Western Rite Orthodox...

[Keble]

There are those parishes of the western rite which will have a choir screen/Rood screen. This is the western version of what developed as the iconostasis in the east.

No, it isn't. The closest analogue to the iconostasis in the West is the altar rail, and the latter is somewhat later in its origin. The purpose of the rood screen was primarily to close off the choir for office services. The vague physical similarity is deceiving.

[Michael]

Really?

Hmmm.  This seems out of accordance with things that I have come across in the past, but it makes some sense.

I shall try to look a bit further into this.

[yBeayf]

This is a good article on the history of rood-screens and how they were used.

[Michael]

Ooooooo.

Thank you for that, Beayf.

This certainly is different from what I have been accustomed to, and very informative as well.  It appears that I ought to humbly bow and acknowledge my inaccurate statement earlier in the thread.  I ought to have known that the Roman Liturgy website was the place too look.

[alexp4uni]

Why is the Russian styled Churches that have no Byzantine style but influence not contain a Christ Pantocrator on top of their cielings?

[Sabbas]

Why is the Russian styled Churches that have no Byzantine style but influence not contain a Christ Pantocrator on top of their cielings?

I am not sure what you mean? I think most Russian churches have the Icon of the Pantocrator underneath the center onion dome.

Has anyone here been to a Western Rite parish that uses only Latin in the Mass? Do you know if the have 'Byzantine' portions of the liturgy online so I can see what they are in Latin?
I recently found the set of Trisagion prayers in Latin online.
http://members.lycos.co.uk/ivanmoody/liturgicaltexts.lat.trisagion.htm

[beewolf]

Cool!

Being a former Epsicopalian myself, I always did prefer Rite 1 to Rite 2 (which IMHO I hope no one makes an Orthodox Liturgy out of. ‰ts too flowers and bunnies for my taste ). ‰n such western parishes, do they have an Iconostas, or simply a communion rail and perhaps a rood screen, like in old Anglican and Episcopal Cathedrals, or hold on to the Iconostas of their traditional bretheren? „o they have a procession towards the alter? ‰s the choir in the balcony, or on the side of the alter? Do they use Traditional Orthodox Vestments or those of the Anglo-Catholic tradition? Šust curious.

Ian Lazarus ºgrommit:

"Raised by a cup of coffee :coffee:"

There is a Western Rite Monastery in Tasmania, you could check for info or email any questions, they have answered a few of mine:

try  http://www.rocor.org.au/

[Mexican]

I don't see many differences between a traditional Anglican Mass and this Western Orthodox Mass?

Given the fact that the Rite of St. Gregory is a reverent translation of the Roman Mass, it must have been similar to Thomas Cranmer's first translation of the liturgy which was faithful to the Roman Missal (then it was replaced an ambiguous service that contained some changes and the protestantization came gradualy).

I find this rite similar to the 1965 missal:
http://www.coreyzelinski.8m.com/1965_Mass/

(as it contains Pius XII's reforms and the whole service is translated to English).

The fact that these rites have been linked somehow to Anglicanism deeply disturbs me.

[Michael]

Thomas Cranmer's First Pray Book of 1549 was not a translation, nor was it taken from the Roman Missal.

The first Prayer Book was a simplification of the Mass in the Sarum Missal, many of the prayers and rubrics having been omited, and many of the prayers having been penned by Cranmer himself.  The Sarum Missal was the version of the Western Liturgy predominantly in use in Britain immediately prior to the unpleasantness of the 16th century.  Previously, there had been others, such as the York Missal, Hereford, Bangor &c.  There had never been one single western rite, but there were local variants of it, until the Council of Trent of the late 16th cent., which formulated and imposed on the RC Church the Tridentine Mass, which, I believe, is where the Antiochian Liturgy of S. Gregory the Great comes from.  ROCOR uses Sarum.  More here.

Having said that, your point stands as to why there are similarties.

[Mexican]

Oh yes thanks for the correction, it was the Salisbury Misal or Sarum Rite, considered to be a rescension of the Latin Rite which had already been romanized at that time.

The problem with the restoration of "pre-schism" liturgical traditions is that it can lead to liturgical anthropologism and speculation as the French Orthodox did with the Galican Rite or the Milan-Synod does with several "restored" rites that they now offer.

It's no coincidence that British Traditional Catholics have fought for the restoration of the Tridentine Rite and as far as I know, they celebrate the Sarum Rite only in very special ocasions, but they do not want to restore it.

The Antiochian Vicariate has also avoided this speculation by approving living rites of the west.

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