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Offline hecma925

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Re: Women
« Reply #360 on: July 10, 2014, 05:33:02 AM »


And puppies.
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Women
« Reply #361 on: July 10, 2014, 08:39:56 AM »
Have we seriously not thought about being a little sensible to people's feelings?  Or is it that there is no other way to convey what could possibly be a good and edifying conversation in a more professional and dignified manner?  The OP wanted to bring to light how some are insensitive (including myself) to some of the sexist remarks.  We need to stop being so disagreeable and start asking why, or what do you mean, or how is it that I am insensitive.  Remember, even if food makes one offend, a good Christian is one who abtains from it, even if it's just a bunch of tomatoes let's say.  Likewise with your words too, when there are things you think you can say is not wrong, but better to abstain from saying it.  Sometimes, and I'll be the first to admit it to myself, we just stop thinking about how to be sensitive and start wanting to push buttons or become virulently responsive to posts.  Calm down, take a deep breathe, and start over.

+1 Mina.

I have seen many instances where the idea/suggestion of taking other people's thoughts, feelings and concerns into account has been dismissed as being "politically correct"  (a phrase that doesn't seem to have much definition but gets tossed off casually at times) or "censorship".  Another response has been that the poster is "just telling the truth" that another person needs to read (in his/her personal opinion).  This then says that the person who is the target is the one with a problem not the one who is being insensitive, to use your word.

It can be difficult to remember that there are real human beings at the "other end" of an on-line discussion.  Some people may just not care or are even enjoy rousing negative feelings.   I am *not* saying that you have done this, Mina, I assure you. 
   

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Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #362 on: July 10, 2014, 09:36:09 AM »
I have seen many instances where the idea/suggestion of taking other people's thoughts, feelings and concerns into account has been dismissed as being "politically correct"  (a phrase that doesn't seem to have much definition but gets tossed off casually at times) or "censorship".  Another response has been that the poster is "just telling the truth" that another person needs to read (in his/her personal opinion).  This then says that the person who is the target is the one with a problem not the one who is being insensitive, to use your word.

It can be difficult to remember that there are real human beings at the "other end" of an on-line discussion.  Some people may just not care or are even enjoy rousing negative feelings.   I am *not* saying that you have done this, Mina, I assure you. 

I don't think that the problem is remembering that there are "real human beings" at the other end.  The problem is that some of us don’t come from cultures that are as fragile as some people on this forum appear to be.  I was brought up and taught that no man can insult me.  I have to choose to be insulted.  I was also taught that if enough people say the same thing about you, there is probably some truth to it.  Either change or learn to live with it.  Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

And to be clear, this is not directed at the OP (provided that anyone even remembers it given the length and general stupidity of this thread).  In spite of what I have written above, I actually agree with the OP and have no problem with someone challenging what they believe to be false, or chooses to define their boundaries.  Usually if someone has the courage to define their boundaries (rather than just whining), I have the respect for them to honor their boundaries.
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Offline PeterTheAleut

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Re: Women
« Reply #363 on: July 10, 2014, 11:47:17 AM »
Quote
more to risk at the time of the Passion. Also women tend to be more fanatical or  zealous in following a leader or a cause, even today you see whackjobs like Femen or "Pussy Riot" engaging in the most ridiculous stunts in order to get their point across.

Wow, Charles. Wow. Insinuating that the holy women and the Mother of God were little more than "zealous, fanatical whackjobs" is not just low, it's subterranean, even by your usual belligerent standards.  >:( >:( >:(
I'm no fan of Charles Martel and his white supremacist, male chauvinist belligerence, but I see hardly anything in the post you just quoted that supports your interpretation of his words.
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Offline NicholasMyra

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Re: Women
« Reply #364 on: July 10, 2014, 12:24:04 PM »
Cyrillic....
Charles Martel...

Ban them.

