Poll

Should the Holy and Great Council be postponed?

Yes, more preparational work is needed
17 (41.5%)
No, the historical Council should be held as scheduled
14 (34.1%)
No, it shouldn't be held at all until agenda changes
10 (24.4%)

Total Members Voted: 41

Voting closed: June 24, 2016, 09:11:23 AM

Author Topic: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016  (Read 155998 times)

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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #990 on: July 05, 2016, 03:55:36 PM »
While making this about personalities is potentially quite a bit more interesting than what Denise was doing, I have given my reaction and have nothing else to add. The Council was not a group of old boys playing hooky, it was not either, on the other hand, a Satanic menace. Positions have been stated clearly on several sides. There's nothing more to do here.
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #991 on: July 06, 2016, 05:35:16 PM »
This is PRECISELY Antioch's position.

If people were to actually read Antioch's official statements, they would see that Antioch objected to how ALL the other Autocephalous Churches were treated by the Patriarch of Constantinople.  This was manifest in the demands that the agenda only be set by Constantinople, in addition to how the documents were to be drafted and the limited input from the other Churches. 

The fact that Constantinople could not articulate its reasoning for ignoring Antioch's request for a hearing at the meeting should show everyone exactly how Constantinople thinks of other Churches and what is important to them.  The lack of mutual respect is astounding.

+1

Well, then we are reading two entirely different versions of the facts, I'm afraid.

Yes, the generosity of diasporal Greeks has allowed Constantinople to motor along, but it has come at a price for all concerned.  And that is, Constantinople can't seem to decide whether it wants to continue to be a Grecocentric affair or something that can embrace the growing non-Greek parts of the Church.  Alexandria and Jerusalem are examples of Autocephalous Churches that have Greek bishops but virtually no Greeks in them.  Constantinople is is ghost town of metropolises without any Christians (or a negligible number).
+1

Instead, this meeting in Crete became something like a holiday dinner for a dysfunctional family, where the elephants are not mentioned and the closets are full of skeletons.  We can't just keep ignoring our real problems.
Unfortunately, I have to agree with Father.
I have this feeling of bishops holiday especially observing the official website of the Polish Church.. Almost no info (and except one bishop, no opinion, no interview, nothing), but pictures... With Romanian patriarch, with Serbian patriarch, with African bishops, bishops drinking coffee together, bishops posing on the sea background and so on... Only selfie is lacking. I hope it's not so offensive... That's jsut feeling of a laywoman, and I think many 'usual' faithful have similar feelings, at least that's what I see reading various Orthodox forums and commentaries across the world in different languages...

You are closely related to hierarchs by work or friendship, then? Surely you would not be judging your fathers in the Spirit solely based on feeling dissatisfied with a particular photo album?

Those of us who listened to the addresses, observed the press conferences, participated in the liturgies in a sense, remotely, and who read the documents didn't feel the Council amounted to a day on the beach. Frankly, I can't think how much suspicion must already reside in a nature or popular perception to be willing to assume our Holy Fathers would do nothing even at a Council but kill time and feed the flesh. If this degree of suspicion were leveled at earthly children, they would be rightly irate -- how can we level it at heavenly elders?
Well, actually Mor has clarified what I'd been meaning (thank you, Mor :)), but maybe I'll try to better explain myself:
1. I'm a coordinator for the foreign news for cerkiew.pl (the biggest Polish Orthodox website, however not official), so I was following all the things around the Council in various languages.  But because of the lack of time (exams session, writing the thesis) and no people able/wanting to do translations for free for cerkiew.pl, we didn't write enough about the council.

2. However, we asked our bishops and other members of the Polish delegation to give some info, articles, interviews etc. before the council, during it, and after it; no one, except one priest, has answered positively. So, the unique info were short general info ("today we were discussing about x topic") and plenty of pictures of type I wrote in the earlier post.

