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Offline 88Devin12

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Healthy Fasting
« on: February 25, 2014, 01:51:32 PM »
This Lent I'm planning on trying to fast in a healthier manner. Normally my lenten diet consists of foods high in cholestorol, fat or sugars. Or just foods that are cheap.

Despite our fasting periods, because of the types of "fasting" foods I'm eating, I've gained weight and now it has stayed constant for a while now. I want to start exercising and dropping pounds while also observing the fast.

What are some good, lenten foods that are relatively quick to fix and are pretty healthy and also not too expensive?

What are good pro-fasting protein sources (other than beans)?

Offline vamrat

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2014, 02:16:28 PM »
A lot of it is going to be portion control.  Keep that in mind.

Water is the best thing you can drink.

My friend's wife is a fitness nut and she eats that quinoa stuff.  Personally, I think it tastes like feces, but it is supposedly healthier than regular rice, and pasta.
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2014, 02:31:40 PM »
This Lent I'm planning on trying to fast in a healthier manner. Normally my lenten diet consists of foods high in cholestorol, fat or sugars. Or just foods that are cheap.

Despite our fasting periods, because of the types of "fasting" foods I'm eating, I've gained weight and now it has stayed constant for a while now. I want to start exercising and dropping pounds while also observing the fast.

What are some good, lenten foods that are relatively quick to fix and are pretty healthy and also not too expensive?

What are good pro-fasting protein sources (other than beans)?

There is a good facebook page called "Orthodoxy and the Paleo Lifestyle"

I suggest Sweet Potatoes. They are low on the glycimic index and are nutritious. They wont spike your blood sugar so you will not have a drop later and get over hungry. Use them rather than bread or pasta. Use coconut oil to add healthy fat which will also keep you steady.

For protein there is a variety of Lenten seafoods that you can have a few times a week without getting too sick of them. Shrimp, squid, scallops, clams, crab..anything without a backbone.

Add lots of vegetables, salads or cooked. Snack on nuts and drink coconut milk or coconut cream or Almond Milk.

Avoid Wheat. It is engineered to keep you coming back for more. Same with sweet things..avoid. 

Here is another thing that will help: Bullet Proof Coffee.

Make coffee as you like it. Pour hot into a blender. Add a generous amount of coconut oil ( this week and other times outside of lent people add grass fed butter too).. Two big tablespoons..Blend... Will give you lots of energy from mid chain fat and keep you strong for hours. It tastes far better than you would suspect.

Remember, avoid wheat and sugar..Default to rice if need be or grits or oatmeal
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2014, 03:16:31 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 03:17:11 PM by orthonorm »

Offline DeniseDenise

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2014, 03:32:37 PM »
And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.



Oh thank goodness.....butter/coconut oil in coffee just sounds vile..... : :-\
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2014, 03:33:55 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Fasting isn't "not eating" in Orthodoxy. Fasting is just not eating certain things. You can eat pasta, rice and bread moderately, observing the fast and still gain weight as I have. I eat a lot less during fasting periods, but still don't drop any pounds because the only cheap, fast-friendly alternatives I know of (and can afford) aren't that healthy and are fatty.

I could eat a small plate of food of lean meats and dairies during non-fasting periods, and eat the same amount of foods, but with pastas, breads etc... yet gain weight.  It is the kind of food you eat, not always how much you eat.

Trans Fats, Sugary Soda, and Effective Regulation: http://youtu.be/6XDV3IwnF8Q
Is Organic Food Better for Your Health? : http://youtu.be/gl5GXArC134
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 03:38:37 PM by 88Devin12 »

Offline DeniseDenise

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2014, 03:36:00 PM »
I know you said no beans.....

But quite seriously the Rice and Beans that quite a lot of the developing world live on, are cheap, fasting, protein....and if you make the beans in a crockpot....can last a good while with refrigeration...
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Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2014, 03:43:01 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Fasting isn't "not eating" in Orthodoxy.

Actually it is. Maybe not to you or whoever you chat with, but it is indeed not eating.

Offline Adela

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2014, 03:44:29 PM »
Quinoa, buckwheat and teff are good grains to eat with beans. They have good amino acid profiles.   I'd avoid sugar as much as possible.  I like to make teff porridge and add applesauce or puréed pears instead of milk.   As far as all the coconut milk, everyone is different but it is extremely high in salicylates which some people ( like me ) can't process well. 

Offline hecma925

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2014, 03:44:42 PM »
I know you said no beans.....

But quite seriously the Rice and Beans that quite a lot of the developing world live on, are cheap, fasting, protein....and if you make the beans in a crockpot....can last a good while with refrigeration...

This.

