Dpaula
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« on: December 17, 2013, 12:49:50 PM » |
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You're 30. Have a job, good enough to pay the bills. Married. No children. You can afford a loan. What would you use it for? 1. Go back to school to get a Bachelor. 2. Invest in your current home so you can sell it and buy your dream home. 3. Adopt a child 4. Don't get the loan and don't change anything that will complicate your stress-free life. LoL. Yes...I'm talking about me  |
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katherineofdixie
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« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2013, 12:54:15 PM » |
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I wouldn't borrow money just to borrow money. What do you want to do?
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"If but ten of us lead a holy life, we shall kindle a fire which shall light up the entire city."
St. John Chrysostom
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IoanC
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« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2013, 12:54:50 PM » |
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You can afford a Ioan. Get him. Joking. That's my name, but sometimes English speaking readers think it's Loan. Seriously speaking, I have no idea. I hate loans myself. Never was able to pay one back , but I have good reasons. |
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Justin Kissel
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« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2013, 12:56:37 PM » |
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Start an Orthodox publishing house!  But out of the four options given, I'd go with #4... which I guess is boring, but there it is. |
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Dpaula
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« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2013, 01:01:19 PM » |
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Haaa, you made me laugh!!!
I definitely want to do something. I can't not do anything. Just go to work, come home, cook dinner, watch tv, go to bed. I gotta find me a project. LoL.
I want to go back to school, but if I do, I won't have time for my home renovations and having children will also have to wait. If I start with the house, I won't have time for school and I'm pretty much stuck to this level of salary for the rest of my life. I know I can do so much more with myself, but if I let time fly, it will be too late for college. I want children, but if it doesn't happen the natural way, I want to adopt. But if I wait too long, I'll be too old for children.
And so on, so on , so on....!!!
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Mamizous
What the heck is a Mamizou?
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Woaw.
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« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2013, 01:03:16 PM » |
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Mmm, I'd go back to school.
But that's just me.
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J Michael
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« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2013, 01:09:22 PM » |
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I'd suggest #4, but with a slight alteration as you said you can't not do anything. Don't get the loan. Do something that doesn't involve spending more money. You know...volunteer at a homeless shelter/pregnancy counseling center/food bank, etc., etc. Or...write a great novel. Or...since you are now married...have a boatload of wonderful kids!!!  |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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hecma925
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« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2013, 01:09:54 PM » |
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If you can go back to school without the debt, even better. Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
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J Michael
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« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2013, 01:16:03 PM » |
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If you can go back to school without the debt, even better. Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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Mamizous
What the heck is a Mamizou?
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Woaw.
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« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2013, 01:20:21 PM » |
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Yeah, loans are p. bad. Or so, I've heard. Luckily my student loan won't have to be paid back until I earn over a certain amount, and will disappear forever in 30 years... Which is why I'm not worried once I go to University in about a year.  As for otherwise... yeah, if you can avoid getting one, just... give it a miss. That interest will totally cramp your style. |
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Jetavan
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« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2013, 01:20:39 PM » |
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Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
...and wreck the economy. |
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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J Michael
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« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2013, 01:26:44 PM » |
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Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
...and wreck the economy. Yes...single-handedly, no less. |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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Gamliel
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« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2013, 01:27:55 PM » |
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Is your husband working? What happens if one of you lost your job? Can you still pay back the loan?
