OrthodoxChristianity.net
April 21, 2014, 10:36:51 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: The Rules page has been updated.  Please familiarize yourself with its contents!
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Sleeveless shirts  (Read 957 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« on: December 16, 2013, 12:51:07 AM »

outside of liturgy of course, yay or nay?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2013, 12:52:26 AM »

Why not?
Logged
Altar Server
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian(as of 12/18/10)
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 833


Before Thy Cross we bow down in worship O Master!


« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2013, 01:25:06 AM »

Why not?
+1 as long as they are not terribly immodest
Logged

"Open to me the doors of repentance O lifegiver!"
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2014, 10:58:38 PM »

What along those lines would be immodest?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2014, 11:04:39 PM »

What along those lines would be immodest?

Thin straps and revealing necklines come to mind for starters.
Logged
Santagranddad
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: ROCA
Posts: 986



« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2014, 11:07:53 PM »

I would never enter a place of worship in a sleeveless shirt.
Logged
LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2014, 11:09:17 PM »

I would never enter a place of worship in a sleeveless shirt.

Anastasia can correct me if need be, but I took her OP as referring to women's wear.
Logged
Santagranddad
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: ROCA
Posts: 986



« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2014, 11:14:40 PM »

My point is that a sleeveless shirt in Church is not suitable attire for either men or women. Indeed in India I wore a blazer when visiting places of worship, out of respect.
Logged
Mor Ephrem
"Mor is right, you are wrong." - Carl Kraeff
Section Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 12,036


I'm back, Mom...miss Me?


WWW
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2014, 11:39:38 PM »

My point is that a sleeveless shirt in Church is not suitable attire for either men or women. Indeed in India I wore a blazer when visiting places of worship, out of respect.

In my experience, people don't wear sleeveless garments to church there.  "Short sleeves", yes, but certainly nothing that involve revealing necklines or exposed shoulders.  I know of cases where girls buy Western style sleeveless wedding gowns and show up to church only to have the priest or bishop read them the riot act, often in front of all the guests, and refuse to begin the wedding until they are appropriately attired. 
Logged

"Best of all, Mor Ephrem won't trap you into having his baby." - dzheremi

"Mor Ephrim will not be allowed in(to the getes of heaven) because God doesnt know him." - Cackles

"You are consistently one of the cruelest posters on this forum." - William
Asteriktos
Pegleg J
Protostrator
***************
Offline Offline

Faith: Like an arrow to the knee
Posts: 27,243



« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2014, 11:58:10 PM »

I took "outside of liturgy" in the OP to mean outside of church services generally. Was I mistaken in that?
Logged

I'll bet I look like a goof.

"And since when have Christians become afraid of rain?"
LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2014, 11:59:42 PM »

I took "outside of liturgy" in the OP to mean outside of church services generally. Was I mistaken in that?

I took it that way as well. I hope Anastasia chimes in.
Logged
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2014, 02:00:16 AM »

I took "outside of liturgy" in the OP to mean outside of church services generally. Was I mistaken in that?
No, you were not mistaken.
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
wainscottbl
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Somewhere between Rome and Constantinople (Roman Catholic investigating Eastern Orthodoxy)
Posts: 764


Tunc dicit ei Jesus: Vade Satana!


« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2014, 02:49:04 AM »

Coming from the SSPX side into Eastern Orthodoxy I want to take the middle ground. I am not going to say that stupid thing that pretentious trads say: "Can you picture the Virgin Mary wearing that?" No, I would like to say, but I can't picture in what you are wearing either so....but I would just consider your neigbour. I do not think it should be a terrible temptation for a normal man as long as we are not talking cleavage, middrift, etc. Something like this would be fine, I think:



I assume it is something similar to that. Trying to be less rigorous it's hard for me, but I am inclined to say I would not be too concerned. The traditional Catholics can be not only so rigorous on the matter but legalistic. Like what I posted is a venial sin. Something showing middrift and cleavage would be a mortal sin. I really think you're fine outside of liturgy, though some of the writings of the early fathers may make you think different like "On The Apparel of Women"http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0402.htm by Tertullian
Logged

