Author Topic: The mass of Paul VI  (Read 8885 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,041
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair
The mass of Paul VI
« on: October 14, 2013, 01:47:25 PM »
I was wondering, since there is so much variation, in how roman catholics celebrate their liturgies, I have actually never figured out what the "correct" way to celebrate the mass of Paul VI is.

I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

I would also appreciate if you could maybe give some examples of what you would consider a "proper" mass.
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline Romaios

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,933
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2013, 02:01:31 PM »
I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

Lay people distributing communion alongside with the priest?!



Offline Cyrillic

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,428
  • Cyrillico est imperare orbi universo
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2013, 02:04:15 PM »
Pews?!
"My idea of an agreeable person is a person who agrees with me"
-Benjamin Disraeli

Offline Alpo

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,258
  • My borcht recipe is better than your borcht recipe
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2013, 02:25:08 PM »
Silly Franks. Just replace Novus Ordo with dialogue version of Tridentine mass in vernacular.

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,640
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2013, 02:30:48 PM »
Silly Franks. Just replace Novus Ordo with dialogue version of Tridentine mass in vernacular.
That's what I'm saying.
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline Regnare

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 433
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2013, 02:37:50 PM »
I'm a bit confused about why the title of the video includes the words "Latinsk messe" when, as you say, it's not a Tridentine Mass.

Unfortunately, there isn't really consent about what the correct way to celebrate the Novus Ordo is, but if we were to go by the recommendations of the council which advised the revision (recommending the preservation of Latin and Gregorian chant, while only suggesting a simplification and use of the vernacular), then the answer would probably be "as much like the Tridentine as the rubrics will possibly allow," in other words, the Mass should be celebrated the way it has always been.

(The use of lay or "Extraordinary" ministers of Holy Communion is intended to be a provision for parishes large enough that only having one person distributing communion would lengthen the Mass to a ridiculous extent. However, it is widely taken as a means of getting through the distribution of communion as quickly as possible.)

We used to do basically a Tridentine dialogue Mass in the vernacular; it was a temporary revision of the Mass in 1967 after Vatican II. But apparently that wasn't good enough for some bishops, and Pope Paul VI spent the last years of his papacy trying to fix the mess he'd helped make.

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,041
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2013, 02:42:22 PM »
Quote
I'm a bit confused about why the title of the video includes the words "Latinsk messe" when, as you say, it's not a Tridentine Mass.

If I understand it correctly, it simply means that it is a latin rite mass.
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline Alpo

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,258
  • My borcht recipe is better than your borcht recipe
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2013, 02:45:20 PM »
In what way pope Paul VI tried clear the mess?

Offline Regnare

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 433
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2013, 02:59:08 PM »
I believe his action mostly involved trying to revive the use of traditional chant during the Mass.

Offline Shanghaiski

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,978
  • Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2013, 06:31:29 PM »
Silly Franks. Just replace Novus Ordo with dialogue version of Tridentine mass in vernacular.
That's what I'm saying.

I've always wondered why this was never done.

This may be apocryphal, but supposedly Fr. Alexander Schmemann, when asked his thoughts after observing Vatican II, said, "I'm glad I'm Orthodox."
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Nephi

  • Monster Tamer
  • Section Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,762
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2013, 07:29:46 PM »
I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

Lay people distributing communion alongside with the priest?!

Common practice at the RC masses I've been to. Good ol' "extraordinary minister of Holy Communion."

Seeing middle-aged women wearing t-shirts and jeans handing out communion was just strange for me. Frankly it still is, whenever I end up at a RC Mass.

Online Mor Ephrem

  • The Fourteenth Apostle and Judge of the Interwebs
  • Section Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,963
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2013, 07:31:42 PM »
Seeing middle-aged women wearing t-shirts and jeans handing out communion was just strange for me. Frankly it still is, whenever I end up at a RC Mass.