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hecma925
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« Reply #13 on: December 17, 2013, 01:28:22 PM » |
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Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
...and wreck the economy. Oh, consumer debts don't wreck the economy? Maybe I should retake high school economics. |
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hecma925
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« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2013, 01:28:50 PM » |
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Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
...and wreck the economy. Yes...single-handedly, no less. The authority bestowed on the Waxy One is heavy, my friend. |
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Dpaula
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« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2013, 01:33:31 PM » |
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If you can go back to school without the debt, even better. Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
Why? I'm very good at it. I have mortgage, car payment, credit cards and I had other loans throughout the years. Never late, never missed a payment. I love loans. I can get what I want and then gradually pay for it. Sure, the interest can be high, but I will never ever ever be able to save $30,000! So I pick to get the loan, do what I want and use my lifetime to pay it off while I enjoy my "thing". I know doctors that still pay for their medical school. I bet they have no problem with their loan, now that they make well over 100k/year. When I said "Don't get the loan"...I meant doing one of the three things listed will actually add some stress to my life (which I'll probably enjoy), not the actual loan. |
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Dpaula
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« Reply #16 on: December 17, 2013, 01:35:29 PM » |
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Is your husband working? What happens if one of you lost your job? Can you still pay back the loan?
We both work for the city. Unless we both screw up very badly, I can't see how we could lose our jobs. Plus, we have families that would help, I have no doubt. |
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Gamliel
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« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2013, 01:39:22 PM » |
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^ If you are confident of that, the price of school tends to go up every year, so I would lean toward a school loan if you want to do so. But remember that you are making a commitment. You may want to speak with a 3rd party you trust. I think you are an intelligent person, but committing oneself to a loan should be a decision which is cautiously taken.
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J Michael
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« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2013, 02:06:37 PM » |
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If you can go back to school without the debt, even better. Otherwise, stay away from all loans.
Why? I'm very good at it. I have mortgage, car payment, credit cards and I had other loans throughout the years. Never late, never missed a payment. I love loans. I can get what I want and then gradually pay for it. Sure, the interest can be high, but I will never ever ever be able to save $30,000! So I pick to get the loan, do what I want and use my lifetime to pay it off while I enjoy my "thing". I know doctors that still pay for their medical school. I bet they have no problem with their loan, now that they make well over 100k/year. When I said "Don't get the loan"...I meant doing one of the three things listed will actually add some stress to my life (which I'll probably enjoy), not the actual loan. Ahh....the consummate consumer  ! I still say...stay away from all loans to the extent that you are able, and don't take on new ones unless it is, like buying a house (and even that is highly arguable), absolutely necessary. |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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quietmorning
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« Reply #19 on: December 17, 2013, 02:15:11 PM » |
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I'd take the money that I would use to pay off the loan - the payment amount and save it to either work on the house or go to school. Why pay interest when some other institution can pay you?
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Justin Kissel
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« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2013, 02:50:18 PM » |
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You could always give the money to oc.net to bring us up to date up to where we were a half dozen years ago |
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J Michael
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« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2013, 03:02:51 PM » |
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You could always give the money to oc.net to bring us up to date up to where we were a half dozen years ago Or...you could always give half the money to oc.net to bring us up to date to where we were a dozen years ago, and give the other half to me to help me pay off my loans. |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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vamrat
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« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2013, 04:59:25 PM » |
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Loans are the root of all many economic evils.
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One day we will talk about why people fetishize children, but for now I'll keep on the side of humanity that doesn't think the height of life is a drinking a juice box and eating a tater tot while defecating in their pants.
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orthonorm
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« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2013, 05:09:24 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
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Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
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J Michael
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« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2013, 05:12:34 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect". A third might be "depending". All seems pretty "iffy".  |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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orthonorm
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« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2013, 05:14:43 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect". A third might be "depending". All seems pretty "iffy". Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth. |
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Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
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Shiny
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« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2013, 05:17:47 PM » |
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Dpaula its like we are soul mates.