But you can make some good stir-fry or curries with firm tofu.  Relatively quick and easy.
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2014, 03:45:07 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Fasting isn't "not eating" in Orthodoxy.

Actually it is. Maybe not to you or whoever you chat with, but it is indeed not eating.

It isn't... Lenten fasting is fasting from all animal products. It isn't not eating during the day. You can still eat breakfast, lunch and dinner and still be fasting. It isn't about dropping a meal or two, it's about what foods you're fasting from. I don't know who you've been talking to.

Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2014, 03:46:21 PM »
I know you said no beans.....

But quite seriously the Rice and Beans that quite a lot of the developing world live on, are cheap, fasting, protein....and if you make the beans in a crockpot....can last a good while with refrigeration...

This.

But you can make some good stir-fry or curries with firm tofu.  Relatively quick and easy.

I used to do a lot of stir-fry but then decided it was probably a food that clogs arteries and isn't that healthy. I was eating a lot more greens, but they also had a lot of soy sauce and stir-fry sauce put on them (aka TONS of sodum/sugars). Lettuce, bean sprouts, onions, mushrooms, rice or noodles. But because of the rice/noodles and the sauces, I decided the health risk outweighed the benefits.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 03:48:08 PM by 88Devin12 »

Offline hecma925

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2014, 03:49:18 PM »
I know you said no beans.....

But quite seriously the Rice and Beans that quite a lot of the developing world live on, are cheap, fasting, protein....and if you make the beans in a crockpot....can last a good while with refrigeration...

This.

But you can make some good stir-fry or curries with firm tofu.  Relatively quick and easy.

I used to do a lot of stir-fry but then decided it was probably a food that clogs arteries and isn't that healthy. I was eating a lot more greens, but they also had a lot of soy sauce and stir-fry sauce put on them (aka TONS of sodum/sugars).

There are recipes that are much lighter.  And even better, season the dish with a good veggie broth, rather than those sugary sauces.  The broth will thicken up.  The more greens, the better, but throw some colorful veggies in too.
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2014, 03:53:21 PM »
I know you said no beans.....

But quite seriously the Rice and Beans that quite a lot of the developing world live on, are cheap, fasting, protein....and if you make the beans in a crockpot....can last a good while with refrigeration...

This.

But you can make some good stir-fry or curries with firm tofu.  Relatively quick and easy.

I used to do a lot of stir-fry but then decided it was probably a food that clogs arteries and isn't that healthy. I was eating a lot more greens, but they also had a lot of soy sauce and stir-fry sauce put on them (aka TONS of sodum/sugars).

There are recipes that are much lighter.  And even better, season the dish with a good veggie broth, rather than those sugary sauces.  The broth will thicken up.  The more greens, the better, but throw some colorful veggies in too.

 What kind of veggies and greens do you suggest?

Would white rice or brown rice be better?
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 03:53:40 PM by 88Devin12 »

Offline augustin717

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2014, 04:00:34 PM »
I suggest medium rare steak, in order to further confound the Armenians. Extrapolating the Typikon a bit.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2014, 04:33:53 PM »
 What kind of veggies and greens do you suggest?

Would white rice or brown rice be better?
[/quote]

I like onions, garlic, ginger, bok choy cabbage, broccoli, colorful bell peppers, carrots, peas, green beans, maybe some hot pepper, mushrooms, fresh basil/cilantro/parsley, cauliflower, snow peas, radish.  Basically anything, but I'm a sucker for mushrooms and crunchy veggies in my stir fry (like daikon radish and carrots).  To add more green, add fresh spinach or kale the last few minutes of cooking to let it wilt.

Personally, I dislike the flavor of brown rice (both long grain and jasmine).  But I've never made a veggie fried rice with brown rice, so it would taste better, I suppose.  Brown is healthier, because it's whole grain, has more fiber, and helps stabilize your blood sugar.
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2014, 04:51:50 PM »
Fasting isn't "not eating" in Orthodoxy.

Actually it is. Maybe not to you or whoever you chat with, but it is indeed not eating.

It isn't... Lenten fasting is fasting from all animal products. It isn't not eating during the day. You can still eat breakfast, lunch and dinner and still be fasting. It isn't about dropping a meal or two, it's about what foods you're fasting from. I don't know who you've been talking to.

Actually, orthonorm is right.  Fasting = not eating.  Abstinence = avoiding certain foods and drinks (and people ;)).

By definition, you can't eat breakfast and still be fasting: breakfast means "break (the) fast". 

Traditionally, fasting means you eat or drink nothing until sundown, or at least the ninth hour (3pm).  That has been economically stretched by some to be a bare minimum of no food or drink till noon (a word that derives from "none", or the ninth hour prayer, anticipated in enough places at 12pm to loan its name to that moment of the day).  But fasting, however long it lasts, is definitely "not eating".

