Author Topic: The Synod of Milan  (Read 10584 times)

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Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2011, 07:14:15 PM »
You may not like our Synod, you may despise us 'schismatics',
.

Please do attribute to me things which are not true.

I look on every schismatic as a potential Orthodox.   :laugh:

Offline ag_vn

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #46 on: February 03, 2011, 04:10:31 AM »
Isn't most of the Bulgarian Church Old Calendar anyway (I know nearly all of it, or perhaps all of it is in the US)? Why not just enter into communion with us? :)

In Christ,
Andrew

The Bulgarian Patriarchate is New Calendar. There are just several Old Calendar parishes in Bulgaria who are part of the canonical Bulgarian Orthodox Church (although I have no idea where in Bulgaria they are actually). All Bulgarian parishes in Western and Central Europe are also New Calendar. As for the USA, I think the convert parishes tend to be Old Calendar, while the Bulgarian ones - New Calendar.

BTW isn't the Bulgarian Alternative Synod New Calendar too? They schismed many years after the calendar switching.

Yes, it is. The Calendar was not the reason for this schism. It happened after the fall of the communism, about 20 years ago. Nowadays the Bulgarian Orthodox Church - Alternative Synod has only a few parishes.  I think most parishes and priests returned to the canonical Bulgarian Church in 2002.

Last year (or in 2009) a group joined the Old Calendar Metropolitan Angelos in Greece, AFAIK they are quite a few also. Their Bishop in Bulgaria Damaskin is or used to be a scandalous person.

The largest Bulgarian Old Calendar group is the Bulgarian Old Calendar Orthodox Church which is in communion with Metropolitan Cyprian's Synod in Resistance in Greece and in the 90's was in communion with the ROCOR.

In addition there are 2-3 parishes which are under the omophorion of Archbishop Gregory of Denver.

Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #47 on: February 03, 2011, 05:04:48 AM »
We are in communion with the Old Calendar Bulgarian Alternative Synod. You may see that listed here among our sister Churches.
http://metropolsynodgoc.blogspot.com/p/ecclcommunion.html


I see that on your website NTFU you report that you do not know if the Bulgarian Alternative Synod is Old Calendar New Calendar.

http://news-nftu.blogspot.com/2010/03/bulgarian-alternative-synod-elevates.html

Offline ag_vn

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #48 on: February 03, 2011, 06:19:30 AM »
We are in communion with the Old Calendar Bulgarian Alternative Synod. You may see that listed here among our sister Churches.
http://metropolsynodgoc.blogspot.com/p/ecclcommunion.html

There is only one Bulgarian Alternative Synod (which is close to extinction) and it is New Calendar. There is no Old Calendar Bulgarian Alternative Synod. The group that you mean and is connected with Metropolitan Anghelos is called Bulgarian Orthodox Church-GOC. It consists of Metropolitan Gervasios who was part of the Alternative Synod and 2-3 other bishops. One of them is Bishop Damaskinos who is widely known as Dim Dukov in the society...

Offline mike

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #49 on: February 03, 2011, 08:12:54 AM »
BTW isn't the Bulgarian Alternative Synod New Calendar too? They schismed many years after the calendar switching.

Actually, I think it was about four years. I'd have to check.

AFAIR - about 30 years.

Quote
The Bulgarian GOC with which we are in communion formed due to a pending split that was occurring over the past couple of years in the Bulgarian Alternative Synod.

Metropolitan Anghelos offered to assist in the consecration of Bishops for the majority, provided that they returned to the Old Calendar.

That is how the Synod formed.

Clear, thanks.

Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #50 on: February 03, 2011, 04:52:58 PM »
This is NOT a website of your Church.

It is a website of our Sister Church.

Quote
It appears to that of some obscure Greek Old Calendarist group which came into existence only 2 or 3 years ago.   I would not put too much emphasis in anything it places on the Web.

I would, considering with the exception of Metropolitan Anghelos and now Metropolitan Chrysostomos, all of the Bishops were consecrated with the assistance of our Metropolitan and Synod.

These are our sister Churches.
http://metropolsynodgoc.blogspot.com/p/ecclcommunion.html

Perhaps they are your uncanonical Sister Churches (?) but we have a very clear statement on your official website of six canonical Churches which are your "canonical Sister Orthodox Churches."

 http://www.metropoliadimilano.it/   

That's four times. Those churches are sister churches to each other.

WE ARE NOT IN COMMUNION WITH ANY OF THOSE CHURCHES.

Stop lying.

Please.

Dear Father,

I do  not think that anybody is lying but it is obvious that there are two Milans operating and you may not have all the information.  There is a kind of "new" Milan in the USA fostered by converts during the last few years which is adopting a more isolationist approach to mainstream Orthodoxy  And there is the old and more open Milan, still the norm in Europe and in large measure in the USA.

You seem unaware of Milan's position on some things.  Here is confirmation that communion does take place, from a veteran monk in Milan-USA.  (Calling me a liar was really going too far!!)

Milan allows concelebrations and communion with the local Orthodox Churches (the Patriarchates, etc.)  Fr. Aidan (Keller) has documented quite a few instances, and we have this statement as well:

"As I have written elsewhere, "The Milan Synod is a thoroughly canonical body that views "modernists" Orthodox Churches still Grace-filled but ailing and in trouble." due to their participation in & influences of false Ecumenism. Contrary to the Cyprianites, the Milan Synod is NOT "walled off". Our clergy do concelebrate with both NC & OC on a selective basis."

in Christ's Peace,
Stavrophoremonk Symeon

http://www.monachos.net/forum/showthread.php?5356-Question-about-the-Milan-Synod

Offline Alpo

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #51 on: February 03, 2011, 07:42:42 PM »
The Synod of Milan seems to be quite rare case in the sense that they seem to be fully comfortable with being a bi-ritual church. In other EO churches where there are WR parishes or monasteries there still seems to live some anti-WR sentiments. Is the Milan Synod so unianimously for WRO as it seems or are there hierarchs who oppose WR? Does the faithful on the grassroots level accept WR?

