Author Topic: Patriarch Ilia II calls for ban on "gay rights march" "Gay-Rights Rally"  (Read 9637 times)

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Online TheTrisagion

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This thread reminds now of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest'. But infinitely less amusing.
we get it your victorian sensibiities have been gravely offended. someone fetch the salts.

That comment doesn't make any sense.  Do you know what One Flew OVer the Cuckoo's Nest is about?  I'll give you a hint. Its not about "victorian sensibilities".
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Offline augustin717

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This thread reminds now of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest'. But infinitely less amusing.
we get it your victorian sensibiities have been gravely offended. someone fetch the salts.

That comment doesn't make any sense.  Do you know what One Flew OVer the Cuckoo's Nest is about?  I'll give you a hint. Its not about "victorian sensibilities".
the fact the both of you are particularly shocked that some people aren't shocked by what you call "public semi-nudity".

Online TheTrisagion

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This thread reminds now of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest'. But infinitely less amusing.
we get it your victorian sensibiities have been gravely offended. someone fetch the salts.

That comment doesn't make any sense.  Do you know what One Flew OVer the Cuckoo's Nest is about?  I'll give you a hint. Its not about "victorian sensibilities".
the fact the both of you are particularly shocked that some people aren't shocked by what you call "public semi-nudity".

I'm not shocked by it at all. Just because I don't prefer to see public semi or full nudity does not mean I'm victorian or shocked by it.  I also don't like airplanes flying over my house because they are noisy.  Am I anti-technologist as well?

One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, though, refers to the novel about an insane asylum.  The point he was trying to make is that just about everyone in this threat is saying ridiculous statement that are completely without logic and insane.
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Offline Santagranddad

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This thread reminds now of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest'. But infinitely less amusing.
we get it your victorian sensibiities have been gravely offended. someone fetch the salts.

Sir, I doubt you even know anything about the Victorians, much less their sensibilities. And the 'we' in your response - is this the Royal we or have I missed something.

This thread is full of partisan views, immoderately expressed viewpoints, the Church's teaching on modesty ridiculed even blasphemy. Truly it feels somewhat as if the lunatics have taken over and the moderators are locked in the nurses station.

It this chaotic and increasingly frantic environment which reminds me of the film.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 01:30:01 PM by Santagranddad »

Offline Orthodox11

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It's people like these that should be excommunicated.

From what I understand, Mama Basili, who was one of the first to break police lines at the gay rights rally, had already been deposed by the Georgian Church for a previous act of violence and joined one of the Old Calendarist groups upon his release from prison.
+1

I praise His Holiness for replying and condemning the violence. It puts some hope that people like Ativan do in fact not represent the Georgian Church.

I just checked the website of the Old Calendar group in question and he's no longer listed among their clergy in Georgia, so I don't know what his status was as of Friday.

Offline Orthodox11

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Basili Mkalavishvili


About Friday's protest:
Quote
According to Georgia’s Inter Press News service, the anti-gay protesters carried icons and posters proclaiming: “Homosexuals, away from Georgia.” They also brought eggs and stinging nettles to the protest, threatening to lash anyone who “deserved” such treatment.
Basili Mkalavishvili, an outspoken defrocked Georgian Orthodox priest who was sentenced to six years in 2005 for a series of attacks against minority religious edifices, pledged to “start a revolution of nettles to protect orthodox Christendom,” describing the plant as a symbol of Orthodox Christendom directed against homosexuals.
“There has been a rose and broom revolution; we are starting the revolution of nettles to protect orthodox Christians. We, as Orthodox Christians, won’t let them [homosexuals] walk down the holy streets,” Inter Press News quoted Mkalavishvili as saying.
http://en.ria.ru/world/20130517/181207800.html
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 03:06:25 PM by Orthodox11 »

Offline minasoliman

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM
It's quite telling that these are all places where either Orthodox at the majority or have a strong presence.
telling what exactly?
That usually Christians act like real charitable Christians when they're a minority.  When they're a majority, there's a diversity of them, including apathetic nominal Christians and Christians who advocate violence, as shown here.
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Offline minasoliman

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It's people like these that should be excommunicated.