We fast on Lenten weekdays, but we do not fast on the weekends.  Nevertheless, we maintain abstinence on all days.     

Now, if you and your priest have worked out a plan for how you're going to practice your annual Lenten "fast", and that involves eating three vegetarian meals a day, that may count as a fast for you, but it is certainly economy.  That doesn't mean it's bad, that it doesn't count, that it is not a praiseworthy practice, etc., but it is definitely something less than the discipline of the Church. 

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2014, 06:02:22 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Actually keeping your insulin steady and eating foods that wont spike it will help you through the fast.. That's pretty sound science. i have no idea what Norm's problem is.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 06:03:59 PM by Marc1152 »
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2014, 07:15:13 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Actually keeping your insulin steady and eating foods that wont spike it will help you through the fast.. That's pretty sound science. i have no idea what Norm's problem is.

Cause you have no idea what you are talking in terms of nutrition nor the mechanics nor spirit of fasting? Wedge in Orthodoxy into your "paleo lifestyle" if you want, but let's not kid others about what is going on.

Fasting is not eating, so snacking to help yourself not eat makes absolute no sense along with nearly every other sentence you wrote. Blending coffee and coconut oil?

Now if you want spend more time, money, and thought about eating then do you what you do, just don't tell others it has anything to do with the mechanics nor spirit of fasting.

If Devin wants solid advice on making abstinence easier:

Take your most strict day you are going to encounter (save maybe a day where to take no food or water), eat like for the first two weeks or so of Lent.

Pray, spend the time and money you would be making special expensive meals on others.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 07:16:06 PM by orthonorm »

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2014, 08:30:54 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Actually keeping your insulin steady and eating foods that wont spike it will help you through the fast.. That's pretty sound science. i have no idea what Norm's problem is.

Cause you have no idea what you are talking in terms of nutrition nor the mechanics nor spirit of fasting? Wedge in Orthodoxy into your "paleo lifestyle" if you want, but let's not kid others about what is going on.

Fasting is not eating, so snacking to help yourself not eat makes absolute no sense along with nearly every other sentence you wrote. Blending coffee and coconut oil?

Now if you want spend more time, money, and thought about eating then do you what you do, just don't tell others it has anything to do with the mechanics nor spirit of fasting.

If Devin wants solid advice on making abstinence easier:

Take your most strict day you are going to encounter (save maybe a day where to take no food or water), eat like for the first two weeks or so of Lent.

Pray, spend the time and money you would be making special expensive meals on others.

 

To repeat, there is a good supportive facebook page of Orthodox Christians who want to help each other figure out  ways to fast in a healthy way.

  Spaghetti = bad   Sweet Potato = Good

No one ( who is  in their right mind) should be offended by that

Fasting and a certain level of hunger go together. In fact some people only eat to 80% of being full. But that is different than unwise choices that will make you over hungry because you have spiked you blood sugar so high you crash later.

My suggestion was to avoid foods that do that. One slice of whole wheat bread spikes your blood sugar higher and faster than 3 teaspoons of table sugar.

That advice makes lots of sense.  
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 08:31:39 PM by Marc1152 »
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2014, 09:05:46 PM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Actually keeping your insulin steady and eating foods that wont spike it will help you through the fast.. That's pretty sound science. i have no idea what Norm's problem is.

Cause you have no idea what you are talking in terms of nutrition nor the mechanics nor spirit of fasting? Wedge in Orthodoxy into your "paleo lifestyle" if you want, but let's not kid others about what is going on.

Fasting is not eating, so snacking to help yourself not eat makes absolute no sense along with nearly every other sentence you wrote. Blending coffee and coconut oil?

Now if you want spend more time, money, and thought about eating then do you what you do, just don't tell others it has anything to do with the mechanics nor spirit of fasting.

If Devin wants solid advice on making abstinence easier:

Take your most strict day you are going to encounter (save maybe a day where to take no food or water), eat like for the first two weeks or so of Lent.

Pray, spend the time and money you would be making special expensive meals on others.

 

To repeat, there is a good supportive facebook page of Orthodox Christians who want to help each other figure out  ways to fast in a healthy way.

  Spaghetti = bad   Sweet Potato = Good

No one ( who is  in their right mind) should be offended by that

Fasting and a certain level of hunger go together. In fact some people only eat to 80% of being full. But that is different than unwise choices that will make you over hungry because you have spiked you blood sugar so high you crash later.

My suggestion was to avoid foods that do that. One slice of whole wheat bread spikes your blood sugar higher and faster than 3 teaspoons of table sugar.