3. Regarding other Churches, I can give examples of Bulgaria and Serbia; the first one - no info from the bishops except 2 official statements that they're not going to Crete. No explanations to the faithful. And a mess with one archimandrite that was "representing" Bulgarian Church, but he had been expelled from it and now he's a member of the Church of Greece. But, again, nothing from official media, only journalists from dveri.bg (the biggest Bulgarian Orthodox website, not official) did some efforts to search who is this person.
The second one: patriarch Ireneus gave an interview to one of Serbian newspapers (not Church one), bishop Porphyrios was giving some summary in videos, and bishop Maxim was writing and publishing his diary, after each of the council days. Surely, that's much more than in case of Polish Church, however even Serbian faitful feel not being well-informed.

4. I know personally some hierarchs, at least 3 Polish bishops know me by name, last year when i visited Lublin the local bishops arranged a staying for me at parish house next to the cathedra, I ate with him a super and talking for 2 horus privately, another time, he brought for me Serbian beer from Serbia (that's not a joke). I was talking 2 times (and one of them quite long, as it was a kind of party, even drinking rakija together) with Serbian bishop Andrew (in/of Switzerland), even visited his room at the Patriarchate House. I had an opportunity to talk shortly with Serbian patriarch Ireneus, Antiochian metropolitan Joseph of America, one of Brazilian bishops under the Polish jurisdiction. I was (as a translator) with another Polish bishop at a kind of lunch with Serbian musicians. And so on.
Surely, it's not friendship or a cooperation (work), but, I suppose, because of my voluntarly work for the Church (mainly cerkiew.pl, but not only), I had some opportunies to get know closer the hierarchs than some of laypeople.

5. I didn't want to accuse people (hierarchs), but some attitudes. That's a certain difference. I'm sorry, if you or anybody have been offended.
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #992 on: July 06, 2016, 06:00:14 PM »
Considering this breadth and intimacy of knowledge of hierarchs you have compared to many laypersons, it's all the more remarkable that you wrote:

I have this feeling of bishops holiday especially observing the official website of the Polish Church.. Almost no info (and except one bishop, no opinion, no interview, nothing), but pictures... With Romanian patriarch, with Serbian patriarch, with African bishops, bishops drinking coffee together, bishops posing on the sea background and so on... Only selfie is lacking.
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #993 on: July 06, 2016, 06:13:32 PM »
Considering this breadth and intimacy of knowledge of hierarchs you have compared to many laypersons, it's all the more remarkable that you wrote:

I have this feeling of bishops holiday especially observing the official website of the Polish Church.. Almost no info (and except one bishop, no opinion, no interview, nothing), but pictures... With Romanian patriarch, with Serbian patriarch, with African bishops, bishops drinking coffee together, bishops posing on the sea background and so on... Only selfie is lacking.

While making this about personalities is potentially quite a bit more interesting than what Denise was doing, I have given my reaction and have nothing else to add. The Council was not a group of old boys playing hooky, it was not either, on the other hand, a Satanic menace. Positions have been stated clearly on several sides. There's nothing more to do here.

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #994 on: July 06, 2016, 06:24:57 PM »
Porter's just envious, as we all are. I'd like to share a six pack with bishops.
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #995 on: July 11, 2016, 05:23:28 PM »
Quote
Various media reports and editorials have described the controversies before, during, and after the Holy and Great Council of the Orthodox Church, recently held during Pentecost on the island of Crete.

Some have concluded that the Council’s difficulties were the result of geopolitics, and can therefore be explained away as little more than an ecclesial version of the larger political and cultural battle taking place between Russia and the West. Others have concluded that the disagreements revealed disparate visions between those wishing to engage the broader world and those more interested in internal disputes over church administration.

In some sense, these factors played a role in the weeks leading up to the Council, but something far more significant was brewing beneath the surface. A real theological disagreement came to a head during the debate at the Council itself, to the degree that the Council almost failed to pass one of its pre-approved documents, “Relations of the Orthodox Church with the Rest of the Christian World.”

http://blogs.ancientfaith.com/orthodoxyandheterodoxy/2016/07/11/two-schools-council-crete-means-future-orthodox-theology/

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #996 on: July 11, 2016, 05:24:02 PM »
Porter's just envious, as we all are. I'd like to share a six pack with bishops.

Be careful what you wish for. 