From what I understand, Mama Basili, who was one of the first to break police lines at the gay rights rally, had already been deposed by the Georgian Church for a previous act of violence and joined one of the Old Calendarist groups upon his release from prison.
+1

I praise His Holiness for replying and condemning the violence. It puts some hope that people like Ativan do in fact not represent the Georgian Church.

I just checked the website of the Old Calendar group in question and he's no longer listed among their clergy in Georgia, so I don't know what his status was as of Friday.
If the implication is that he's cut off from the Old Calendar group, good for them too!  This shows that strict "fundamentalist" Christians are peaceful by nature, not violent.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 05:56:10 PM by minasoliman »
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If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline Santagranddad

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Amen

Offline orthonorm

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM
It's quite telling that these are all places where either Orthodox at the majority or have a strong presence.
telling what exactly?
That usually Christians act like real charitable Christians when they're a minority.  When they're a majority, there's a diversity of them, including apathetic nominal Christians and Christians who advocate violence, as shown here.

Wow. Someone other than in augustin making sense in the last two pages.

Some real disgusting comments around here.

Thanks mina.
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Offline Shiny

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM
It's quite telling that these are all places where either Orthodox at the majority or have a strong presence.
telling what exactly?
That usually Christians act like real charitable Christians when they're a minority.  When they're a majority, there's a diversity of them, including apathetic nominal Christians and Christians who advocate violence, as shown here.

Wow. Someone other than in augustin making sense in the last two pages.

Some real disgusting comments around here.

Thanks mina.
I'm waiting for the Bible verses to defend such actions
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Offline ativan

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We must understand the culture and politics of Georgia before saying anything. Georgians are pious Orthodox Christians who seriously want to preserve traditional religious ethics in their society with the Church as the center of society. His Holiness is well loved by the faithful including many politicians and he often counsels Georgia acting as spiritual guardian, this is his duty, Eis Polla Eti Despota! Many years to the faithful Georgians who are pushing those who seek to harm the traditional society out of Georgia. Gay-pride parades do not belong in the streets of a religious Orthodox country such as Georgia. Both Homosexuality and Pride are terrible sins and a celebration/parade in honor of such monstrosity would be opposite of Orthodox teachings. The physical fighting between the Orthodox and the Gay-pride supporters was bad and the priest was not supposed to be using a chair as a weapon but the counter-protest was good.

We must understand the culture and politics of Georgia before saying anything. Georgians are pious Orthodox Christians who seriously want to preserve traditional religious ethics in their society with the Church as the center of society. His Holiness is well loved by the faithful including many politicians and he often counsels Georgia acting as spiritual guardian, this is his duty, Eis Polla Eti Despota! Many years to the faithful Georgians who are pushing those who seek to harm the traditional society out of Georgia. Gay-pride parades do not belong in the streets of a religious Orthodox country such as Georgia. Both Homosexuality and Pride are terrible sins and a celebration/parade in honor of such monstrosity would be opposite of Orthodox teachings. The physical fighting between the Orthodox and the Gay-pride supporters was bad and the priest was not supposed to be using a chair as a weapon but the counter-protest was good.   
Absolutely right!

I know there are some non-Christians on this forum, but, still, It is depressing to see "Christians" judging their own brothers repeatedly. In terms of real "violence", it's peanuts what our Georgian brothers demonstrated in the video. They have not killed nobody. It's easy, and at times luckewarmish, to sit behind a computer and comment with ignorance. I wonder how would folks react when some of these sodomite criminals live next to them burning them with microwave radiation, or sending them HIV-infected things to them. Yes! This is terrible to say, but it's this what's happening to many Christian leaders, Christians in many parts of the developed world. Google it! Until recently these sodomite groups were classified as dangerous criminal groups with the police forces of Austria, Switzerland and Germany.  :police:
There are two groups of people at the moment who have been used by the evils of this world to destroy Christianity: that are Islmists and Sodomites! If you care and love, as you say, these folks, please tell them to stop being Muslims or Gays, tell them to halt their anti-Christian agenda, tell them to undergo some kind of spiritual healing, tell them, otherwise, they are heading to hell.