That advice makes lots of sense.  

You have no idea what you are talking about. If you are not diabetic few things do more to even out insulin levels than, guess what, fasting.

If you are fasting regularly, let's say doing a moderate fast (not breaking till 3PM having awoken at 7AM, for example and you take a small snack at 3PM and a small meal at 6-7PM, for example).

How your body produces insulin is a lot different than what your boutique diet provides. I don't care if you are living off white bread.

Thousands of years of practice by untold people > your diet guru. Oh and science > your diet guru.

« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 09:06:34 PM by orthonorm »

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2014, 09:08:13 PM »
Someone lamented a lack of a diet debate recently.

There. I think Devin already outmarced and linked to a youtube clip about how sugar is killing you.

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2014, 09:12:46 PM »
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/best-diets-of-2014/

U.S. News & World Report ranked the best diets of 2014. Guess which one came in last?
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Offline orthonorm

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2014, 09:17:44 PM »
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/best-diets-of-2014/

U.S. News & World Report ranked the best diets of 2014. Guess which one came in last?

Paleo is a stupid thing. If you are a sedentary person, boost nutrient density. That's how to think about all this. So high carbohydrate foods go out the door more often, since they provide very little nutrient support other than some calories.

The brand and thinking behind paleo is just dumb. But I eat close to what marc would call paleo at times and have before Cordain ever thought about diet.

If you are very active, you are going to have to have carbs. I couldn't live at one time without more than 5k calories a day. But if you are some namby pamby Crossfitter then, yeah, cut the carbs, cause I expend more calories getting from my car to my desk than you do trying to break your Fran time.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 09:18:38 PM by orthonorm »

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2014, 10:13:23 PM »
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/best-diets-of-2014/

U.S. News & World Report ranked the best diets of 2014. Guess which one came in last?

Paleo is a stupid thing.

I don't know anything about Paleo, so I can't say.  But I appreciated the article because, at right about the place I stopped reading, there was an ad for a video entitled "2 Broke Girls" stars on hit show and their real lives.  Kat Dennings is kinda cute. 

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2014, 12:39:10 AM »
If you fast, you cannot gain weight, in fact you will lose a lot*. IME, about 14-18% of body mass.

It is that simple. If you gain weight or don't lose a considerable amount, you are not fasting in any sense relative to food. Whether or not fasting from food matters is another question, as we can see many Orthodox manage to remain overweight, obese, etc, before, during, and after fasting periods.

I am thin and every time I've fasted I've struggled not to lose precious body mass.

And do yourself a favor and ignore everything marc posted. Don't worry about any of that nonsense, unless you have some serious autoimmune issues.

*Baring rare medical conditions, in which case you should see a doctor.

Actually keeping your insulin steady and eating foods that wont spike it will help you through the fast.. That's pretty sound science. i have no idea what Norm's problem is.

Cause you have no idea what you are talking in terms of nutrition nor the mechanics nor spirit of fasting? Wedge in Orthodoxy into your "paleo lifestyle" if you want, but let's not kid others about what is going on.

Fasting is not eating, so snacking to help yourself not eat makes absolute no sense along with nearly every other sentence you wrote. Blending coffee and coconut oil?

Now if you want spend more time, money, and thought about eating then do you what you do, just don't tell others it has anything to do with the mechanics nor spirit of fasting.

If Devin wants solid advice on making abstinence easier:

Take your most strict day you are going to encounter (save maybe a day where to take no food or water), eat like for the first two weeks or so of Lent.

Pray, spend the time and money you would be making special expensive meals on others.

 

To repeat, there is a good supportive facebook page of Orthodox Christians who want to help each other figure out  ways to fast in a healthy way.

  Spaghetti = bad   Sweet Potato = Good

No one ( who is  in their right mind) should be offended by that

Fasting and a certain level of hunger go together. In fact some people only eat to 80% of being full. But that is different than unwise choices that will make you over hungry because you have spiked you blood sugar so high you crash later.

My suggestion was to avoid foods that do that. One slice of whole wheat bread spikes your blood sugar higher and faster than 3 teaspoons of table sugar.

That advice makes lots of sense.  

You have no idea what you are talking about. If you are not diabetic few things do more to even out insulin levels than, guess what, fasting.

If you are fasting regularly, let's say doing a moderate fast (not breaking till 3PM having awoken at 7AM, for example and you take a small snack at 3PM and a small meal at 6-7PM, for example).

How your body produces insulin is a lot different than what your boutique diet provides. I don't care if you are living off white bread.

Thousands of years of practice by untold people > your diet guru. Oh and science > your diet guru.