No.  In my younger days I also misunderstood.  I hated the Virgin Mary and I hated the Saints.  I hated anything that took away from my God Jesus Christ.  I wanted to smash the statues of Mary and burn the Icons and images that showed anything other that Christ and His Cross.  Why?  I was a Bride of Christ, and I would allow nothing to be get between me and my betrothed.  God was I wrong.  These men have written nothing here that matches my error.

You're projecting your Protestant baggage onto everyone else. Hating Mary and icons is definitely not why I'm disputing the arguments that men and women are naturally equal in all respects. I'm an ex-Catholic, after all, and I've never experienced or understood the problems Protestants have with Mary (except in a purely intellectual sense of understanding their theological arguments).

Why feel attacked? It's not like you were on Nicholas' enemy list.
It's not a matter of enemies, Cyrillic.

I think you and I both know that another thread about women, minorities, homosexuals, muslims, russia, the poor, etc. is going to pop up, and the usual suspects will come there to scandalize. I don't see it stopping without some sort of greater intervention.
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Offline Severian

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Re: Women
« Reply #365 on: July 12, 2014, 12:54:35 PM »
You never know what a woman wants nowadays.

If you behave properly according to all that chivalrous stuff my mom indoctrinated me with, they'll hate you and see you as belittling them and upholding an outdated system. If you treat them like crap--er, I mean equals--just like we treat other men, they get mad and consider you to be rude and not a gentleman.

This is why life is simpler being a perpetually single man. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you women, but I'm too lazy to go through the trouble of acquiring one.
+1
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 12:55:44 PM by Severian »
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Offline Keble

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Re: Women
« Reply #366 on: July 12, 2014, 04:31:54 PM »
You never know what a woman wants nowadays.

If you behave properly according to all that chivalrous stuff my mom indoctrinated me with, they'll hate you and see you as belittling them and upholding an outdated system. If you treat them like crap--er, I mean equals--just like we treat other men, they get mad and consider you to be rude and not a gentleman.

First point: maybe the message here is about how you act around your (guy) buddies.

Second point: This isn't about Women; it's about a woman. You actually do have to treat them as individual human beings with their own tastes and desires and hang-ups and all that.

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Women
« Reply #367 on: July 14, 2014, 07:41:11 PM »
The Romans were civilised (for certain values of the word) Europeans, and they were as much into slavery, if they could be bothered not to just crucify everyone.

Slaves weren't exclusively women. Female slaves, unlike their male counterparts, were spared the mines and the galleys, which were the worst forms of slavery.

I happen to believe prostitution is the worst form of slavery, but we're not going to see this from the same angle, no matter what
Since men weren't spared that form of slavery, is there a point to be made here?
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Offline kelly

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Re: Women
« Reply #368 on: July 14, 2014, 07:54:00 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.
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Online xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Women
« Reply #369 on: July 14, 2014, 07:54:19 PM »
Edit: Whoops! Wrong thread! I meant to post on the politics fora.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2014, 07:55:36 PM by xOrthodox4Christx »
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Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #370 on: July 14, 2014, 07:58:02 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

Thank you for your opinion.  You know what they say about opinions.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline LBK

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Re: Women
« Reply #371 on: July 14, 2014, 07:58:49 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

Thank you for your opinion.  You know what they say about opinions.

Including yours?  ;)
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Offline kelly

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Re: Women
« Reply #372 on: July 14, 2014, 08:01:47 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

Thank you for your opinion.  You know what they say about opinions.

Sorry, I'll keep my mouth shut in the congregation from now on.
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Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #373 on: July 14, 2014, 08:14:22 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

Thank you for your opinion.  You know what they say about opinions.

Including yours?  ;)

See?  I say thank you to a woman and this is what I get . . . :)
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline john_mo

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Re: Women
« Reply #374 on: July 16, 2014, 07:41:23 AM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

I dunno... someone did post a pretty sweet picture of puppies a while back.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: Women
« Reply #375 on: July 16, 2014, 07:43:37 AM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

I dunno... someone did post a pretty sweet picture of puppies a while back.

