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Author Topic: Forget gay marriage: 'Fornicators and adulterers' in church a bigger issue  (Read 492 times) Average Rating: 0
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Jetavan
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« on: May 07, 2014, 01:29:45 PM »

Quote
Christians should clean up their own act before condemning gay marriage, said actor Kirk Cameron, who visits Alabama this month to lead marriage seminars.
....
"If the people sitting in the pews are fornicators and adulterers, the church will destroy marriages much more quickly than those outside the church. When God's people mock marriage, God doesn't take that lightly."

Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.
....
"We need to be faithful in our own house," he said. "Jesus didn't go shouting at the Romans. He went into the temple. We have the same problem today that people had back then. We've had pastors drop like flies, guys I know. When that happens, it drags the name of Christ through the mud. When hypocrisy grows within the church, it's like pouring fertilizer on the weeds in your garden."

I disagree with his anti-evolutionism, but he was great in 'Growing Pains'.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2014, 01:31:22 PM by Jetavan » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2014, 01:42:13 PM »

What's surprising is that he still has an audience that's willing to pay.
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Justin Kissel
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« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2014, 01:44:15 PM »

Huh. I would have found it hard to believe that I'd agree with Kirk on much, yet here it is...
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« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2014, 01:51:27 PM »

Huh. I would have found it hard to believe that I'd agree with Kirk on much, yet here it is...
I greatly respect Kirk.  He was a visionary before his time.  Let us reflect on some of his quotes.

Leave bigotry in your quarters; there's no room for it on the bridge.

There's only one kind of woman...or man, for that matter. You either believe in yourself or you don't.

Worlds are conquered, galaxies destroyed...but a woman is always a woman.

There are certain things men must do to remain men.

*sigh*  I'm getting all nostalgic now.  I think I'll go watch Star Trek this evening.
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« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2014, 01:53:06 PM »

Huh. I would have found it hard to believe that I'd agree with Kirk on much, yet here it is...
I greatly respect Kirk.  He was a visionary before his time.  Let us reflect on some of his quotes.

Leave bigotry in your quarters; there's no room for it on the bridge.

There's only one kind of woman...or man, for that matter. You either believe in yourself or you don't.

Worlds are conquered, galaxies destroyed...but a woman is always a woman.

There are certain things men must do to remain men.

*sigh*  I'm getting all nostalgic now.  I think I'll go watch Star Trek this evening.

Wisdom....
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« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2014, 02:18:20 PM »

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Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.

That all sins are bad doesn't mean that some shouldn't be criticized because they're "not a priority". His logic stinks.
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« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2014, 02:19:12 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
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« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2014, 02:29:33 PM »

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Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.

That all sins are bad doesn't mean that some shouldn't be criticized because they're "not a priority". His logic stinks.

Maybe he didn't want to get dragged into the thousandth time that topic is discussed. Maybe he meant something along the lines of 'that is not a priority for me to speak about today,' knowing how people tend to fixate on gay marriage, and that once that cat is out of the bag that it wouldn't be possible to put it back in.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2014, 02:29:54 PM by Asteriktos » Logged

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« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2014, 02:31:16 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...except for Tim Tebow.

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« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2014, 02:34:06 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...
...uh, that would be MLK, Jr.

And, no, saints are not perfect.  Wink
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« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2014, 02:50:05 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...
...uh, that would be MLK, Jr.

And, no, saints are not perfect.  Wink
Um, that blog only mentions Episcopalians and Lutherans.
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« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2014, 02:55:47 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...
...uh, that would be MLK, Jr.

And, no, saints are not perfect.  Wink
Um, that blog only mentions Episcopalians and Lutherans.
But MLK was a Baptist.
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« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2014, 02:58:10 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...
...uh, that would be MLK, Jr.

And, no, saints are not perfect.  Wink
Um, that blog only mentions Episcopalians and Lutherans.
But MLK was a Baptist.
Speaking as a former Baptist, I would say that most of the more conservative strains of Baptists do not look favorably upon him. Of course, there are about 80+ different Baptist denominations, so that really doesn't tell you much.
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« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2014, 03:02:13 PM »

Kirk Cameron, the closest thing Baptists have to a saint...
...uh, that would be MLK, Jr.

And, no, saints are not perfect.  Wink
Um, that blog only mentions Episcopalians and Lutherans.
But MLK was a Baptist.
Speaking as a former Baptist, I would say that most of the more conservative strains of Baptists do not look favorably upon him. Of course, there are about 80+ different Baptist denominations, so that really doesn't tell you much.

+1.  And with as many Independent Baptist churches that also happen to be homogenous and/or racist, good luck having them recognize MLK a saint.  Or any saint for that matter.  That be eye-doll-ah-tree, son.
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« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2014, 06:29:12 PM »

Quote
Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.

That all sins are bad doesn't mean that some shouldn't be criticized because they're "not a priority". His logic stinks.

Ya, he was being politically correct at that moment, but I think overall the quoted OP seems to be something I tend to agree with.  Increased divorce rates, adultery, and fornication became socially acceptable before gay marriage.  I think the underlying problem that lead to gay marriage is not gay predispositions, but an overall destruction of the very fabric of marriage itself, leading to a vain understanding of what "marriage" is in the secular world.
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« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2014, 06:39:09 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2014, 06:39:47 PM by ialmisry » Logged

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« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2014, 08:23:46 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.

Your life isn't society.
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« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2014, 08:26:42 PM »

Quote
Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.