Read for comprehension. No one said fasting ( by eating less) does not help even out blood sugar.. Where did you read otherwise? Certainly not from me.

But... If you eat high glycemic foods, you    will    spike   your   blood    sugar.  Then you crash and may feel bad.

Modern wheat is particularly noxious because it has been engineered to artificially stimulate appetite past what it does to your blood sugar level.

So...if you want to fast in a healthy way, you should be careful with certain foods, especially if you are eating less. Going on a blood sugar roller coaster may give you a buzz but most people dont like it.

This sort of discussion should not flip you out.. Perhaps you have a blood sugar problem and youre at a  low point. :)
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Offline Ersaia

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #26 on: February 26, 2014, 05:20:30 AM »
typical greek

green beans with  potato cubes and carrots
peas with potato cubes and carrots
white beans soup
lentil
all pasta with tomato sause
rice with vegetables
chick-peas
many vegetable salads
melitzanosalata  (eggplant salad)
skordalia (potato garlic salad) - we eat this on March 25th with cod(?)
wild greens salad
spinach
leek
soya balls (like meat balls)
we have some vegan cheece also (I never eat until now)
and people use margarine also
and greeks eat a lot of bread (always)

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #27 on: February 26, 2014, 09:40:49 AM »
I read this article last evening. I thought it gave a good answer to Devin's questions on fasting healthily. A spirit of sobriety needs to prevail here. Does anyone remember the epistle reading from Sunday?

In Christ,
Andrew
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline Ferd Berfel

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #28 on: February 26, 2014, 10:49:08 AM »
Dude, I can't believe that only one person so far has even mentioned lentils.

Seriously. Super low in calories, protein dense, and delicious. I've been eating red lentil curry every single day this week. It takes like fifteen minutes to make two days worth of red lentil curry.

Here's the recipe I use:

2 cups red lentils, washed in cold water until the water runs clear (very, very important to clean them)
1 large red onion, run through a food processor until very finely minced
2 tablespoons red curry paste
1 tsp curry powder
1 tsp minced garlic
1 tsp cumin
1 tsp salt
1 tsp tumeric
1 tsp sugar (optional, only if you like a sweeter curry; I prefer spicy, so I leave this out and add capsaicin extract)
1 tsp chili powder
1 tsp minced ginger.

Simmer the lentils in water until they're tender. Mix all the spices into a bowl together. Caramelize the onions in a pan, and add the spices to the onions once they're done cooking. Drain the lentils and add them to the pan. Mix it all together over a low heat and serve hot.

This makes 8 servings. Nutritional profile per serving:

Fat: 2.6g
Carbs: 32g
Protein: 12.1g

Lots of iron and potassium in this as well. Combine it with some quinoa on the side for a full amino acid profile in your proteins.

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #29 on: February 26, 2014, 10:59:28 AM »
As to suggestions about protein, Lentils are unusually high in protein. Personally, I hate them and they don't fit well into my over all diet but they can help sustain you.

If you have a crock pot, slow cook them with salt and garlic. They will keep in the fridge for a while so you can hit on them as needed. I have heard people recommend "Sprouted Lentil Soup" for the fast.. I don't go there :) but you can search on it.

Finally, it's not a good idea to think that unless you are losing weight, you are not fasting correctly. There are many gradations to acceptable fasting and much of it depends on your own Priests assessment of your personal situation both spiritual and physical.
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2014, 11:06:28 AM »
Oh.. I almost forgot. There is a well known nutritionist Dr. Chris Masterjohn who is Orthodox. He had promised to write a paper on healthy Orthodox fasting. I dont know if he has published it yet.  Google him.
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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2014, 11:10:06 AM »
lentils are great as well....I just can't stand them by about day 6 of eating them...bleh.  maybe its that everyone uses indian spices...again i have a finite tolerance for that flavor profile.

I find beans a more variable flavor option...but thats probably just the fact I lived on 2 meals of beans, rice and a tiny bit of protein for well over a year in Brazil.  
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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #32 on: February 26, 2014, 11:25:57 AM »
Dude, I can't believe that only one person so far has even mentioned lentils.

Seriously. Super low in calories, protein dense, and delicious. I've been eating red lentil curry every single day this week. It takes like fifteen minutes to make two days worth of red lentil curry.


I will try the lentil curry! we usually make lentil soup in Greece
lentil soup and white bean soup are the most common foods for lent in Athos and all monasteries

The first Monday of Lent you can see very huge caldrons with white bean soup (φασολάδα) in parks and anyone can eat :)








Offline Ferd Berfel

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #33 on: February 27, 2014, 12:38:14 AM »
I will try the lentil curry! we usually make lentil soup in Greece
lentil soup and white bean soup are the most common foods for lent in Athos and all monasteries

The first Monday of Lent you can see very huge caldrons with white bean soup (φασολάδα) in parks and anyone can eat :)

[pictures of delicious soup]

That looks awesome. Any good recipes you recommend for this stuff?

