Author Topic: The Hip-Hop Thread  (Read 23848 times)

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Offline Matthew777

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The Hip-Hop Thread
« on: May 09, 2005, 01:13:51 AM »
Does anyone on this forum enjoy real hip-hip? If so, do you have any album recomendations? I am not talking about gangster rap or the thugs on the radio who have no talent (Master P, Puff Daddy, etc.) but the artistic rappers who create their own complex beats and write witty lyrics.
I really dig the Beastie Boys. Though many only know them for their first hit "Fight for Your Right", they've really matured since then. I would recomend the Sounds of Science, their anthology, for a solid introduction to the group.
I also like John Reuben and Furthermore, which are Christian hip-hop groups that do not sound derivative like other Christian acts.
Now, I am starting to listen to the Roots and I've heard that Things Fall Apart is one of the best rap albums ever recorded. The Roots play their own instraments, use jazz elements in their sound, and provide thought-provoking political commentary in their lyrics. 
Oh, man. Next to classic rock and punk, hip-hop has got to be my favorite style. But then again, I am very picky about which hip-hop I listen to.
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2005, 01:20:59 AM »
Uh, Master P is one of the most brilliant hip hop artists and entrepreneurs around. Don't you know that he is the reason that people can actually make money in hip hop because he revolutionized the idea of artists recording on their own labels? His song "bout it bout it" from 1996 was a real classic.

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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2005, 01:21:58 AM »
Some of the best lyrics were by Biggie Smalls and Tupac. They had the best lyrics but unfortunately had lots of profanity.  Best music had to be Dr Dre from the Chronic album.
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Offline Robert

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2005, 01:22:07 AM »
Anything DRE
Lil' Jon
Ludacris
David Banner

Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2005, 01:22:46 AM »
Outcast's 1990's teamup with Mystikal was great too!
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2005, 01:22:57 AM »
Uh, Master P is one of the most brilliant hip hop artists and entrepreneurs around.

Really? Then perhaps I am only thinking of the stereotype of Master P. Do you have any song recomendations?
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Offline Robert

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2005, 01:23:06 AM »
yea i got all the chronic albums. they're quality.

Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2005, 01:25:05 AM »
Anything DRE
Lil' Jon
Ludacris

Um... Perhaps a little too corporate for my tastes. I could be mistaken.

David Banner

I've never heard of him. I'll look that up. Thank you.
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Offline Robert

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2005, 01:25:59 AM »
Juvenile
Old skool - Onyx


Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2005, 01:31:02 AM »
There is a difference between mainstream "gangster" acts like Dr. Dre and progressive hip-hop artists like the Roots.
Though the Beastie Boys are incredibly popular, I really dig them because they don't follow any trends. They play their own instruments, cut their own loops and beats, write witty lyrics, and do not follow any gangster sterotypes.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 01:33:05 AM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2005, 01:32:19 AM »
There is a difference between mainstream "gangster" acts like Dr. Dre and progressive hip-hop artists like the Roots.

True but just because something is mainstream doesn't mean it is bad.
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2005, 01:33:47 AM »


Really? Then perhaps I am only thinking of the stereotype of Master P. Do you have any song recomendations?

No, it's been such a long time. You probably wouldn't like his music though because he is "commercial," but his true contribution is as I said in freeing artists.

Now that I think about it, Nas is probably the best lyricist ever. Have you heard any of his tracks such as "If I Ruled the World" etc? Now that is quality.  He is against fake gangstas and even wrote a whole song dissing Jay-Z as the phoney that he really is. Now that is quality ;)

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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #12 on: May 09, 2005, 01:34:43 AM »
True but just because something is mainstream doesn't mean it is bad.

That is true. I just don't usually listen to anything that fits into any ganster stereotypes.
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2005, 01:38:39 AM »


That is true. I just don't usually listen to anything that fits into any ganster stereotypes.

Ah, but by accepting stereotypes aren't you fitting into mainstream yourself? lol

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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2005, 01:45:55 AM »
As for a Christian group, I also recomend Grits, especially if you like Outkast.
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2005, 02:10:41 AM »

Now that I think about it, Nas is probably the best lyricist ever.

