Author Topic: Happy Reformation Day!  (Read 11347 times)

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Offline Dpaula

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Happy Reformation Day!
« on: October 31, 2013, 08:45:05 AM »
Sorry, I couldn't help it. Haha!

Today, my Facebook page is split in two categories of people. One says "Happy Halloween" and the other says " Happy Reformation Day". How comical.

Oh and then there are my Orthodox friends who go on with their day like usual.

Not posting anymore due to the rudeness on this site.

Offline Luke

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2013, 09:22:44 AM »
I preferred National Cat Day a day or two ago.  :police:

Offline LBK

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2013, 09:26:02 AM »
I preferred National Cat Day a day or two ago.  :police:

A MUCH more worthy and edifying commemoration!!!
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

Offline Arachne

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2013, 09:30:28 AM »
Happy birthday to Stephen Rea, Peter Jackson and Infanta Leonor of Spain! ;D
'Evil isn't the real threat to the world. Stupid is just as destructive as evil, maybe more so, and it's a hell of a lot more common. What we really need is a crusade against stupid. That might actually make a difference.'~Harry Dresden

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Offline Hinterlander

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2013, 09:55:37 AM »
Really potshots at the Reformed?



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Offline Papist

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2013, 02:51:03 PM »
EWWWWWWWWWw
"For, by its immensity, the divine substance surpasses every form that our intellect reaches. Thus we are unable to apprehend it by knowing what it is. Yet we are able to have some knowledge of it by knowing what it is not." - St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa contra gentiles, I, 14.

Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2013, 03:26:36 PM »
I like Halloween better. Although I truly admire Martin Luther particularly as a person.

The Reformation itself... not so much. One of the biggest disasters in human history.
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Offline Hinterlander

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2013, 04:13:36 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Interested to know what real disasters you rank it behind.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 04:13:47 PM by Hinterlander »

Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2013, 04:54:47 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Interested to know what real disasters you rank it behind.


What do you mean by that?
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Offline mike

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2013, 05:07:29 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Actually it prevented persecutions on us here (at least a bit) so I cannot agree.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 05:07:54 PM by Michał Kalina »
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Offline brastaseptim

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2013, 05:10:14 PM »
I prefer the term Hallowmas, to avoid the secular name Halloween and the term All Saints, because we Byzantines already got several All Saints days.
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Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2013, 05:10:25 PM »
How was the Reformation bad? I can understand it if Papist doesn't like it but why would we be bothered?

Philip Melanchton was a pretty cool guy.

Offline Hinterlander

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2013, 05:18:03 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Interested to know what real disasters you rank it behind.


What do you mean by that?

How does it compare to say this?


Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2013, 07:50:30 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Actually it prevented persecutions on us here (at least a bit) so I cannot agree.
Really? What do you think would have happened, crusades giving up on Islam and attacking non-Romans?
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Offline mike

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2013, 09:21:17 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Actually it prevented persecutions on us here (at least a bit) so I cannot agree.
Really? What do you think would have happened, crusades giving up on Islam and attacking non-Romans?

No Civil War in Poland between Catilics and Lutherans/Kalvinists. No Wrsaw Confederation..
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Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2013, 10:57:56 PM »
One of the biggest disasters in human history.

Actually it prevented persecutions on us here (at least a bit) so I cannot agree.
Really? What do you think would have happened, crusades giving up on Islam and attacking non-Romans?

No Civil War in Poland between Catilics and Lutherans/Kalvinists. No Wrsaw Confederation..
Ok, quick google search reveals something about a religious tolerance agreement, so there would have been less tolerance for Orthodox without it. Interesting.
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Offline lovesupreme

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2013, 12:31:39 AM »
Let the reformation continue.

Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2013, 01:30:07 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!
Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. (2 Cor 2:6)

Offline Nephi

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2013, 02:02:05 AM »
How was the Reformation bad? I can understand it if Papist doesn't like it but why would we be bothered?

How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters. And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Offline JamesRottnek

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2013, 02:57:35 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.
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Offline lovesupreme

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2013, 03:24:29 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.

Ouch! But it's Catholics who have "the Rock." :)

Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #21 on: November 01, 2013, 03:33:35 AM »
How was the Reformation bad? I can understand it if Papist doesn't like it but why would we be bothered?

How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters. And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.
Ahh, heretics... Gotta love them...