Offline vamrat

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #34 on: February 27, 2014, 01:10:50 AM »
Dude, I can't believe that only one person so far has even mentioned lentils.

Seriously. Super low in calories, protein dense, and delicious. I've been eating red lentil curry every single day this week. It takes like fifteen minutes to make two days worth of red lentil curry.

Here's the recipe I use:

2 cups red lentils, washed in cold water until the water runs clear (very, very important to clean them)
1 large red onion, run through a food processor until very finely minced
2 tablespoons red curry paste
1 tsp curry powder
1 tsp minced garlic
1 tsp cumin
1 tsp salt
1 tsp tumeric
1 tsp sugar (optional, only if you like a sweeter curry; I prefer spicy, so I leave this out and add capsaicin extract)
1 tsp chili powder
1 tsp minced ginger.

Simmer the lentils in water until they're tender. Mix all the spices into a bowl together. Caramelize the onions in a pan, and add the spices to the onions once they're done cooking. Drain the lentils and add them to the pan. Mix it all together over a low heat and serve hot.

This makes 8 servings. Nutritional profile per serving:

Fat: 2.6g
Carbs: 32g
Protein: 12.1g

Lots of iron and potassium in this as well. Combine it with some quinoa on the side for a full amino acid profile in your proteins.

How well do you think this recipe would work with coconut milk?

As it is, looks delicious.  You might be my favorite poster if I can get this to work.

Marc, you mentioned the crock pot.  (Or Mr. Berfel.)  Using the above recepie, would you put the lentils int he crock pot dry with water ala Corned Beef, or soften them first by boiling as described, then throw in pot with spice mix?
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline Ferd Berfel

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #35 on: February 27, 2014, 11:57:02 AM »

How well do you think this recipe would work with coconut milk?

As it is, looks delicious.  You might be my favorite poster if I can get this to work.

Marc, you mentioned the crock pot.  (Or Mr. Berfel.)  Using the above recepie, would you put the lentils int he crock pot dry with water ala Corned Beef, or soften them first by boiling as described, then throw in pot with spice mix?

I've never tried to make curry with coconut milk, that's an interesting idea. Are you planning to add it to the curry itself? Or are you softening the lentils in the milk? If you try this, let me know what happens. I might do it myself later...

Usually a curry isn't very runny, that's why you have to drain the lentils after boiling them. You typically would serve a curry over some basmati rice, or at least that's how I've always eaten it. I'm not so sure this would work too well in a crock pot because of the lack of liquid. If you try it, make sure to stir frequently to prevent burning.

I always soften the lentils in a large pot. They require a fair amount of water and you'll need to keep an eye on them. Stir frequently and watch to make sure they don't boil over. After they're done softening (not mushy, but tender), just drain the excess water off into the sink. Use a very fine mesh colander or sieve.

Also, handy tip: When washing them before boiling, make sure to put them into a fine mesh sieve or colander, and make sure to put them in the right container the first time. Wet raw lentils are incredibly sticky.

This recipe does well when stored in tupperware containers and refrigerated / microwaved later, which makes it very portable for work lunches.

Offline Marc1152

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #36 on: February 27, 2014, 12:03:23 PM »
Dude, I can't believe that only one person so far has even mentioned lentils.

Seriously. Super low in calories, protein dense, and delicious. I've been eating red lentil curry every single day this week. It takes like fifteen minutes to make two days worth of red lentil curry.

Here's the recipe I use:

2 cups red lentils, washed in cold water until the water runs clear (very, very important to clean them)
1 large red onion, run through a food processor until very finely minced
2 tablespoons red curry paste
1 tsp curry powder
1 tsp minced garlic
1 tsp cumin
1 tsp salt
1 tsp tumeric
1 tsp sugar (optional, only if you like a sweeter curry; I prefer spicy, so I leave this out and add capsaicin extract)
1 tsp chili powder
1 tsp minced ginger.

Simmer the lentils in water until they're tender. Mix all the spices into a bowl together. Caramelize the onions in a pan, and add the spices to the onions once they're done cooking. Drain the lentils and add them to the pan. Mix it all together over a low heat and serve hot.

This makes 8 servings. Nutritional profile per serving:

Fat: 2.6g
Carbs: 32g
Protein: 12.1g

Lots of iron and potassium in this as well. Combine it with some quinoa on the side for a full amino acid profile in your proteins.

How well do you think this recipe would work with coconut milk?