Bless the tough Georgians, and please never judge your own brothers and sisters!

Thank you brothers in Christ

Unfortunately this age has so much distorted Orthodoxy that normal is taken as abnormal and the other way round. People can't even think in terms of the past, in terms of their ancestors. They call us middle age beasts just because we remember past and stick to our ancestor's teaching and moral. Not that I wary about us leaving in cage. It is those who have lost touch with the past and with their ancestors that are really pitiful.

Our saintly king Vakhtang Gorgasali when dying said these words: "be strong in your faith and look forward to die for the Christ so that you can find permanent glory". We remember up to now his words.

17 th century traveler Don Pietro Avitabile traveled through Georgia. It was the time when Persian Shah Abbas destroyed cities and leveled houses and churches to the ground. The robbed Georgia and everything in here. People had no food. They were hungry and drained of power. Clergy had no Eucharist clothes or objects. In spite of these people did not fall in any despair and still stayed pridefully. Don Pietro reports what they were saying: "Even if Christ's faith will be rooted out of the whole world we will still retain pure faith of Christ".

And they want to inject this garbage in this country with this much tradition. That will not happen and even if violence is necessary we should not stop. This "violence" was just to show those people that they can do whatever they want to do in their house (and everybody who protested against immorality explicitly stated this and whoever know Georgian will hear it) but do not bring this in the streets. We will not allow them to spoil future Generation. Future Generation is jewel for our Country. I don't wish any country in the world whatever I don't wish my country. God bless all faithful.

Offline mike

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OK... who's arguing it's uncommon?

You are mistaken, once again.

This is NOT how all Orthodox protest against sin.

Why are you always so adamant to plop everyone in to one basket?

You are mistaken, once again.

This is NOT how all Orthodox protest against sin.

Same in Serbia, Ukraine, Russia etc.

Really?  I hadn't heard about it.

:(Watched the news on RT today and witnessed the violent and unedifying blockading of a so-called 'Gay Pride' parade in Tbilisi, Georgia. The news strip running below the news pictures had 'Christians block Gay Pride march'. The newsreader spoke of protestors lead by Orthodox Christian priests. What I saw extremely violent attacks on vehicles presumably trying to get the Pride marchers away in a minibus with broken windows and a screaming mob trying to knock seven barrels of .... out of whatever they could lay their fists on.

I have seen 'Gay Pride' marches before and found the over the top behaviour and outfits difficult to stomach, but this protest would best described as deeply shameful and mob violence rather than a protest by Christians.

Church Militant didn't even begin to describe it.

Okay, show me where the angry, violent mob is. Where is the Catholicos Patriarch urging people to beat up gays? For God's sake...

This is a single isolated event.  If Orthodox Christians the world over were attacking people, it would be different, but they are not.

I understand some of this posts are naive, but IMHO some are purposely misleading.

Our saintly king Vakhtang Gorgasali when dying said these words: "be strong in your faith and look forward to die for the Christ so that you can find permanent glory". We remember up to now his words.

It looks like you ignore his words and try to make others die for Christ, not yourselves.
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Offline ativan

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Our saintly king Vakhtang Gorgasali when dying said these words: "be strong in your faith and look forward to die for the Christ so that you can find permanent glory". We remember up to now his words.

It looks like you ignore his words and try to make others die for Christ, not yourselves.
It looks like for you truth is as much important as for me learning magic, which I care nothing about.

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ativan, do you live in Georgia?  I'm curious as to hearing more about your thoughts regarding what went on in the protest.
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Offline Punch

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Our saintly king Vakhtang Gorgasali when dying said these words: "be strong in your faith and look forward to die for the Christ so that you can find permanent glory". We remember up to now his words.