That's why I make sure to end up at the right type of RC Mass or none at all.  ;)
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

Online Mor Ephrem

  • The Fourteenth Apostle and Judge of the Interwebs
  • Section Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,963
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2013, 10:28:44 PM »
I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

I don't know what the RC's here think, but this was hands down one of the nicest "Novus Ordo" Masses I've seen.  I haven't seen any "new" Mass done this well in person, even when it was all in Latin and with music, incense, and other rites, broadcasts from the Vatican being the exception. 
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

Offline Nephi

  • Monster Tamer
  • Section Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,762
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2013, 10:38:54 PM »
I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

I don't know what the RC's here think, but this was hands down one of the nicest "Novus Ordo" Masses I've seen.  I haven't seen any "new" Mass done this well in person, even when it was all in Latin and with music, incense, and other rites, broadcasts from the Vatican being the exception. 

I think this is another nicely done Novus Ordo/OF Mass. Ad Orientem, even.

Offline Deacon Lance

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,131
  • Faith: Byzantine Catholic
  • Jurisdiction: Archeparchy of Pittsburgh
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2013, 11:10:19 PM »
I was wondering, since there is so much variation, in how roman catholics celebrate their liturgies, I have actually never figured out what the "correct" way to celebrate the mass of Paul VI is.

I sometimes like watching videos of catholic masses and I would like to know what the traditional catholics(or just catholics in general) would think of this mass:
http://katolsk.mediaplatform.dk/video/watch/1853/63

It is not exactly a Tridentine Mass, but I honestly didn't think it was especially bad.

I would also appreciate if you could maybe give some examples of what you would consider a "proper" mass.

The General Instruction of the Roman Missal

http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/the-mass/general-instruction-of-the-roman-missal/

If you get EWTN they do it right.
My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.

Offline Apotheoun

  • "Three realities pertain to God: essence, energy, and the triad of divine hypostaseis." St. Gregory Palamas
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,421
  • St. John Maximovitch
    • The Taboric Light
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2013, 01:34:47 AM »
Silly Franks. Just replace Novus Ordo with dialogue version of Tridentine mass in vernacular.
That's what I'm saying.
Sadly no one in the Roman Church is listening to you.

The Mass in the first post is better than many of the Masses in the SF East Bay area. I have actually been to Lutheran services that are very similar.
"All that the Father has belongs likewise to the Son, except Causality."
St. Gregory Nazianzen

"We should believe that divine grace is present in the icon of Christ and that it communicates sanctification to those who draw near with faith."
St. Theodore Studite

Offline Charles Martel

  • Traditional Roman Catholic
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 3,739
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2013, 05:18:27 AM »
It's an abomination.  >:(
Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio, contra nequitiam et insidias diaboli esto praesidium.

Offline monkvasyl

  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 653
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2013, 10:18:34 AM »
If the priest would follow the rubrics in the Roman missal the "Mass of Paul VI" can be done reverently and beautifully, but most priest chose the shortest forms and also did whatever they thought looked cute.
The unworthy hierodeacon, Vasyl

Offline Regnare

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 433
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2013, 10:23:35 AM »
Here's a Novus Ordo Mass celebrated like it should be.

http://www.canons-regular.org/go/apostolates/ordinary-form-tutorials/

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2013, 06:58:48 PM »
My husband and I will be attending Mass here (http://www.stmichaelsabbey.com/abbey/) this Sunday. I suspect it won't be much like that video.  8)
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Online Mor Ephrem

  • The Fourteenth Apostle and Judge of the Interwebs
  • Section Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,963
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2013, 11:32:53 AM »
You never know...I've only heard good things about Norbertines, though I've never seen one in real life.  :)
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2013, 11:41:26 AM »
It was really wonderful! It was the so-called "New Mass" but almost ALL in Latin using the Gregorian Chant. Will write more later - gotta go out to breakfast!  ;D
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline Alpo

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,258
  • My borcht recipe is better than your borcht recipe
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2013, 01:04:40 PM »
Are all Danish RC masses like that? I'm fairly suprised how traditional that is. Finnish RC masses are a bit more of a low church.

