Author Topic: "I Waited Until My Wedding Night to Lose My Virginity, and I Wish I Hadn’t"  (Read 12998 times)

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Offline BrethrenBoy

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This article popes up I my Facebook feed recently. I  insure of how to respond to it.
http://www.styleite.com/first-person/i-waited-until-my-wedding-night-to-lose-my-virginity-and-i-wish-i-hadnt/
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An unfortunate experience, I'm sorry that she got conditioned in such a horrible way (and still seems to be so?) I was similarly a virgin on my wedding night, and I also think it was unnecessary, though for seemingly different reasons than her.
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Offline ialmisry

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"When I have sex with my husband, I make sure it’s because I have a sexual need and not because I feel I’m required to fulfill his desires."
So, he's just a tool to fulfill her sexual needs, and that is progress.  OK.

"Your sexuality is nobody’s business but yours." Only if your masturbating, and some would dispute even then.  You don't have to listen to them though.
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Offline JamesR

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"When I have sex with my husband, I make sure it’s because I have a sexual need and not because I feel I’m required to fulfill his desires."
So, he's just a tool to fulfill her sexual needs, and that is progress.  OK.

"Your sexuality is nobody’s business but yours." Only if your masturbating, and some would dispute even then.  You don't have to listen to them though.

I love you

Offline Gorazd

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It seems to me like she first of all has an issue with her faith.

Offline littlepilgrim64

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It is very concerning that she states that after she was married she felt that sex was "dirty and wrong and sinful".  Also, that she felt that after she was married those around her viewed her as being "soiled and tarnished".  She must have been in some ultra-fundamentalist Baptist church and/or her parents views of sex were unhealthy.  Very sad.

I was raised Roman Catholic and I remember my mom explaining to me that I was to remain a virgin until I was married because God designed sex to be a holy and beautiful connection between a husband and wife.  It was all positive and holding on to that is what helped me remain a virgin until marriage (though really, really, really difficult). 

Offline Agabus

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She must have been in some ultra-fundamentalist Baptist church...
I was raised amongst ultra-fundamentalist Baptists, and we were told by numerous people that sex was off limits until marriage not because it is dirty but because it is awesome and thus must not be experienced.

It was kind of a weird message, actually.

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Offline Aquensis

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From the article: "It was entirely possible that my future husband wouldn’t remain pure for me, because he didn’t have that same responsibility, according to the Bible."

Why is it these people ALWAYS say this? Everyone is always telling me Christianity teaches women have to remain virgin until marriage, and men do not. I don't even believe these people came from families identifying as Christian when they are so clueless. Just more liars that probably never entered a church in their life.

Offline Porter ODoran

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From the article: "It was entirely possible that my future husband wouldn’t remain pure for me, because he didn’t have that same responsibility, according to the Bible."

Why is it these people ALWAYS say this? Everyone is always telling me Christianity teaches women have to remain virgin until marriage, and men do not. I don't even believe these people came from families identifying as Christian when they are so clueless. Just more liars that probably never entered a church in their life.

You're simply unaware of many people's experience. I understand your exasperation -- but aim it at the hucksters who pose as spiritual teachers in this country, don't "shoot the messenger."
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Offline scamandrius

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Whenever any group, be it a church  or anyone else, only demonizes sex then this kind of reaction as portrayed in the article is, to me, understandable. 
Da quod iubes et iube quod vis.

Offline TheTrisagion

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She must have been in some ultra-fundamentalist Baptist church...
I was raised amongst ultra-fundamentalist Baptists, and we were told by numerous people that sex was off limits until marriage not because it is dirty but because it is awesome and thus must not be experienced.

It was kind of a weird message, actually.


This is pretty much what I was taught with the exception for a warning that if you did partake of the awesomeness of sex before you were married, then no one would ever want to marry you except for some godless devil worshipper or their equivalent, the liberal mainline denominationalists.
God bless!

Offline Punch

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She must have been in some ultra-fundamentalist Baptist church...
I was raised amongst ultra-fundamentalist Baptists, and we were told by numerous people that sex was off limits until marriage not because it is dirty but because it is awesome and thus must not be experienced.

It was kind of a weird message, actually.
This is pretty much what I was taught with the exception for a warning that if you did partake of the awesomeness of sex before you were married, then no one would ever want to marry you except for some godless devil worshipper or their equivalent, the liberal mainline denominationalists.


I was taught something similar.
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I find purity pledges creepy as all get out. Especially when they involve prepubescent kids, who may have no clue what they're getting themselves into, but who will most definitely be held to that pledge with all the force guilt-tripping can muster.
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Offline TheTrisagion

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Personal experience leads me to the belief that purity pledges only work when the child involved does not have the means to act contrary to the pledge.  It is easy to pledge purity when the girls run in fear from your pimple ridden face.  :P
God bless!

Offline Alpo

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I'm sorry for her. It seems that the problem wasn't the prohibition of pre-marital sex itself but all the other stuff his former church add to that. Christians can be be morons too.
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Offline Alveus Lacuna

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To offer a balanced perspective, I have a friend who saved himself for marriage. He's still glad he waited, but it has definitely caused problems with his sex life afterward. You just can't have guilty sex feelings for your whole life and then expect to suddenly have it all be OK.

