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Author Topic: Mormonism and why it is an evil cult that needs to be stopped.  (Read 13436 times) Average Rating: 0
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Zeezrom
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« Reply #90 on: October 28, 2005, 05:34:47 AM »

First of all,  Wowser.  Go home.  Pahoran is lonely. Wink

Anastasio wrote:
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does your Church tell missionaries not to try to lure people in with promises of friendship, love, and social connections?

I can state categorically that the Church does not try to lure people into the Church, period.  We offer what we have and encourage the investigator to ponder and pray for a witness of the Holy Spirit.

How old were you when these missionaries of whom you spoke told you you could marry a "hot chick" if you joined?  I am guessing you were probably close to the same age, and the missionaries' statement was lighthearted.  Certainly not to be taken seriously.  Ok?

The Church instructs the missionaries to teach investigators under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.  Converts should only be baptized after they have received a confirming witness from the Holy Spirit and are committed to keeping all of the commandments of the Lord as revealed through latter-day prophets.  It's not an easy commitment to make, and something more than the promise of a "hot chick" prompts people to make the commitment.

Ebor wrote:
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Bowing and kissing a picture (icon) might look absurd to an outsider.  The administering of communion with a little spoon might be another example

You guys do that?!?!?  Weird. Cheesy

Seriously Ebor, thanks for your comments.  I understand that this Board is not representative of mainstream OC, just as Wowser is not representative of mainstream LDS.
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« Reply #91 on: October 28, 2005, 05:47:32 AM »

Anyone that wants to know about mormonism should watch a film called the Godmakers. Totally exposes Joe Smith for the fraud he was. He was so noble that he was shot in jail by a hoard of angry men who were pissed off at him seducing wives & young women to marry him, thats some prophet.... Roll Eyes  Also, the whole book of mormon is a joke. It reads as if it were written by a third grader with totally debunked geography and people. To this date not a shred of evidence can back up this pack of lies. I found myself in constant amazement that anyone could take such a shoddy piece of work so seriously after reading through it. Mormonism claims that it is the true faith restored, but it's just about the farthest thing from 1st & 2nd century christian writings/tradition and what the church believed at the time. Who the hell would believe in the first place that suddenly after 1900 years of darkness that some magical scrolls descend from heaven which bears the text of the book of mormon in 16th century english? It's nice to know God wasn't taking his sweet time or anything, lets thank the mormons for getting us back on the right track after 1900 years of heretics....... Grin

I swore I wasn't coming back to this thread, but I must respond. The Godmakers does misrepresent the church. In fact, a number of protestant ministers have come forward and admitted as much. It has also been throughly documented as deceptive in the book "The Truth About The Godmakers" by Gilbert Scharffs.

Joseph Smith was shot by an angry mob. He is not the first or last to die for his faith. He wasn't killed for seducing their wives. There were many factors involved, polygamy being only one. The women he did marry were LDS though, not from the mobbers.

Evidence for the Book of Mormon. First off, let me state evidence still wouldn't change anyone's mind. Even if you could prove any church to be correct, some would still not believe. Also too, what would proof do? Religion is faith, and faith is believe in things not seen. Would there be any faith involved if it could be proven? There is a debate on evidence though, and if you care to see the other side of it, here is a  link for you. http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ Prowl around there and you can see the other side of pretty much any criticism of the church.

There were no magic scrolls decending from heaven. It doesn't sound like you know much about the church to voice such criticism. I did not come here to proselyte for the LDS church, but I won't not defend it from misrepresentation either.
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SouthSerb99
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« Reply #92 on: October 28, 2005, 08:04:05 AM »

Okay, unless some honest discussion begins in this thread, I'm going to lock it.
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« Reply #93 on: October 28, 2005, 09:39:31 AM »

Have you checked yours lately?  ÃƒÆ’‚ Wink  

 I am certain I will not be around long.  ÃƒÆ’‚ Any board that allows hatemongering to this extent is not likely to be comfortable with it being pointed out.  ÃƒÆ’‚  
Boy are you Mormons touchy.  By the very fact this is an Orthodox Christian forum, you are not going to find people praising your cult since they do not believe in it.  No one has been even slightly aggressive, but have just stated what they believe to be the truth.  This may be unpallatable to you, but too bad.
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Ebor
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« Reply #94 on: October 28, 2005, 09:47:53 AM »

There can be aggression in mockery and cheap shots. Saying something "needs to be stopped" could be construed as aggressive or an attack.  What if this thread were on another forum and it denounced EO? 