It looks like you ignore his words and try to make others die for Christ, not yourselves.
It looks like for you truth is as much important as for me learning magic, which I care nothing about.

LOL.  I am really starting to like you.  A lot.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline ativan

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ativan, do you live in Georgia?  I'm curious as to hearing more about your thoughts regarding what went on in the protest.
Currently I live in US and will be going back to Georgia soon. But I do know in details what happened. Some preliminaries: 1) This gay pride thing had been tried in Georgia several times before which failed each time. It turned into another mildly violent clash last year. They have tried to hold this also in Batumi City 2-3 years back and again failed. Many people came out in the streets. 2) Country was mourning three dead Georgian soldiers who died in Afghanistan and these people were warned not to chose this time. 3) Besides, as I know they've been also told if they wanted to hold such a thing to choose another place since that particular place is also important for Georgians. In April 9 of 1989 20 Georgians died out of Russian's hand for freedom. Conducting such a dirty show in a sacred spot is very painful for Georgians. 4) Catholicos Patriarch Ilia II has warned them that it was not a good idea and would lead to opposition. 5) There's was a gathering the day prior at that particular area and people clearly expressed that such a thing should not be hold.

In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

As Georgian's position against gay people is concerned it is such: they've lived in our country before these incidents and nobody was hurt because they were gay. We don't think we are any batter then them. Although we recognize that it is abominable sin we don't judge them. They can do whatever they want to do in their own homes (and this was clearly stated by many protesters), though as a human I don't wish them to be sunk in such a sin. Violence was not an effect of our hate against them (which we don't have to start with) but an act to curtail the spread of disease in the future generation, that's it. I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

I should admit though that our Church is not perfect either and we too have totally unholy priests some of whom are even hidden gays themselves. Our church is not perfect; Our clergy may exhibit aggression or whatever, they are also humans. I definitely will not approve Priest's aggression (but they should be involved in such matters) against gays. Though as I've already mentioned I totally approve such a "prophylactic" on people's side. To me it also seems that this was "controlled" violence. If we really hated gays there would've been many dead bodies before and after. In reality nobody got hurt seriously. There were minor injuries only.

Offline mike

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.

Quote
I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

How would that parade harm your children?

Quote
To me it also seems that this was "controlled" violence. If we really hated gays there would've been many dead bodies before and after. In reality nobody got hurt seriously. There were minor injuries only.

Thanks to police. Rioters would tear them apart.
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Offline ativan

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.
Democracy means also respecting majority rights. Majority decided that such a thing would be unhealthy and decided to stop it. This is true democracy and not pseudo-democracy: minority and majority both exercised their rights in full not unlike in many places where police tries to keep majority off stopping minorities shameful attempts.

Quote
Quote
I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

How would that parade harm your children?
This is why I said truth is not what you seek for. If it was then the answer would have been clear. If you can't see how it protects children I don't think any explanation would help you to understand the problem.

Quote
Quote
To me it also seems that this was "controlled" violence. If we really hated gays there would've been many dead bodies before and after. In reality nobody got hurt seriously. There were minor injuries only.

Thanks to police. Rioters would tear them apart.
That is untrue again. It was mostly clergy and people that gays did not get injured seriously. Police did try to protect gays but in many cases they in fact let the people against gay and this is explicit on many videos.

In spite of your attempts to make us look like animals and cannibals we are humans. This may hurt you but it's true. Georgians are humans.

Offline podkarpatska

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Democracy is complicated and messy. Tocqueville said it best in his early 19th century essay on the tyranny of the majority in his masterwork, " Democracy in America." It's worth the read. 

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2216858/posts

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.


What are the laws in Georgia regarding assembly?  In the US we have freedom of assembly but even this has restrictions.  If freedom of assembly is not guaranteed by the Georgian constitution then whichever bean counter approved of this despite repeated complaints from the majority is at fault for this.


Besides, Democracy is all about the rights of the majority.  The minorities be damned.  This is why so many historical authors spoke poorly of it as a system.  Now, some specific democracies guarantee the rights of the minorities, but this is not inherent in the system.
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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.