I personally think that Christianity is intrinsically sexually ackward. There's just no getting around it.

Also, in Orthodoxy virginity is the ultimate. Christ and his Mother were both virgins, and those who assert that there is something wrong, undeveloped, or half-human about virgins would do well to remember that!
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 04:55:33 PM by Alveus Lacuna »

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To offer a balanced perspective, I have a friend who saved himself for marriage. He's still glad he waited, but it has definitely caused problems with his sex life afterward. You just can't have guilty sex feelings for your whole life and then expect to suddenly have it all be OK.

I personally think that Christianity is intrinsically sexually ackward. There's just no getting around it.

Also, in Orthodoxy virginity is the ultimate. Christ and his Mother were both virgins, and those who assert that there is something wrong, undeveloped, or half-human about virgins would do well to remember that!

Sex is intrinsically awkward. Christianity just turns the intrinsic awkwardness oft into something pathological.

Offline Godspell

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It is very concerning that she states that after she was married she felt that sex was "dirty and wrong and sinful".  Also, that she felt that after she was married those around her viewed her as being "soiled and tarnished".  She must have been in some ultra-fundamentalist Baptist church and/or her parents views of sex were unhealthy.  Very sad.

I was raised Roman Catholic and I remember my mom explaining to me that I was to remain a virgin until I was married because God designed sex to be a holy and beautiful connection between a husband and wife.  It was all positive and holding on to that is what helped me remain a virgin until marriage (though really, really, really difficult). 

I was actually thinking the same thing. In the Mormon Church, my wife was told that an unchaste girl was like an ice cream Sunday with a cockroach on it. Or like chewing a piece of used gum. All that goes into the idea that sex makes you "dirty". I don't like this idea that we should be ashamed of our body, it's just that our body is a gift to our spouse. So give it to him or her, and not someone who is going to not appreciate it.

Notice, she didn't say she wanted to have sex with other guys other than her husband. She just wished she had sex with him before marriage.

Honestly, though, I think people get a little TOO hyped up about sex on one's wedding night. Don't hype it up, its probably not going to be that great. I'd rather have a great marriage than a great wedding day.

To offer a balanced perspective, I have a friend who saved himself for marriage. He's still glad he waited, but it has definitely caused problems with his sex life afterward. You just can't have guilty sex feelings for your whole life and then expect to suddenly have it all be OK.

I personally think that Christianity is intrinsically sexually ackward. There's just no getting around it.

Also, in Orthodoxy virginity is the ultimate. Christ and his Mother were both virgins, and those who assert that there is something wrong, undeveloped, or half-human about virgins would do well to remember that!

Didn't St. Paul say "Food is for the stomach, and sexual immorality is for the body"? (Just Kidding)  ;D
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Offline JamesR

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Sex is intrinsically awkward.

Maybe this is off topic, but is it really? Serious question. I mean, I imagine if it weren't for all that Christianity stuff I could probably easily have sex and not feel awkward or affected by it really at all anymore than I am after eating or using the bathroom. I imagine if love is involved, then yeah, it could be awkward. But is say a "casual" encounter really awkward? (assuming such a thing exists). I get the hunch that society just makes sex awkward but what do I know? Hands don't teach you much.

Offline Theophania

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)
It's common knowledge that you secretly want to be born in early 17th century Russia.  As a serf or a royal, I know not.  Chances are serf.

Offline DeniseDenise

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

because its mostly male
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Offline Godspell

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o
Just as the thought of fire does not warm the body, so faith without love does not actualize the light of spiritual knowledge in the soul.

Just as the light of the sun attracts a healthy eye, so through love knowledge of God naturally draws to itself the pure intellect.

– St Maximos

Offline DeniseDenise

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

Trust us when we say, our -secular- friends don't talk about sex and masturbation nearly as much as this forum does over time. A few weeks of being here does not reveal that -fun-....stick around and ye shall see
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Offline Theophania

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.
It's common knowledge that you secretly want to be born in early 17th century Russia.  As a serf or a royal, I know not.  Chances are serf.

Offline Godspell

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.
Just as the thought of fire does not warm the body, so faith without love does not actualize the light of spiritual knowledge in the soul.

Just as the light of the sun attracts a healthy eye, so through love knowledge of God naturally draws to itself the pure intellect.

– St Maximos

Offline biro

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

because its mostly male

This.
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works Warning: stories have mature content.

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Offline Theophania

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.
It's common knowledge that you secretly want to be born in early 17th century Russia.  As a serf or a royal, I know not.  Chances are serf.

Offline Godspell

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.

Well, why do you keep asking them about it?  ::)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 08:31:08 PM by Godspell »
Just as the thought of fire does not warm the body, so faith without love does not actualize the light of spiritual knowledge in the soul.

Just as the light of the sun attracts a healthy eye, so through love knowledge of God naturally draws to itself the pure intellect.

– St Maximos

Offline DeniseDenise

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.