Oh, you liked that one, huh?  :D
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Offline john_mo

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Re: Women
« Reply #376 on: July 16, 2014, 12:03:26 PM »
Always  ;D
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Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Women
« Reply #377 on: July 16, 2014, 12:25:00 PM »
No good point has been made in this thread since the OP.

I dunno... someone did post a pretty sweet picture of puppies a while back.

Oh, you liked that one, huh?  :D
So now you are comparing women to dogs.  Despicable.  ;)
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Offline Pravoslavbob

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Re: Women
« Reply #378 on: July 16, 2014, 01:46:53 PM »
Dear Brothers and Sisters,

I must admit to being quite dismayed and disappointed by the way this thread has run at times.  I have left it unlocked because IMHO some good points have been raised concerning an important topic,  as well as many things that ought to have remained unwritten.  I am sorry if, in the opinion of some, I have let things go on for too long.

Please treat this topic with the respect that it deserves.  I am giving everyone fair warning here that from now on I will not hesitate to issue warnings in this thread for flippant or off the cuff or hurtful remarks that do not help the flow of the discussion.  The same thing goes for posts that are not engaging the OP and are off-topic.  (I do not include the puppies or the kittens already posted, at the time of their posting  I found them to be a welcome relief.)  

Please realise that many in our midst have been hurt by sexism or racism or other attitudes and actions designed to make them feel less than human.  Surely these kinds of attitudes or attacks must be opposed by those of us who affirm that "There is neither Jew not Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." (Galatians 3:28)  Please post with sensitivity and tact, keeping these things in mind.  Brothers and sisters, let us struggle to use this thread (in however small a way) to further the healing of our brokenness under the tender ministrations of the Lord.

Your unworthy servant,

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« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 03:07:11 PM by Pravoslavbob »
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Women
« Reply #379 on: July 24, 2014, 01:23:37 PM »
I have seen many instances where the idea/suggestion of taking other people's thoughts, feelings and concerns into account has been dismissed as being "politically correct"  (a phrase that doesn't seem to have much definition but gets tossed off casually at times) or "censorship".  Another response has been that the poster is "just telling the truth" that another person needs to read (in his/her personal opinion).  This then says that the person who is the target is the one with a problem not the one who is being insensitive, to use your word.

It can be difficult to remember that there are real human beings at the "other end" of an on-line discussion.  Some people may just not care or are even enjoy rousing negative feelings.   I am *not* saying that you have done this, Mina, I assure you. 

I don't think that the problem is remembering that there are "real human beings" at the other end.  The problem is that some of us don’t come from cultures that are as fragile as some people on this forum appear to be.  I was brought up and taught that no man can insult me.  I have to choose to be insulted.  I was also taught that if enough people say the same thing about you, there is probably some truth to it.  Either change or learn to live with it.  Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

OK, you don't. Maybe what you wrote that you see is one problem, but it's not the *only* problem with on-line discussions.  I don't assume that someone objecting to or disagreeing with what another poster wrote is being "fragile".     There's a good bit of leeway between "nice" (whatever that means to you) and the dismissive or vicious or insulting and I was brought up to treat other people with some degree of courtesy whether I agree with them or not.

Quote
And to be clear, this is not directed at the OP (provided that anyone even remembers it given the length and general stupidity of this thread).  In spite of what I have written above, I actually agree with the OP and have no problem with someone challenging what they believe to be false, or chooses to define their boundaries.  Usually if someone has the courage to define their boundaries (rather than just whining), I have the respect for them to honor their boundaries.

Sometimes, though, one person being courageous might be dismissed as "whining" by another who doesn't like being challenged.  That word was used in this thread to describe a woman the person said he worked with.   Some people have no respect for those who disagree with them or don't fit what is supposed to be their "proper place".  There have been plenty of instances where people trying to have a voice or make a change in their situations have been put down sometimes with social displeasure, sometimes with violence and other times with disdain. They have been called "unnatural" or "uppity" or even more pejorative terms.  As Pravoslavbob wrote there are real human beings who have been really hurt by sexism and racism and other treatment.




