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Author Topic: Sign of the Cross for the Theotokos and the Church?  (Read 983 times) Average Rating: 0
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Mor Ephrem
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« Reply #45 on: May 06, 2014, 11:38:17 AM »

It seems to me that raising your hands palm up in a supplicatory manner is a most natural gesture. At home, I do it during my private prayers and am sorely tempted to also do it at Church (such as, during the pre-communion prayers, St Symeon's prayer, the Trisagion prayers...) Alas, I suspect that this practice is discouraged as folks may inadvertently touch each other.

God forbid!  Tongue

At one of the local parishes, there is a guy who maintains the orans position, with palms up and hands above his head (!), for just about the entire duration of the Liturgy (he doesn't do it during the sermon or while on the Communion line).  And he's not being hyperdox about it, either.  It is really an edifying sight. 
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Apolytikion, Tone 1, by Antonis

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« Reply #46 on: May 06, 2014, 12:06:27 PM »

It seems to me that raising your hands palm up in a supplicatory manner is a most natural gesture. At home, I do it during my private prayers and am sorely tempted to also do it at Church (such as, during the pre-communion prayers, St Symeon's prayer, the Trisagion prayers...) Alas, I suspect that this practice is discouraged as folks may inadvertently touch each other.

God forbid!  Tongue

At one of the local parishes, there is a guy who maintains the orans position, with palms up and hands above his head (!), for just about the entire duration of the Liturgy (he doesn't do it during the sermon or while on the Communion line).  And he's not being hyperdox about it, either.  It is really an edifying sight. 

 Shocked My arms hurt after a few minutes.  I'm a wuss.
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Mor Ephrem
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« Reply #47 on: May 06, 2014, 12:11:19 PM »

At one of the local parishes, there is a guy who maintains the orans position, with palms up and hands above his head (!), for just about the entire duration of the Liturgy (he doesn't do it during the sermon or while on the Communion line).  And he's not being hyperdox about it, either.  It is really an edifying sight. 

 Shocked My arms hurt after a few minutes.  I'm a wuss.

But if you want, you can be all flame. 
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Apolytikion, Tone 1, by Antonis

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« Reply #48 on: May 06, 2014, 12:50:41 PM »

At one of the local parishes, there is a guy who maintains the orans position, with palms up and hands above his head (!), for just about the entire duration of the Liturgy (he doesn't do it during the sermon or while on the Communion line).  And he's not being hyperdox about it, either.  It is really an edifying sight. 

 Shocked My arms hurt after a few minutes.  I'm a wuss.

But if you want, you can be all flame. 

If I want, I'd be doing morning and evening prayers, but I'm struggling with that. Tongue
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« Reply #49 on: May 06, 2014, 12:55:06 PM »

It seems to me that raising your hands palm up in a supplicatory manner is a most natural gesture. At home, I do it during my private prayers and am sorely tempted to also do it at Church (such as, during the pre-communion prayers, St Symeon's prayer, the Trisagion prayers...) Alas, I suspect that this practice is discouraged as folks may inadvertently touch each other.

I definitely do it during private prayers, but I've never seen enough people do it at church to feel comfortable doing it there myself.
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« Reply #50 on: May 06, 2014, 05:51:49 PM »

It seems to me that raising your hands palm up in a supplicatory manner is a most natural gesture. At home, I do it during my private prayers and am sorely tempted to also do it at Church (such as, during the pre-communion prayers, St Symeon's prayer, the Trisagion prayers...) Alas, I suspect that this practice is discouraged as folks may inadvertently touch each other.

God forbid!  Tongue

At one of the local parishes, there is a guy who maintains the orans position, with palms up and hands above his head (!), for just about the entire duration of the Liturgy (he doesn't do it during the sermon or while on the Communion line).  And he's not being hyperdox about it, either.  It is really an edifying sight. 

Really?

That's one thing I miss about Pentecostal worship. It still feels right to raise my hands to the Lord sometimes.

But no one in church does anything similar, so I don't. Only Fr. M. sometimes raises his hands, outward slightly. And only briefly and at a few moments.