Offline servulus

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #997 on: July 14, 2016, 12:33:07 PM »
Athonite Fathers call for Rejection of Cretan Council
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/95378.htm

They have some harsh words. I wonder if this is just a minority opinion. I don't know much about the Athonite monks.

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #998 on: July 14, 2016, 12:56:16 PM »
Athonite Fathers call for Rejection of Cretan Council
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/95378.htm

They have some harsh words. I wonder if this is just a minority opinion. I don't know much about the Athonite monks.
It remains to be seen whether it is a minority opinion or not. The document was signed by a group of monks inhabiting the Holy Mountain's kelli to be submitted to the Holy Koinotita (the "governing body" of the Mountain) for consideration. We'll see what happens.
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Offline Antonis

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #999 on: July 14, 2016, 01:00:06 PM »
Met. Hierotheos' review, "Just After the 'Holy and Great Council'," has been translated into English:

https://orthodoxethos.com/post/just-after-the-holy-and-great-council
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1001 on: July 19, 2016, 07:25:53 PM »
Quote
US Foreign Policy Leaders Praise Great Council

Washington, D.C.
7/12/2016

Many of the United States' top foreign policy leaders put statements in the Congressional Record and on social media praising Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew and the historic Holy and Great Council that convened in Crete, Greece June 19-26. Below are excerpts from these statements and links to their full remarks.

http://archons.org/news/detail.asp?id=910

Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1002 on: July 19, 2016, 08:11:01 PM »
Quote
"All people of faith should welcome the convening of the first Holy and Great Council of the Orthodox Christian Church in over 1,200 years by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew. I have had the privilege of seeing Patriarch Bartholomew's spiritual leadership for myself, and am hopeful that the Council will renew ties that have frayed through the centuries--because we are stronger together."
Hillary is Netodox. I bet she wouldn't call the Vaticanist denomination a church!
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 08:12:26 PM by RaphaCam »
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1003 on: July 20, 2016, 12:15:00 AM »
Quote
"All people of faith should welcome the convening of the first Holy and Great Council of the Orthodox Christian Church in over 1,200 years by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew. I have had the privilege of seeing Patriarch Bartholomew's spiritual leadership for myself, and am hopeful that the Council will renew ties that have frayed through the centuries--because we are stronger together."
Hillary is Netodox. I bet she wouldn't call the Vaticanist denomination a church!

I bet $1000 (you get 10:1 odds) if  you want to take it. Do not bet on politicians - it should be in the bible somewhere.

I liked the Biden quote in one of the links.
If you cannot remember everything, instead of everything, I beg you, remember this without fail, that not to share our own wealth with the poor is theft from the poor and deprivation of their means of life; we do not possess our own wealth but theirs.  If we have this attitude, we will certainly offer our money; and by nourishing Christ in poverty here and laying up great profit hereafter, we will be able to attain the good things which are to come. - St. John Chrysostom

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If you cannot remember everything, instead of everything, I beg you, remember this without fail, that not to share our own wealth with the poor is theft from the poor and deprivation of their means of life; we do not possess our own wealth but theirs.  If we have this attitude, we will certainly offer our money; and by nourishing Christ in poverty here and laying up great profit hereafter, we will be able to attain the good things which are to come. - St. John Chrysostom

Offline Antonis

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1005 on: July 20, 2016, 01:36:13 AM »
http://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2016/07/the-ecclesiology-of-holy-and-great-synod.html
With that title, I was expecting a discussion about the power granted to primates in the procedure of the synod, rather than a discussion of one of the documents.
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Offline Rohzek

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1006 on: September 18, 2016, 01:42:31 PM »
So whatever happened to this? Any news about it has long since been rather mum. I know Russia made a response via its synod over the summer and had both positive and negative comments about it. Has anything else happened?
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Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1007 on: September 18, 2016, 06:44:58 PM »
Quote
"All people of faith should welcome the convening of the first Holy and Great Council of the Orthodox Christian Church in over 1,200 years by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew. I have had the privilege of seeing Patriarch Bartholomew's spiritual leadership for myself, and am hopeful that the Council will renew ties that have frayed through the centuries--because we are stronger together."
Hillary is Netodox. I bet she wouldn't call the Vaticanist denomination a church!