What are the laws in Georgia regarding assembly?  In the US we have freedom of assembly but even this has restrictions.  If freedom of assembly is not guaranteed by the Georgian constitution then whichever bean counter approved of this despite repeated complaints from the majority is at fault for this.


Besides, Democracy is all about the rights of the majority.  The minorities be damned.  This is why so many historical authors spoke poorly of it as a system.  Now, some specific democracies guarantee the rights of the minorities, but this is not inherent in the system.

in the cradle of democracy, Athens, only a small minority had any rights to respect.

Georgia needs only to look to San Francisco to see where this leads.  The majority has a right to make sure that never happens.
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Online ialmisry

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM
It's quite telling that these are all places where either Orthodox at the majority or have a strong presence.
telling what exactly?
That usually Christians act like real charitable Christians when they're a minority.  When they're a majority, there's a diversity of them, including apathetic nominal Christians and Christians who advocate violence, as shown here.
Not exactly.  I know plenty of the history of the Christians while a minority in the Middle East that the diversity you speak of exists.
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Online ialmisry

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.

Quote
I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

How would that parade harm your children?

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.

Quote
I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

How would that parade harm your children?



Keepin' it classy as always.

Offline augustin717

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.


What are the laws in Georgia regarding assembly?  In the US we have freedom of assembly but even this has restrictions.  If freedom of assembly is not guaranteed by the Georgian constitution then whichever bean counter approved of this despite repeated complaints from the majority is at fault for this.


Besides, Democracy is all about the rights of the majority.  The minorities be damned.  This is why so many historical authors spoke poorly of it as a system.  Now, some specific democracies guarantee the rights of the minorities, but this is not inherent in the system.

in the cradle of democracy, Athens, only a small minority had any rights to respect.

Georgia needs only to look to San Francisco to see where this leads.  The majority has a right to make sure that never happens.
lulz
you mean make sure it doesn't get as thriving as SF?

Offline podkarpatska

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

Offline Punch

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

Offline podkarpatska

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.

You are a bad..that made me laugh!  ;)

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Reductio ad Hitlerum  ::)
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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.

IDK.  The modern Russians are giving them a run for their money.
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline Punch

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.

IDK.  The modern Russians are giving them a run for their money.

True.  The last couple of ones in Moscow were quite good.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 01:48:14 PM by Punch »
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM
It's quite telling that these are all places where either Orthodox at the majority or have a strong presence.
telling what exactly?
That usually Christians act like real charitable Christians when they're a minority.  When they're a majority, there's a diversity of them, including apathetic nominal Christians and Christians who advocate violence, as shown here.
Not exactly.  I know plenty of the history of the Christians while a minority in the Middle East that the diversity you speak of exists.
Thats why I said "usually"
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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.

IDK.  The modern Russians are giving them a run for their money.

True.  The last couple of ones in Moscow were quite good.

You have to admit though that North Korea really goes over the top on such things. Sort of the Super Bowl halftime on crack and meth.... Sort of a totalitarian Vegas.

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You have to admit though that North Korea really goes over the top on such things. Sort of the Super Bowl halftime on crack and meth.... Sort of a totalitarian Vegas.

Have you watched their women soldiers goosestep?  Wow!  It causes an emotion in me that I don't think is good for me to have, so I switch to something else.
I would be happy to agree with you, but then both of us would be wrong.

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You have to admit though that North Korea really goes over the top on such things. Sort of the Super Bowl halftime on crack and meth.... Sort of a totalitarian Vegas.

Have you watched their women soldiers goosestep?  Wow!  It causes an emotion in me that I don't think is good for me to have, so I switch to something else.

Like I said, an alternate universe Vegas.

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.


What are the laws in Georgia regarding assembly?  In the US we have freedom of assembly but even this has restrictions.  If freedom of assembly is not guaranteed by the Georgian constitution then whichever bean counter approved of this despite repeated complaints from the majority is at fault for this.