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“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”
– St. Ambrose of Milan
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J Michael
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« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2013, 05:33:40 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect". A third might be "depending". All seems pretty "iffy". Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth. So..... "you speculate what inflation will be"....seems pretty "iffy", no? And if it turns out to be other than your speculation....? I didn't say "inflation increasing seems iffy." Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy". "If" you're right, well...that's great. "If" you're not, you could be screwed. Oh well..... Lots and lots of our decisions in life are based upon speculation and expectation. Lots of times we're wrong, too. The only thing I was trying to get across is...limit the potential for damage. Unless, of course, you're an adrenaline junky and love risk-taking. At my age, it's more about damage control . Plus, I'm not a particularly "good" member of the consumer society, as I try to limit my consumption and the spending it incurs--not always as successfully as I'd like though.  |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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Shiny
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« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2013, 05:38:15 PM » |
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Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy". "If" you're right, well...that's great. "If" you're not, you could be screwed. Oh well... .limit the potential for damage We are finally getting somewhere... |
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“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”
– St. Ambrose of Milan
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orthonorm
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« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2013, 05:46:05 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
The 2 most problematic words in your post = "speculate" and "expect". A third might be "depending". All seems pretty "iffy". Inflation increasing seems iffy? You are always speculating with every dollar you use in capitalism. If you just stick it under your bed, you making a speculative decision about the future of that dollar's worth. So..... "you speculate what inflation will be"....seems pretty "iffy", no? And if it turns out to be other than your speculation....? I didn't say "inflation increasing seems iffy." Your use of words like "speculate" and "expect" is what makes the whole exercise "iffy". "If" you're right, well...that's great. "If" you're not, you could be screwed. Oh well..... Lots and lots of our decisions in life are based upon speculation and expectation. Lots of times we're wrong, too. The only thing I was trying to get across is...limit the potential for damage. Unless, of course, you're an adrenaline junky and love risk-taking. At my age, it's more about damage control . Plus, I'm not a particularly "good" member of the consumer society, as I try to limit my consumption and the spending it incurs--not always as successfully as I'd like though. Just realize that capitalism has laid hold of everything in the world and assigned it a value, even persons, feelings, etc, once valued that which is valued is in the world of economy which is a network of never ending speculation. Choosing not to consume remains that which can be speculated upon. There is no escaping that spectre which haunts more than just Europe. |
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Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
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Dpaula
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« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2013, 06:52:04 PM » |
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Dpaula its like we are soul mates.
Oh yes! Should we hug now? |
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Shiny
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« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2013, 06:55:04 PM » |
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Dpaula its like we are soul mates.
Oh yes! Should we hug now? If you promise you won't touch. |
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“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”
– St. Ambrose of Milan
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Dpaula
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« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2013, 07:06:21 PM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
Well, how about looking at it as an investment? 1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge. 2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in. 3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything. All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan. I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something! I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money. |
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Dpaula
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« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2013, 07:08:42 PM » |
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Dpaula its like we are soul mates.
Oh yes! Should we hug now? If you promise you won't touch. Dude, how can I hug you without touching?!?!? If we are soul mates, we must hug, and if we must hug, we must touch! Take it or leave it! |
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Shiny
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« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2013, 07:12:51 PM » |
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Dpaula its like we are soul mates.
Oh yes! Should we hug now? If you promise you won't touch. Dude, how can I hug you without touching?!?!? If we are soul mates, we must hug, and if we must hug, we must touch! Take it or leave it! How do I know you aren't a cactus?  |
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“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”
– St. Ambrose of Milan
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hecma925
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« Reply #35 on: December 18, 2013, 08:06:42 AM » |
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Well, how about looking at it as an investment? 1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge. 2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in. 3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything. All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan. I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something! I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money. [/quote] 1. You can get a better-paying job. I took loans out for my bachelor's and I was unemployed after I graduate. It's not a gurantee. 2. If your housing market is good and you plan on selling right away (because you know the market is in your favor), do it. Otherwise, it's better to save for a down payment. People do it all the time, it's not impossible. Without having to be 50. 3. You don't need a loan to have a kid. People do it all the time and adjust their lives. |
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J Michael
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« Reply #36 on: December 18, 2013, 10:59:04 AM » |
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If the loan is going to allow you to get money at a rate which beats what you speculate inflation will be. Always take it.
If you expect inflation to continue (I am just waiting to what the world will look like under deflation), then every dollar you have today is worth more than those you get in the future. So getting today's dollars in exchange for dollars from the year 2024 is a great idea, depending on the interest rate and all that.