Have you listened to Illmatic?

Have you heard any of his tracks such as "If I Ruled the World" etc? Now that is quality. 

I am downloading it now. Thanks.
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Offline optxogokcoc

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2005, 03:20:32 AM »
Hip hop.... NOOOOOOOO.

Each to their own I suppose. (I dont listen to serbian "Turbo-folk" music either)...



Offline EkhristosAnesti

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2005, 04:16:24 AM »
I stopped listening to Dr Dre, B.I.G and Nas when i was 15. That's when I realised that it's no longer cool to listen to that sort of crap unless you are actually so screwed up to be able to empathise with the sort of things they rap about.

Props to Cross Movement. Some of their songs have the best Christian lyrics I’ve ever heard. They have a rhythmical style on par with Eminem and Tech N9ne, and they generally have a very Mobb Deep feel to them. I don't want to generalise too much though because they manage to bring so much variety to the table. Oh and they definitely never disappoint when it comes down to delivery and flow.

Recommended songs:

-   What do you see
-   Father Forgive them
-   Closer to You
-   I Love You Jesus
-   Remember

Peace.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 04:19:53 AM by EkhristosAnesti »
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2005, 11:22:13 AM »
Does anyone listen to Jurassic Five?
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2005, 11:24:50 AM »


Hip hop.... NOOOOOOOO.

Each to their own I suppose. (I dont listen to serbian "Turbo-folk" music either)...




Man I love Serbian techno folk!  But of course I also like "real" Serbian folk music.  Techno folk, though, I love Osman Hadjic's* Moja Prva Luba ;)

Anastasios

*I am sure with a name like that he is Bosnian but we all know they speak Serbian ;)
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2005, 02:29:42 PM »
Sweet...

The Beastie Boys: Sabotage
I Can't Stand It I Know You Planned It
I'm Gonna Set It Straight, This Watergate
I Can't Stand Rocking When I'm In Here
Because Your Crystal Ball Ain't So Crystal Clear
So While You Sit Back and Wonder Why
I Got This Fucking Thorn In My Side
Oh My, It's A Mirage
I'm Tellin' Y'all It's Sabotage

So Listen Up 'Cause You Can't Say Nothin'
You'll Shut Me Down With A Push Of Your Button?
But Yo I'm Out And I'm Gone
I'll Tell You Now I Keep It On And On

'Cause What You See You Might Not Get
And We Can Bet So Don't You Get Souped Yet
You're Scheming On A Thing That's A Mirage
I'm Trying To Tell You Now It's Sabotage

Whyyy; Our Backs Are Now Against The Wall
Listen All Of Y'all It's A Sabotage
Listen All Of Y'all It's A Sabotage
Listen All Of Y'all It's A Sabotage
Listen All Of Y'all It's A Sabotage

I Can't Stand It, I Know You Planned It
But I'm Gonna Set It Straight This Watergate
But I Can't Stand Rockin' When I'm In This Place
Because I Feel Disgrace Because You're All In My Face
But Make No Mistakes And Switch Up My Channel
I'm Buddy Rich When I Fly Off The Handle
What Could It Be, It's A Mirage
You're Scheming On A Thing - That's Sabotage
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Offline Sabbas

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2005, 04:53:03 PM »
Some of the best lyrics were by Biggie Smalls and Tupac. They had the best lyrics but unfortunately had lots of profanity. Best music had to be Dr Dre from the Chronic album.
I am really suprised at what you are saying. When I converted to Orthodoxy I threw out all my rap albums. As much as I do empathize with Tupac Shakur I think a lot of his songs are fueling violence and mistreatment of women. He was also a jerk to many people once he became popular. However I am shocked that you can say the Chronic album was good. I do not think one of the songs on that album has anything respectable or good in it that isn't marred by the evil of profanity, violence, and perverted sexual lyrics. I just cannot understand how you can think it is okay to listen to songs with artists yelling, "Yeah muthaf***a!," "B**ches ain't s**t but h**s and tricks," "real killa droppin' bombs like Hiroshima," and the rest of that crap.