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,640
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2013, 01:16:59 PM »
Here's a Novus Ordo Mass celebrated like it should be.

http://www.canons-regular.org/go/apostolates/ordinary-form-tutorials/
Yes, this looks about how it should be done.
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,640
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2013, 01:18:15 PM »
It was really wonderful! It was the so-called "New Mass" but almost ALL in Latin using the Gregorian Chant. Will write more later - gotta go out to breakfast!  ;D
Interesting. The Norbertines in New Mexico are etremely low church liberals. Their church is ugly and their liturgy is uglier.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2013, 01:18:29 PM by Papist »
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline Cyrillic

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,428
  • Cyrillico est imperare orbi universo
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #25 on: October 21, 2013, 01:27:01 PM »
Here's a Novus Ordo Mass celebrated like it should be.

http://www.canons-regular.org/go/apostolates/ordinary-form-tutorials/
Yes, this looks about how it should be done.

Didn't Pope Pius X ban baroque music in Mass?
"My idea of an agreeable person is a person who agrees with me"
-Benjamin Disraeli

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,640
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #26 on: October 21, 2013, 03:10:52 PM »
Here's a Novus Ordo Mass celebrated like it should be.

http://www.canons-regular.org/go/apostolates/ordinary-form-tutorials/
Yes, this looks about how it should be done.

Didn't Pope Pius X ban baroque music in Mass?
wouldn't baroque music be a great improvement over what Roman churches have now?  :D That being said, the ban may not be applicable to the new rite of the mass.
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline Cyrillic

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,428
  • Cyrillico est imperare orbi universo
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #27 on: October 21, 2013, 04:10:13 PM »
wouldn't baroque music be a great improvement over what Roman churches have now?  :D

True that  :)

That being said, the ban may not be applicable to the new rite of the mass.

I suppose that's indeed the case. Pity, though. Nothing beats Gregorian chant.
"My idea of an agreeable person is a person who agrees with me"
-Benjamin Disraeli

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #28 on: October 21, 2013, 09:11:49 PM »
It was really wonderful! It was the so-called "New Mass" but almost ALL in Latin using the Gregorian Chant. Will write more later - gotta go out to breakfast!  ;D
Interesting. The Norbertines in New Mexico are etremely low church liberals. Their church is ugly and their liturgy is uglier.

Perhaps the ones in New Mexico are not the best representatives of their tradition. The ones in El Toro, CA certainly are. And their liturgy is anything BUT ugly.
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline Ionnis

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,074
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #29 on: October 21, 2013, 09:15:32 PM »
It was really wonderful! It was the so-called "New Mass" but almost ALL in Latin using the Gregorian Chant. Will write more later - gotta go out to breakfast!  ;D
Interesting. The Norbertines in New Mexico are etremely low church liberals. Their church is ugly and their liturgy is uglier.

Perhaps the ones in New Mexico are not the best representatives of their tradition. The ones in El Toro, CA certainly are. And their liturgy is anything BUT ugly.

I agree.  St. Michael's Abbey in Silverton, CA has an exceptional Liturgy and they are very, very orthodox in the Roman Catholic sense. 
"If you cannot find Christ in the beggar at the church door, you will not find Him in the chalice.”  -The Divine John Chrysostom

“Till we can become divine, we must be content to be human, lest in our hurry for change we sink to something lower.” -Anthony Trollope

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,640
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #30 on: October 21, 2013, 09:30:49 PM »
It was really wonderful! It was the so-called "New Mass" but almost ALL in Latin using the Gregorian Chant. Will write more later - gotta go out to breakfast!  ;D
Interesting. The Norbertines in New Mexico are etremely low church liberals. Their church is ugly and their liturgy is uglier.