"I thought I should be too miserable, unless folded in female arms; and of the medicine of Thy mercy to cure that infirmity I thought not, not having tried it. As for continency..none can be continent unless [God] gives it."  --St. Augustine of Hippo
wainscottbl
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Somewhere between Rome and Constantinople (Roman Catholic investigating Eastern Orthodoxy)
Posts: 764


Tunc dicit ei Jesus: Vade Satana!


« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2014, 02:51:07 AM »

And the link from Tertullian was meant half as a joke, but of course halfway for your benefit, my lady. Can never go wrong with the fathers, though some of it must be taken in the right spirit. It can be read to the point of hypocritical rigor and scruple against wearing even makeup or putting on earrings. The golden mean is golden though.
Logged

"I thought I should be too miserable, unless folded in female arms; and of the medicine of Thy mercy to cure that infirmity I thought not, not having tried it. As for continency..none can be continent unless [God] gives it."  --St. Augustine of Hippo
Dominika
Serbian/Polish
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of Poland
Posts: 880


St. Luke, pray for us!


« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2014, 03:30:16 PM »

To church or for any church service - definitely not, both for men and women.
Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

As for shirts with short sleeves, I do wear them to church
Logged

Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria
Mor Ephrem
"Mor is right, you are wrong." - Carl Kraeff
Section Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 12,036


I'm back, Mom...miss Me?


WWW
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2014, 04:12:27 PM »

Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

Depends on the arms.  Wink
Logged

"Best of all, Mor Ephrem won't trap you into having his baby." - dzheremi

"Mor Ephrim will not be allowed in(to the getes of heaven) because God doesnt know him." - Cackles

"You are consistently one of the cruelest posters on this forum." - William
Dominika
Serbian/Polish
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of Poland
Posts: 880


St. Luke, pray for us!


« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2014, 04:24:20 PM »

Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

Depends on the arms.  Wink

I don't think so. If somebody finds it's wrong, it's a problem of particular man Wink At least I don't feel I'm doing something inappropriate when I'm wearing a sleeveless shirt
Logged

Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria
Michał Kalina
Stratopedarches
**************
Offline Offline

Posts: 21,465


WWW
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2014, 04:24:58 PM »

Not for males.
Logged

Byzantinism
no longer posting here
Cyrillic
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Moscow
Posts: 7,957


The Reactionary Rebel


WWW
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2014, 04:27:11 PM »

Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

Depends on the arms.  Wink

Depends on the armpits, I'd say.

Not for males.

+1
« Last Edit: January 16, 2014, 04:27:45 PM by Cyrillic » Logged

Odi profanum vulgus et arceo

"J'ai pour les institutions démocratiques un goût de tête, mais je suis aristocrate par instinct"
-A. de Tocqueville

'Don't bother arguing with Cyrillic, he is Dutch or something queer like that.'
-Byron
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: <Insert your favourite patriotic attribute here> Orthodox
Posts: 5,944



« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2014, 04:28:48 PM »

The only canonically kosher form is telnayshka.

Logged

Dominika
Serbian/Polish
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of Poland
Posts: 880


St. Luke, pray for us!


« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2014, 04:30:24 PM »

Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

Depends on the arms.  Wink

Depends on the armpits, I'd say.

laugh

Not for males.

Huh
Logged

Pray for persecuted Christians, especially in Serbian Kosovo and Raška, Egypt and Syria
orthonorm
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Posts: 16,167



« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2014, 05:06:20 PM »

I do not think it should be a terrible temptation for a normal man as long as we are not talking cleavage, middrift, etc.

Here we go, placing the foibles of some men on all women. You could bring a woman into my presence naked. I would be OK. If most men are honest, arousal which is not temptation, is an irreducibly complex phenomenon. Men who want to pretend to be foreverpotent will exaggerate the effect of the appearance of a woman on their psyche. 