Quote
Now that I think about it, Nas is probably the best lyricist ever
While I did like his song "One Love," which does accurately describe what it is like to have a friend doing hard time while his family goes to hell, I still do not think he can be described as a good guy.

I will ask you the same thing Fr.Seraphim asked a young man who came to his monastery and listened to Rock music, "How can you reconcile that with Orthodoxy?" When I converted I stopped listening to Rap music. It is not good for your nerves and destroys clear thinking. I think St.Nikodemos the Hagiorite would be shocked by you guys thinking that listening to such sensual, jarring music can be reconciled with the Orthodox lifestyle.

Of course I have an idea what your response will be,

"You tryin' to check my homie you best check ya'self 'cause when ya dis Dre ya dis ya'self, muthaf***a!"
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 05:04:26 PM by Sabbas »
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2005, 06:26:03 PM »
It is not good for your nerves and destroys clear thinking.

Christian hip-hop can actually be rather good for one's spiritual life, if you pick the right group. Furthermore, mainstream acts that do not focus on gangster themes are fun to listen to also. I'll always be a Beastie Boys fan!!!
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Offline Sabbas

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2005, 06:46:20 PM »


Christian hip-hop can actually be rather good for one's spiritual life, if you pick the right group. Furthermore, mainstream acts that do not focus on gangster themes are fun to listen to also. I'll always be a Beastie Boys fan!!!
Pentecostals do the same thing with music. They say it makes them feel spiritual. No offense Matthew but you recently told us you would chant the Jesus prayer to Shankar to make you feel spiritual. Such emphasis on mushy or uplifting feelings is not Orthodox. When I was a hedonist and Atheist a lot of things made me feel good but many of them were very sinful not spiritual. Often when we do very good things we feel nothing. What is important is that I am doing what is right not worrying about how I feel.
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Offline cizinec

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2005, 06:55:14 PM »
Go tell the punks  and postpunks that the well-crafted sound has fallen to pieces.  Henry Rollins dwells here no more, there is no more punkular laurel, no Oi!ing sprint, and the voice of the Pixies has been silenced.

Punk is dead. 

Oi! Oi! Oi!
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2005, 06:56:59 PM »
Christian hip-hop is great because of the Christ-centered lyrics and moral themes. This isn't about how it makes one "feel good", this is about good music with a great message.
 I'm sorry but only a weirdo would think he is "too Orthodox" for some good music. ;)
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 07:05:36 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2005, 07:07:17 PM »
Punk is dead. 

Good thing this is a hip-hop thread, then. :)

As for punk, it will always be alive as long as Rancid makes music.
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Offline Sabbas

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2005, 07:30:45 PM »
Christian hip-hop is great because of the Christ-centered lyrics and moral themes. This isn't about how it makes one "feel good", this is about good music with a great message.
 I'm sorry but only a weirdo would think he is "too Orthodox" for some good music.  ;)
Matthew you are just not getting it. Rap music plays on the senses in a way that is unhealthy. The Cthonic beats it utilizes are similar to what primitives do when the beat on drums an whip themselves into a dancing frenzy. It is unChristian and pagan in the extreme. Beats aside I do understand that some Rap songs have good lyrics but reading lyrics is quite different from listening to the music behind them.
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Offline PhosZoe

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #28 on: May 09, 2005, 07:57:52 PM »
There is no way the Beastie Boy  could ever be "gangsta" Mike D. AKA Michael Diamond is the son of Neil Diamond. 

Also, since when is Rancid punk? If the band was born post 1985 it's post punk. The actual scene died long before you were born.

Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2005, 08:22:46 PM »
The Cthonic beats it utilizes are similar to what primitives do when the beat on drums an whip themselves into a dancing frenzy.

This is exactly what Bible-belt fundamentalists said about jazz, blues and then rock music. This does not stem from the music itself but the racial stereotypes associated with the music.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 08:24:53 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #30 on: May 09, 2005, 08:28:26 PM »


Of course I have an idea what your response will be,

"You tryin' to check my homie you best check ya'self 'cause when ya dis Dre ya dis ya'self, muthaf***a!"