I feel rather "Baptist" ... often clutching the back of the pew in front of me.

At least there is private worship/prayers. Smiley
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« Reply #51 on: May 06, 2014, 06:26:07 PM »

Really?

That's one thing I miss about Pentecostal worship. It still feels right to raise my hands to the Lord sometimes.

But no one in church does anything similar, so I don't. Only Fr. M. sometimes raises his hands, outward slightly. And only briefly and at a few moments.

Yeah, I get the feeling that, out of all the Eastern Orthodox, only the Antiochians are comfortable with such things because of the Middle Eastern influence.  All of the Oriental Orthodox have this sort of thing (though it's not exactly the same as Pentecostals) in both public and private worship. 
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Apolytikion, Tone 1, by Antonis

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« Reply #52 on: May 06, 2014, 06:51:17 PM »

Really?

That's one thing I miss about Pentecostal worship. It still feels right to raise my hands to the Lord sometimes.

But no one in church does anything similar, so I don't. Only Fr. M. sometimes raises his hands, outward slightly. And only briefly and at a few moments.

Yeah, I get the feeling that, out of all the Eastern Orthodox, only the Antiochians are comfortable with such things because of the Middle Eastern influence.  All of the Oriental Orthodox have this sort of thing (though it's not exactly the same as Pentecostals) in both public and private worship. 

While a few old first-gen immigrants did it at my home Antiochian parish, oddly enough more people (converts) seem to do it at my OCA parish.
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« Reply #53 on: May 07, 2014, 03:36:44 AM »

So much of the Divne Liturgy is supplication, it would seem natural?

Before I came to an Orthodox Church, I saw a picture of worship in an Orthodox liturgy (not sure what kind) and all the women had slightly raised/outstretched hands. It looked like very sincere worship.
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« Reply #54 on: May 07, 2014, 07:42:39 AM »

I've been wondering this as well?

I'm not sure if the traditions are the same through all Orthodox churches, but in our church, we cross ourselves at certain times.

I understand why, when the Trinity is mentioned (at least that was what was explained to me).

But why does almost everyone do it when the Theotokos is mentioned? And as well, most do it during the Creed when the Church is mentioned?

Thank you.

I´ve heard my priest say that every time we cross ourselves it´s either a way of praising and glorifying God through his name, of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. So when we remember Saints, the Church and all it´s truth in different matters we, by crossing ourselves, are praising God for the work He has done for us to grant salvation, through other people, his Church and many different things.

Or, as the priest mentioned, by the sign of the cross we are given one of the strongest, personal and easiest way to bless ourselves. So when we remember the Holy Theotokos, the church in the creed, Saints, their relics in our prayers and actions towards God, He actually in the process blesses us so as we through the sign of the cross both praise Him for all things and for all His work.

Pray for me and forgive me, the sinner
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« Reply #55 on: May 15, 2014, 12:41:04 AM »

i can answer for why it is done for theotokos, is bcos there is an over-devotion to her by many deluded people.
u often see them seated when anything regarding jesus is mentioned, but when theotokos is mentioned, they want to make a big show that they adore her THIIIISSSSSS MUCH
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Mor Ephrem
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« Reply #56 on: May 15, 2014, 01:05:06 AM »

It's like the people who are perfectly capable of choosing an icon of Christ as their avatar, but choose the Theotokos instead.  Deluded, crazy people. 
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Apolytikion, Tone 1, by Antonis

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« Reply #57 on: May 15, 2014, 01:40:37 AM »

i can answer for why it is done for theotokos, is bcos there is an over-devotion to her by many deluded people.
u often see them seated when anything regarding jesus is mentioned, but when theotokos is mentioned, they want to make a big show that they adore her THIIIISSSSSS MUCH

Yeah, what was the Church thinking when first calling her "God-bearer".  I mean, why would anyone care about her very minor role in mankind's salvation?  It's like she's the Mother of God or something...

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« Reply #58 on: May 15, 2014, 05:58:06 AM »

xD
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