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Author Topic: Serbia and Kosovo  (Read 1609 times) Average Rating: 0
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Nacho
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« on: February 18, 2005, 12:53:58 AM »

Saw this guy Francisco Gil-White who was a Professor at U. of Pennyslvania on Bill O'Reilly tonight and he claimed the charges against Milosevic and the so called mass killings by Serbia were all fabricated by NATO.

I looked him up and found an article by him called "How to lie (or without) Statistics" about the conflict. I always thought the serbians got shafted also. I'm wondering if these claims are legit or is the professor a kook? Here is a link to the article:
http://emperors-clothes.com/gilwhite/ball.htm

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« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2005, 01:31:11 AM »

The guy is a bit kooky, so let me provide you with an article by the late Daniel Pearl from the Wall Street Journal.

http://www.balkanpeace.org/monitor/mgen27.html

I know that isn't the Journal website.  I'm not sure whree else I could go (besides the library or a subscription to the WSJ website) to get an official link. 
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« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2005, 02:10:01 AM »

The article is reasonable enough, and if people would read newspapers in languages other than English (i.e. Greek, but perhaps also in Russian, Serbian, Romanian, et cetera) they would have got more accurate news concerning Serbia, and have found the posistions in the posted articles to be both laid out and well defended. The tales of mass execution were clearly false, though Serbia would not have been in the wrong if they were true, the 'Ethnic Albanians' represent Turks who moved into the Reigon during the invasions of the Byzantine Empire to conquer and occupy these lands; even today we see that they are militantly opposed to anything Christian (murdering Christians, desecrating Christian graves, and destroying ancient Christian monasteries), Serbia has only fought for her rightful lands and to protect her the reigon's Christian Population. The true war Criminals are the KLA, NATO Leadership, and the NATO Pilots and Flight Crews who did their murdering for them, if anyone needs to be brought to justice it is these people.
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« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2005, 12:02:18 PM »

Well, the truth was out there in the Wall Street Journal.  Members of the mainstream media in the U.S. were questioning the claims.  However, nobody gets a Pulitzer for reporting that it's another civil war and that's it.  As Pearl reported, it was a mad rush to prove the KLA claims and everybody knew it. 

When the mainstream press managers go with a position they stick to it regardless of reality.  Just look at the trouble that hit CBS this year.  That's just human nature.  Don't admit you're wrong.  Those news providers wanted those Pulitzers too.  They all wanted a scoop so badly that they created one. 

I hate to sound too postmodern, but didn't Baudrillard discuss mass media and the problems of when the copies become more real than the original?   We then end up in a huge issue of never knowing what is real and what is simulated.  Even the authors of the simulated believe it is real and preach it like a sort of religion. 
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« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2005, 12:52:28 AM »

Thanks for the input guys. I guess there are more gray areas than I thought, but I'll err on the side of Serbia still from everything I've read up to this point.   
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« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2005, 12:07:03 PM »

I've posted this article on other threads, but it is relevant here as well.  The article originally appeared in Toronto's Globe & Mail.  http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0902-02.htm

Unfortunately, everything I've read recently suggest that it is only a matter of time (by that I mean months), before the "international community" (specifically the EU) accepts and independent Kosova [sic].

I don't now how the EU plans on dealing with the Serbian minority remaining in Kosovo or all of our Churches and Monastaries, but the more I read, the more ridiculous this becomes.

The UNDISPUTED fact remains, there is NO evidence of mass killings in Kosovo.  To me, what is going on in Kosovo is a direct attack on Orthodoxy.

Think about it like this.  Yugoslavia was a communist nation and (officially) atheist.  Now that the communists have been removed, and religion is starting to play a more prominant role in the every day life of Serbs, the West seeks to annex the most significant religious area in Serbia and give it to a nation run by drug runners and Islamic fanatics.  Conveniently, this undermines the spread and strength of Orthodoxy to the Serbs.
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« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2005, 12:10:07 PM »

Saw this guy Francisco Gil-White who was a Professor at U. of Pennyslvania on Bill O'Reilly tonight and he claimed the charges against Milosevic and the so called mass killings by Serbia were all fabricated by NATO.