Whatever. We are discussing the artistic merit of such albums. Note that I said it was unfortunate the amount of profanity used, etc.  I actually don't really listen to rap music all that much anymore anyway, because I recognize that it can be spiritually dangerous.  Your last line--my "response"--is actually quite ridiculous and shows you don't really care what my response would be so I give up and won't be saying anything else.

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Offline Matthew777

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #31 on: May 09, 2005, 08:45:23 PM »
There is no way the Beastie Boy could ever be "gangsta" Mike D. AKA Michael Diamond is the son of Neil Diamond.

Mike D is not even related to Neil Diamond.

Also, since when is Rancid punk? If the band was born post 1985 it's post punk. The actual scene died long before you were born.

The original punk movement may have died but there will always be good bands who carry on the style. We might as well say that rock music died with Elvis too.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 08:45:56 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Elisha

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #32 on: May 09, 2005, 09:27:09 PM »


Mike D is not even related to Neil Diamond.

And you can prove that how?  Maybe PhosZoe knows something you don't.

Offline cizinec

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #33 on: May 09, 2005, 10:46:18 PM »
Well, a paternity test would work

Let's order one!

Punk is dead (mostly).  It is for me.  Unfortunately(?) I grew out of it.  Now I listen to this hillbilly stuff my old man listened to when I was a kid.  Disgusting.  The other day I was listening to the "Texas Jukebox" on a local indie station.  I was really loving this song.  Then the anouncer came on and said, "that was George Jones . . ."  I had to stop the car because I was too sick to drive.

Okay okay.  I did buy one Dropkick Murphys CD after I got married. 

I still like some ska.  Ska isn't dead yet.  Right?
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 10:48:06 PM by cizinec »
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Offline Arystarcus

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2005, 10:55:16 PM »
Quote
Well, a paternity test would work

Let's order one!

Somebody call Maury Povich!  :laugh:  ;D

Offline Strelets

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #35 on: May 09, 2005, 11:05:23 PM »
All right, you boyz are scarin' me out. Da worst I evuh listened to was Depeche Mode and U2 and no b*tches or homeys got shot or stabbed. Word.
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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #36 on: May 09, 2005, 11:31:43 PM »
Nas
« Last Edit: May 09, 2005, 11:33:15 PM by Mor Ephrem »
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #37 on: May 09, 2005, 11:33:32 PM »
Fr. Stan Fortuna
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #38 on: May 09, 2005, 11:36:50 PM »
NWA
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

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Offline Bogoliubtsy

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #39 on: May 09, 2005, 11:39:38 PM »
Immortal Techique
"When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist". - Archbishop Hélder Pessoa Câmara

Offline Nacho

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #40 on: May 09, 2005, 11:40:36 PM »
Quote
All right, you boyz are scarin' me out.  Da worst I evuh listened to was Depeche Mode and U2 and no b*tches or homeys got shot or stabbed.  Word.

Ahh man, I have always been a big Depeche Mode and U2 fan......hope none of ya'll's b*tch slap me for being a wussy lol.. ;D
I'm actually a fan of most good music. Lately I've been diggin' Korn, Deftones, ColdPlay and the Beasties of late.
"If I find in myself a desire which no experience in this world can satisfy, the most probable explanation is that I was made for another world."--Mere Christianity

Offline Bogoliubtsy

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #41 on: May 09, 2005, 11:42:00 PM »
"When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist". - Archbishop Hélder Pessoa Câmara

Offline Donna Rose

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #42 on: May 10, 2005, 02:06:05 AM »
Quote
Fr. Stan Fortuna

LOL

my MOM actually gave me his CD....i barely got thru it once, but i still own it...somewhere....lol.
hmmmm...

Offline Elisha

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #43 on: May 10, 2005, 02:09:47 AM »


Ahh man, I have always been a big Depeche Mode and U2 fan......hope none of ya'll's b*tch slap me for being a wussy lol.. ;D
I'm actually a fan of most good music. Lately I've been diggin' Korn, Deftones, ColdPlay and the Beasties of late.
It's OK.  Depeche Mode has always been one of my favorites as well.

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: The Hip-Hop Thread
« Reply #44 on: May 10, 2005, 08:00:18 AM »
Josh, you can be MC Gusto. 
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