Well, how about looking at it as an investment? 1. Even with a high interest rate, in four years with a good college degree, I can get a better paying job. I wouldn't start paying for that loan until I graduate anyway, so how bad could it be? It's just a very big change for me. Lifestyle will be just absolutely completely different. So it's scary. But I looooooove a good challenge. 2. I could invest it in the house I have to be able to sell it with a profit and use that as a down payment for a better house that will most likely become the house I will grow old in. This is risky, and it won't improve my finances, but I'll be satisfied with the place I'm in. 3. Well..a child is a child. I can't compare this with anything. All in all, I would never ever ever afford any of this without a loan. I don't know how you guys are able to save a good couple of thousands or how long it takes you, but I don't have the patience to wait until I'm 50 to do something! I still don't understand why some of you disagree with loaning money. I don't totally disagree with lending or borrowing money. Sometimes this is perceived to be necessary, especially in the consumer society we live in--most people need to borrow money to buy a house; many people need to borrow money to buy a car; sometimes people need to borrow money to deal with some kind of emergency. But...if you don't really need to, why do it? Used to be that many (most?) people either saved up to purchase those big expensive things, or simply did without. What's so wrong with doing without? Seems as though the standard for what is "needed" has been significantly lowered. |
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« Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 10:59:56 AM by J Michael »
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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Dpaula
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« Reply #37 on: December 18, 2013, 12:41:05 PM » |
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I see your point. I grew up watching a black and white TV, even though color TVs were available. My parents simply could not afford one, so they didn't buy it.
I'm not like that. If I want it, I better have it! I don't want stupid stuff though and I usually make elaborate plans and budgets on how I'll be paying for it. If it doesn't pass my math test, it ain't happening.
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J Michael
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« Reply #38 on: December 18, 2013, 01:07:28 PM » |
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I see your point. I grew up watching a black and white TV, even though color TVs were available. My parents simply could not afford one, so they didn't buy it.
If I want it, I better have it!
Well...uhh....I guess there's no rational argument against that, is there? Isn't that some folks' definition of "spoiled"? I don't want stupid stuff
What's your definition of "stupid stuff"? and I usually make elaborate plans
Old Yiddish saying: "If you want to make God laugh, tell Him your plans." |
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"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire. May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian
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Dpaula
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Jurisdiction: OCA
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« Reply #39 on: December 18, 2013, 01:44:43 PM » |
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Trust me, I'm far from spoiled. But I'm a go-getter. I want it? I'll find a way to get it!
And I don't consider going back to school to continue my education or buying a house, stupid things.
Do you?
I always want to improve myself and my life. If I'm done aspiring for more or better, I might as well dig my hole.
I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them. God gave me the life, but I won't just sit here hoping it will be good.
And surely, if it's not meant to be, it's not meant to be, but at least I die trying.
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orthonorm
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« Reply #40 on: December 18, 2013, 01:45:52 PM » |
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I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.
How very American of you. |
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Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
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yeshuaisiam
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« Reply #41 on: December 18, 2013, 01:47:40 PM » |
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What I would do is serve the lord with all my might, all my mind, and all my soul.
I would evade debt in order to serve him.
I would evade "education" at college, in order to serve him.
Adopting a child would be wonderful. Having children would be wonderful. Charity would be wonderful.
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Dpaula
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« Reply #42 on: December 18, 2013, 01:49:11 PM » |
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I want to adopt. It costs at least $15,000!!!!
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Dpaula
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« Reply #43 on: December 18, 2013, 01:49:50 PM » |
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I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.
How very American of you. Republican 100% |
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Shiny
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Toumarches
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Paint It Red
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« Reply #44 on: December 18, 2013, 01:51:03 PM » |
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I consider people that have no plans, no wishes, wants, goals, are wasting the life God gave them.
How very American of you. Republican 100% I'd rather do without all of the above. |
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“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”
– St. Ambrose of Milan
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