How does this thread make Eastern Orthodoxy look good?

Ebor
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« Reply #95 on: October 28, 2005, 10:40:40 AM »

How does this thread make Eastern Orthodoxy look good?

I don't think it's aim was ever to make Orthodoxy look good.

But compared to polygamy, "blood atonement of apostates", Joseph Smith, chastity underwear, racism against blacks...I'd say Orthodoxy's looking pretty good.
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« Reply #96 on: October 28, 2005, 11:06:28 AM »

There can be aggression in mockery and cheap shots. Saying something "needs to be stopped" could be construed as aggressive or an attack.ÂÂ  What if this thread were on another forum and it denounced EO?ÂÂ  

How does this thread make Eastern Orthodoxy look good?

Ebor

If this thread were about RCism, Anglicanism, or any other Christian denomination, I would agree with you 100%.  All of these Churches are capable of rational discussion with Orthodoxy and as such we should engage them politely.  However, Mormonism by its nature is a non-Christian organization that is quite aggressive towards non-Mormons and which is a real and clear threat to Christianity, in my opinion.  Mormons are much more successful than SDA's and JW's in proselytizing people and we need to take an aggressive stand with Mormons, just as with Muslims, but one that we might not take with other Christian denominations.

I agree also after rereading some of the posts that outright mocking Mormonism is not a Christian thing to do but we must oppose the untruth of Mormonism, and many of these things that were made fun of in this thread are mocking aside, quite foreign to Christianity and should be denounced.

I am not too sympathetic to wowser because his style is not to educate but to make fun of us as individuals which is not something I believe we have done to any Mormon on this board.  Normally someone saying "has your IQ gone down" etc would be warned but I think we will not do that to Wowswer given that he is on the defensive.  But I don't want to see posters calling other posters stupid in a blatent fashion.

Perhaps some will say I am a bigot but when it comes down to it, I just don't think we can extend to Mormonism (not individual Mormons mind you, who must be treated with love and respect) the same courtesy that we do to other Christian Churches given its different tone, objectives, and aggressiveness.

Anastasios
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« Reply #97 on: October 28, 2005, 01:15:59 PM »

We believe in one God the father almighty. Maker of heaven and Earth and every thing visibl and invisible.And in one Lord Jesus Christ , the son of God, the only begotten. Begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of Light, True God of True God. Begotten not made. Of one essence of the Father by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was born of the Holy Spirit and the Ever Virgin Mary and became man. And he was crucified by Pontious Pilate and suffered and was buried and the third day he rose again according to the scriptures. And he shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. Whose kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit. The Lord and Giver of Life. who proceeds from the Father. Who with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified. Who spoke by the prophets. And I believe in one Holy catholic and apostolic church. In one Baptizm for the remission of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the age to come. Amen.      the Nicean Creed.                         what does mormonism say to that?
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« Reply #98 on: October 28, 2005, 01:51:36 PM »

We believe in one God the father almighty. Maker of heaven and Earth and every thing visibl and invisible.And in one Lord Jesus Christ , the son of God, the only begotten. Begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of Light, True God of True God. Begotten not made. Of one essence of the Father by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was born of the Holy Spirit and the Ever Virgin Mary and became man. And he was crucified by Pontious Pilate and suffered and was buried and the third day he rose again according to the scriptures. And he shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. Whose kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit. The Lord and Giver of Life. who proceeds from the Father. Who with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified. Who spoke by the prophets. And I believe in one Holy catholic and apostolic church. In one Baptizm for the remission of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the age to come. Amen.  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  the Nicean Creed.  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚ what does mormonism say to that?

They will say the believe the same...but with things defined differently.
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Wowser
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« Reply #99 on: October 28, 2005, 02:38:20 PM »

Okay, unless some honest discussion begins in this thread, I'm going to lock it.

Like we couldn't see that coming.   Roll Eyes   
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Zeezrom
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« Reply #100 on: October 28, 2005, 02:42:24 PM »

To address Germanus's question, What does Mormonism say about that?:

We believe in one God the father almighty. Maker of heaven and Earth and every thing visible and invisible.  And in one Lord Jesus Christ , the son of God, the only begotten. Begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of Light, True God of True God. Begotten not made.