Especially since we can't burn them.
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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #22 on: November 01, 2013, 04:42:41 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2013, 04:49:31 AM »
Bottom line, Protestants and Catholics need prayer and should all become Orthodox.
Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. (2 Cor 2:6)

Offline Gunnarr

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2013, 05:11:20 AM »
Anathema Anathema Anathema!

 >:( ;D >:( ;D >:( ;D
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Offline Santagranddad

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2013, 06:09:47 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

But it will not and cannot 'reform' into a closer approximation. Rather it will fall into the pitfalls due to the fads and fancies of the would be reformers, and distorted by the baggage and history they bring with them. The living reality of Christ's Church is with us today. It cannot and will not be recreated by folks so separated in time, culture, connection and devoid of all the antibodies that our spiritual forebears had to develop against heresy over centuries. They will simply fall into error, tragically.

Offline alanscott

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2013, 07:46:13 AM »
IMHO you all are missing the greater implications of Oct 31st.
 
For it is TODAY that Orthodox, Roman Catholics, and Protestants alike can celebrate together;

  the extra candy and chocolate go on sale!!!

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Offline brastaseptim

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #27 on: November 01, 2013, 07:49:27 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

Yes, but there is a difference between suspect and "no chance in Hades this is valid because they don't even believe near the same concept of Holy Orders and Eucharist" like with most of the Protestants.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 07:50:59 AM by brastaseptim »
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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2013, 08:02:33 AM »
IMHO you all are missing the greater implications of Oct 31st.
 
For it is TODAY that Orthodox, Roman Catholics, and Protestants alike can celebrate together;

  the extra candy and chocolate go on sale!!!



Amen!
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Offline Santagranddad

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #29 on: November 01, 2013, 08:08:26 AM »
IMHO you all are missing the greater implications of Oct 31st.
 
For it is TODAY that Orthodox, Roman Catholics, and Protestants alike can celebrate together;

  the extra candy and chocolate go on sale!!!



Amen!

My dentist groans...... Sooner have a Russet apple with some extra mature cheese, or a pear. Pear and cheese, lovely.

Offline Nephi

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #30 on: November 01, 2013, 08:42:48 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

Yes, but there is a difference between suspect and "no chance in Hades this is valid because they don't even believe near the same concept of Holy Orders and Eucharist" like with most of the Protestants.

This is more or less how I feel.

At least Catholics have bishops and believe in their necessity for the Church like we do. Too many (read: most, apart from some Anglo-Catholics AFAIK) Protestants either don't, or view them as "useful but optional." There are other views of the Church beyond the episcopate that drifted even further out to sea, but vary in degree. And apart from modern liturgical abuse, Catholics have preserved a pretty good view and treatment of the Eucharist. Protestants, as varied as they are, generally didn't and don't.

It helps that I also don't believe Catholics are graceless, which admittedly is a challenge for me being around so-called "progressive" Catholics on a regular basis.

Not to mention, while schism between the major communions (Rome, EO, OO, ACOE) is bad enough, I'm inclined to believe the denominational and post-denominational crises are travesties before God, and the Reformation can be disliked for those reasons alone.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 08:43:35 AM by Nephi »

Offline William

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #31 on: November 01, 2013, 08:56:46 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

neither of these responses validates the development of protestantism or addresses Nephi's points.

It's pretty revisionist for an Orthodox Christian to try and spin the Protestant Revolution in a positive light.
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Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #32 on: November 01, 2013, 09:05:19 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

Yes, but there is a difference between suspect and "no chance in Hades this is valid because they don't even believe near the same concept of Holy Orders and Eucharist" like with most of the Protestants.

This is more or less how I feel.

At least Catholics have bishops and believe in their necessity for the Church like we do. Too many (read: most, apart from some Anglo-Catholics AFAIK) Protestants either don't, or view them as "useful but optional." There are other views of the Church beyond the episcopate that drifted even further out to sea, but vary in degree. And apart from modern liturgical abuse, Catholics have preserved a pretty good view and treatment of the Eucharist. Protestants, as varied as they are, generally didn't and don't.

It helps that I also don't believe Catholics are graceless, which admittedly is a challenge for me being around so-called "progressive" Catholics on a regular basis.

Not to mention, while schism between the major communions (Rome, EO, OO, ACOE) is bad enough, I'm inclined to believe the denominational and post-denominational crises are travesties before God, and the Reformation can be disliked for those reasons alone.

It's not really 'denominational' as much as it is sectarian. Romans don't just disregard hierarchy and do whatever they want.
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Offline Nephi

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #33 on: November 01, 2013, 09:09:44 AM »
It's not really 'denominational' as much as it is sectarian. Romans don't just disregard hierarchy and do whatever they want.