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Offline Maria

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Re: Women
« Reply #380 on: July 24, 2014, 01:34:44 PM »
Quote
He said a woman should not have teaching authority over a man, but he also allowed there to be deaconesses.

Here are relevant selections from the services for several female saints, of varying stations in life and place of origin, which have something to say about women teaching:

St Olga, Great-princess of Kiev (9th-10th century):

Your memory dawns like the sun, holy Olga.
The mother of Russian kings, you pointed the way to Christ.
Teaching the angelic way, you overthrew the idols,
And the devil you countered with strength from the Holy Spirit.
You led the whole land to God from the darkness of ignorance.
Pray to him for those who remember you.


I'm sure that a more thorough examination of any Menaion would bring forth a good many more examples, showing that St Paul's directive against women teaching cannot be regarded as an absolute. It is also worth noting that the Epistle reading appointed for most of these saints is Gal. 3:23-29.

Speaking of which, today is the feast day of St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles.
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Offline Keble

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Re: Women
« Reply #381 on: July 24, 2014, 01:58:29 PM »
Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

(my highlighting)



Offline john_mo

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Re: Women
« Reply #382 on: July 24, 2014, 01:59:21 PM »
Was St. Paul against women teaching? Didn't he only say that they should remain silent in church?
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Offline Maria

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Re: Women
« Reply #383 on: July 24, 2014, 02:13:15 PM »
Was St. Paul against women teaching? Didn't he only say that they should remain silent in church?

Good question. If women were to remain silent all the time, and linguistic studies have shown that men do talk more than women, then we would not have as examples, St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles. St, Mary Magdalen, Equal to the Apostles, and St. Photini.

St. Mary Magdalen and St. Photini also taught others about Christ. St. Photini, the Samaritan Woman at the well, led her entire village to Christ, not by extensive teaching, but simply by one sentence, "Come and see ..."

Quote
Nero had St. Photini brought to him and asked if she would now relent and offer sacrifice to the idols. St. Photini spat in his face, and laughing at him, said, “O most impious of the blind, you profligate and stupid man! Do you think me so deluded that I would consent to renounce my Lord Christ and instead offer sacrifice to idols as blind as you?”

Hearing such words, Nero gave orders to throw St. Photini down a well, where she surrendered her soul to God in the year 66.

http://www.antiochian.org/node/17560
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Re: Women
« Reply #384 on: July 24, 2014, 02:15:14 PM »
Was St. Paul against women teaching? Didn't he only say that they should remain silent in church?

Quote from: Frederica Mathewes-Green
For example, opponents of women’s ordination often start by citing St. Paul’s requirement that women be submissive and silent in church (I Tim 2:11-15 and I Cor 14:34-35). Yet this can’t mean utter silence, because Paul honors many women in active ministry, like the deaconess Phoebe (Romans 16:1), and he hails Euodia, Synteche (I Cor 4:2-3) and Prisca (Rom 16:3) as synergoi (fellow-workers) in the gospel. Vocal prophetesses span the bible, from Moses’ sister Miriam (Ex 15:20) to the four daughters of St. Philip (Acts 21:9). The prophetess Anna spoke out in the temple, telling everyone about the child Christ (Lk 2:36-38).

When read in context, it sounds like St. Paul’s primary concern is that worship be reverent and orderly. It’s not just women; he wants men to shape up, too. In I Timothy, he admonishes men to pray “without anger or quarrelling” and tells women to “be silent,” as if both men and women have been restless, noisy, and disruptive. The problem isn’t women speaking in church, it’s women talking in church. Speaking in church would be something different, a way of participating in worship, which we can guess Philip’s daughters did when they functioned as prophets.

By the way, when Paul says women should “be silent,” in New Testament Greek it’s “be in hesychia,” a state of prayerful stillness.

http://frederica.com/writings/womens-ordination.html
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Offline Didyma

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Re: Women
« Reply #385 on: July 24, 2014, 02:16:11 PM »
If women were to remain silent all the time, and linguistic studies have shown that men do talk more than women, then we would not have as examples, St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles. St, Mary Magdalen, Equal to the Apostles, and St. Photini.

