Poll

Is poverty a virtue?

Yes
4 (36.4%)
No
6 (54.5%)
I don't know.
1 (9.1%)

Total Members Voted: 11

Author Topic: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)  (Read 1912 times)

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Offline Gunnarr

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Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« on: September 20, 2013, 02:21:26 AM »
Discuss if you like.
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Offline Asteriktos

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2013, 02:32:59 AM »
I would say... being poor and yet able to be content and go about your life in a healthy manner is a good thing. Simplicity of life, non-acquisitiveness, etc. are also good things. In these cases poverty might be a situation in which many people flourish. I don't think it's a virtue, though, in the same way that humility or courage are. Poverty is more like one possible tool for cultivating virtue, but not exactly a virtue itself. The same thing goes for wealth: it can be used a tool, but is not itself a virtue, and does not provide evidence that you are virtuous. Both can lead astray as well: poverty to bitterness or anger or envy, wealth to greed or stinginess.

Offline Arachne

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2013, 02:33:30 AM »
Poverty is a financial situation. How you handle it can be a virtue, or not. ::)

(Yeah, not much here. Me talk pretty one day.)
« Last Edit: September 20, 2013, 02:34:55 AM by Arachne »
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Offline Gunnarr

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2013, 03:08:48 AM »
Thank you for your responses!

as to my opinion, I am still thinking about it

perhaps I should reread a few holy fathers and see their opinion "On Wealth and Poverty" its been a few years

maybe I can type out blocks of text from it to give some more commentary
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Offline ironchapman

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2013, 04:02:40 AM »
Poverty is not a virtue, neither is wealth.

This is a good post on the subject. http://palamas.info/greed-is-wrong-but-what-about-wealth-itself/
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Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2013, 04:10:04 AM »
Poverty is never dishonourable in itself, but only when it is a mark of sloth, intemperance, extravagance, or thoughtlessness. When, on the other hand, it is the handmaid of a sober, industrious, righteous, and brave man, who devotes all his powers to the service of the people, it is the sign of a lofty spirit that harbours no mean thoughts.

Offline Gunnarr

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2013, 04:17:05 AM »
Poverty is never dishonourable in itself, but only when it is a mark of sloth, intemperance, extravagance, or thoughtlessness. When, on the other hand, it is the handmaid of a sober, industrious, righteous, and brave man, who devotes all his powers to the service of the people, it is the sign of a lofty spirit that harbours no mean thoughts.

hmm

maybe I don't even need to read any more holy fathers, we might have one here  ;)  ;D

all this talk reminds me of dobry dobrev
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Offline TheTrisagion

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2013, 08:46:41 AM »
Amid the inanity of oc.net, there come on occasion very good and insightful posts. This thread has several.  Well done all.
God bless!

Offline JamesR

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2013, 02:56:03 PM »
Depends

Does the person in question choose poverty? If so, then I suppose it is, by Christian morality.

Is a person living in poverty for circumstances outside of their control? No. It is only a virtue if they practice contentment and virtue. Many people living in poverty are--believe it or not--not so nice. We have this habit of "balancing" the world in our mind, for example, saying that the impoverished are virtuous and the wealthy are vile and wicked, but that is not always the case in reality.

Personally, this whole thing don't make sense to me when you really look at it.

Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2013, 03:08:57 PM »
I'm with James. It's all based on whether you choose poverty or whether you haven't.

It also depends on what "choosing" poverty means, is it because you are lazy (like Cyrillic said) or whether you want free govt. benefits, or whether you choose it as a way of life for yourself like Christians do. Or maybe you choose it by gambling and buying drugs, like I have personally experienced.

If you haven't chosen poverty, it depends on how the person reacts to their impoverished state. Are they trying to horde and steal as much as they can to get wealthy? Or do they accept the position they are in and move on from it.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2013, 03:10:05 PM by xOrthodox4Christx »
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Offline J Michael

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2013, 04:39:14 PM »
Poverty is a financial situation. How you handle it can be a virtue, or not. ::)



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Offline podkarpatska

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2013, 11:29:10 AM »
I'm with James. It's all based on whether you choose poverty or whether you haven't.

It also depends on what "choosing" poverty means, is it because you are lazy (like Cyrillic said) or whether you want free govt. benefits, or whether you choose it as a way of life for yourself like Christians do. Or maybe you choose it by gambling and buying drugs, like I have personally experienced.

If you haven't chosen poverty, it depends on how the person reacts to their impoverished state. Are they trying to horde and steal as much as they can to get wealthy? Or do they accept the position they are in and move on from it.

Some people are poor, they neither choose that state (for "government benefits" - I suppose some thank God they are not that THAT person in their prayers), nor can they in ACTUALITY (as opposed to in theory) avoid their impoverished state. Neither by itself is virtuous or sinful. It depends.

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2013, 11:53:46 AM »
This is pretty disgusting thread. Really, does anyone around here have a heart anymore?

Poverty is sin. Those who aren't and who are Christians and allow those to remain in poverty are sinners.

Jesus says these are the people who are going to hell. It is one the more clear teachings of Gospel.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2013, 11:54:05 AM by orthonorm »

Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2013, 12:06:18 PM »
Poverty is very much relative. Unless everyone has exactly as much money as the rest there'll always be those who are considered poor.

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2013, 12:07:39 PM »
Poverty is very much relative. Unless everyone has exactly as much money as the rest there'll always be those who are considered poor.

And thus people will always be going to hell. That's the point.

Offline augustin717

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2013, 12:14:21 PM »
hell will be, I'm sure, like a huge white suburb/gated community perhaps. like winnetka, say.
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Offline podkarpatska

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2013, 12:17:28 PM »
This is pretty disgusting thread. Really, does anyone around here have a heart anymore?

Poverty is sin. Those who aren't and who are Christians and allow those to remain in poverty are sinners.

Jesus says these are the people who are going to hell. It is one the more clear teachings of Gospel.

I agree as my point was not clear. Status doesn't determine salvation, it is how we live the Gospel which does.

Offline augustin717

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2013, 12:19:43 PM »
but living the gospel is inextricably linked to one's status. that.s why the young rich man was told to give away all he had etc
"I saw a miracle where 2 people entered church one by baptism and one by chrismation. On pictures the one received by full baptism was shinning in light the one by chrismation no."

Offline Rufus

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2013, 01:10:36 PM »
Anytime you want, you could take a walk downtown and actually get to know the people you are talking about.

Most middle-class people are willing to perform idiotically trivial acts in the "service" of the "less fortunate," but will quickly become hysterical if pushed beyond that.

I've met a handful of people who were willing to do more.

Then again, one of those people ended up lying on the ground getting throttled by a homeless man, but hey, it comes with the territory.

Offline Rufus

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2013, 01:28:38 PM »
but living the gospel is inextricably linked to one's status. that.s why the young rich man was told to give away all he had etc

Even if other people can't take it, I always enjoy reading your remarx.

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Offline Shiny

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Re: Is Poverty a Virtue? (This forum needs moar polls)
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2013, 06:29:10 AM »
but living the gospel is inextricably linked to one's status. that.s why the young rich man was told to give away all he had etc

Even if other people can't take it, I always enjoy reading your remarx.

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