Well, maybe you should stop asking them about it, then.  ::)

again.....you do not know of what you are speaking.


this information is volunteered repeatedly.  NO one is asking...no one cares......
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Offline ialmisry

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

Trust us when we say, our -secular- friends don't talk about sex and masturbation nearly as much as this forum does over time.
you new to the internet, besides this forum?
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
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Offline DeniseDenise

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

Trust us when we say, our -secular- friends don't talk about sex and masturbation nearly as much as this forum does over time.
you new to the internet, besides this forum?

actually i meant real life people....even the least godly are honestly no where near as topically challenged as here

and no...I am not at al new to the internet.
All opinions expressed by myself are quite tragically my own, and not those of any other poster or wall hangings.

Offline Godspell

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.

Well, maybe you should stop asking them about it, then.  ::)

again.....you do not know of what you are speaking.


this information is volunteered repeatedly.  NO one is asking...no one cares......

LOL, maybe the site should make a board only for masturbation issues, and then all four individuals can discuss it there.
Just as the thought of fire does not warm the body, so faith without love does not actualize the light of spiritual knowledge in the soul.

Just as the light of the sun attracts a healthy eye, so through love knowledge of God naturally draws to itself the pure intellect.

– St Maximos

Offline JamesR

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.

You had to say "stick"...

Offline Godspell

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

LOL, yeah that's totally what I was implying.

Maybe everyone here is just really comfortable with their sexuality.

I noticed their was a post to stop posting about homosexuality too.

Maybe they're just confused. Need clarification and such.

Stick around long enough and you'll see it's basically the same people talking about their masturbatory habits all. the. time.

You had to say "stick"...

James, you have problemz.
Just as the thought of fire does not warm the body, so faith without love does not actualize the light of spiritual knowledge in the soul.

Just as the light of the sun attracts a healthy eye, so through love knowledge of God naturally draws to itself the pure intellect.

– St Maximos

Offline vamrat

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

I ain't saying nothing on the former, and truth be told ain't gonna say nothing on the latter.
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline Punch

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)

Yeah! In society they really tone down all the sex stuff...  :o

Trust us when we say, our -secular- friends don't talk about sex and masturbation nearly as much as this forum does over time.
you new to the internet, besides this forum?

actually i meant real life people....even the least godly are honestly no where near as topically challenged as here

and no...I am not at al new to the internet.

Must not have a lot of male friends that are not closet homosexuals.  I have found that men talk and joke about sex quite frequently, particularly in the blue collar world.  I have also found that the more they talk, the less they are getting.  Women talk not so much.  But then again, that is why women have the upper hand in a lot of things.  For women, sex is nothing other than a way to get what they want.  For men, sex is what they want.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline orthonorm

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I get the hunch that society just makes sex awkward but what do I know?

Sex doesn't exist outside society.


Offline LBK

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James, you have problemz.

You're learning, Grasshopper!  :laugh:
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

Offline Charles Martel

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"When I have sex with my husband, I make sure it’s because I have a sexual need and not because I feel I’m required to fulfill his desires."
So, he's just a tool to fulfill her sexual needs, and that is progress.  OK.

"Your sexuality is nobody’s business but yours." Only if your masturbating, and some would dispute even then.  You don't have to listen to them though.
Onanism is a sin.........

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/onanism

http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=2940

http://www.beginningcatholic.com/catholic-teaching-on-masturbation.html
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Offline Papist

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The most insane thing about this article is that she identified her virginity with her identity. She is missing the entire point. All Christians are called to chastity, but that takes different forms given one's state in life. When single it means celibacy, but when married it means sexual fidelity to one's spouse. She got the wrong message. It's not that sex is bad, but abuse of sex is.
"For, by its immensity, the divine substance surpasses every form that our intellect reaches. Thus we are unable to apprehend it by knowing what it is. Yet we are able to have some knowledge of it by knowing what it is not." - St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa contra gentiles, I, 14.

Offline orthonorm

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The most insane thing about this article is that she identified her virginity with her identity. She is missing the entire point. All Christians are called to chastity, but that takes different forms given one's state in life. When single it means celibacy, but when married it means sexual fidelity to one's spouse. She got the wrong message. It's not that sex is bad, but abuse of sex is.

Sex is bad. Christians have sex in public? I don't think the blinds are there just to protect prying eyes. Sex is shameful. The question isn't whether or not it is shameful to have sex but how to understand the origins of the shame and how to best enjoy the shame which accompanies sex.

Offline littlepilgrim64

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The most insane thing about this article is that she identified her virginity with her identity. She is missing the entire point. All Christians are called to chastity, but that takes different forms given one's state in life. When single it means celibacy, but when married it means sexual fidelity to one's spouse. She got the wrong message. It's not that sex is bad, but abuse of sex is.

+1

Offline Shlomlokh

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Why is this forum so obsessed with sex and masturbation?  ::)
Because JamesR
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Offline yeshuaisiam

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It's honestly as simple as following the gospel and the teachings.  Pledges and all that are .. whatever.  Following God's will is where it is at.

At matrimony, the two become one flesh.  Yes, it is very important.   There are so many biblical warnings about fornication/adultery.  Also so many writings of EO saints warning of it.   Along with that it is a commandment.

It's a touchy subject but fornication can affect people in their marriages.   I have a friend who suffers knowing that his wife was not exactly a virgin.  There is a purity in the giving of herself to him and only him.  I don't think he reacts in a jealous way, nor does it consume him, but he has expressed that it bothers him fwiw. 