I know many (here) might disagree, but I try to avoid O'Reilly at all cost.  I think the discussion on his show is about as useful as the discussion on Howard Stern.

In addition, I can't tell you how many times I've heard him rail against "us evil" Serbs.
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« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2005, 12:17:43 PM »



I know many (here) might disagree, but I try to avoid O'Reilly at all cost. I think the discussion on his show is about as useful as the discussion on Howard Stern.

In addition, I can't tell you how many times I've heard him rail against "us evil" Serbs.

I'm with you on all counts, SouthSerb99...and I'm a nominal conservative. And also one who has worn his fingers down typing emails, faxs, and letters to everyone in DC who might actually read my complaints.
Last night for the first time in months, I tuned in Michael Savage for exactly 10 minutes (something I do not recommend). I was so surprised that he was wailing about the treatment of the Christian Serbs by the western powers. Quite surprised. Too bad we can't get some main stream press.

Demetri
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« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2005, 12:25:30 PM »

The other undisputed fact is that the Serbs numbers have dramatically dropped in Kosovo.  Since NATO and the Albanians have kept a lot of Serbs without electricity this winter many have left for Serbia. 

I hate to turn what is happening into something "Muslim" because of the number of Muslim Slavs being forced out by Albanian terrorists.  The Romany and Egyptian population is being forced out to those intollerant Serbs, who welcome them.  It's racism and fascism, which are both flourishing in modern Europe.
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« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2005, 12:50:27 PM »

Demetri,

      I think one of the hopes for "us" Serbs is the current Governor of Illinois, Rod Blagojevich.  I talked with him in November 2004 and I was pleasantly surprised by his feelings and opinions about Serbia.  Of course, this could have been bluster, since it was at Serbian sponsored event, but he might be the "mainstream" support Serbs need.

      On the same trip, I also had an opportunity to meet with two very influential Greek leaders advocating on behalf of Serbs.  Again, a great help.

Cizinec,

      You are spot on.  One of the attorneys I am currently working with at the ICJ, personally delivered power generators to two Serbian villages in Kosovo, to provide electricity to two schools.  He was driven through in an Italian tank, under heavy KFOR protection.

      Needless to say, the Albanians have cut all electricity to many villages.  I anticipate seeing first hand the disaster, that is Kosovo, in September.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2005, 12:51:59 PM by SouthSerb99 » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2005, 02:55:38 PM »

Quote
I'm with you on all counts, SouthSerb99...and I'm a nominal conservative. And also one who has worn his fingers down typing emails, faxs, and letters to everyone in DC who might actually read my complaints.
Last night for the first time in months, I tuned in Michael Savage for exactly 10 minutes (something I do not recommend). I was so surprised that he was wailing about the treatment of the Christian Serbs by the western powers. Quite surprised. Too bad we can't get some main stream press.


Lol, Savage is such a character. This is where I found out about the conspiracy against serbia by NATO. I have heard him rail against NATO on many occasions for the invasion into serbia. He laid out the facts of what really happened and the white wash that took place by our media. He was the only person I could think of that took that position.
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« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2005, 02:36:11 AM »

I've heard that the Italian, Czech and Slovak KFOR troops are well respected and liked by the local Serbs. 
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« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2005, 09:19:05 AM »

I've heard that the Italian, Czech and Slovak KFOR troops are well respected and liked by the local Serbs. 

After talking to some colleagues that have been there recently, I get the feeling that our people have good feelings towards anyone who will "protect" them in any way.

I mean, after what happened in March 04, with the KFOR troops standing by and watching while Serbian Churches and homes were destroyed, it is quite amazing our people still have the courage to remain.

Like I said earlier, unfortunately my feelings about the future of Kosovo is not optimistic.  Anyone who doesn't think this is an attack on Orthodoxy is really kidding themselves.
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