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Author Topic: One lung or two  (Read 1152 times) Average Rating: 0
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podkarpatska
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« on: March 20, 2013, 03:55:08 PM »

From the Economist, a sobering analysis of the papal installation: "So if personal chemistry were the only thing required to get the Orthodox and Catholics breathing in sync, the way ahead might be clear. Unfortunately things are not so simple..."   http://www.economist.com/blogs/erasmus/2013/03/orthodox-christians-and-catholics

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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2013, 04:02:44 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2013, 04:03:27 PM »

i just find it interesting that the "Economist" is taking this topic on. 
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« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2013, 04:08:59 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.
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« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2013, 04:17:05 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.

I see what you did there.  Cheesy
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« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2013, 04:20:31 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

It's Lent.  I'll not retort.
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« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2013, 05:02:33 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

It's Lent.  I'll not retort.

Salute!
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« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2013, 07:06:36 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.

I see what you did there.  Cheesy

Many a native speaker couldn't do it. Well done sir!
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« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2013, 07:08:26 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.

I see what you did there.  Cheesy

Many a native speaker couldn't do it. Well done sir!

We have some dictionaries, you know...
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« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2013, 08:21:44 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.

I see what you did there.  Cheesy

Many a native speaker couldn't do it. Well done sir!

We have some dictionaries, you know...
yes, but many native speakers couldn't use them to come up with that...bravo!
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« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2013, 08:25:50 PM »

From the Economist, a sobering analysis of the papal installation: "So if personal chemistry were the only thing required to get the Orthodox and Catholics breathing in sync, the way ahead might be clear. Unfortunately things are not so simple..."   http://www.economist.com/blogs/erasmus/2013/03/orthodox-christians-and-catholics



The article says regarding the two-lung metaphor:

"It will certainly be an arresting, and perhaps disturbing, idea for Pope Francis, who quite literally has only one functioning lung; he lost one during a childhood illness."

 Roll Eyes

What a dumb thing for the writer to say.  If anything, I would think it would be perhaps more meaningful from an RC position:  "we have gotten by on one lung but..."  

Of course, from our point of view, the two-lung thing does not work.  Still, the writer's presuppositions and projections are ridiculous on this point.  
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« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2013, 08:31:53 PM »

I never like that offal metaphore.

I see what you did there.  Cheesy

Many a native speaker couldn't do it. Well done sir!

We have some dictionaries, you know...

Dictionary or not, it was a superb play on words.  Now it is the first week in Great Lent, so because we are all complimenting you so much, you must now do 100 prostrations to keep yourself humble    police

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« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2013, 08:41:10 PM »

From the Economist, a sobering analysis of the papal installation: "So if personal chemistry were the only thing required to get the Orthodox and Catholics breathing in sync, the way ahead might be clear. Unfortunately things are not so simple..."   http://www.economist.com/blogs/erasmus/2013/03/orthodox-christians-and-catholics



The article says regarding the two-lung metaphor:

"It will certainly be an arresting, and perhaps disturbing, idea for Pope Francis, who quite literally has only one functioning lung; he lost one during a childhood illness."

 Roll Eyes

What a dumb thing for the writer to say.  If anything, I would think it would be perhaps more meaningful from an RC position:  "we have gotten by on one lung but..."  

Of course, from our point of view, the two-lung thing does not work.  Still, the writer's presuppositions and projections are ridiculous on this point.  

Father, you'd be quite surprised by what passes as journalism these days.
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« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2013, 11:01:29 PM »

The lung thing aside, the last paragraph is the part that was frank and honest. Good feelings and charitable thoughts are one thing, unity remains elusive.
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« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2013, 11:34:56 PM »

The lung thing aside, the last paragraph is the part that was frank and honest. Good feelings and charitable thoughts are one thing, unity remains elusive.

The last paragraph was frank.  However, Rome's approach has changed.  Then, it was "conform to Latin dogma."  Now (at least Post Vatican II until now) has been "don't worry about the dogma thing--submit to Rome, and we can bend on some stuff."  It was bizarre to me that P.Benedict would do away with "Patriarch of the West" then sit Pat. Bartholomew equal to him in St. Peter's to read the original creed in Greek.  
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« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2013, 12:31:37 AM »

The lung thing aside, the last paragraph is the part that was frank and honest. Good feelings and charitable thoughts are one thing, unity remains elusive.

The last paragraph was frank.  However, Rome's approach has changed.  Then, it was "conform to Latin dogma."  Now (at least Post Vatican II until now) has been "don't worry about the dogma thing--submit to Rome, and we can bend on some stuff."  It was bizarre to me that P.Benedict would do away with "Patriarch of the West" then sit Pat. Bartholomew equal to him in St. Peter's to read the original creed in Greek.  

