Poll

Star-Spangled Virgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?

(RC opinion only): Blessed
0 (0%)
(RC opinion only): Blasphemous
4 (10.8%)
(RC opinion only): Meh
2 (5.4%)
(EO opinion only): Blessed
1 (2.7%)
(EO opinion only): Blasphemous
22 (59.5%)
(EO opinion only): Meh
8 (21.6%)

Total Members Voted: 37

Author Topic: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?  (Read 4416 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Mor Ephrem

  • ʿalayhi al-salām
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 29,197
  • Abp Yeznik Petrosian Defender of the Faith
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #45 on: July 06, 2013, 10:57:38 AM »
The OO Arameans and Assyrians also mix their religious and national symbols.

Though I've seen this in Youtube videos, I've never actually seen it in a church.  Maybe the parishioners just didn't care about patriotism?  :P
Quote from: Fr Alexander Schmemann
The Gospel is quite clear: both saints and sinners love God. "Religious" people do not love him, and whenever they can, they crucify him.

Of course, OC.net is not reflective of the Church, but is rather a surreal bubble. I have visited a lot of different parishes around the world and have listened to many hours of AFR...

Offline Romaios

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,933
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #46 on: July 06, 2013, 11:26:17 AM »
The OO Arameans and Assyrians also mix their religious and national symbols.

Though I've seen this in Youtube videos, I've never actually seen it in a church.  Maybe the parishioners just didn't care about patriotism?  :P

Sorry if that wasn't accurate - I based my affirmation on youtube videos, since I haven't had the chance of seeing an OO church in real life (so far).

Online Mor Ephrem

  • ʿalayhi al-salām
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 29,197
  • Abp Yeznik Petrosian Defender of the Faith
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: East
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #47 on: July 06, 2013, 01:25:08 PM »
You don't know what you're missing.  ;)
Quote from: Fr Alexander Schmemann
The Gospel is quite clear: both saints and sinners love God. "Religious" people do not love him, and whenever they can, they crucify him.

Of course, OC.net is not reflective of the Church, but is rather a surreal bubble. I have visited a lot of different parishes around the world and have listened to many hours of AFR...

Offline LBK

  • No Reporting Allowed
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,279
  • Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!
  • Faith: Orthodox
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #48 on: July 06, 2013, 09:39:47 PM »
I used to be scandalized by the tricolor bookmark ribbons in most Romanian liturgical books. And the Greek flags hanging around Greek churches, even on Mount Athos. Then I saw that the Ethiopians sometimes have their tricolor around icons/liturgical items. The OO Arameans and Assyrians also mix their religious and national symbols. The Byzantine double-headed eagle is on the rug all our bishops stand on (the orlets/aetos). In the litanies we pray for "our pious nation" (to eusebes hemon genos), the political leaders (monarch, president, mayors, etc.), the army; at the Great Entrance the "heroes who died for our freedom and the faith of our ancestors" are commemorated. Surely, the line between a legitimate liturgical patriotism and ethnophyletism is easy to cross, but there must be one somewhere.    

I think the key is in the word "pious". We pray for pious kings, our pious nation, etc. What is appropriate in Church is the Christianization of our nation, not the nationalism-isation of our Christianity.

Precisely. There is no problem with bookmarks in the national colors, nor in praying liturgically and privately for the nation and its rulers. They are simply decorations and embellishments.

What is offensive about the tricolor forming the yarn on the Mother of God's spindle is that a national symbol is used in place of a motif which represents the Incarnation, God's taking of flesh and blood from the Virgin to become Man. In effect, the blood of Christ, derived from His Mother, becomes the national flag.

Is this travesty so difficult for some here to comprehend?
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

Offline Justin Kolodziej

  • Stuck in the surreal dirty bubble of OC.NET!
  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 427
  • Zealous Zealot of Zealotry
  • Faith: ortho-wannabe
  • Jurisdiction: goaa i guess
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #49 on: July 10, 2013, 03:50:22 PM »
"bleck" may be the word I'm looking for here.  :'(

Offline Gebre Menfes Kidus

  • "SERVANT of The HOLY SPIRIT"
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,701
  • Trolling Babylon 24/7, without apology!
    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=1456515775
  • Faith: Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #50 on: July 10, 2013, 03:58:45 PM »
These images would be funny if they weren't so sad. Horrible.


Selam
"God is a consuming fire. And His fire is love."
+ Gebre Menfes Kidus +

Offline Scotty

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 86
Re: Star-Spangled Virrgin: Blessed, Blasphemous, or Meh?
« Reply #51 on: July 15, 2013, 01:13:14 PM »
I don't think the Church in the U.S. has ever given much thought to Rome's condemnations of Americanism in the late 1800s.