Topic: What would you do?

[Dpaula]

You're 30. Have a job, good enough to pay the bills. Married. No children.
You can afford a loan.

What would you use it for?
1. Go back to school to get a Bachelor.
2. Invest in your current home so you can sell it and buy your dream home.
3. Adopt a child
4. Don't get the loan and don't change anything that will complicate your stress-free life. LoL.

Yes...I'm talking about me 

[katherineofdixie]

I wouldn't borrow money just to borrow money. What do you want to do?

[IoanC]

You can afford a Ioan. Get him. Joking. That's my name, but sometimes English speaking readers think it's Loan. Seriously speaking, I have no idea. I hate loans myself. Never was able to pay one back , but I have good reasons.

[Asteriktos]

Start an Orthodox publishing house!    But out of the four options given, I'd go with #4... which I guess is boring, but there it is.

[Dpaula]

Haaa, you made me laugh!!!

I definitely want to do something. I can't not do anything. Just go to work, come home, cook dinner, watch tv, go to bed. I gotta find me a project. LoL.
I want to go back to school, but if I do, I won't have time for my home renovations and having children will also have to wait. If I start with the house, I won't have time for school and I'm pretty much stuck to this level of salary for the rest of my life. I know I can do so much more with myself, but if I let time fly, it will be too late for college. I want children, but if it doesn't happen the natural way, I want to adopt. But if I wait too long, I'll be too old for children.
And so on, so on , so on....!!!

[Mamizous]

Mmm, I'd go back to school.
But that's just me.

[J Michael]

I'd suggest #4, but with a slight alteration as you said you can't not do anything.  Don't get the loan.  Do something that doesn't involve spending more money.  You know...volunteer at a homeless shelter/pregnancy counseling center/food bank, etc., etc. 

Or...write a great novel.  Or...since you are now married...have a boatload of wonderful kids!!! 

[hecma925]

If you can go back to school without the debt, even better.  Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

[J Michael]

If you can go back to school without the debt, even better.  Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

[Mamizous]

Yeah, loans are p. bad. Or so, I've heard. Luckily my student loan won't have to be paid back until I earn over a certain amount, and will disappear forever in 30 years...
Which is why I'm not worried once I go to University in about a year.
As for otherwise... yeah, if you can avoid getting one, just... give it a miss. That interest will totally cramp your style.

[Jetavan]

Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

...and wreck the economy.

[J Michael]

Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

...and wreck the economy.

Yes...single-handedly, no less.

[Gamliel]

Is your husband working?  What happens if one of you lost your job?  Can you still pay back the loan?

[hecma925]

Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

...and wreck the economy.

Oh, consumer debts don't wreck the economy?  Maybe I should retake high school economics.

[hecma925]

Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

...and wreck the economy.

Yes...single-handedly, no less.

The authority bestowed on the Waxy One is heavy, my friend.

[Dpaula]

If you can go back to school without the debt, even better.  Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

Why?
I'm very good at it.
I have mortgage, car payment, credit cards and I had other loans throughout the years. Never late, never missed a payment.
I love loans. I can get what I want and then gradually pay for it. Sure, the interest can be high, but I will never ever ever be able to save $30,000! So I pick to get the loan, do what I want and use my lifetime to pay it off while I enjoy my "thing".

I know doctors that still pay for their medical school. I bet they have no problem with their loan, now that they make well over 100k/year.

When I said "Don't get the loan"...I meant doing one of the three things listed will actually add some stress to my life (which I'll probably enjoy), not the actual loan.

[Dpaula]

Is your husband working?  What happens if one of you lost your job?  Can you still pay back the loan?

We both work for the city. Unless we both screw up very badly, I can't see how we could lose our jobs.
Plus, we have families that would help, I have no doubt.

[Gamliel]

^ If you are confident of that, the price of school tends to go up every year, so I would lean toward a school loan if you want to do so.  But remember that you are making a commitment.  You may want to speak with a 3rd party you trust.  I think you are an intelligent person, but committing oneself to a loan should be a decision which is cautiously taken.

[J Michael]

If you can go back to school without the debt, even better.  Otherwise, stay away from all loans.

Why?
I'm very good at it.
I have mortgage, car payment, credit cards and I had other loans throughout the years. Never late, never missed a payment.
I love loans. I can get what I want and then gradually pay for it. Sure, the interest can be high, but I will never ever ever be able to save $30,000! So I pick to get the loan, do what I want and use my lifetime to pay it off while I enjoy my "thing".

I know doctors that still pay for their medical school. I bet they have no problem with their loan, now that they make well over 100k/year.

When I said "Don't get the loan"...I meant doing one of the three things listed will actually add some stress to my life (which I'll probably enjoy), not the actual loan.

Ahh....the consummate consumer  !  I still say...stay away from all loans to the extent that you are able, and don't take on new ones unless it is, like buying a house (and even that is highly arguable), absolutely necessary.

[quietmorning]

I'd take the money that I would use to pay off the loan - the payment amount and save it to either work on the house or go to school.  Why pay interest when some other institution can pay you?

[Asteriktos]

You could always give the money to oc.net to bring us up to date up to where we were a half dozen years ago 

[J Michael]

You could always give the money to oc.net to bring us up to date up to where we were a half dozen years ago 

Or...you could always give half the money to oc.net to bring us up to date to where we were a dozen years ago, and give the other half to me to help me pay off my loans.

[vamrat]

Loans are the root of all many economic evils.

[orthonorm]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

[J Michael]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect".  A third might be "depending".  All seems pretty "iffy".

[orthonorm]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect".  A third might be "depending".  All seems pretty "iffy".

Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth.

[Shiny]

Dpaula its like we are soul mates.

[J Michael]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect".  A third might be "depending".  All seems pretty "iffy".

Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth.

So..... "you speculate what inflation will be"....seems pretty "iffy", no?  And if it turns out to be other than your speculation....?

I didn't say "inflation increasing seems iffy."  Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy".  "If" you're right, well...that's great.  "If" you're not, you could be screwed.  Oh well.....

Lots and lots of our decisions in life are based upon speculation and expectation.  Lots of times we're wrong, too.  The only thing I was trying to get across is...limit the potential for damage.  Unless, of course, you're an adrenaline junky and love risk-taking.  At my age, it's more about damage control  .  Plus, I'm not a particularly "good" member of the consumer society, as I try to limit my consumption and the spending it incurs--not always as successfully as I'd like though.

[Shiny]

Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy".  "If" you're right, well...that's great.  "If" you're not, you could be screwed.  Oh well...

.limit the potential for damage

We are finally getting somewhere...

[orthonorm]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect".  A third might be "depending".  All seems pretty "iffy".

Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth.

So..... "you speculate what inflation will be"....seems pretty "iffy", no?  And if it turns out to be other than your speculation....?

I didn't say "inflation increasing seems iffy."  Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy".  "If" you're right, well...that's great.  "If" you're not, you could be screwed.  Oh well.....

Lots and lots of our decisions in life are based upon speculation and expectation.  Lots of times we're wrong, too.  The only thing I was trying to get across is...limit the potential for damage.  Unless, of course, you're an adrenaline junky and love risk-taking.  At my age, it's more about damage control  .  Plus, I'm not a particularly "good" member of the consumer society, as I try to limit my consumption and the spending it incurs--not always as successfully as I'd like though.

Just realize that capitalism has laid hold of everything in the world and assigned it a value, even persons, feelings, etc, once valued that which is valued is in the world of economy which is a network of never ending speculation.

Choosing not to consume remains that which can be speculated upon. There is no escaping that spectre which haunts more than just Europe.

[Dpaula]

Dpaula its like we are soul mates.

Oh yes! Should we hug now? 

[Shiny]

Dpaula its like we are soul mates.

Oh yes! Should we hug now? 

If you promise you won't touch. 

[Dpaula]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

Well, how about looking at it as an investment?
1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge.

2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in.

3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything.

All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan.
I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something!

I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money.

[Dpaula]

Dpaula its like we are soul mates.

Oh yes! Should we hug now? 

If you promise you won't touch. 

Dude, how can I hug you without touching?!?!?

If we are soul mates, we must hug, and if we must hug, we must touch! Take it or leave it!

[Shiny]

Dpaula its like we are soul mates.

Oh yes! Should we hug now? 

If you promise you won't touch. 

Dude, how can I hug you without touching?!?!?

If we are soul mates, we must hug, and if we must hug, we must touch! Take it or leave it!

How do I know you aren't a cactus?

[hecma925]

Well, how about looking at it as an investment?
1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge.

2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in.

3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything.

All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan.
I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something!

I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money.
[/quote]

1.  You can get a better-paying job.  I took loans out for my bachelor's and I was unemployed after I graduate.  It's not a gurantee.

2.  If your housing market is good and you plan on selling right away (because you know the market is in your favor), do it.  Otherwise, it's better to save for a down  payment.  People do it all the time, it's not impossible.  Without having to be 50.

3.  You don't need a loan to have a kid.  People do it all the time and adjust their lives.

[J Michael]

If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.

If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.

Well, how about looking at it as an investment?
1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge.

2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in.

3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything.

All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan.
I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something!

I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money.

I don't totally disagree with lending or borrowing money.  Sometimes this is perceived to be necessary, especially in the consumer society we live in--most people need to borrow money to buy a house; many people need to borrow money to buy a car; sometimes people need to borrow money to deal with some kind of emergency.  But...if you don't really need to, why do it?  Used to be that many (most?) people either saved up to purchase those big expensive things, or simply did without.  What's so wrong with doing without?  Seems as though the standard for what is "needed" has been significantly lowered.

[Dpaula]

I see your point. I grew up watching a black and white TV, even though color TVs were available. My parents simply could not afford one, so they didn't buy it.

I'm not like that. If I want it, I better have it! I don't want stupid stuff though and I usually make elaborate plans and budgets on how I'll be paying for it. If it doesn't pass my math test, it ain't happening.

[J Michael]

I see your point. I grew up watching a black and white TV, even though color TVs were available. My parents simply could not afford one, so they didn't buy it.
If I want it, I better have it!

Well...uhh....I guess there's no rational argument against that, is there?  Isn't that some folks' definition of "spoiled"?

I don't want stupid stuff

What's your definition of "stupid stuff"?

and I usually make elaborate plans 

Old Yiddish saying: "If you want to make God laugh, tell Him your plans."

[Dpaula]

Trust me, I'm far from spoiled. But I'm a go-getter. I want it? I'll find a way to get it!

And I don't consider going back to school to continue my education or buying a house, stupid things.

Do you?

I always want to improve myself and my life. If I'm done aspiring for more or better, I might as well dig my hole.
 
I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them. God gave me the life, but I won't just sit here hoping it will be good.
And surely, if it's not meant to be, it's not meant to be, but at least I die trying.

[orthonorm]

I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.

How very American of you.

[yeshuaisiam]

What I would do is serve the lord with all my might, all my mind, and all my soul.

I would evade debt in order to serve him.
I would evade "education" at college, in order to serve him.

Adopting a child would be wonderful.  Having children would be wonderful.   Charity would be wonderful. 

[Dpaula]

I want to adopt. It costs at least $15,000!!!!

[Dpaula]

I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.

How very American of you.

Republican 100% 

[Shiny]

I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.

How very American of you.

Republican 100% 

I'd rather do without all of the above.