The First Article of Faith of the LDS Church is:  We believe in God the Eternal Father, and in His Son Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.

Of one essence of the Father by whom all things were made.

I am not certain what this means.  The LDS Church does not believe in the Trinity.  The LDS Church believes that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost are separate and distinct beings, always and forever.  We believe that all scriptural references to the Father and the Son being one is in reference to their unity of purpose, as Christ told His apostles to be one, even as He and His Father were one.  This is, admittedly, a substantial deviation from what most mainstream Christians believe.

Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was born of the Holy Spirit and the Ever Virgin Mary and became man. And he was crucified by Pontious Pilate and suffered and was buried and the third day he rose again according to the scriptures.

The LDS Church believes this.  We believe in the literal resurrection of the Savior.

And he shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. Whose kingdom shall have no end.

We believe in, and look forward with great anticipation to, the Second Coming of the Savior.  We believe that Christ shall establish His Kingdom on earth, and that all men will stand before God to be judged according to their works.

And in the Holy Spirit. The Lord and Giver of Life. who proceeds from the Father. Who with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified. Who spoke by the prophets.

Again, we believe in the Holy Ghost, that he/she ( Grin) is a personage of spirit, separate and distinct from the Father and the Son, and who is worshipped as an equal member of the Godhead.

And I believe in one Holy catholic and apostolic church.

No, we do not believe in the Catholic Church.  We believe in one true and living Church, restored in these latter-days as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, presided over by Jesus Christ, and directed through his holy prophets and the Council of the Twelve Apostles as currently constituted upon the earth.

In one Baptism for the remission of sins.

The LDS Church believes in and practices baptism by immersion for the remission of sins.  The LDS Church also believes in and practices the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.

I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the age to come.

We look with great anticipation to the literal resurrection of all mankind from the dead, when the spirit and the flesh shall be reunited and thereafter enjoy everlasting life.

Hope this was helpful.
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« Reply #101 on: October 28, 2005, 02:49:19 PM »

We believe in one God the father almighty. Maker of heaven and Earth and every thing visibl and invisible.And in one Lord Jesus Christ , the son of God, the only begotten. Begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of Light, True God of True God. Begotten not made. Of one essence of the Father by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was born of the Holy Spirit and the Ever Virgin Mary and became man. And he was crucified by Pontious Pilate and suffered and was buried and the third day he rose again according to the scriptures. And he shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. Whose kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit. The Lord and Giver of Life. who proceeds from the Father. Who with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified. Who spoke by the prophets. And I believe in one Holy catholic and apostolic church. In one Baptizm for the remission of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the age to come. Amen.  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  the Nicean Creed.  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚  ÃƒÆ’‚ what does mormonism say to that?

That is is not biblical. ÂÂ  You do not find this kind of philosophical language from any apostles or Christ or anything close. ÂÂ  But if it works for you more power to you. ÂÂ I have to go now. ÂÂ Satan is calling.
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Wowser
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« Reply #102 on: October 28, 2005, 02:56:44 PM »

 I am not too sympathetic to wowser because his style is not to educate but to make fun of us as individuals which is not something I believe we have done to any Mormon on this board.ÂÂ  Normally someone saying "has your IQ gone down" etc would be warned but I think we will not do that to Wowswer given that he is on the defensive.ÂÂ  But I don't want to see posters calling other posters stupid in a blatent fashion.

Oh!   I get it!   Calling people the spawn of satan is educational!  Mocking and making vile, disgusting comments about what others consider sacred is just, well,  recreational!  Do you guys get together at the West Wall and laugh at the Jews in their funny outfits, too?  And those Native Americans, get a load of them in that garb!   I wish I could be more like you but I am the spawn of Satan and must be satisfied with demonic activities.   I can never hope to acheive the level of Godliness that would bring me to engage in such Christlike behaviors.

Perhaps some will say I am a bigot but when it comes down to it, I just don't think we can extend to Mormonism (not individual Mormons mind you, who must be treated with love and respect) the same courtesy that we do to other Christian Churches given its different tone, objectives, and aggressiveness.

Courtesy is always a bad thing for Christians.   You wouldn't want to be caught dead at the judgement seat admitting that you were civil and respectful to the wrong kind of people.   

 
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« Reply #103 on: October 28, 2005, 02:59:48 PM »

Locked as a result of the obvious.
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