Maybe it would help you not to look for loopholes.
Before I even worry about loopholes, I want proof that there's a loop to be worried about to begin with!
Maybe it would help you not to look for loopholes.
I will never understand how people completely miss the point and then make empty points in an attempt to support...nothing, apparently.
All I'm saying is that it is wrong to judge someone based on a single nasty habit. If someone can't go two or three days a week and up to 138 other days a year without doing something, then it is a problem. If every nasty habit and/or indulgence is a sin then stop drinking alcohol, smoking, consuming meat and dairy products, eating sugar, eating sweet fruits, eating rare foods, etc.
That's good, but only half so.
I do not support it for myself, I also don't go around telling people who do that they are going to go to hell. Again, there are reasons we have fast days.
Would you laugh at an off hand comment about someone having sex without consent with a passed out drunk young lady? No? Then why the double standard? Wrong is wrong and finding humor in that wrong and voicing your pleasure at the humor does nothing good.
What, you think I'm trying to justify weed?
Without knowingly doing so, my points are being proven.
i enjoy the ride with a nice bowl of organic californian bud.
Spiral of insanity and Kerdy is driving the trainActually, I'm attempting to use the breaks, but the other passengers seem to enjoy the ride.
If you do not support it, then you may not want to encourage it either.
But it was mainly for DR.
Neither do I.
What does that have to do with what we are talking about?
Is getting high right or wrong? This is the question. It matters not if a person uses MJ, cocaine, Meth, MDMA, Hash, Spice, Salvia or any other drug chosen from a very extensive list of substances people use to recreationally get wasted. Are we taught the occasional drunk is ok or than drunkenness is wrong? I laugh when I see folks compare MJ to alcohol, but refuse to associate drunkenness with it, which is extremely telling and reveals the truth. What you don't say is just as important as what you do.
It is wrong, it has always been wrong, it will always be wrong regardless of any hipster SNL comments a person ignorantly spews it a failed attempt to justify its use.
Actually, the question is what is the Church's teaching on marijuana. Seeing as how it has never come up in the canons and only recently in the teachings of Orthodox priests, it does not seem that the Church specifically has a traditional teaching on marijuana.
Following that, the only way to determine what the Church's teaching on marijuana might be is by analogy, hence the many comments on alcohol and your own use of the intoxication argument. Is it possible to use marijuana and not get "wasted" or "high"? Of course, different people are going to have different interpretations "high" and what the Church Fathers might have considered an acceptable level of alcohol use would probably be considered "binge drinking" by the American medical establishment. At what level of drinking does one go past having one's heart "gladdened" and being drunk? What separates a feast and celebration from an orgy and debauchery? The Fathers never give us a two drink limit, they only condemn drunkeness and relate it to the lack of self control that drunkeness brings. Is there an analogous level of marijuana use, or does just one hit bypass gladdening and go straight to "wasted"?
"It is wrong, it has always been wrong, yadda yadda, hipster reference, SNL bashing". This is not an argument- it's a proclamation from on high, with no reference to tradition, the Church Fathers, or even a comparable Scripture reference.
And what a merry-go-round we find ourselves on.
If it helps at all, my problem is not with your final position, merely the route you're taking to get there. You've been making a lot of proclamations without any convincing arguments, such dogmatic statements without a rational position detracts from the point you are trying to make.
I have no need of loopholes. Yes, I used to smoke pot. Yes, at one point I was even a pot-head. I don't now, and haven't for close to three years. Even if it magically became legal overnight I wouldn't.
The reason your argument fails isn't because everyone is trying to rationalize something they enjoy, but quite frankly because the actual effects of marijuana have yet to be discussed without your interjecting the DEA dogmatic line. Now, were we all good citizens before becoming Orthodox or Christian, and just flat out never tried the stuff because Uncle Sam told us it was bad and would have us raping women and hanging out with black people, your argument might work. But we weren't- or some us just don't come from countries where marijuana has the stigma and illegality it does here in the US. This means that our experiences are different- we know for a fact that it is possible to smoke without getting "high" or wasted or any level of buzzed past one or two drinks. We know that for the majority of people who use marijuana exclusively do not end up in the type of debauchery that the Fathers condemned drunkeness as leading to, that marijuana use does not lead to the loss of self control that alcohol and other drugs lead to. The fact of the matter is that marijuana use is not analogous to all the drugs you mentioned in its effect- as far as the consequences of its use goes, it is more benign than alcohol. Either accept that this is the case, or stay out of the argument, otherwise you are making your own position appear ridiculous.
There are plenty of factual arguments you can use- the link between marijuana use and chromosonal damage along with Second Chance's argument about damaging the body.
I speak from experience when I say that marijuana used even occasionally can become a crutch if the use of becomes associated with certain activities almost exclusively. There are certain albums I just can't listen to anymore, and certain types of movies that I don't find enjoyable, not because I had to be high to enjoy them but because the usage was so associated with the activity that it was impossible to enjoy for several years afterward. I only just recently started to be able to play video games all the way through again.