St. Mary Magdalen and St. Photini also taught others about Christ. St. Photini, the Samaritan Woman at the well, led her entire village to Christ, not by extensive teaching, but simply by one sentence, "Come and see ..."

Quote
Nero had St. Photini brought to him and asked if she would now relent and offer sacrifice to the idols. St. Photini spat in his face, and laughing at him, said, “O most impious of the blind, you profligate and stupid man! Do you think me so deluded that I would consent to renounce my Lord Christ and instead offer sacrifice to idols as blind as you?”

Hearing such words, Nero gave orders to throw St. Photini down a well, where she surrendered her soul to God in the year 66.

http://www.antiochian.org/node/17560


Good points, though linguistic studies actually show that women and men talk roughly the same amounts, just distributed differently depending on the social situation.
.- -. -.. / --. --- -.. / ... .... .- .-.. .-.. / .-- .. .--. . / .- .-- .- -.-- / .- .-.. .-.. / - . .- .-. ... / ..-. .-. --- -- / - .... . .. .-. / . -.-- . ...

Offline Maria

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Re: Women
« Reply #386 on: July 24, 2014, 02:20:25 PM »
If women were to remain silent all the time, and linguistic studies have shown that men do talk more than women, then we would not have as examples, St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles. St, Mary Magdalen, Equal to the Apostles, and St. Photini.

St. Mary Magdalen and St. Photini also taught others about Christ. St. Photini, the Samaritan Woman at the well, led her entire village to Christ, not by extensive teaching, but simply by one sentence, "Come and see ..."

Quote
Nero had St. Photini brought to him and asked if she would now relent and offer sacrifice to the idols. St. Photini spat in his face, and laughing at him, said, “O most impious of the blind, you profligate and stupid man! Do you think me so deluded that I would consent to renounce my Lord Christ and instead offer sacrifice to idols as blind as you?”

Hearing such words, Nero gave orders to throw St. Photini down a well, where she surrendered her soul to God in the year 66.

http://www.antiochian.org/node/17560


Good points, though linguistic studies actually show that women and men talk roughly the same amounts, just distributed differently depending on the social situation.

Have you read more recent studies? The ones I read were dated before 2009, but I do not have access unless I visit the university library. However, I do not feel safe visiting there, not with all the construction still going on to replace earthquake damaged buildings, and the huge sinkhole that recently opened up.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 02:20:53 PM by Maria »
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Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Women
« Reply #387 on: July 24, 2014, 02:28:57 PM »
The argument of who talks more is pretty silly, but here is an article that makes it as interesting as the topic can be, I suppose.

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20131112-do-women-talk-more-than-men

Quote
In research published in the journal Science in 2007, Pennebaker found that in their 17 waking hours the women they tested in the US and Mexico uttered an average of 16,215 words while the men spoke 15,669. Again, a negligible difference.

I can tell you in my house, my wife talks way more than I do.  I don't attribute it to gender, but rather just personality differences.
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Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #388 on: July 24, 2014, 02:40:24 PM »
Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

(my highlighting)




What? Did it take you 14 days to figure it out?
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #389 on: July 24, 2014, 02:45:33 PM »

OK, you don't. Maybe what you wrote that you see is one problem, but it's not the *only* problem with on-line discussions.  I don't assume that someone objecting to or disagreeing with what another poster wrote is being "fragile".

Nor do I.  I consider one "fragile" when they cannot engage in a conversation without getting hurt unless the other person has their lips on their behind.
     
Quote
Sometimes, though, one person being courageous might be dismissed as "whining" by another who doesn't like being challenged.  That word was used in this thread to describe a woman the person said he worked with.  