I'm not sure what you mean. By "denominational" crisis I was referring to the appearance of thousands of Protestant denominations.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 09:10:54 AM by Nephi »

Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2013, 09:11:24 AM »
How was it bad? Generally speaking, an irreconcilable distortion of the Eucharist, episcopate/ecclesiology, for starters.

The Roman Catholic sacraments, such as the Eucharist and Holy Orders have, for long periods, been considered invalid or at the very least suspect.

And we've had too many encounters with Protestants throughout the centuries to consider their creation and existence as an irrelevant isolated phenomenon with no impact on us.

Yes, they sent missionaries to the East, but so did the Propaganda Fide.

It's pretty revisionist for an Orthodox Christian to try and spin the Protestant Revolution in a positive light.

No. The first response of the Orthodox to the Reformation was quite positive. There were cordial relations with the Hussites and the Anglicans. Up until the appearence of the Bible Societies in the 19th-century the Protestants were held in a much higher regard than the Roman Catholics.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 09:17:25 AM by Cyrillic »

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2013, 09:49:53 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.

Bones are alive.  Cancer kills.
Mor Ephrem is a nice guy.  Just say sorry and it will all be ok. Say I had things that were inside troubling me but I didn't know how to express appropriately. I will not behave that way again but I am seeking help.

thank you so much Mor ephrem you are a hero!

Offline Santagranddad

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2013, 10:12:31 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.

Bones are alive.  Cancer kills.

"Bones are alive"? I hope not having just watched the dog bury his!  :o

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2013, 11:40:25 AM »
"Bones are alive"? I hope not having just watched the dog bury his!  :o

Well, they start out that way.  :P
Mor Ephrem is a nice guy.  Just say sorry and it will all be ok. Say I had things that were inside troubling me but I didn't know how to express appropriately. I will not behave that way again but I am seeking help.

thank you so much Mor ephrem you are a hero!

Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2013, 11:48:52 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.
I'd prefer Christianity over happy clappy dancing priestesses.  ;)
God bless!

Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2013, 11:54:22 AM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

I'd prefer a living Christianity to an ossified one.


Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #40 on: November 01, 2013, 12:02:09 PM »
Mor Ephrem is a nice guy.  Just say sorry and it will all be ok. Say I had things that were inside troubling me but I didn't know how to express appropriately. I will not behave that way again but I am seeking help.

thank you so much Mor ephrem you are a hero!

Offline Rufus

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #41 on: November 01, 2013, 01:10:51 PM »
Some of you people don't get it.

There is no such thing as going back to an "earlier Christianity." When people try to do it, they just mess everything up.

This is exactly why tradition is important. Tradition always lives in the present. Trying to reverse the flow of tradition can be just as disastrous and possibly more stupid than reckless innovation.

Nafpliotis understood this.

Offline Santagranddad

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #42 on: November 01, 2013, 01:16:14 PM »
Some of you people don't get it.

There is no such thing as going back to an "earlier Christianity." When people try to do it, they just mess everything up.

This is exactly why tradition is important. Tradition always lives in the present. Trying to reverse the flow of tradition can be just as disastrous and possibly more stupid than reckless innovation.

Nafpliotis understood this.

+1

Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #43 on: November 01, 2013, 01:21:31 PM »
IMHO you all are missing the greater implications of Oct 31st.
 
For it is TODAY that Orthodox, Roman Catholics, and Protestants alike can celebrate together;

  the extra candy and chocolate go on sale!!!



Amen!
Glory to God.
Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. (2 Cor 2:6)

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Re: Happy Reformation Day!
« Reply #44 on: November 01, 2013, 01:24:38 PM »
Let the reformation continue.
Let it reform into an earlier Christianity closer to how it was back in the day. Viva la Orthodoxy!

But it will not and cannot 'reform' into a closer approximation. Rather it will fall into the pitfalls due to the fads and fancies of the would be reformers, and distorted by the baggage and history they bring with them. The living reality of Christ's Church is with us today. It cannot and will not be recreated by folks so separated in time, culture, connection and devoid of all the antibodies that our spiritual forebears had to develop against heresy over centuries. They will simply fall into error, tragically.
But they are more than welcome to start attending liturgy and learning about Orthodoxy, maybe talk to a priest, converse with the parish members, get chrismated, etc.
Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. (2 Cor 2:6)