offline podkarpatska

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,732
  • Pokrov
    • ACROD (home)
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2014, 04:48:59 PM »
I think if you asked the average person on the street in the USA if the Bulgarian Orthodox and Greek Orthodox were different religions or believed greatly different things, he would likely say yes. (Of course, he likely wouldn't be able to find Greece or Bulgaria on a map, but that's beside the point.)

I also read frequently that there's some problem with perceived ethnocentrism in the various Orthodox traditions, true or not.

So how about instead of calling your home church "St. Graphite the Pencilhealer Russian Orthodox Church", you call it "St. Graphite Orthodox Church of Russian Tradition" or "St. Graphite Orthodox Church under authority of the ROCOR"?

I mean, it's a mouthful, but it immediately liquidates the problems of (a) bad PR and (b) perceived ethnocentrism.



I suspect that'll happen when St. Volodomyr Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church becomes St. Vladimir's Eastern Catholic Church in union with the Pope of Rome of the Galician Ukrainian Tradition.  ;)

Seriously, the 'problem' is simply solved by simply saying: St. So and so Orthodox Church as is becoming more and more the norm in North America in many jurisdictions - even that of the Greeks. ( But in parishes where it is not perceived to be a problem, it will remain St. So and So 'Blavanian' Orthodox Church probably forever...)
« Last Edit: November 03, 2014, 04:51:43 PM by podkarpatska »

Offline TheTrisagion

  • Hoplitarches
  • *************
  • Posts: 17,814
  • All good things come to an end
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2014, 04:54:00 PM »
We just go by St. John Chrystostom Orthodox Church or St. John's for short.  I think our sign might say Antiochian, but we don't really use it in the title of our church
God bless!

Offline Inquirer

  • Antihyperaphthartodocetist
  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 326
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2014, 04:58:01 PM »
I think if you asked the average person on the street in the USA if the Bulgarian Orthodox and Greek Orthodox were different religions or believed greatly different things, he would likely say yes. (Of course, he likely wouldn't be able to find Greece or Bulgaria on a map, but that's beside the point.)

I also read frequently that there's some problem with perceived ethnocentrism in the various Orthodox traditions, true or not.

So how about instead of calling your home church "St. Graphite the Pencilhealer Russian Orthodox Church", you call it "St. Graphite Orthodox Church of Russian Tradition" or "St. Graphite Orthodox Church under authority of the ROCOR"?

I mean, it's a mouthful, but it immediately liquidates the problems of (a) bad PR and (b) perceived ethnocentrism.



I suspect that'll happen when St. Volodomyr Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church becomes St. Vladimir's Eastern Catholic Church in union with the Pope of Rome of the Galician Ukrainian Tradition.  ;)

Seriously, the 'problem' is simply solved by simply saying: St. So and so Orthodox Church as is becoming more and more the norm in North America in many jurisdictions - even that of the Greeks. ( But in parishes where it is not perceived to be a problem, it will remain St. So and So 'Blavanian' Orthodox Church probably forever...)

well thats justified. The blavanians are a very oppressed people.
"[The Sacred Congregation of Rites'] decisions are made by a crowd of dirty little Monsignori at Rome in utter ignorance of the meaning or reason of anything. To the historian their decisions are simply disgusting nonsense, that people of my kind want simply to ignore." -- Fr. Adrian Fortescue

Offline Alveus Lacuna

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,336
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2014, 06:01:35 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"

Offline Nephi

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,829
  • A non-Chalcedonian in Chalcedonian clothing.
  • Faith: Orthodox
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2014, 06:32:06 PM »
We just go by St. John Chrystostom Orthodox Church or St. John's for short.  I think our sign might say Antiochian, but we don't really use it in the title of our church

As an aside, I think "Antiochian" might be one of the more inclusive names since the average person will not know what it means or refers to, much less identify it with a specific ethnic community. Even American Protestant churches, communities, etc. have "Antioch" in them. E.g. "Antioch Baptist Church."

Offline LBK

  • No Reporting Allowed
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,540
  • Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!
  • Faith: Orthodox
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2014, 06:49:14 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"

I have come across a church whose patrons are the Fathers of the First Ecumenical Council. A very rare patronage, sure, but note that the saints are the patrons, not the council itself.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2014, 06:49:34 PM by LBK »
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

Offline Minnesotan

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,329
  • Milo Thatch is the ONLY Milo for me. #FreeAtlantis
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2014, 07:47:45 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"

I once saw a Calvinist church named after Chalcedon, which made me chuckle, because if time travel existed and any Calvinists actually went back there, what do you think the reaction to them would have been?
I'm not going to be posting as much on OC.Net as before. I might stop in once in a while though. But I've come to realize that real life is more important.

Offline Shlomlokh

  • 主哀れめよ!
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,356
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Bulgarian/GOA
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2014, 07:58:24 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"
Or the earthquake in Constantinople.

In Christ,
Andrew
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline Paisius

  • Ditry Pope-loving ecumenist
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,341
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Depends on the mood
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2014, 11:17:37 AM »
I imagine the use of ethic identifiers will decrease over time. For now it's a convenient way of at least partially identifying yourself. If someone asks me about my faith and I say "I'm Orthodox" they say "so you're Jewish?" So I usually add either "Russian" or "Greek" to it so they at least understand I'm a Christian. Of course then invariably I get asked "so you're Greek?"

Offline scamandrius

  • A man of many, many turns
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,243
  • Faith: Greek Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: DOWAMA of AANA
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2014, 11:47:17 AM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"
Or the earthquake in Constantinople.

In Christ,
Andrew

I'd go to that church!
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Offline Shlomlokh

  • 主哀れめよ!
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,356
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Bulgarian/GOA
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2014, 12:08:26 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"
Or the earthquake in Constantinople.

In Christ,
Andrew

I'd go to that church!
St. Earthquake Orthodox Church!
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline mabsoota

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,859
  • Kyrie eleison
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox (Coptic)
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2014, 12:23:28 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"

I once saw a Calvinist church named after Chalcedon, which made me chuckle, because if time travel existed and any Calvinists actually went back there, what do you think the reaction to them would have been?

that's funny!
i imagine them getting told off for being bad catechumens and being ordered to crush beans for the evening's hummus as their penance...

Offline CopticDeacon

  • Αναγνώστης(Reader) in the God-loving Diocese of New York and New England
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 646
  • St. Macarius, the Spirit Bearer, Pray for Us!
Re: Why "X Orthodox" and not "Orthodox of X Tradition"
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2014, 12:30:35 PM »
Are there any churches named after ecumenical councils? "Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicea Orthodox Church"
Or the earthquake in Constantinople.

In Christ,
Andrew

I'd go to that church!
St. Earthquake Orthodox Church!

Sts. Earthquake and Graphite, fools for Christ,  Pray to the Lord on our behalf!  I love this thread.
"I see the heavens opened up, and the Son of Man seated at the right hand of God"
-St. Stephen the Archdeacon and Protomartyr