Without you being there and knowing the context of the conversation, you have no idea if they were whining or not.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline Ebor

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Re: Women
« Reply #390 on: July 24, 2014, 02:52:33 PM »
Quote
Sometimes, though, one person being courageous might be dismissed as "whining" by another who doesn't like being challenged.  That word was used in this thread to describe a woman the person said he worked with.  

Without you being there and knowing the context of the conversation, you have no idea if they were whining or not.

That is true and without being any of us being there and knowing the context of the conversation it is not known if the poster himself related it accurately, phrased it to show his own viewpoint of a situation or if he just dismissed a woman speaking up about what is *to her* some sort of bad situation as automatically "whining". 
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Offline Didyma

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Re: Women
« Reply #391 on: July 24, 2014, 03:05:57 PM »
If women were to remain silent all the time, and linguistic studies have shown that men do talk more than women, then we would not have as examples, St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles. St, Mary Magdalen, Equal to the Apostles, and St. Photini.

St. Mary Magdalen and St. Photini also taught others about Christ. St. Photini, the Samaritan Woman at the well, led her entire village to Christ, not by extensive teaching, but simply by one sentence, "Come and see ..."

Quote
Nero had St. Photini brought to him and asked if she would now relent and offer sacrifice to the idols. St. Photini spat in his face, and laughing at him, said, “O most impious of the blind, you profligate and stupid man! Do you think me so deluded that I would consent to renounce my Lord Christ and instead offer sacrifice to idols as blind as you?”

Hearing such words, Nero gave orders to throw St. Photini down a well, where she surrendered her soul to God in the year 66.

http://www.antiochian.org/node/17560


Good points, though linguistic studies actually show that women and men talk roughly the same amounts, just distributed differently depending on the social situation.

Have you read more recent studies? The ones I read were dated before 2009, but I do not have access unless I visit the university library. However, I do not feel safe visiting there, not with all the construction still going on to replace earthquake damaged buildings, and the huge sinkhole that recently opened up.

Well, I can't remember the exact source.  Just my Linguistics textbook from the semester before last.
.- -. -.. / --. --- -.. / ... .... .- .-.. .-.. / .-- .. .--. . / .- .-- .- -.-- / .- .-.. .-.. / - . .- .-. ... / ..-. .-. --- -- / - .... . .. .-. / . -.-- . ...

Offline Keble

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Re: Women
« Reply #392 on: July 24, 2014, 04:28:55 PM »
Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

(my highlighting)

(implied facepalm)


What? Did it take you 14 days to figure it out?

No. It took seeing your words in Ebor's response, the latter being that which I found actually worth reading all of.

Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Women
« Reply #393 on: July 24, 2014, 04:39:27 PM »
Wow.  

9 pages!

Impressive.

I still say that we, Orthodox Christians, need to be nicer to people.

« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 04:39:44 PM by LizaSymonenko »
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Offline Maria

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Re: Women
« Reply #394 on: July 24, 2014, 04:39:45 PM »
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Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #395 on: July 24, 2014, 04:44:09 PM »
Quote
Sometimes, though, one person being courageous might be dismissed as "whining" by another who doesn't like being challenged.  That word was used in this thread to describe a woman the person said he worked with.  

Without you being there and knowing the context of the conversation, you have no idea if they were whining or not.

That is true and without being any of us being there and knowing the context of the conversation it is not known if the poster himself related it accurately, phrased it to show his own viewpoint of a situation or if he just dismissed a woman speaking up about what is *to her* some sort of bad situation as automatically "whining". 

I was the one that used the term in an earlier post.  I assure you, I was there and was quite aware of the context of the conversation.  Whether or not you believe it was accurately stated is your problem.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline Jonathan Gress

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Re: Women
« Reply #396 on: July 24, 2014, 04:44:59 PM »
If women were to remain silent all the time, and linguistic studies have shown that men do talk more than women, then we would not have as examples, St. Olga of Russia, Equal to the Apostles. St, Mary Magdalen, Equal to the Apostles, and St. Photini.