Perhaps we should look at St. Joseph and consider what he thought of the Mary before his dream. 
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Offline PeterTheAleut

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It's honestly as simple as following the gospel and the teachings.  Pledges and all that are .. whatever.  Following God's will is where it is at.

At matrimony, the two become one flesh.  Yes, it is very important.   There are so many biblical warnings about fornication/adultery.  Also so many writings of EO saints warning of it.
It's easy to cite EO saints when they agree with you, isn't it, yesh? ;)
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Offline ialmisry

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"When I have sex with my husband, I make sure it’s because I have a sexual need and not because I feel I’m required to fulfill his desires."
So, he's just a tool to fulfill her sexual needs, and that is progress.  OK.

"Your sexuality is nobody’s business but yours." Only if your masturbating, and some would dispute even then.  You don't have to listen to them though.
Onanism is a sin.........

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/onanism

http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=2940

http://www.beginningcatholic.com/catholic-teaching-on-masturbation.html
onanism is a renaissance neurosis-the term originates in the beginning of the 18th century advertising (an early informercial) "cures" for it and the "dangers" of it.  To go further into the Scholastics obsession on this would be a tangent, which has already been spun off many times.
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                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Punch

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Let's face it, if you were not supposed to touch yourself, you would not have been created to be able to touch the parts that feel good.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline gzt

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

Offline zaphod

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.

Offline gzt

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.
One thing that may help is to actually talk, at some point, to the woman you are thinking of marrying.

Offline Jonathan Gress

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Sex takes practice, so many couples who save themselves for marriage find their wedding night experience rather disappointing. It seems to me the solution is not to make such a big deal out of it. There seems to be this cultural expectation that honeymoon sex needs to be mindblowingly awesome, i.e. confident and well-practiced, rather than an opportunity to get to know each other intimately for the first time. If Christian couples had more realistic expectations about the first time, they wouldn't be so disappointed.

Another thing to remember is that many couples who have cohabited for a long time before marriage find that, soon after the wedding, they rapidly lose interest in each other. This is, of course, to be expected as couples become more familiar; a lot of sexual desire arises out of the novelty of your first experience with your partner. But it shows that not waiting until marriage isn't exactly a surefire solution to the problem of awkward honeymoon sex.

Finally, the author does seem clueless about traditional Christian moral teaching if she believes that men are not expected to uphold the same standards of chastity as women. The "double standard" appears to be a common cultural phenomenon, but has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with the different sexual natures of men and women (men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).

Offline Agabus

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.
I DO NOT AFFIRM OR DENY THE CONTENT OF ANY GIVEN POST IN THESE FORUMS. THEY REFLECT DIFFERENT STAGES OF MY FAITH AND LIFE. IF ONE OF MY POSTS HELPS YOU, MAY GOD BLESS IT, AND IF IT IS A STUMBLING BLOCK, MAY YOU AND GOD FORGIVE ME.

Offline Alpo

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Sex takes practice, so many couples who save themselves for marriage find their wedding night experience rather disappointing. It seems to me the solution is not to make such a big deal out of it. There seems to be this cultural expectation that honeymoon sex needs to be mindblowingly awesome, i.e. confident and well-practiced, rather than an opportunity to get to know each other intimately for the first time. If Christian couples had more realistic expectations about the first time, they wouldn't be so disappointed.

While I agree with basically everything you wrote IMO this is basically a failed task. Christians have too long been part of this suberb honeymoon narrative. These kind of internalized ideas won't just go away easily.

As for men being more lustful, have you ever actually talked with women?  :P
« Last Edit: August 17, 2014, 02:59:27 PM by Alpo »
I just need to find out how to say it in Slavonic!

Offline Jonathan Gress

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

LOL. But seriously.

Offline Jonathan Gress

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Sex takes practice, so many couples who save themselves for marriage find their wedding night experience rather disappointing. It seems to me the solution is not to make such a big deal out of it. There seems to be this cultural expectation that honeymoon sex needs to be mindblowingly awesome, i.e. confident and well-practiced, rather than an opportunity to get to know each other intimately for the first time. If Christian couples had more realistic expectations about the first time, they wouldn't be so disappointed.

While I agree with basically everything you wrote IMO this is basically a failed task. Christians have too long been part of this suberb honeymoon narrative. These kind of internalized ideas won't just go away easily.

As for men being more lustful, have you ever actually talked with women?  :P

Yes, in fact I'm even married to one. ;)

Offline Jonathan Gress

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Sex takes practice, so many couples who save themselves for marriage find their wedding night experience rather disappointing. It seems to me the solution is not to make such a big deal out of it. There seems to be this cultural expectation that honeymoon sex needs to be mindblowingly awesome, i.e. confident and well-practiced, rather than an opportunity to get to know each other intimately for the first time. If Christian couples had more realistic expectations about the first time, they wouldn't be so disappointed.

While I agree with basically everything you wrote IMO this is basically a failed task. Christians have too long been part of this suberb honeymoon narrative. These kind of internalized ideas won't just go away easily.

As for men being more lustful, have you ever actually talked with women?  :P

Also, did you mean "superb" or "suburb"?