As it is, looks delicious.  You might be my favorite poster if I can get this to work.

Marc, you mentioned the crock pot.  (Or Mr. Berfel.)  Using the above recepie, would you put the lentils int he crock pot dry with water ala Corned Beef, or soften them first by boiling as described, then throw in pot with spice mix?

I dont recall, I will ask about it
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #37 on: February 27, 2014, 12:31:11 PM »
Dude, I can't believe that only one person so far has even mentioned lentils.

Seriously. Super low in calories, protein dense, and delicious. I've been eating red lentil curry every single day this week. It takes like fifteen minutes to make two days worth of red lentil curry.


I will try the lentil curry! we usually make lentil soup in Greece
lentil soup and white bean soup are the most common foods for lent in Athos and all monasteries

The first Monday of Lent you can see very huge caldrons with white bean soup (φασολάδα) in parks and anyone can eat :)


I had a lot of that while I was in Greece. How do you make it?

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #38 on: February 27, 2014, 12:34:20 PM »

How well do you think this recipe would work with coconut milk?

As it is, looks delicious.  You might be my favorite poster if I can get this to work.

Marc, you mentioned the crock pot.  (Or Mr. Berfel.)  Using the above recepie, would you put the lentils int he crock pot dry with water ala Corned Beef, or soften them first by boiling as described, then throw in pot with spice mix?

I've never tried to make curry with coconut milk, that's an interesting idea. Are you planning to add it to the curry itself? Or are you softening the lentils in the milk? If you try this, let me know what happens. I might do it myself later...

Usually a curry isn't very runny, that's why you have to drain the lentils after boiling them. You typically would serve a curry over some basmati rice, or at least that's how I've always eaten it. I'm not so sure this would work too well in a crock pot because of the lack of liquid. If you try it, make sure to stir frequently to prevent burning.

I always soften the lentils in a large pot. They require a fair amount of water and you'll need to keep an eye on them. Stir frequently and watch to make sure they don't boil over. After they're done softening (not mushy, but tender), just drain the excess water off into the sink. Use a very fine mesh colander or sieve.

Also, handy tip: When washing them before boiling, make sure to put them into a fine mesh sieve or colander, and make sure to put them in the right container the first time. Wet raw lentils are incredibly sticky.

This recipe does well when stored in tupperware containers and refrigerated / microwaved later, which makes it very portable for work lunches.

Most of the curries I have eaten are of the Vietnamese/Thai variety with coconut milk:



I have been wanting to make this for a while, and was thinking about combining the recepies.  The place I usually go to get it has the coconut milk "sauce"/"broth?" as a soup with peppers, onions, beef/chicken/shrimp/tofu.  My favorite part of the whole meal is after chopsticking out the various veggies/meats/unmeats, I then pour the side of rice into the leftover liquid and then eat as a porridge.  I was thinking that by mixing the rice and finely chopped onions with lentils, I could just make this at home and skip to the best part!

I just don't know about cooking any of these ingredients other than the onions in the crock pot.  I have never cooked with coconut milk before, just had it in dishes at restaurants.  Likewise, I've never had lentil soup not in a can...thus have never had curry lentils!  

I might have to mess with this a bit and see how these things work out.


My meal for next week (going to cook on sunday and eat all week long, if it lasts) is a variation on my Vamrat-gulash and my friend's "meat-slop", sans the usual beef:

Red cabbage, yellow onion (I cry less for some reason), two red peppers, one anaheim, one poblano, one hellifiknow, as much smashed garlic as I can safely muster, thrown in the crock pot with half a jar of paprika, two cans of tomato sauce, vegie stock, and perhaps some cumin/corriander/whatever I have that looks good at the time, and then cooked all day till the various vegtables become largely indistinguishable.  I don't know yet if I will stew this with mystery-meat ("soy crumbles") or cook it on the side with cumin/corriander/garlic/onions/pepper/salt and then add later.
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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #39 on: February 27, 2014, 12:35:48 PM »
lentils are great as well....I just can't stand them by about day 6 of eating them...bleh.  maybe its that everyone uses indian spices...again i have a finite tolerance for that flavor profile.

And I now have a finite tolerance for you.  :P

Actually, I understand.  India has several regional cuisines, and the spices used and how they're combined differ from place to place.  Generally, I prefer southern food to northern food (though I enjoy both), but there are certain things for which my preference goes the other way around: spices make a big difference.  