That all sins are bad doesn't mean that some shouldn't be criticized because they're "not a priority". His logic stinks.

Ya, he was being politically correct at that moment, but I think overall the quoted OP seems to be something I tend to agree with.  Increased divorce rates, adultery, and fornication became socially acceptable before gay marriage.  I think the underlying problem that lead to gay marriage is not gay predispositions, but an overall destruction of the very fabric of marriage itself, leading to a vain understanding of what "marriage" is in the secular world.

I think I agree. It seems to make more sense that gay marriage is not directly a cause, but a symptom, of the collapse of marriage.
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« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2014, 08:39:16 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.

Your life isn't society.
You're right: my sons are legitimate.
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« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2014, 08:45:42 PM »

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Cameron declined to criticize gay marriage and same-sex unions, saying that's not a priority.

That all sins are bad doesn't mean that some shouldn't be criticized because they're "not a priority". His logic stinks.

Or not "politically correct."
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« Reply #20 on: May 07, 2014, 08:55:25 PM »

I dunno, it seemed quite politically incorrect to me, taking into consideration the politics of conservative Christianity.
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« Reply #21 on: May 07, 2014, 10:18:04 PM »

I dunno, it seemed quite politically incorrect to me, taking into consideration the politics of conservative Christianity.

Good point, but I think he was trying to attract the opposition with his double message of "I'm not concentrating on that right now" and "wo to you Christian fornicators and divorcees, hypocrites!"
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« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2014, 10:20:34 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.

Your life isn't society.
You're right: my sons are legitimate.

I guess the government knowing who a kid's parent is more important than the kid knowing who they are. Strange twist coming from you.
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« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2014, 10:33:30 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.
Right, because heterosexuals never got divorces before. At least divorce is something you know about.
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« Reply #24 on: May 07, 2014, 10:36:39 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.

Your life isn't society.
You're right: my sons are legitimate.

I guess the government knowing who a kid's parent is more important than the kid knowing who they are. Strange twist coming from you.
Last year, 40% of children in the US not living with their father (an ever increasing number) had not set foot in their father's house, a large number not even seeing him the entire year.
Good luck on them knowing who they are.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2014, 10:40:55 PM by ialmisry » Logged

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« Reply #25 on: May 07, 2014, 10:38:44 PM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.
Right, because heterosexuals never got divorces before. At least divorce is something you know about.
LOL.
The more you harp on that one note, the more you prove my point on this issue.
It takes only one person to get a divorce, it takes two people of opposite gender to make a marriage.

btw, in IL, as in NY, they had "same sex divorce" before they had redefined marriage.  In fact, in IL the first homosexual "divorcing" his "partner" filed two years ago.  Marriage isn't officially redefined in IL until next month.
How apropos!
« Last Edit: May 07, 2014, 10:43:53 PM by ialmisry » Logged

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« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2014, 03:22:56 AM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.
Right, because heterosexuals never got divorces before. At least divorce is something you know about.
LOL.
The more you harp on that one note, the more you prove my point on this issue.
It takes only one person to get a divorce, it takes two people of opposite gender to make a marriage.

btw, in IL, as in NY, they had "same sex divorce" before they had redefined marriage.  In fact, in IL the first homosexual "divorcing" his "partner" filed two years ago.  Marriage isn't officially redefined in IL until next month.
How apropos!

My mother's been through two divorces; two of my sisters are divorced.  Trust me, it takes two to divorce, but usually both parties think it only takes one.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2014, 03:23:34 AM by JamesRottnek » Logged

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ialmisry
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« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2014, 08:04:03 AM »

I'm sure as more Americans support marriage equality, Evangelical Christians will back away from the issue.
and contribute to accelerate societal collapse.  After all, they paved the way with divorce.
Right, because heterosexuals never got divorces before. At least divorce is something you know about.
LOL.
The more you harp on that one note, the more you prove my point on this issue.
It takes only one person to get a divorce, it takes two people of opposite gender to make a marriage.

btw, in IL, as in NY, they had "same sex divorce" before they had redefined marriage.  In fact, in IL the first homosexual "divorcing" his "partner" filed two years ago.  Marriage isn't officially redefined in IL until next month.
How apropos!

My mother's been through two divorces; two of my sisters are divorced.  Trust me, it takes two to divorce, but usually both parties think it only takes one.
No, it takes only one. Besides the admission by the ad hominem crowd that divorce (as opposed to my parents or siblings, though you can trust them when they say the same answer as mine) "is something [ I ] know about," and the same judgement of my ex's father confessor and our counselor (and, it would seem, our son's psychologist-although he hasn't come out and said it, he has said plenty on their mother), there is plenty of data that the divorce courts of this country churn out.  Let alone the plain language of the divorces statutes.

"Usually" doesn't mean "always."  I'm not sure of this issue if you can even substantiate it meaning "mostly."

The same ad hominem ilk used to point out that Reagan was divorced when he promoted family values.  Not something pertinent, mind you, like he signed the first no fault divorce law while governor of California (something he (and his son) said he regretted when he saw what he unleashed).  No, a personal attack because they couldn't argue the facts on the matter.  That his ex remarried and divorced after him-as she had married before him-and the number of years of their marriage outnumbered the number of years of her other marriages put together, while he remarried for over half a century until his death, would suggest a rather lopsided allotment of responsibility for the divorce.

Mel Gibson said the he alone bore the responsibility of his divorce.  Given his behavior, is there any contrary evidence?
« Last Edit: May 08, 2014, 08:06:00 AM by ialmisry » Logged

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