Offline Alpo

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LOL. I meant "superb". Pardon for broken English.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2014, 03:07:35 PM by Alpo »
I just need to find out how to say it in Slavonic!

Offline Jonathan Gress

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LOL. I meant "superb". Pardon for broken English.

No worries. Your English is certainly not "broken". :)

Offline Alpo

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LOL. I meant "superb". Pardon for broken English.

No worries. Your English is certainly not "broken". :)

Thanks.  I sometimes wonder how my English seems like for a native speaker. It's a shame really that I don't have any English-speaking friends. It would be nice to learn the language from someone who doesn't speak it as as second language.
I just need to find out how to say it in Slavonic!

Offline Jonathan Gress

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LOL. I meant "superb". Pardon for broken English.

No worries. Your English is certainly not "broken". :)

Thanks.  I sometimes wonder how my English seems like for a native speaker. It's a shame really that I don't have any English-speaking friends. It would be nice to learn the language from someone who doesn't speak it as as second language.

I suppose I can spot the occasional error, but really your English is very impressive for a non-native speaker who apparently doesn't have any native-speaker friends! I guess that's typical for a Nordic these days. ;)

Offline littlepilgrim64

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.
One thing that may help is to actually talk, at some point, to the woman you are thinking of marrying.

Yes . . Communication, communication, communication before getting married.

Offline Jonathan Gress

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.
One thing that may help is to actually talk, at some point, to the woman you are thinking of marrying.

Yes . . Communication, communication, communication before getting married.

Agreed. Some of the problem does seem to arise out of the idealization of virginity that extends to punishing even open discussion of sex. It's as if we're supposed to be blissfully ignorant of all things sexual until our wedding, after which we miraculously turn into sex experts! Of course, it doesn't work like that in the real world. Men and women who are intending to get married need to know about what sex involves beforehand and be clear of any illusions and unrealistic expectations.

Offline vamrat

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LOL. I meant "superb". Pardon for broken English.

No worries. Your English is certainly not "broken". :)

Thanks.  I sometimes wonder how my English seems like for a native speaker. It's a shame really that I don't have any English-speaking friends. It would be nice to learn the language from someone who doesn't speak it as as second language.

You'd prolly talk much badder.  ESL's tend to learn the language weller than us native folk does.

And I am sure you speak English far better than I do Finn! (Jaakari talvisota suomi konapistooli!)
« Last Edit: August 18, 2014, 02:22:56 PM by vamrat »
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.
One thing that may help is to actually talk, at some point, to the woman you are thinking of marrying.

Yes . . Communication, communication, communication before getting married.

Agreed. Some of the problem does seem to arise out of the idealization of virginity that extends to punishing even open discussion of sex. It's as if we're supposed to be blissfully ignorant of all things sexual until our wedding, after which we miraculously turn into sex experts! Of course, it doesn't work like that in the real world. Men and women who are intending to get married need to know about what sex involves beforehand and be clear of any illusions and unrealistic expectations.

CAVEAT: I want to make it crystal clear that I do not advocate the following practice.

The Amish and Mennonites in Netherlands had a couple of interesting cathechetical tools in this regard. First, an engaged couple were allowed to sleep together, but with a board between them to ensure that they do not engage in intercourse. Second, the engaged couples did not get married until the young lady had become pregnant.  :laugh: :police: :angel:

Offline Alpo

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And I am sure you speak English far better than I do Finn! (Jaakari talvisota suomi konapistooli!)

I can't teach you lots of obscenities in Finnish. With those you can impress your friends with mastery of an exotic language, convince your Protestant relatives that you are a born-again Christian by speaking in tongues and swear without your priest noticing it.
I just need to find out how to say it in Slavonic!

Offline Jonathan Gress

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I don't think having sex before marriage would have made a difference without different catechesis, but then with different catechesis, this may not have been a problem. There are a lot of unfortunate things going on here, but I don't see how "doin' it" earlier in life would have solved them.

I don't know if it would have solved her problem, but I can't help it might have solved the poor husband's problem of having married a woman with all these issues. In fact, I'm scared out of my mind of marrying a woman and waiting till the marriage, and finding out she has some issue like this.
One thing that may help is to actually talk, at some point, to the woman you are thinking of marrying.

Yes . . Communication, communication, communication before getting married.

Agreed. Some of the problem does seem to arise out of the idealization of virginity that extends to punishing even open discussion of sex. It's as if we're supposed to be blissfully ignorant of all things sexual until our wedding, after which we miraculously turn into sex experts! Of course, it doesn't work like that in the real world. Men and women who are intending to get married need to know about what sex involves beforehand and be clear of any illusions and unrealistic expectations.

CAVEAT: I want to make it crystal clear that I do not advocate the following practice.

The Amish and Mennonites in Netherlands had a couple of interesting cathechetical tools in this regard. First, an engaged couple were allowed to sleep together, but with a board between them to ensure that they do not engage in intercourse. Second, the engaged couples did not get married until the young lady had become pregnant.  :laugh: :police: :angel:

I've heard about those "bed courtships". I honestly don't understand what they are supposed to achieve, unless there's some poorly communicated expectation that the couple will "explore" each other without engaging in full intercourse and so learn at least some practical things about sex before fully committing to each other. Otherwise, if you really want the couple to remain chaste as traditionally understood, a board is hardly going to make a difference if they are left alone in the same room together overnight (unless there's something about Amish bed design I don't know).