Offline Suaiden

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #52 on: February 05, 2011, 04:42:33 PM »
The Synod of Milan seems to be quite rare case in the sense that they seem to be fully comfortable with being a bi-ritual church. In other EO churches where there are WR parishes or monasteries there still seems to live some anti-WR sentiments. Is the Milan Synod so unianimously for WRO as it seems or are there hierarchs who oppose WR? Does the faithful on the grassroots level accept WR?

Well, all the rites we use are pre-schism. Because of that, they are slightly less familiar to the modern-day Westerner but in a few ways a little more familiar to the modern-day Eastern Orthodox. While a Western convert can still relate to the rites of the Orthodox West, they are clearly not Roman Catholic and Anglican services, and one would be hard pressed to notice the similarity except on paper.

Since the majority of our Synod is comprised of converts, they are less apt to judge the ritual based on the "foreign-ness" of its appearance and more on the purity of the Orthodoxy expressed in the ritual. So our Western Rite members and Eastern Rite members understand their own choices as children of circumstance-- but they are less quick to judge another ritual as necessarily more or less "right" or "wrong".

In Christ
Deacon Joseph
Still a Deacon of the Autonomous Metropolia, Nope, Still Don't Like Ecumenism, Yep, Still Western "Rite"

Offline Andrew - The First Called

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #53 on: June 17, 2014, 05:35:10 PM »
I don't know if this is the correct place to ask this but, does anyone here know the former Milan synod bishop Metropolitan John Lobue? Where do his orders come from? Was he received as a bishop in the Milan synod via chierothesia? Many thanks.

Offline searn77

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #54 on: June 18, 2014, 12:40:00 AM »
I don't know if this is the correct place to ask this but, does anyone here know the former Milan synod bishop Metropolitan John Lobue? Where do his orders come from? Was he received as a bishop in the Milan synod via chierothesia? Many thanks.

Yes, he is my Metropolitan. In 1997, Vladyka John and another bishop, Vladyka Hilarion, were received into the Milan synod via chierothesia as per the request of Vladykas John and Hilarion.

You may be able to find some of the information you're looking for on our Metropolia's website at orthodoxmetropolia.org

Also, Deacon Joseph Suaiden wrote a book about the Milan Synod and our Metropolia titled Lux Veritatis: A Short History of the Autonomous Metropolia of Western Europe and the Americas which you can find at http://www.lulu.com/shop/search.ep?contributorId=358441

If you have any more questions, feel free to ask them here or message me.
Let us the faithful now come together to praise our father, protector and teacher the pillar of the Orthodox faith and firm defender of piety even the wondrous hierarch Philaret and let us glorify our Saviour Who has granted us his incorrupt relics as a manifest sign of his sanctity.

Offline Cyrus

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #55 on: June 18, 2014, 01:13:54 AM »
here is an interesting letter to Met. John L. (NY), from his brother Russian bishop...seems there are some doctrinal errors Met. John has been following without probably knowing it.  Here is the link:
http://www.portal-credo.ru/site/?act=news&id=108220




Offline searn77

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #56 on: June 18, 2014, 01:30:36 AM »
here is an interesting letter to Met. John L. (NY), from his brother Russian bishop...seems there are some doctrinal errors Met. John has been following without probably knowing it.  Here is the link:
http://www.portal-credo.ru/site/?act=news&id=108220

The issue of name-worshiping/glorifying within the Russian synod under Met. Raphael is very new. It has only been brought up, to my knowledge, within the past month or so. To be clear, Met. John and Met. Raphael are the heads of two separate Traditional Orthodox synods that have two separate histories, who have only been in communion with each other since 2011. I pray that this situation gets resolved peacefully and that communion won't be broken.
Let us the faithful now come together to praise our father, protector and teacher the pillar of the Orthodox faith and firm defender of piety even the wondrous hierarch Philaret and let us glorify our Saviour Who has granted us his incorrupt relics as a manifest sign of his sanctity.

Offline Cyrus

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #57 on: June 18, 2014, 02:47:29 AM »
here is an interesting letter to Met. John L. (NY), from his brother Russian bishop...seems there are some doctrinal errors Met. John has been following without probably knowing it.  Here is the link:
http://www.portal-credo.ru/site/?act=news&id=108220

The issue of name-worshiping/glorifying within the Russian synod under Met. Raphael is very new. It has only been brought up, to my knowledge, within the past month or so. To be clear, Met. John and Met. Raphael are the heads of two separate Traditional Orthodox synods that have two separate histories, who have only been in communion with each other since 2011. I pray that this situation gets resolved peacefully and that communion won't be broken.

it sounds serious.  apparently this issue is not new, meaning the saints and holy fathers understandings on the subject, but rather is the opposition a fairly new situation, with the misunderstanding of the differences between Name worshippers as defined by st. tikhon patriarch of moscow and Name glorifiers, and the modernday fighters of God.  i too pray for a peaceful resolution, as its clear to many, met. john is heavely influenced by the western scholastics within and without his communion.  most of it is to be acceptable to the synod of kallinikos in greece.   no need to impress them, they hav cut their own path away from the holy fathers
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 02:48:56 AM by Cyrus »

Offline Cyrus

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Re: The Synod of Milan
« Reply #58 on: June 18, 2014, 04:56:36 PM »
After reading through this thread, I have come to the conclusion that Met. John has not been mislead in his ideas concerning the energies of God, as he used to be a Jesuit and his theologians also have similar backgrounds.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 04:57:17 PM by Cyrus »