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Author Topic: Kalimni Bil Masry (Speak to Me in Egyptian Arabic)  (Read 2121 times) Average Rating: 0
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copticmind
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« Reply #45 on: May 15, 2013, 05:37:55 PM »

ألف الشكر, Coptic mind, for all your help. It appears I've got some work to do before I open my silly mouth around Arabic-speaking Copts again.  Wink

العفو، لا شكر على واجب

I'm the one causing confusion because of my lack of precision and ignorance of proper phonological terms.
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Ⲡⲁϭⲟⲓⲥ Ⲓⲏⲥ Ⲡⲭⲥ ⳿ⲡϣⲏⲣⲓ ⳿ⲙ⳿Ⲫⲛⲟⲩϯ ⲛⲁⲓ ⲛⲏⲓ ⲁⲛⲟⲕ ⲡⲓⲣⲉϥⲉⲣⲛⲟⲃⲓ
يا ربي يسوع المسيح ابن الله ارحمني أنا الخاطئ
Severian
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« Reply #46 on: May 15, 2013, 06:37:27 PM »

I haven't laughed this hard while reading Arabic in a long long time! it's like my 3 years old daughter trying to phrase her thoughts in Arabic! but it's a good start.

..........................

Ana mosta3ed asa3edkom fel 3araby sawa2 masry (bel 7orof el 3arabi / bel 7orof el englizi )aw fel Fus7a! ana shater fel 2etnen.
ta3alo ne7'tar mawdo3 netakalem feeh, yekon sahl, wana ha7awel asala7 el 3'alatat elly hate3moloha. hateb2a 7aga lateefa gidan, we akeed ha ned7ak keteer 3ala 3'alatatna.

أنا مستعد اساعدكم في العربي سواء مصري (بالحروف العربي / بالحروف الانجليزي) أو في الفصحى! أنا شاطر في الاتنين.
تعالوا نختار موضوع نتكلم فيه، يكون سهل، و أنا هحاول أصلح الغلطات اللي ها تتعملوها. هتبقى حاجة لطيفة جدا، و اكيد هنضحك كتير على غلطاتنا.

............................

so, what do you think?
(ha, eah ra2yokom?)
 
Fikra kwiyisa. Bes ana mish fahim, howa fee 7aga mo3ayena a7na ghiliTna feeha?

(Good idea. But I don't understand, is there something specific we made a mistake in?)
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 06:51:57 PM by Severian » Logged

On hiatus from posting. Forgive me if my posts have lacked humility or tact. Note that some of my older posts -especially those prior to late 2012- may not reflect my current views. In the meantime, please pray for my sinful self as I am in a critical and unsure juncture in my life. Thank you.
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« Reply #47 on: May 15, 2013, 06:38:54 PM »

Cyrillic,

The 3 is a voiced (not voiceless...silly fingers) pharyngeal fricative, written in Arabic like ع (so you can see where they got the idea to use 3). This sound does not occur in English, and apparently not in Dutch either, but you can hear examples of it on wikipedia.

2 is (I think...now Copticmind's transliteration has me doubting) a glottal stop, represented in Arabic by ء (I've blown it up so that you can see it better; it looks like a little 2). It represents a glottal stop, which is in a lot of languages (apparently including Dutch), but usually is not represented in writing as it often occurs as a replacement for some deleted sound (the famous deletion of medial sequence "tt" in certain varieties of British English being probably the best example for Anglophones; you can see and hear an example of it at the link above in the form of "bottle" [ˈbɐʔn̩], as it is apparently pronounced in "Received Pronunciation"/Beeb speak).

7 is the voiceless pharyngeal fricative (generally transliterated H)...until Copticmind tells me it isn't. This is another sound that isn't in English or Dutch. When I was learning it, they told us to treat it as if you are fogging up your glasses to clean them. Works pretty well, if you don't want to go to another wikipedia page.

(Yay, useful discussions of phonology!)

Curious . . .

You lament sometimes not knowing Spanish or Arabic as well as you would like (or perhaps it was the assumptions that others have that you study Arabic?). What languages do you know as "well" as you would like?

A question relevant to this thread, given your obvious expertise in language in general and I imagine better insight into methods of language acquisition than any of us have, what gets in the way of better your Spanish? Lack of time? Opportunity?

If you don't mind saying, is there is a particular language you are expert or becoming expert in? If these are dumb questions, which they could be since I don't really know many linguists, or don't want to answer for whatever reason, no offense.

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dzheremi
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« Reply #48 on: May 15, 2013, 07:23:26 PM »

Curious . . .

You lament sometimes not knowing Spanish or Arabic as well as you would like (or perhaps it was the assumptions that others have that you study Arabic?). What languages do you know as "well" as you would like?

None, I guess. I think there's always room for improvement. My Spanish is fine, I just lament having essentially lost that connection with the death my aunt and grandmother over the last decade and a half or so (now I'm the only Spanish-speaker in my family, so unless I marry into a Spanish-speaking family, it probably dies with me). I still use it around friends back home and whatnot, but I'm very rarely in a situation where I absolutely have to use it, since most people here in ABQ (and back home in CA) are bilingual, and those who aren't generally don't like it. There's a certain stigma using it in a mixed community, like you're choosing sides or something.

Quote
A question relevant to this thread, given your obvious expertise in language in general and I imagine better insight into methods of language acquisition than any of us have, what gets in the way of better your Spanish? Lack of time? Opportunity?