Another issue I suspect is simply that, when knowledge of sex is as circumscribed as it is in traditionally Christian cultures, expectations of performance are correspondingly low. In our era of sex aids and manuals and free pornography, everyone expects fireworks in the bedroom.

Offline jah777

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The article sounds as if this woman's identity was based on being a virgin, that her Christianity was defined by her virginity, that her virginity was sustained by her perception of sex as "dirty" and "sinful".  Consequently, once she lost her virginity she naturally felt dirty and her Christian identity based on her virginity fell apart.  She then went to "therapy" in which she was likely told that all forms of self-denial and repression are bad and unhealthy and so now she is preaching the gospel of modern psychology that we should indulge our passions in the quest for self-satisfaction rather than restrain our passions out of love for and obedience to Christ.

It is bizarre for this woman to think that sex before marriage would have been good for her.  Sure, she may not have had these particular problems, but she would simply trade one set of problems for another.

All forms of sexual activity, including masturbation, both before marriage and outside of marriage are sins that cut us off from Christ, keep us from receiving Holy Communion, and deprive us of the grace of God.  All such sexual sins should be confessed, repented of, and penanced according to the canons.  Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions. 

Ascetical struggle is required of all Christians, but we have to understand why we abstain from certain things at certain times and for what purpose.  The same action can be either pleasing to God or displeasing to God based on a person's understanding and intention.  For instance, in the Scriptures we find both praise for those who refrain from marriage and remain virgins for the sake of God, as well as condemnation for those who "forbid to marry" as teaching "doctrines of demons".  It is not the action (virginity) that is pleasing to God by itself, but rather the good action (virginity) embraced in a God-pleasing manner.


Offline Jonathan Gress

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Struggle against the passions does help to put struggle with lust in a broader context: if our minds are clouded by things of this world, we can't hope to have room for God. Too many people, however, think more in terms of ritual purity, and unfortunately a lot of traditional language about sex can give rise to that kind of misinterpretation: we talk about staying "pure" and not "defiling" ourselves with fornication. It's not surprising that many people who are not fluent in the language of struggle and asceticism come away with the impression that sex is "dirty", which is not what the Church intends us to think.

Offline NicholasMyra

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Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions.  
Never been any healthy or chaste people outside of Orthodoxy? In any respect?

Oh, Jah.

If moderation was not so lax...

Also, Orthodox lifestyle?
« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 01:23:48 PM by NicholasMyra »
Quote from: Fr. Thomas Hopko, dystopian parable of the prodigal son
...you can imagine so-called healing services of the pigpen. The books that could be written, you know: Life in the Pigpen. How to Cope in the Pigpen. Being Happy in the Pigpen. Surviving in the Pigpen. And then there could be counselling, for people who feel unhappy in the pigpen, to try to get them to come to terms with the pigpen, and to accept the pigpen.

Offline biro

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Jah777, out of curiosity, are you a priest or deacon?
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works Warning: stories have mature content.

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Offline Punch

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"Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions."


This is the biggest crock of bull that I have read in a while (or rather, at least since the sex while fasting thread).  I will believe this when all of my Lutheran, Roman Catholic and Hindu friends have affairs and none of my Orthodox friends end up divorced.  I am not holding my breath. 
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline TheTrisagion

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"Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions."


This is the biggest crock of bull that I have read in a while (or rather, at least since the sex while fasting thread).  I will believe this when all of my Lutheran, Roman Catholic and Hindu friends have affairs and none of my Orthodox friends end up divorced.  I am not holding my breath. 
They are Orthodox and just didn't know it.  ;)
God bless!

Offline Agabus

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"Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions."


This is the biggest crock of bull that I have read in a while (or rather, at least since the sex while fasting thread).  I will believe this when all of my Lutheran, Roman Catholic and Hindu friends have affairs and none of my Orthodox friends end up divorced.  I am not holding my breath. 
They are Orthodox and just didn't know it.  ;)
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Offline Maria

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Offline biro

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works Warning: stories have mature content.

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Offline Mor Ephrem

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.

I suppose that was all gay porn.
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Offline minasoliman

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If moderation was not so lax...

If this was a criticism or complaint of forum moderation publicly, then I prefer you do not engage in this again.  And that goes for anyone else.  If you have a problem with moderation, you can send us a PM, or if there is a problem with someone's post that breaks the rules of the forum, then report the post.  Otherwise, I personally will not tolerate this in my section.  As the rules mention:

Please respect the mod/admin staff -- The moderators and administrative staff of oc.net keep this place running tidy.  While you don't have to agree with a particular decision they make, we ask that you at least respect it publicly.  Do not complain about forum moderation, or the specific official actions taken by the moderators, global moderators, or administrators, on the forum.

Thank you and God bless.

Mina
« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 11:30:58 PM by minasoliman »
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline Porter ODoran

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...

... Celibacy before marriage and chastity in marriage cannot be maintained in a healthy and beneficial way outside of living an active Orthodox lifestyle by participating in the mysteries, maintaining a prayerful lifestyle, and engaging in an ascetical struggle against all of the passions.