Besides, Democracy is all about the rights of the majority.  The minorities be damned.  This is why so many historical authors spoke poorly of it as a system.  Now, some specific democracies guarantee the rights of the minorities, but this is not inherent in the system.

in the cradle of democracy, Athens, only a small minority had any rights to respect.

Georgia needs only to look to San Francisco to see where this leads.  The majority has a right to make sure that never happens.
lulz
you mean make sure it doesn't get as thriving as SF?
was miring down a cesspool when I saw it four years ago.  Around the same time Michael Savage saw it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJmmMgnIQaw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKWviKFiPQQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE8Qo3l9TZo

You need a future generation for having a future
Quote
San Francisco becoming a child-free zone as youth population declines

Despite efforts to stem the tide of family flight, the population of children in San Francisco continues to ebb.

Families that remain in The City are bucking the trend that has plagued San Francisco for years as the number of children — defined as people up to 17 years old — has dropped from 181,532 in 1960 to 107,524 today, according to the latest U.S. Census Bureau figures. The 2000 census counted 112,802 youths.

The decrease is disappointing news for city officials, who have attempted to counter the family-flight trend by creating more affordable housing, improving schools and cutting costs, such as a college savings account for kindergarten enrollees.   
http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2011/03/san-francisco-becoming-child-free-zone-youth-population-declines#ixzz2U44RXzdv

Quote
The San Francisco and San Jose metro regions, which added more than 1.1 million new jobs from 1992-2000, produced fewer than 70,000 jobs between 2000 and 2008—a dropoff of 95%.
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/viewSubCategory.asp?id=1678
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Online ialmisry

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In short if they (organizer's of gay parade) really cared about democracy and if they really were rational beings they would've aborted the whole thing.

Democracy means also respecting minority rights.

Quote
I totally support such a thing because future generation matters for me. I have 2 children on my own. If I don't wish anything like these to them I don't wish it to any child in the world and God knows it.

How would that parade harm your children?



Keepin' it classy as always.
better than staying ignorant.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
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If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.



Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Santagranddad

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.





Yuck, murdering Red fascists - who actually killed more people than the Axis powers.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 07:01:11 PM by Santagranddad »

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Reductio ad dictatorum  ::)
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Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Perhaps it's a post-Soviet phenomenon rather than an Orthodox one?

That might be. Mykonos in Greece was, according to the Lonely Planet guide, the biggest gay tourist destination in Europe until it was supplanted by some place in Spain.
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I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Shanghaiski

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I for one for one find your comment at odds with your involvement on an Orthodox Christian forum.


Why? It's true. Every gay manifestation in Eastern Europe I've heard ends up being attacked by violent "religious" mob. I would be surprised if for once it wasn't.

Serbia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Ukraine: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2147385/Horrific-moment-thugs-attack-head-gay-rights-group-Ukraine-forced-cancel-parade-hijacked-neo-Nazi-zealots.html

Russia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDOV6qvizmA

Lithuania: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXwkj1pcexM

Why oh why do the Gays feel the need to rub our heterosexual faces in the mud just to propagate their agenda?  If you want to be gay, OK, if you are gay Ok, but don't push your abomination in my face ,,,,,,,thank you...  Whats wrong in keeping your preference to yourselves?

Because, since they cannot acknowledge a problem with themselves, the problem therefore must lie with society. Therefore, the society must be change. Then, supposedly, they will stop killing themselves .
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Shanghaiski

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When all else fails, bring on the Nazis. Yuck.

I'm sorry, but they did have some of the best parades.

IDK.  The modern Russians are giving them a run for their money.

True.  The last couple of ones in Moscow were quite good.

You have to admit though that North Korea really goes over the top on such things. Sort of the Super Bowl halftime on crack and meth.... Sort of a totalitarian Vegas.

Totalitarian Vegas, lol! (Las Vegas has its own totalitarianism.)
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Shanghaiski

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Reductio ad dictatorum  ::)

Reductio ad latinum.

(Probably didn't get the grammar right.)
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 07:41:53 PM by Shanghaiski »
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.