St. Mary Magdalen and St. Photini also taught others about Christ. St. Photini, the Samaritan Woman at the well, led her entire village to Christ, not by extensive teaching, but simply by one sentence, "Come and see ..."

Quote
Nero had St. Photini brought to him and asked if she would now relent and offer sacrifice to the idols. St. Photini spat in his face, and laughing at him, said, “O most impious of the blind, you profligate and stupid man! Do you think me so deluded that I would consent to renounce my Lord Christ and instead offer sacrifice to idols as blind as you?”

Hearing such words, Nero gave orders to throw St. Photini down a well, where she surrendered her soul to God in the year 66.

http://www.antiochian.org/node/17560


Good points, though linguistic studies actually show that women and men talk roughly the same amounts, just distributed differently depending on the social situation.

Have you read more recent studies? The ones I read were dated before 2009, but I do not have access unless I visit the university library. However, I do not feel safe visiting there, not with all the construction still going on to replace earthquake damaged buildings, and the huge sinkhole that recently opened up.

Well, I can't remember the exact source.  Just my Linguistics textbook from the semester before last.

http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=12983#more-12983

Offline Punch

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Re: Women
« Reply #397 on: July 24, 2014, 04:46:00 PM »
Maybe some people on this forum need grow a pair instead of crying for everyone else to be “nice”.

(my highlighting)

(implied facepalm)


What? Did it take you 14 days to figure it out?

No. It took seeing your words in Ebor's response, the latter being that which I found actually worth reading all of.


Yet you fount it worth your time to comment, rendering your above response false.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Women
« Reply #398 on: July 24, 2014, 04:48:51 PM »

Go Dover Porn?  Is this porn from Delaware?


« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 04:49:10 PM by TheTrisagion »
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Offline vamrat

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Re: Women
« Reply #399 on: July 24, 2014, 04:50:24 PM »


It looks like he's breaking her neck.  I don't think that's what they mean by "leading to Christ". 
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Women
« Reply #400 on: July 24, 2014, 04:51:02 PM »

LOL!  You guys are too much!
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Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Women
« Reply #401 on: July 24, 2014, 04:51:56 PM »


It looks like he's breaking her neck.  I don't think that's what they mean by "leading to Christ".  
Please, it is clearly a sleeper hold.  Of course, given the context, that has disturbing ramifications as well.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 04:52:18 PM by TheTrisagion »
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Women
« Reply #402 on: July 24, 2014, 05:13:24 PM »
Quote
Sometimes, though, one person being courageous might be dismissed as "whining" by another who doesn't like being challenged.  That word was used in this thread to describe a woman the person said he worked with.  

Without you being there and knowing the context of the conversation, you have no idea if they were whining or not.

That is true and without being any of us being there and knowing the context of the conversation it is not known if the poster himself related it accurately, phrased it to show his own viewpoint of a situation or if he just dismissed a woman speaking up about what is *to her* some sort of bad situation as automatically "whining". 

I was the one that used the term in an earlier post.  I assure you, I was there and was quite aware of the context of the conversation.  Whether or not you believe it was accurately stated is your problem.

My apologies.  I was conflating another poster's remarks on women in the workforce with yours.  I should have been more diligent in looking for quotes.  This was my error.

However, there are plenty of instances in the world where negative terms such as "whining" have been used to dismiss other people attempting to speak up. 

Again, apologies for my mistake.
 

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Offline littlepilgrim64

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Re: Women
« Reply #403 on: July 24, 2014, 06:56:32 PM »
These words are soooo true . . .thanks for posting, Maria!

(But not the best photo the folks @ godoverporn could have used to get their point across, ya know?  I learned several maneuvers in a self-defense class I took to get out of a similar kind of hold.)
 

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Re: Women
« Reply #404 on: July 24, 2014, 07:00:20 PM »
(But not the best photo the folks @ godoverporn could have used to get their point across, ya know?  I learned several maneuvers in a self-defense class I took to get out of a similar kind of hold.)

I know I wouldn't want to go anywhere with someone who held me in a headlock.
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