Not sure if its polemics or what from what I read, but "Patriarch of the West" really doesn't mean anything today.  Christianity has expanded beyond "East and West Roman Empire".  What does "West" really mean?
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« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2013, 09:22:38 AM »

The lung thing aside, the last paragraph is the part that was frank and honest. Good feelings and charitable thoughts are one thing, unity remains elusive.

The last paragraph was frank.  However, Rome's approach has changed.  Then, it was "conform to Latin dogma."  Now (at least Post Vatican II until now) has been "don't worry about the dogma thing--submit to Rome, and we can bend on some stuff."  It was bizarre to me that P.Benedict would do away with "Patriarch of the West" then sit Pat. Bartholomew equal to him in St. Peter's to read the original creed in Greek.  

Not sure if its polemics or what from what I read, but "Patriarch of the West" really doesn't mean anything today.  Christianity has expanded beyond "East and West Roman Empire".  What does "West" really mean?

Quote
West is a noun, adjective, or adverb indicating direction or geography.

West is one of the four cardinal directions or compass points. It is the opposite of east and is perpendicular to north and south.

To go west using a compass for navigation, one needs to set a bearing or azimuth of 270°.

West is the direction opposite that of the Earth's rotation on its axis, and is therefore the general direction towards which the Sun sets.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West

Gotta love wikipedia, eh  Grin Grin?
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« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2013, 10:46:11 AM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

It's Lent.  I'll not retort.

I am experiencing theosis, so I will also keep silence.   Roll Eyes
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« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2013, 12:00:03 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

It's Lent.  I'll not retort.

I am experiencing theosis, so I will also keep silence.   Roll Eyes

Good thinkin'! Kiss
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« Reply #19 on: March 21, 2013, 02:46:22 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

It's Lent.  I'll not retort.

I am experiencing theosis, so I will also keep silence.   Roll Eyes

Good thinkin'! Kiss

Awww, come on, I was jist joshin' ya!
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« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2013, 03:05:03 PM »

I have the suspicion that Constantinople has not only bought into the two lung theory, she also believes that the lungs must be headed by only two people, the bishops of Rome and Constantinople. This is from Patriarch Bartholemew's response to Pope Francis at the Wednesday do.

"As the Ecumenical Patriarchate and the worldwide Orthodox Church of Christ..."

http://www.monasterodibose.it/content/view/4927/135/1/8/lang,en/

Not a surprise certainly, but very discouraging.
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« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2013, 10:16:11 AM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

And Orthodoxy can work on their own, like the Nestorians and Non-Chalcedonians (though at least the latter are benign)...?
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« Reply #22 on: March 22, 2013, 10:25:28 AM »

I have the suspicion that Constantinople has not only bought into the two lung theory, she also believes that the lungs must be headed by only two people, the bishops of Rome and Constantinople. This is from Patriarch Bartholemew's response to Pope Francis at the Wednesday do.

"As the Ecumenical Patriarchate and the worldwide Orthodox Church of Christ..."

http://www.monasterodibose.it/content/view/4927/135/1/8/lang,en/

Not a surprise certainly, but very discouraging.

I posted this yesterday in another thread, but it is pertinent here as well.

Here is the official transcript of the Patriarch's formal address yesterday from the Patriarchal website. http://www.patriarchate.org/documents/2013popefrancisaddress

So yes, he did say the quoted phrase. BUT  I would urge those upset by this to read the whole speech. In the context of the speech, the phrase in question seems to me NOT to be a royal like "we" but rather an awkward phrasing where he is expressing his personal best wishes and the best wishes on behalf of the Orthodox community at large.

He was the only speaker at the public event, speaking for all of the non-Catholics there. Would it have been preferable for him NOT to include his regards on behalf of all of Orthodoxy? "I can't speak for any other autochephalous or autonomous Orthodox Church whose representatives are here in this room with us but ...."

Like it or not, he is the 'primus', he was asked to speak as such and he conveyed the good wishes of the Orthodox to the new Pope. There were after all delegations from at least ten of the Orthodox national Churches in attendance. They certainly weren't attending to cast anathemas upon Pope Francis.
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« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2013, 12:33:47 AM »

^As one could anticipate, I agree with podkarpatska in what he said above.  

I propose a reversal monday for 2nd Monday of Great Lent, where Carl and Isa will defend Patriarch Bartholomew, and Pod.and I criticize him.  That way pod and I can be closer to keeping our minds in hell as the Fathers say, and Isa and Carl can be one step closer to heaven.  

 angel

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Just sayin' is all...

Who will respond first?  Those bystanders who would make gimmicky money for their parishes instead of being stewards, may want to take bets.  After all, if the Church is not about fundraisers, what is it about?  