Most women are sensible. When in Rome . . . Frankly, when women step outside the norm, it is rarely provocative in an arousing manner but rather in an uncomfortable manner. For example, my once seeing a woman wearing to what amounted to a transparent dress to a DL. I could have told you the cut and color of her underwear. I wasn't aroused, just a little unsure of how to act to mitigate her embarrassment before I told her later of her clothing predicament.

Everyone who was "too shy" to do what I did, I asked some women to talk to her, none were particularly aroused or angry, just wanted to avoid embarrassing her. 

I guess it was a dress that didn't look see through up close and when wearing it.

Now, if you take the same situation and place it in place where sex is the reason for being there, a club or whatever. Then it is quite different. But then, it is also NBD cause that is reason why everyone is there.

When in Rome. Guys who are forever tempted will be no matter what you do and in my experience the more society capitulates to that "weakness" the worse it makes the weakness, not better.
Logged

Gradually fading away on a strict punishment schedule.
vamrat
Vamratoraptor
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Faith: Serbian Orthodox
Jurisdiction: New Gracanica
Posts: 7,102



« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2014, 05:35:02 PM »

The only canonically kosher form is telnayshka.



Truth. Otherwise, men should never be in sleeveless shirts in public.  My brother makes fun of me once for wearing a wifebeater once at home when a friend of his was over.  Then again, that could be because there was a hole the size of my stomach in it (pretty big, FYI).  Still, sleeves or go home (and put sleeves on).
Logged

One day we will talk about why people fetishize children, but for now I'll keep on the side of humanity that doesn't think the height of life is a drinking a juice box and eating a tater tot while defecating in their pants.
vamrat
Vamratoraptor
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Faith: Serbian Orthodox
Jurisdiction: New Gracanica
Posts: 7,102



« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2014, 05:36:15 PM »

Other places and occasions - I don't see nothing wrong in wearing sleeveless shirts.

Depends on the arms.  Wink

I don't think so. If somebody finds it's wrong, it's a problem of particular man Wink At least I don't feel I'm doing something inappropriate when I'm wearing a sleeveless shirt

Still, there is a problem with some people showing too much.  (By too much I mean quantity, not quality.  Or maybe it's the other way around.  If you arms are wider than my torso, please, have decency.)
Logged

One day we will talk about why people fetishize children, but for now I'll keep on the side of humanity that doesn't think the height of life is a drinking a juice box and eating a tater tot while defecating in their pants.
ZealousZeal
Interplanet Janet
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: ✔
Posts: 2,227


I'm the magnificent, marvelous, mad Madam Mim.


« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2014, 06:21:55 PM »

Not a fan of tank tops on guys in general, for some reason. For girls, I think it's fine.
Logged

There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2014, 11:11:09 PM »

Would it be immodest to take off one's sweater in the car in the middle of summer (or at least pretty hot) when one is in mixed company and one is wearing a spaghetti strap dress?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
Mor Ephrem
"Mor is right, you are wrong." - Carl Kraeff
Section Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 12,036


I'm back, Mom...miss Me?


WWW
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2014, 11:49:42 PM »

Would it be immodest to take off one's sweater in the car in the middle of summer (or at least pretty hot) when one is in mixed company and one is wearing a spaghetti strap dress?