I bet $1000 (you get 10:1 odds) if  you want to take it. Do not bet on politicians - it should be in the bible somewhere.

I liked the Biden quote in one of the links.
I think you're talking about Psalm 146:3?
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1008 on: September 18, 2016, 08:16:26 PM »
So whatever happened to this? Any news about it has long since been rather mum. I know Russia made a response via its synod over the summer and had both positive and negative comments about it. Has anything else happened?
Only this:
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/96993.htm

Someone finally did put the scans of the documents out there so we can all see who signed or didn't sign them.
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1009 on: September 19, 2016, 12:06:14 AM »
So whatever happened to this? Any news about it has long since been rather mum. I know Russia made a response via its synod over the summer and had both positive and negative comments about it. Has anything else happened?
Only this:
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/96993.htm

Someone finally did put the scans of the documents out there so we can all see who signed or didn't sign them.

And that means what, exactly?
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1010 on: September 19, 2016, 08:26:43 AM »
So whatever happened to this? Any news about it has long since been rather mum. I know Russia made a response via its synod over the summer and had both positive and negative comments about it. Has anything else happened?
Only this:
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/96993.htm

Someone finally did put the scans of the documents out there so we can all see who signed or didn't sign them.

And that means what, exactly?
IMHO it means that this document is a feel good document with the ecclesial authority of a Campbell's Soup label.

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1011 on: December 11, 2016, 10:45:41 PM »
Whoa, is this true? What should one expect?  :(

Patriarch of Constantinople's Letter to the Archbishop of Greece: Defrock and Excommunicate those Opposed to our Council in Crete


Quote
In unprecedented and uncanonical fashion the Patriarch of Constantinople, Bartholomew, is demanding that the Archbishop of Athens and the Holy Synod of the Church of Greece depose and excommunicate leading hierarchs and clergy of the Church for their opposition to the "Council" of Crete and its innovative organization and decisions. The Patriarchal letter names first of all, the one-time representative of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, Protopresbyter Theodore Zisis, professor emeritus of Patrology, as the supposed "ring leader," but also implicates "those under him" who traveled with him to the Churches of Georgia, Bulgaria and Moldova before and after the Cretan gathering. The Patriarch demands that, in the event of their persistence in rejecting the "Council" of Crete, they be defrocked and excommunicated, according the canonical akriveia..

The Patriarch goes further and states that similar action be taken also against two well-known bishops, the Metropolitans of Piraeus, Seraphim, and Kalavryta and Agialeias, Ambrose (or Amvrosios), for their exposure of the Cretan "Council" as innovative and unorthodox in its decisions. If the Church of Greece refuses to act accordingly, the Patriarch informs the Archbishop, he and his synod will "sever ecclesiastical and sacramental communion with them." This last statement is perhaps the most significant aspect of the Patriarchal letter, for it would be unprecedented for the Holy Synod of a Local Church to cease communion with particular hierarchs of another Local Orthodox Church. It would raise serious questions as to status of communion between the two Local Churches and the reach of the canonical authority of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. Furthermore, it may also actually serve to isolate not only the two hierarchs in question but rather the Ecumenical Patriarchate itself, depending on the reaction of the Church of Greece and other Local Orthodox Churches. If early reports are indicative, which has the Holy Synod of the Church of Greece deciding not to respond at all to the Patriarch's demands, resistance to these Papal pretensions, and the Patriarch's further isolation, have already begun.

https://orthodoxethos.com/post/patriarch-of-constantinoples-letter-to-the-archbishop-of-greece-defrock-and-excommunicate-those-opposed-to-our-council-in-crete
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Offline Samn!

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1012 on: December 11, 2016, 10:59:54 PM »
Whoa, is this true? What should one expect?  :(

Yes. Unclear.

The odd thing is that Patriarch Bartholomew threatens to break communion with the two bishops in question without, apparently, breaking communion with the Church of Greece, which is an unusual move to say the least. It would be good if he were more explicit about the ecclesiology underlying such a move.