Perhaps the ones in New Mexico are not the best representatives of their tradition. The ones in El Toro, CA certainly are. And their liturgy is anything BUT ugly.
Well this is good news. Glad to hear it.
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline username!

  • Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • *****
  • Posts: 5,081
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2013, 08:41:00 PM »
A Benedictine priest says 1962 roman missal every sunday at 11am Twice a month it is sung by a great Schola. AItsits
This is 30min away from me.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 08:42:30 PM by username! »

Offline brastaseptim

  • Protopsáltis
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 952
  • From BBC Louisiana to you, here's the morning news
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2013, 08:50:20 PM »
For me, it has to be:
1. No Praise and Worship music, semi-traditional hymns or Chant with organ or accapella only
2. Ministers must be properly vested
3. Priest must not speed through, and not spend 10 minutes after the sign of the cross talking about his day.
4. Priest must be orthodox in teaching when giving the homily
5. Must not have priest's chair in the middle unless it's a Cathedral, and must have a crucifix on the altar
6. Anything but this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
BBC news certified; The Guardian rejected; OC.net approved.

Offline Santagranddad

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,198
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2013, 09:21:42 PM »
For me, it has to be:
1. No Praise and Worship music, semi-traditional hymns or Chant with organ or accapella only
2. Ministers must be properly vested
3. Priest must not speed through, and not spend 10 minutes after the sign of the cross talking about his day.
4. Priest must be orthodox in teaching when giving the homily
5. Must not have priest's chair in the middle unless it's a Cathedral, and must have a crucifix on the altar
6. Anything but this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU

What is the dickens was the YouTube extract supposed to be. And are people supposed to be 'entertained', or worship or what at this dog's dinner? I had previously seen a RC Mass from California with dancing, bowls of incense carried aloft and wondered whether liturgical reform was a polite term for something unrepeatable.

Offline brastaseptim

  • Protopsáltis
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 952
  • From BBC Louisiana to you, here's the morning news
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2013, 09:24:45 PM »
For me, it has to be:
1. No Praise and Worship music, semi-traditional hymns or Chant with organ or accapella only
2. Ministers must be properly vested
3. Priest must not speed through, and not spend 10 minutes after the sign of the cross talking about his day.
4. Priest must be orthodox in teaching when giving the homily
5. Must not have priest's chair in the middle unless it's a Cathedral, and must have a crucifix on the altar
6. Anything but this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU

What is the dickens was the YouTube extract supposed to be. And are people supposed to be 'entertained', or worship or what at this dog's dinner? I had previously seen a RC Mass from California with dancing, bowls of incense carried aloft and wondered whether liturgical reform was a polite term for something unrepeatable.

That YouTube extract was supposed to be some form of Messa Disastrica, I believe. And I spell it "Messa" on purpose. I assume it's some form of pagan Kool-Aid ritual that will end up with the participants dead from either the dancers or their guts being destroyed from the sheer absurdity of this... thing.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 09:28:18 PM by brastaseptim »
BBC news certified; The Guardian rejected; OC.net approved.

Offline Nephi

  • Monster Tamer
  • Section Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,762
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2013, 10:30:29 PM »

Offline William

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,354
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2013, 10:39:55 PM »
How does one find an orthodox Catholic Church?

The most traditional parish in my city has a picture on its front page of a woman holding a communion host.
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2013, 11:04:31 PM »
How does one find an orthodox Catholic Church?

The most traditional parish in my city has a picture on its front page of a woman holding a communion host.

What city are you in?
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline William

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,354
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2013, 11:09:20 PM »
How does one find an orthodox Catholic Church?

The most traditional parish in my city has a picture on its front page of a woman holding a communion host.

What city are you in?

Louisville, Kentucky.
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline brastaseptim

  • Protopsáltis
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 952
  • From BBC Louisiana to you, here's the morning news
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2013, 11:09:41 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU

Isn't this from a vagante group at least?
And that makes it okay? The most Broad Church Anglicans would be ashamed to try this, and considering the past 40 years, that's saying something.
BBC news certified; The Guardian rejected; OC.net approved.