God will surely bless you, Anastasia.  You think and care more about these details than I do, and if modesty has taken that much root in your soul, it will be reflected outwardly, even on a hot day when you have to take off your sweater lest you faint. 
Logged

"Best of all, Mor Ephrem won't trap you into having his baby." - dzheremi

"Mor Ephrim will not be allowed in(to the getes of heaven) because God doesnt know him." - Cackles

"You are consistently one of the cruelest posters on this forum." - William
Arachne
Trinary Unit || Resident Bossy Boots
Section Moderator
Archon
*****
Online Online

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian Archdiocese of the British Isles and Ireland
Posts: 3,472


Tending Brigid's flame


« Reply #27 on: January 17, 2014, 03:32:28 AM »

I like cap sleeves best. The not-quite-sleeveless effect flatters everyone. Like this:

Logged

'When you live your path all the time, you end up with both more path and more time.'~Venecia Rauls

Blog ~ Bookshelf ~ Jukebox
LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #28 on: January 17, 2014, 03:42:58 AM »

mistaken post ....
« Last Edit: January 17, 2014, 03:43:38 AM by LBK » Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: <Insert your favourite patriotic attribute here> Orthodox
Posts: 5,944



« Reply #29 on: January 17, 2014, 04:57:47 AM »

mistaken post ....

You was about to post an icon with a saint wearing sleeveless shirt?
Logged

LBK
Warned
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 9,105


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #30 on: January 17, 2014, 04:59:43 AM »

mistaken post ....

You was about to post an icon with a saint wearing sleeveless shirt?

Nope. Nice try.  Wink
Logged
Salpy
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Armenian Church
Posts: 11,904


St. Hripsimeh pray for us!


« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2014, 03:40:26 AM »

A tangent about other kinds of clothing besides sleeveless shirts was moved to here:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,56120.0.html#top
Logged

"I don't think I've ever eaten anything Armenian I didn't like.  I even drink my non-Armenian coffee out of a St Nersess Seminary coffee mug because it is better that way." --Mor Ephrem
NicholasMyra
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian/Greek
Posts: 5,627


Avowed denominationalist


« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2014, 09:07:11 PM »

I like cap sleeves best. The not-quite-sleeveless effect flatters everyone. Like this:


I've never seen a white woman make this particular pose before. Maybe when mocking how young men pose.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2014, 09:12:25 PM by NicholasMyra » Logged

"...you are the orphan, not the protagonist."

-St. Seraphim of Vyritsa, 'This was from me'
Maria
Orthodox Christian
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,364


O most Holy Theotokos, save us.


« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2014, 09:37:28 PM »

My point is that a sleeveless shirt in Church is not suitable attire for either men or women. Indeed in India I wore a blazer when visiting places of worship, out of respect.

In my experience, people don't wear sleeveless garments to church there.  "Short sleeves", yes, but certainly nothing that involve revealing necklines or exposed shoulders.  I know of cases where girls buy Western style sleeveless wedding gowns and show up to church only to have the priest or bishop read them the riot act, often in front of all the guests, and refuse to begin the wedding until they are appropriately attired. 

In the small OCA church I used to attend, women, particularly old women having hot flashes would wear sleeveless dresses or blouses that exposed their sagging arm muscles. Then they would ceaselessly fan themselves. In spite of it all, we were glad that they made it to church as the church lacked a decent air conditioning system, and that was hard on them.

Logged

Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory to Him forever!
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2014, 05:03:36 AM »

I like cap sleeves best. The not-quite-sleeveless effect flatters everyone. Like this:


I've never seen a white woman make this particular pose before. Maybe when mocking how young men pose.
You've seen non-white women do it?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
Maria
Orthodox Christian
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,364


O most Holy Theotokos, save us.


« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2014, 03:56:44 PM »

I like cap sleeves best. The not-quite-sleeveless effect flatters everyone. Like this:


I've never seen a white woman make this particular pose before. Maybe when mocking how young men pose.
You've seen non-white women do it?

Is this picture taken of a model? If so, it was the photographer's suggested pose, nothing more.
Logged

Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory to Him forever!
NicholasMyra
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian/Greek
Posts: 5,627


Avowed denominationalist


« Reply #36 on: January 20, 2014, 02:38:56 AM »


You've seen non-white women do it?
Something akin to it, yeah
Logged

"...you are the orphan, not the protagonist."

-St. Seraphim of Vyritsa, 'This was from me'
Tags: proper behavior 
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.113 seconds with 65 queries.