...

I was celibate and chaste for fifteen years outside the Church. I don't insist this was as healthful for me as for an Orthodox monk; I don't know.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

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Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline TheTrisagion

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.
Why would men buy porn when it is free on the internet?
God bless!

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Why would men buy porn when it is free on the internet?

My gram used to say often: "A fool perv and his money are easily parted."
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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.
Why would men buy porn when it is free on the internet?

There was a time before the Internet.
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works Warning: stories have mature content.

"Some people only feel good when they are praising the Lord." - Coptic bishop

Mt. 21:31 Jesus said to them, “Assuredly, I say to you that tax collectors and harlots enter the kingdom of God before you."

"Our Lord will *never* stop loving us." - Fr. Michael P.

Offline TheTrisagion

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.
Why would men buy porn when it is free on the internet?

There was a time before the Internet.


Please, do not remind me of those barbaric times.
God bless!

Online Arachne

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(men are, to put it bluntly, more susceptible to the passion of lust than women).
Ah, yes, it was 100 million men who bought copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

Men bought plenty of porn before that.
Why would men buy porn when it is free on the internet?

There was a time before the Internet.


Please, do not remind me of those barbaric times.

Another theory: You gets what you pays for.

Playboy statistics
(Oh, right - people buy that for the articles :P)
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline TheTrisagion

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I think a 5 second image search through google can provide all the nudity one could possibly need without having to go through the hassle of buying a magazine, or if you want "articles", you can always go to Huffington Post.  They seem to have an endless supply of thought provoking articles about sex.  :P
God bless!

Online Arachne

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 08:49:43 AM by Arachne »
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Cyrillic

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 09:07:14 AM by Cyrillic »

Online Arachne

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"

And that is why people bother to buy magazines rather than make do with what is found for free on the 'net. :laugh:
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline TheTrisagion

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"

And that is why people bother to buy magazines rather than make do with what is found for free on the 'net. :laugh:
but... you can read it on their website for free.  :P

I think we need an expert to weigh in on this.  Where is JamesR?
God bless!

Online Arachne

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"

And that is why people bother to buy magazines rather than make do with what is found for free on the 'net. :laugh:
but... you can read it on their website for free.  :P

Except for the print-only exclusive material. (Interestingly, I can't find the article Cyrillic alluded to, on either site. One of us must be misreading.)

I think we need an expert to weigh in on this.  Where is JamesR?

Expert on the health or the fitness part? :laugh:
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Cyrillic

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Except for the print-only exclusive material. (Interestingly, I can't find the article Cyrillic alluded to, on either site. One of us must be misreading.)

http://www.menshealth.nl/Sex/Verleid-haar-binnen-enkele-seconde

It's here. It gave some great advice on how not to be pepper sprayed as well.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 09:10:44 AM by Cyrillic »

Online Arachne

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Except for the print-only exclusive material. (Interestingly, I can't find the article Cyrillic alluded to, on either site. One of us must be misreading.)

http://www.menshealth.nl/Sex/Verleid-haar-binnen-enkele-seconde

It's here.

Exclusive to the audience, I see. :laugh: You're the only one who could check if it's translated from one of the international editions or original to the Dutch edition.
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Punch

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Look people, it is a rule of the Internet - If it exists, porn of it exists.  If you can't find it, you are not looking.  Now, back to my search for robot tentacle sex with chickens during fasts . . .
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline Cyrillic

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Except for the print-only exclusive material. (Interestingly, I can't find the article Cyrillic alluded to, on either site. One of us must be misreading.)

http://www.menshealth.nl/Sex/Verleid-haar-binnen-enkele-seconde

It's here.

Exclusive to the audience, I see. :laugh: You're the only one who could check if it's translated from one of the international editions or original to the Dutch edition.

Couldn't find it on the English site, sadly. But there's this gem. Five Ways to Seduce Her with Your Mouth. It isn't as exciting as the title would have you believe, but it's still quackery.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 09:16:05 AM by Cyrillic »

Offline TheTrisagion

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"

And that is why people bother to buy magazines rather than make do with what is found for free on the 'net. :laugh:
but... you can read it on their website for free.  :P

Except for the print-only exclusive material. (Interestingly, I can't find the article Cyrillic alluded to, on either site. One of us must be misreading.)

I think we need an expert to weigh in on this.  Where is JamesR?

Expert on the health or the fitness part? :laugh:
On the porn part. I'm sure he has extensive knowledge on the merits of paid vs free porn.  :D
God bless!

Online Arachne

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.

I don't know, Arachne.  While I agree with your generous interpretation, I suspect the target audience would take it the way Cyrillic did (at least based on that segment of the target audience among whom I live).  None of them would likely know what a frippery was, and the best guess might be "one of those fancy-az Starbucks drinks". 
OCnet is KGB.
I hail Mor Ephrem as our Secretary General.

Quote
Oh you Greeks, you are all dumb!

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Offline DeniseDenise

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.

I don't know, Arachne.  While I agree with your generous interpretation, I suspect the target audience would take it the way Cyrillic did (at least based on that segment of the target audience among whom I live).  None of them would likely know what a frippery was, and the best guess might be "one of those fancy-az Starbucks drinks". 


