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Author Topic: Why are there any Orthodox Jurisdictions in the NCC?  (Read 1405 times) Average Rating: 0
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Sabbas
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« on: April 25, 2005, 11:01:29 PM »

I want to let everyone know that I am not trying to break board rules by bringing this up.
Please do not bring American politics into this as tempting as it is.
Why are the SCOBA churches still in the NCC? I just was watching a late night talk show and the NCC representative was defending the NCC saying it had not taken a pro-Abortion stance by saying, ". . . look we have got thirteen Orthodox jurisdictions in the NCC I would be hard pressed to call them liberals on this issue . . ." It occurred to me, "Why does the Orthodox Church put up with all the balogna?" The Orthodox Church does not gain anything from being in the NCC but instead gets abused by the Protestants who trot us out whenever they want to convince Evangelicals and Catholics that the NCC is not a libertine pro-Abortion organization. Why do the bishops stay? What kind of a deal is this? I am no fan of modern day Roman Catholicism but I think the Orthodox should be working in the pro-Life struggle with the Roman church and leave the NCC. I keep playing scenarios in my mind to try and understand why the Orthodox bishops have stayed till now but I just can't figure it out.
Can anyone else explain this to me?
« Last Edit: April 25, 2005, 11:02:09 PM by Sabbas » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2005, 11:20:40 PM »

Explain it to you? I don't think so; I'm on your side here.
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« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2005, 11:30:15 PM »

Once again tell us which jurisdictions are having a hard time dealing with the NCC and who feel fine with the our favorite words "ecumenical dialogue"? 






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« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2005, 12:02:55 AM »

Once again tell us which jurisdictions are having a hard time dealing with the NCC and who feel fine with the our favorite words "ecumenical dialogue"?

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I ask short questions because the pros on this board are my teachers (sort of).
Perhaps the replies I make sometimes don't account for anything productive. I'll be honest I have always had a negative tone and I instigate in a lot of topics without anything good to say that's not on anyone's benefit. So I apologize when I approach the users in a way that feel I am a bother but please forgive me I sin profusely . So I will respect all the board members hereby.... just reading and not answering the posts? :dunno:
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Sabbas
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« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2005, 11:18:09 AM »

Alex we all pray that you will be able to better control yourself in the future and not sin so profusely  Wink
But seriously I think that even Orthodox bishops who like to engage in 'Ecumenical dialogue' should be concerned about this. Orthodoxy is really not being given a voice at all in the NCC. Rather it is being gaged and trotted out for PR reasons like I said before.
I think these are three good articles http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articlesprint4/CouretasNCCP.shtml http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles4/JacobseNCCStalinists.shtml http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles4/JacobseCubaVisit.shtml
If you want to know who is in the NCC heres the page http://www.ncccusa.org/members/index.html Even the Serbs and Russians are still there! Who is not in the NCC? Well the Jerusalem Patriarchate, ROCOR, the Holy Synod in Resistance, the Genuine Orthodox Church, and other Old Calendarists.

The reason why I started this discussion is that I want to know why the SCOBA churches have remained, what recent news/developments do you know about, what do you think about this situation, and is there anything that the laity can and/or should do to try and get the bishops to wake up and smell the garbage?
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« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2005, 11:42:41 AM »

Alex we all pray that you will be able to better control yourself in the future and not sin so profusely Wink
But seriously I think that even Orthodox bishops who like to engage in 'Ecumenical dialogue' should be concerned about this. Orthodoxy is really not being given a voice at all in the NCC. Rather it is being gaged and trotted out for PR reasons like I said before.
I think these are three good articles http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articlesprint4/CouretasNCCP.shtml http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles4/JacobseNCCStalinists.shtml http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles4/JacobseCubaVisit.shtml
If you want to know who is in the NCC heres the page http://www.ncccusa.org/members/index.html Even the Serbs and Russians are still there! Who is not in the NCC? Well the Jerusalem Patriarchate, ROCOR, the Holy Synod in Resistance, the Genuine Orthodox Church, and other Old Calendarists.

The reason why I started this discussion is that I want to know why the SCOBA churches have remained, what recent news/developments do you know about, what do you think about this situation, and is there anything that the laity can and/or should do to try and get the bishops to wake up and smell the garbage?

What's the Holy Synond in Resistance?  ROCOR and JP are credible, but the Gen OC and "other Old Calendarists" don't concern me as their pretty much schismatic.
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Sabbas
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« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2005, 12:00:05 PM »

The Holy Synod in Resistance is headed by Metropolitan Cyprian and in the United States by Archbishop Chrysostomos. http://www.synodinresistance.gr/indexen.htm
We have board members who belong to the G.O.C. (Florinite Synod) and the Holy Synod in Resistance (Cyprianite Synod) and both groups, particularly the Holy Synod in Resistance which has the Center for Traditionalist Orthdox Studies in Etna http://users.sisqtel.net/sgpm/ctos/ , produce very good literature so I think it is only fair to mention them.
Please do not take my statement as an invitation to debate who is or is not schismatic. This discussion is about the Orthodox and the NCC.
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« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2005, 12:29:01 PM »

As I have defined elsewere who I believe to be schismatic and who is not, I see no reason to repeat myself (especially in light of the negitive reaction I get from many on this board Wink )

But as far as why we're members of the NCC, pretty much for the same reaons we're members of the WCC, it's not communion, it's not acceptance of protestant dogmatics, it's not acceptance of these organization's politics, it's simply a forum for discussion. Think of it as a 'UN for Churches," when possible we can use it to our advantage, when not we just ignore them...it's called politics.
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« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2005, 12:37:14 PM »

Yeah, and boy how these politics have helped.
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« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2005, 12:47:27 PM »

There are many who think the Orthodox should leave the WCC as well. But with the NCC the situation seems worse. The NCC is a body that does not seem to be run by people who really care what the Orthodox believe. They do not want to talk about the evils of Liberation Theology or whether opposing stem cell research and abortion are really important to being a Christian. The Church teaches that you cannot be a Christian and support abortion whether through consent or inaction and still call yourself a Christian. I do not believe that the majority of people in the NCC care about the sanctity of human life nor do I believe they care what Orthodoxy has to say about Truth. The Roman Catholic church and the Evangelical churches are working together to fight issues like abortion and same sex marriages. Isn't it time the Orthodox joined them in this fight instead of staying in the NCC?
Now I am trying to stay away from politics but I find this a useful analogy. Say you are in a nation where the majority of people are Socialist. You are a monarchist and nationalist. There is a large minority of people who support private property and national pride but believe in a limited democratic government. Which group would you join? The minority of course! It would be idiotic for you to join the Socialists in a vain attempt to have a voice and try and change peoples minds. That is what is happening right now with the Orthodox Church. There is a large minority group, RC's and Evangelicals, who want more help and are fighting for the same issues as us but the Orthodox bishops for no apparent reason go with the majority, the NCC, that does not fight for the same issues.
What kind of politics is that?
« Last Edit: April 26, 2005, 12:49:19 PM by Sabbas » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2005, 12:55:13 PM »

Sabbas,

You're missing the point, the point of our membership in the NCC is not to try and increase our political influence in the secular sphere and acquire legislation favourable to our moral posistions from Washington. Rather we wish a forum to discuss religious issues, to dialogue with various faiths and make our religious presence known. Though the Church in this country supports things like teh Sanctity of life, we generally have no desire to be caught up in the politics of Washington, that's simply outside our sphere of influence and concern. Now if the country was 70% Orthodox, things may be different, but it is not.
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