On the other hand, he was smart to single out two bishops who are often very off-putting (to be polite) in the shrill tones in which they express their anti-ecumenism and their ties to far-right groups like Golden Dawn. It will be harder for people outside their camp to want to stand up for them on principle compared to if it were a more measured opponent of the council like Metropolitan Hierotheos.

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1013 on: December 12, 2016, 01:31:01 AM »
Whoa, is this true? What should one expect?  :(

Patriarch of Constantinople's Letter to the Archbishop of Greece: Defrock and Excommunicate those Opposed to our Council in Crete


Quote
In unprecedented and uncanonical fashion the Patriarch of Constantinople, Bartholomew, is demanding that the Archbishop of Athens and the Holy Synod of the Church of Greece depose and excommunicate leading hierarchs and clergy of the Church for their opposition to the "Council" of Crete and its innovative organization and decisions. The Patriarchal letter names first of all, the one-time representative of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, Protopresbyter Theodore Zisis, professor emeritus of Patrology, as the supposed "ring leader," but also implicates "those under him" who traveled with him to the Churches of Georgia, Bulgaria and Moldova before and after the Cretan gathering. The Patriarch demands that, in the event of their persistence in rejecting the "Council" of Crete, they be defrocked and excommunicated, according the canonical akriveia..

The Patriarch goes further and states that similar action be taken also against two well-known bishops, the Metropolitans of Piraeus, Seraphim, and Kalavryta and Agialeias, Ambrose (or Amvrosios), for their exposure of the Cretan "Council" as innovative and unorthodox in its decisions. If the Church of Greece refuses to act accordingly, the Patriarch informs the Archbishop, he and his synod will "sever ecclesiastical and sacramental communion with them." This last statement is perhaps the most significant aspect of the Patriarchal letter, for it would be unprecedented for the Holy Synod of a Local Church to cease communion with particular hierarchs of another Local Orthodox Church. It would raise serious questions as to status of communion between the two Local Churches and the reach of the canonical authority of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. Furthermore, it may also actually serve to isolate not only the two hierarchs in question but rather the Ecumenical Patriarchate itself, depending on the reaction of the Church of Greece and other Local Orthodox Churches. If early reports are indicative, which has the Holy Synod of the Church of Greece deciding not to respond at all to the Patriarch's demands, resistance to these Papal pretensions, and the Patriarch's further isolation, have already begun.

https://orthodoxethos.com/post/patriarch-of-constantinoples-letter-to-the-archbishop-of-greece-defrock-and-excommunicate-those-opposed-to-our-council-in-crete

So what exactly is the source?
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Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1014 on: December 12, 2016, 04:06:30 AM »
It's true that he asked them. It's also true that the Church of Greece snubbed Patriarch Bartholomew to his face, and told him, "get back in your jurisdiction bud, this ain't the Papacy!"  8)

« Last Edit: December 12, 2016, 04:07:49 AM by xOrthodox4Christx »
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Offline Samn!

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1015 on: December 12, 2016, 04:48:03 AM »

So what exactly is the source?

The link above had an English translation. The original Greek can be found on several sites, such as here: http://fanarion.blogspot.com/2016/12/blog-post_10.html

I'm not sure who first published it.

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1016 on: December 12, 2016, 05:55:04 AM »

So what exactly is the source?

The link above had an English translation. The original Greek can be found on several sites, such as here: http://fanarion.blogspot.com/2016/12/blog-post_10.html

I'm not sure who first published it.

So the proof is some stolen or unofficially leaked documents without any official statements.
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Offline WPM

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1017 on: December 12, 2016, 07:05:25 AM »
When I analyse and study the Pleroma or Width of the World . . . I fail to see how it relates to the Church or Christianity.
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Offline Samn!

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1018 on: December 12, 2016, 11:31:57 AM »

So the proof is some stolen or unofficially leaked documents without any official statements.