Time is a big one too, yeah. I've actually tried to schedule days to only use it (or only use Russian; I don't think I know enough Arabic anymore to use only Arabic for a whole day, though I used to converse with certain people only or primarily in Arabic back when I lived in Oregon and was using the language every day), as ridiculous as that sounds, but it never really works out that way.

Quote
If you don't mind saying, is there is a particular language you are expert or becoming expert in? If these are dumb questions, which they could be since I don't really know many linguists, or don't want to answer for whatever reason, no offense.

No, I wouldn't say so. As I have become more specialized in my training, I find myself regularly coming back to Afroasiatic languages (modern and ancient, particularly the more peripheral varieties), but this is something other than knowing any of them particularly well. That's not always, or maybe even not often, strictly necessary. That might sound odd, but for example, I have in the past done work on the loss of the emphatic set (T, D, TH ~ Z, S) in peripheral varieties of Arabic as spoken in Chad, Sudan, Cyprus, Afghanistan, Nigeria, Uganda, etc. To do that, of course you need to know enough about Arabic phonology in order to tell a probable story about which variety lost what, when, and why. But other than being able to work with text samples (when available), you could theoretically do this work without knowing any Arabic. And I've worked with many languages in that situation.

There are, of course, many linguists who are experts in particular languages or language families, or aspects of the same. My old adviser at the University of Oregon is something of an expert on the Cariban family of languages (northern South America). But there are also a great number of linguists who are specialists in a particular subfield, rather than a particular language or family (and of course, the line between the two is fuzzy; someone like Niloofar Haeri, an Iranian linguist at Johns Hopkins who has worked a lot on sociolinguistics of Arabic, particularly Egyptian, is probably also at least conversant in the language due to her preexisting research interests in this variety in particular and the time she has spent in the field collecting data).
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« Reply #49 on: May 15, 2013, 07:49:24 PM »

yatara law "Samn!" 3ayiz yishtiriq ma3ana.

(I wonder if "Samn!" wants to participate with us.)

FOB: I woondarr if sAm-na wantiss to bartissibate wiz us
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 07:50:52 PM by minasoliman » Logged

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« Reply #50 on: May 16, 2013, 05:30:23 AM »

I haven't laughed this hard while reading Arabic in a long long time! it's like my 3 years old daughter trying to phrase her thoughts in Arabic! but it's a good start.

..........................

Ana mosta3ed asa3edkom fel 3araby sawa2 masry (bel 7orof el 3arabi / bel 7orof el englizi )aw fel Fus7a! ana shater fel 2etnen.
ta3alo ne7'tar mawdo3 netakalem feeh, yekon sahl, wana ha7awel asala7 el 3'alatat elly hate3moloha. hateb2a 7aga lateefa gidan, we akeed ha ned7ak keteer 3ala 3'alatatna.

أنا مستعد اساعدكم في العربي سواء مصري (بالحروف العربي / بالحروف الانجليزي) أو في الفصحى! أنا شاطر في الاتنين.
تعالوا نختار موضوع نتكلم فيه، يكون سهل، و أنا هحاول أصلح الغلطات اللي ها تتعملوها. هتبقى حاجة لطيفة جدا، و اكيد هنضحك كتير على غلطاتنا.

............................

so, what do you think?
(ha, eah ra2yokom?)
 
Fikra kwiyisa. Bes ana mish fahim, howa fee 7aga mo3ayena a7na ghiliTna feeha?

(Good idea. But I don't understand, is there something specific we made a mistake in?)

I'm sorry if I sounded condescending or blunt. It was just the how I felt reading your attempts to write in Arabic that made me laugh.

No, there aren't major mistakes in what you have written so far, but here is a small correction of your very first statement.

Quote
.هو في حد عايز يدردش معيا بالغة مصرية؟ سمحني لو انا بغلت في الاعرب او الهجاء. على اي حل, اللغة مصرية مش لغة رسمية زاي الفصحى
هو في حد عايز يدردش معايا باللغة المصرية؟ سامحني (سامحوني) لو أنا بغلط في الاعراب او الهجاء، على أي حال، اللغة المصرية مش لغة رسمية زي الفصحى.
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يا ربي يسوع المسيح ابن الله ارحمني أنا الخاطئ
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« Reply #51 on: May 16, 2013, 07:28:32 AM »

7 is the voiceless pharyngeal fricative (generally transliterated H)...until Copticmind tells me it isn't. This is another sound that isn't in English or Dutch. When I was learning it, they told us to treat it as if you are fogging up your glasses to clean them.

fekra kwayesa le ta3leem 3arabi!

(Good idea for teaching Arabic!)
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minasoliman
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« Reply #52 on: May 18, 2013, 01:10:45 PM »

Ana ba7ib Bassem Youssef, lakin bafham nosso bass.  Had yi targimli di:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=b6FhjciQf6E

 Wink

(I love Bassem Youssef, but I understand half of it only.  Someone translate this for me:)
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 01:23:16 PM by minasoliman » Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for \\\"unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain.\\\" (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
Severian
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« Reply #53 on: May 21, 2013, 09:53:35 PM »

Ana ba7ib Bassem Youssef, lakin bafham nosso bass.  Had yi targimli di:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=b6FhjciQf6E

 Wink

(I love Bassem Youssef, but I understand half of it only.  Someone translate this for me:)
Ana bafhemo bas ana ma3andeesh waqt atargimo, lil asaf. Sad

I understand it, but I don't have time to translate it, unfortunately.
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On hiatus from posting. Forgive me if my posts have lacked humility or tact. Note that some of my older posts -especially those prior to late 2012- may not reflect my current views. In the meantime, please pray for my sinful self as I am in a critical and unsure juncture in my life. Thank you.
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