In America, the Indian restaurants aren't really all that authentic, even if they are good, and the food is a generic "Indian", not really focused, regional cuisine, and it's usually made bland (for non-adventurous Americans with money, not tongues, to burn) and, horribile dictu, sometimes with Western ingredients.  For example, I once ate at a restaurant where the chicken tikka masala, not an Indian dish anyway, used ketchup instead of tomatos (I cursed the cook, four generations of his ancestors, and four generations of his descendants in the name of the Lord).  A lot of the recipes online or in cookbooks, even if written by Indians, are usually more of the same, and Western "Indian food" recipes are just Indianesque and "eh".  Curry powders/mixes that are available in your average supermarket, microwaveable Indian food, etc., are typically gross.  For real Indian food, find a real Indian who can really cook, ask them to cook for you, to teach you how to cook, or at least to help you find a source for recipes (good stuff is online, but unless you know what you're looking for, it's tough).        

Perhaps Mexican food is similarly regional and variable, but I wouldn't know: what I've had in Mexican restaurants hasn't really satisfied me.  Cuban, Puerto Rican, Brazilian, Chilean, Argentine, Peruvian, El Salvadorian, almost any other Latin cuisine I enjoy, but Mexican?  No.  This rant had nothing to do with your post, but I felt obligated in my soul to write it.  

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #40 on: February 27, 2014, 12:37:23 PM »
The first Monday of Lent you can see very huge caldrons with white bean soup (φασολάδα) in parks and anyone can eat :)

What a lovely custom! 

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #41 on: February 27, 2014, 12:38:59 PM »
I've never tried to make curry with coconut milk, that's an interesting idea. Are you planning to add it to the curry itself? Or are you softening the lentils in the milk? If you try this, let me know what happens. I might do it myself later...

I like you. 

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #42 on: February 27, 2014, 12:39:16 PM »
Are we fasting yet? I want to go to McDonalds today... (serious question)

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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #43 on: February 27, 2014, 12:46:15 PM »
lentils are great as well....I just can't stand them by about day 6 of eating them...bleh.  maybe its that everyone uses indian spices...again i have a finite tolerance for that flavor profile.

And I now have a finite tolerance for you.  :P

Actually, I understand.  India has several regional cuisines, and the spices used and how they're combined differ from place to place.  Generally, I prefer southern food to northern food (though I enjoy both), but there are certain things for which my preference goes the other way around: spices make a big difference.  

In America, the Indian restaurants aren't really all that authentic, even if they are good, and the food is a generic "Indian", not really focused, regional cuisine, and it's usually made bland (for non-adventurous Americans with money, not tongues, to burn) and, horribile dictu, sometimes with Western ingredients.  For example, I once ate at a restaurant where the chicken tikka masala, not an Indian dish anyway, used ketchup instead of tomatos (I cursed the cook, four generations of his ancestors, and four generations of his descendants in the name of the Lord).  A lot of the recipes online or in cookbooks, even if written by Indians, are usually more of the same, and Western "Indian food" recipes are just Indianesque and "eh".  Curry powders/mixes that are available in your average supermarket, microwaveable Indian food, etc., are typically gross.  For real Indian food, find a real Indian who can really cook, ask them to cook for you, to teach you how to cook, or at least to help you find a source for recipes (good stuff is online, but unless you know what you're looking for, it's tough).        

Perhaps Mexican food is similarly regional and variable, but I wouldn't know: what I've had in Mexican restaurants hasn't really satisfied me.  Cuban, Puerto Rican, Brazilian, Chilean, Argentine, Peruvian, El Salvadorian, almost any other Latin cuisine I enjoy, but Mexican?  No.  This rant had nothing to do with your post, but I felt obligated in my soul to write it.  



Oh I actually like most of the Indian food I have had...despite being a 'heat hot' wimp.  I have eaten both at the British Style Indian takeaway, which is that tikka masala you describe, which does colour my view of things, as well as at some very authentic Northern food at the restaurant owned by the author of this (http://www.amazon.com/The-Bombay-Cafe-Neela-Paniz/dp/0898159350)


My issue is not precisely with 'Indian' food...its with 'hippy vegetarian' lentils and other meatless entrees.....that for some reason, ALL must use 'pseudo-Indian' spicing.  It's as if no one who doesn't eat meat in America, has ever tasted anything meatless from anywhere but 'India'
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Re: Healthy Fasting
« Reply #44 on: February 27, 2014, 12:46:56 PM »
Most of the curries I have eaten are of the Vietnamese/Thai variety with coconut milk:

I don't know much about crock pot cooking, but you can definitely add coconut milk to curry in general.  Your only problem would be if the spice combination doesn't jive with it.  I've mostly had it with southern Indian cuisine, which influenced Thai cuisine (which is why it works there too).  I don't think I've ever seen coconut milk added to a lentil curry, it's usually with meat.  It's worth a shot, though (I like coconut milk, I will pour it over certain native breakfast foods).  

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