That's a Fripperino!
All opinions expressed by myself are quite tragically my own, and not those of any other poster or wall hangings.

Online Arachne

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.

I don't know, Arachne.  While I agree with your generous interpretation, I suspect the target audience would take it the way Cyrillic did (at least based on that segment of the target audience among whom I live).  None of them would likely know what a frippery was, and the best guess might be "one of those fancy-az Starbucks drinks".

Eh. I wouldn't consider myself particularly generous in that respect. As for fripperies, the definition of dishearteningly many of the ladies I hang out with would be something along the lines of 'a 12-pack of beer, after he has been late paying the rent and some of the food budget has to go cover the late fee'.
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

~ bookshelf ~ ugly writing ~ jukebox ~

Offline Cyrillic

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.

I don't know, Arachne.  While I agree with your generous interpretation, I suspect the target audience would take it the way Cyrillic did (at least based on that segment of the target audience among whom I live).  None of them would likely know what a frippery was, and the best guess might be "one of those fancy-az Starbucks drinks". 


That's a Fripperino!

Don't you mean frappuccino? Never heard of a fripperino.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 12:44:12 PM by Cyrillic »

Offline DeniseDenise

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Now you're just enabling, C! :laugh:


The first two examples encourages girls to be gold diggers.

That's probably not what the Bible teaches.

More like encouraging them to stick with someone who knows how to manage their money and won't sink the family into debt over fripperies.

I don't know, Arachne.  While I agree with your generous interpretation, I suspect the target audience would take it the way Cyrillic did (at least based on that segment of the target audience among whom I live).  None of them would likely know what a frippery was, and the best guess might be "one of those fancy-az Starbucks drinks"


That's a Fripperino!

Don't you mean frappuccino? Never heard of a fripperino.


see the highlights above for how my obviously very unfunny joke was made.

 :'(
All opinions expressed by myself are quite tragically my own, and not those of any other poster or wall hangings.

Offline Agabus

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I DO NOT AFFIRM OR DENY THE CONTENT OF ANY GIVEN POST IN THESE FORUMS. THEY REFLECT DIFFERENT STAGES OF MY FAITH AND LIFE. IF ONE OF MY POSTS HELPS YOU, MAY GOD BLESS IT, AND IF IT IS A STUMBLING BLOCK, MAY YOU AND GOD FORGIVE ME.

Offline JamesR

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If you want thought provoking articles about sex, subscribe to Men's Health. (Men's Fitness will do as well, at a pinch.)  :angel:

Their website prominently features an article on how to seduce a woman within a matter of seconds. The only thought that provoced was "Wow! They're a bunch of quacks!"

And that is why people bother to buy magazines rather than make do with what is found for free on the 'net. :laugh:
but... you can read it on their website for free.  :P

I think we need an expert to weigh in on this.  Where is JamesR?

Well, I've always been more of a Maxim and GQ man myself ever since I saw Lindsey Lohan on the cover circa 2006-2007  :angel: But yeah buying any written thing is kind of stupid when you can find virtually anything and everything you want for free on the internet.

Offline TheTrisagion

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Was that back when she was still hot? I shudder to think of what she must look like now. I would google it, but then I might barf.
God bless!

Offline Porter ODoran

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline Punch

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.

Nothing says you have to be on this thread.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline PeterTheAleut

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.

Nothing says you have to be on this thread.
But there is a rule mandating that we work to keep threads on topic, which the posters on this thread have failed miserably to do the last day or so.
Not all who wander are lost.

Offline Cyrillic

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.

Nothing says you have to be on this thread.
But there is a rule mandating that we work to keep threads on topic, which the posters on this thread have failed miserably to do the last day or so.

I can't remember a thread which stayed on topic for more than ten posts.

Offline biro

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.

Nothing says you have to be on this thread.
But there is a rule mandating that we work to keep threads on topic, which the posters on this thread have failed miserably to do the last day or so.

I can't remember a thread which stayed on topic for more than ten posts.

Um, the video and music threads?  ???
https://archiveofourown.org/users/Parakeetist/works Warning: stories have mature content.

"Some people only feel good when they are praising the Lord." - Coptic bishop

Mt. 21:31 Jesus said to them, “Assuredly, I say to you that tax collectors and harlots enter the kingdom of God before you."

"Our Lord will *never* stop loving us." - Fr. Michael P.

Offline Porter ODoran

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It's so thrilling to be a member here when OrthodoxChristianity.net becomes indistinguishable from some shabby subreddit.

Nothing says you have to be on this thread.
But there is a rule mandating that we work to keep threads on topic, which the posters on this thread have failed miserably to do the last day or so.

I can't remember a thread which stayed on topic for more than ten posts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRhq-yO1KN8
"Love ... is an abyss of illumination, a mountain of fire ... . It is the condition of angels, the progress of eternity" (Climacus).

Quote from: Seekingtrue
Yes we who are far from sainthood we can recognize a living saint and I'm talking from personal experience.Yes they are gentle soo gentle it can not be described it is like gentleness and humility in one and also they have this light this energy it's beyond words...and when you are near them you feel ecstatic and very happy

Offline minasoliman

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Alright...back on topic all of you.

May The Lord bless you and purify your thoughts.

-Mina
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.