That such a message had been sent was reported by Romfea a couple weeks ago. Most of the places I've seen that published it, like the Fanarion blog and the people who first brought attention to it, approvingly, on Facebook, are close to the EP. I'm unaware of any statement from the Church of Greece about it and so it may have been leaked as a response to that lack of response.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2016, 11:38:58 AM by Samn! »

Offline FatherGiryus

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1019 on: December 12, 2016, 01:59:41 PM »

So what exactly is the source?

The link above had an English translation. The original Greek can be found on several sites, such as here: http://fanarion.blogspot.com/2016/12/blog-post_10.html

I'm not sure who first published it.

So the proof is some stolen or unofficially leaked documents without any official statements.

OrthoWikiLeaks.

Probably Putin.   ;)

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1020 on: December 12, 2016, 04:32:49 PM »
"Jeresijerah"

Offline Iconodule

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When a time revolts against eternity, the only thing to set against it is genuine eternity itself, and not some other time which has already roused, and not without reason, a violent reaction against itself.
- Berdyaev

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1022 on: December 12, 2016, 04:38:45 PM »
What's a Jeresijerah?
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1023 on: December 12, 2016, 04:39:47 PM »
I assume it's supposed to be "heresiarch."
Quote
When a time revolts against eternity, the only thing to set against it is genuine eternity itself, and not some other time which has already roused, and not without reason, a violent reaction against itself.
- Berdyaev

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Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1024 on: December 12, 2016, 08:54:37 PM »
It's translated from Serbian, a language I have zero proficiency in.
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Offline RaphaCam

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1025 on: December 12, 2016, 09:02:59 PM »
It seems to be "jeresijarh", close enough.
"May the Lord our God remember in His kingdom all Holy Catholic Apostolic Church, which heralds the Word of Truth and fearlessly offers and distributes the Holy Oblation despite human deficiencies and persecutions moved by the powers of this world, in all time and unto the ages of ages."

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1026 on: December 12, 2016, 10:04:33 PM »
St. Gregory, Pope of Rome, pray for us! (and talk some sense into that guy while you're at it)
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Offline WPM

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1027 on: December 12, 2016, 10:39:20 PM »
You don't mean Russian ... You mean American Orthodox.
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1028 on: December 12, 2016, 10:55:23 PM »
It's translated from Serbian, a language I have zero proficiency in.

Or Serbian, English please.
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1029 on: December 12, 2016, 11:17:49 PM »
It's translated from Serbian, a language I have zero proficiency in.

Or Serbian, English please.

I love Serbian English. 

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1030 on: December 12, 2016, 11:30:27 PM »
You don't mean Russian ... You mean American Orthodox.
huh? I mean His Lowliness, like St. Gregory did to St. John the Faster...
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1031 on: December 13, 2016, 04:44:21 PM »
All opinions expressed by myself are quite tragically my own, and not those of any other poster or wall hangings.

Offline Gunnarr

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1032 on: December 13, 2016, 05:01:28 PM »
At the clergy laity conference Archbishop Demetrios compares those Churches that did not attend Crete with those who were condemned in the ecumenical councils

And here EP calls for removal of those who oppose Crete in Greece.

Iin Romania, those who oppose are being crushed by the Church, monks expelled

Maybe they should make the schism official already, rather than sit on this fence, and finally condemn those who oppose their form of ecumenism to be worse than the heretics they love to pray with

Really the ecumenists have more love of rejected heresy than their own brothers who they wish to remove just because they will not hold contempt for holy canons like they do
« Last Edit: December 13, 2016, 05:04:26 PM by Gunnarr »
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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1033 on: December 13, 2016, 09:33:48 PM »
At the clergy laity conference Archbishop Demetrios compares those Churches that did not attend Crete with those who were condemned in the ecumenical councils

...

Iin Romania, those who oppose are being crushed by the Church, monks expelled

Citations?

Offline Noddy999

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Re: Various Discussions about The Holy and Great Council of Crete 2016
« Reply #1034 on: December 14, 2016, 12:57:01 PM »
Metropolitan Jeremiah of Gortynos: “We should not rush to recognize the results of the Crete Council. We need a new discussion of the ‘Relationship of the Orthodox Church with the Rest of the Christian World’ document”

http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/99454.htm