Offline newtoorthodoxy

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 487
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2013, 11:13:35 PM »
I actually stumbled at the title of the thread.  It seems to suggest that Paul VI was really really fat.  

mass, not capitalized =

mass  (ms)
n.
1. A unified body of matter with no specific shape: a mass of clay.
2. A grouping of individual parts or elements that compose a unified body of unspecified size or quantity: "Take mankind in mass, and for the most part, they seem a mob of unnecessary duplicates" (Herman Melville).
3. A large but nonspecific amount or number: a mass of bruises.
4. A lump or aggregate of coherent material: a cancerous mass.
5. The principal part; the majority: the mass of the continent.
6. The physical volume or bulk of a solid body.
7. Abbr. m Physics A property of matter equal to the measure of an object's resistance to changes in either the speed or direction of its motion. The mass of an object is not dependent on gravity and therefore is different from but proportional to its weight.
8. An area of unified light, shade, or color in a painting.
9. Pharmacology A thick, pasty mixture containing drugs from which pills are formed.
10. masses The body of common people or people of low socioeconomic status: "Give me your tired, your poor,/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free" (Emma Lazarus).
tr. & intr.v. massed, mass·ing, mass·es
To gather or be gathered into a mass.
adj.
1. Of, relating to, characteristic of, directed at, or attended by a large number of people: mass education; mass communication.
2. Done or carried out on a large scale: mass production.
3. Total; complete: The mass result is impressive.

Mass, capitalized =

Mass  (ms)
n.
1.
a. Public celebration of the Eucharist in the Roman Catholic Church and some Protestant churches.
b. The sacrament of the Eucharist.
2. A musical setting of certain parts of the Mass, especially the Kyrie, Gloria, Credo, Sanctus, and Agnus Dei.

Catholics don't hold mass.  They hold Mass.

Of course, maybe I'm wrong and the guy really was incredibly fat.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 11:15:37 PM by newtoorthodoxy »
Some of my questions might appear patently stupid to those well-versed in Orthodoxy, but I'm brand new, having no background in the faith.  Please grant me a great deal of patience and consideration as I learn the basics.

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #41 on: November 04, 2013, 01:00:06 AM »
I actually stumbled at the title of the thread.  It seems to suggest that Paul VI was really really fat.  

I think this thread has reached "critical liturgy".  ;D
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Online Mor Ephrem

  • The Fourteenth Apostle and Judge of the Interwebs
  • Section Moderator
  • Stratopedarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,963
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #42 on: November 04, 2013, 01:07:48 AM »
No one surpasses the Orthodox when it comes to "critical liturgy". 
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

Offline brastaseptim

  • Protopsáltis
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 952
  • From BBC Louisiana to you, here's the morning news
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #43 on: November 04, 2013, 01:11:25 AM »
No one surpasses the Orthodox when it comes to "critical liturgy". 

I'd like to say otherwise, but sadly, I've found no one who "critical liturgies" like Gaston- I mean, the Orthodox.
BBC news certified; The Guardian rejected; OC.net approved.

Online Agabus

  • The user formerly known as Agabus.
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,552
Re: The mass of Paul VI
« Reply #44 on: November 04, 2013, 01:27:04 AM »
No one surpasses the Orthodox when it comes to "critical liturgy".  

I'd like to say otherwise, but sadly, I've found no one who "critical liturgies" like Gaston- I mean, the Orthodox.
We are really quite good at expectorating at the Devil.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 01:28:06 AM by Agabus »
Blessed Nazarius practiced the ascetic life. His clothes were tattered. He wore his shoes without removing them for six years.

THE OPINIONS HERE MAY NOT REFLECT THE ACTUAL OR PERCEIVED ORTHODOX CHURCH