 Tongue

  

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« Reply #24 on: March 26, 2013, 06:48:28 PM »

Did you know?

The two lung theory was not created by John Paul II, it was actually from liberal russian priests.

By the way, PATRIARCH BARTHOLOMEW JUST BROKE CANONS ONCE AGAIN!

He prayed with heretics and BLESSED THE FOOD THEY ATE AT DINNER WITH THE PSEUDO-POPE OF OLD ROME

perhaps it was a trick, for the blessing of heretics are curses, and if you are catholic perhaps you can say bartholomew is a heretic, therefore his blessing was a curse, and the food is now poisened while they eat it and the pope will fall ill or something...

or he is a heretic for breaking those canons... so a curse is put upon .. wait no

i need sleep...

EDITl

oh wait, that is stated right in the article of this thread... oh well

SEE LIBERALS HAVE BEEN STRONGER IN THE PAST they are not as strong today
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« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2013, 07:16:02 PM »

  Huh

That post would be even better if you had just gone to sleep.
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« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2013, 08:06:24 PM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

And Orthodoxy can work on their own, like the Nestorians and Non-Chalcedonians (though at least the latter are benign)...?
If Nestorians were Orthodoxy's cancer, that would mean that the Vatican is no more than a cancerous outgrowth as well.

At worst, the Non-Chalcedonians are a collapsed lung.
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« Reply #27 on: March 27, 2013, 07:56:01 AM »

Before Roman Catholics start using our lung, maybe they should try focusing on the cancerous outgrown known as protestantism in their own lung.  Grin

And Orthodoxy can work on their own, like the Nestorians and Non-Chalcedonians (though at least the latter are benign)...?
If Nestorians were Orthodoxy's cancer, that would mean that the Vatican is no more than a cancerous outgrowth as well.

At worst, the Non-Chalcedonians are a collapsed lung.

This is one deranged person.  Three lungs, one good, one cancerous and one collapsed.  We should get them to ICU and then off to Ripley's Believe it or Not.
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« Reply #28 on: March 27, 2013, 08:28:34 AM »

I have the suspicion that Constantinople has not only bought into the two lung theory, she also believes that the lungs must be headed by only two people, the bishops of Rome and Constantinople. This is from Patriarch Bartholemew's response to Pope Francis at the Wednesday do.

"As the Ecumenical Patriarchate and the worldwide Orthodox Church of Christ..."

http://www.monasterodibose.it/content/view/4927/135/1/8/lang,en/

Not a surprise certainly, but very discouraging.

I posted this yesterday in another thread, but it is pertinent here as well.

Here is the official transcript of the Patriarch's formal address yesterday from the Patriarchal website. http://www.patriarchate.org/documents/2013popefrancisaddress

So yes, he did say the quoted phrase. BUT  I would urge those upset by this to read the whole speech. In the context of the speech, the phrase in question seems to me NOT to be a royal like "we" but rather an awkward phrasing where he is expressing his personal best wishes and the best wishes on behalf of the Orthodox community at large.

He was the only speaker at the public event, speaking for all of the non-Catholics there. Would it have been preferable for him NOT to include his regards on behalf of all of Orthodoxy? "I can't speak for any other autochephalous or autonomous Orthodox Church whose representatives are here in this room with us but ...."

Like it or not, he is the 'primus', he was asked to speak as such and he conveyed the good wishes of the Orthodox to the new Pope. There were after all delegations from at least ten of the Orthodox national Churches in attendance. They certainly weren't attending to cast anathemas upon Pope Francis.

I suppose that HAH's erudition and mastery of language must have deserted him for once. He could have said ""As the Ecumenical Patriarchate and the worldwide Orthodox Churches of Christ...", or ""As the Ecumenical Patriarchate and on behalf of the worldwide Orthodox Church of Christ..." But, he merely used a phrase that is in line with his approach to Orthodox ecclesiology that has been rebuffed by Archbishop Paul of Finland, Patriarch Alexei of Moscow and many others. That said, there is no question that he should have answered the Pope's address on behalf of all Orthodox churches, to include the two that were placed in the "Other Representations" category. I do wonder, however, what theory makes him the spokesman for the Muslim, Hindu, Jewish and non-Orthodox Christian leaders in the room. The imperial "we" was stretched very far and wide there, wasn't it? BTW, did you also sense the irony of HAH praising the HF's humility with language that did not even have an ounce of humility?
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« Reply #29 on: March 28, 2013, 10:18:43 AM »

The lung thing aside, the last paragraph is the part that was frank and honest. Good feelings and charitable thoughts are one thing, unity remains elusive.

The last paragraph was frank.  However, Rome's approach has changed.  Then, it was "conform to Latin dogma."  

I can't confidently say you're wrong; but if you're right then I really need to re-read the Union of Brest.
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