Author Topic: Horiscopes?  (Read 1380 times)

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Offline Faith2545

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Horiscopes?
« on: March 21, 2013, 11:07:50 AM »
Where did they come from? And do they have any Christian foundation to them?

Offline jmbejdl

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2013, 11:13:18 AM »
Where did they come from? And do they have any Christian foundation to them?

Ancient Babylon, I believe (could easily be wrong but that's what something in the back of my memory is telling me), and no.

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Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2013, 11:20:15 AM »

The Church forbids getting your fortune told, either horoscopes, fortune-tellers, etc.

Stay away from them.

YOU have free will, and can decide your own future.
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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2013, 11:21:36 AM »
What about reading them for laughs?
"April is the cruellest month, breeding
lilacs out of the dead land, mixing
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dull roots with spring rain."
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Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 11:23:24 AM »

If you are told to not read your horoscope, why read it?

There are many jokes and riddles online that are way more funny than your horoscope.
Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 11:25:05 AM »

If you are told to not read your horoscope, why read it?

There are many jokes and riddles online that are way more funny than your horoscope.


They're printed in the school newspaper.
"April is the cruellest month, breeding
lilacs out of the dead land, mixing
memory and desire, stirring
dull roots with spring rain."
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Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2013, 12:33:16 PM »

Doesn't mean you have to read it.  :)

Too often things we do just for the fun of it, become a habit.

One day you read it and it says your arm will hurt and it does!....then the next day you really do trip and fall, just like it said....so, now you start wondering if there's something to it.  Coincidence.....but, it "came true"....so, now you are hooked.

Get it?

Sometimes the most innocent methods are utilized to trip us up....because we don't suspect them, we think it's all just for fun, etc.


Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
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Offline Faith2545

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2013, 12:34:42 PM »

The Church forbids getting your fortune told, either horoscopes, fortune-tellers, etc.

Stay away from them.

YOU have free will, and can decide your own future.

This is what I think too.

Nevertheless, there were many saints who were able to tell one's future, like Saint Xenia of Petersburg for one.

Offline Ioannis Climacus

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2013, 01:02:10 PM »
What of the saints who were astrologers (Daniel 5:11)?
Note : Many of my posts (especially the ones antedating late 2012) do not reflect charity, tact, or even views I presently hold. Please forgive me for any antagonism I have caused.

Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2013, 01:16:51 PM »

Can the newspaper fortunetellers be compared to clairvoyant saints?

I believe the saints didn't go around telling folks they would trip down the stairs, or some handsome man would pay them attention today, etc.

Here's a good article:  http://orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/ec_magic_occultism.aspx




Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
—St. Isaac of Syria

Offline orthros

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2013, 01:47:10 PM »
What of the saints who were astrologers (Daniel 5:11)?

Daniel wasn't an astrologer, nor was he engaged in actively seeking to divine the future apart from God's prompting.  He was  the ruler or leader over "magicians, enchanters, astrologers and diviners" because "he had the spirit of God within him".

Offline Faith2545

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2013, 01:56:51 PM »

Can the newspaper fortunetellers be compared to clairvoyant saints?

I believe the saints didn't go around telling folks they would trip down the stairs, or some handsome man would pay them attention today, etc.

Here's a good article:  http://orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/ec_magic_occultism.aspx






Very true - thanks for reminding me!

Offline Ioannis Climacus

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2013, 03:39:59 PM »

Can the newspaper fortunetellers be compared to clairvoyant saints?

I believe the saints didn't go around telling folks they would trip down the stairs, or some handsome man would pay them attention today, etc.
I wouldn't compare them, mostly because I doubt one could call newspaper fortune tellers real "astrologers". As it stands, Daniel was most certainly a magician as was Moses before him.

Might I ask a question though : if astrology is wrong because it, as you say, detracts from free will, should not genetics and biochemistry be condemned likewise? For in the first, man is subject to planetary bodies, but in the latter, biological processes.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 03:45:09 PM by Ioannis Climacus »
Note : Many of my posts (especially the ones antedating late 2012) do not reflect charity, tact, or even views I presently hold. Please forgive me for any antagonism I have caused.

Offline Ioannis Climacus

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2013, 03:41:05 PM »
What of the saints who were astrologers (Daniel 5:11)?

Daniel wasn't an astrologer, nor was he engaged in actively seeking to divine the future apart from God's prompting.  He was  the ruler or leader over "magicians, enchanters, astrologers and diviners" because "he had the spirit of God within him".

The thought of someone being leader of the magicians, and yet not one, is unthinkable (especially given the occult/esoteric nature of the Chaldean magicians).
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 03:45:52 PM by Ioannis Climacus »
Note : Many of my posts (especially the ones antedating late 2012) do not reflect charity, tact, or even views I presently hold. Please forgive me for any antagonism I have caused.

Offline JamesR

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2013, 04:36:00 PM »
What about those little pink fortunes from the fortune cookies you get when you go to an Asian restaurant? Is it blasphemy to read them? Who writes them anyway? Some Chinese guy's wife in a backroom behind the kitchen on a typewriter?
...Or it's just possible he's a mouthy young man on an internet forum.
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2013, 05:33:42 PM »
What about those little pink fortunes from the fortune cookies you get when you go to an Asian restaurant? Is it blasphemy to read them? Who writes them anyway? Some Chinese guy's wife in a backroom behind the kitchen on a typewriter?

They are really a Chinese-American restaurant thing; they are not a tradition in China. I don't know who invented them or who writes them; looking at Wikipedia apparently they were actually introduced by Japanese.  Anyways most of the fortunes nowadays contain advice. My favorite one was, "Confucius says: Show-off always shown up in showdown."
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Offline Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2013, 09:34:01 AM »
Replies that talked about theosophy have been moved to "Theosophy from." Carl Kraeff

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2013, 09:37:14 AM »
I think it should be mentioned that astrology as a method of magic or fortune-telling is strictly forbidden for Christians; however, as a more general system of thinking about the heavens, the Church fathers tended to accept aspects of it. The main objection was to any notion that our fates are determined by the planets and stars, but they accepted that the heavenly bodies could influence events on earth in some way.
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Offline Salpy

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2013, 02:59:41 PM »
My priest says that if someone asks what your sign is, you should respond that it is the Sign of the Cross.

Offline mabsoota

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2013, 03:34:37 PM »
awesome!
 :D

i also advise people to stay away from horoscopes.
they are sometimes written by some atheist just making stuff up to sell newspapers,
but interest in these sort of things can lead to other fortune telling and trying to manipulate the future that Christians are forbidden to do because of the danger to our spiritual life.

if you trust God, you don't need to go around trying to find out the future.
God will tell you what you need to know, and you get the best possible future by staying close to God. you do this through God's grace, the death and resurrection of our Saviour the Son of God, and by fasting, prayer, Bible study and giving to the poor.

Offline genesisone

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2013, 03:41:48 PM »
My priest says that if someone asks what your sign is, you should respond that it is the Sign of the Cross.
I've tried that. And then added: I don't consult the stars, but rather their Creator and mine.

Awkward reactions are the norm.

Offline john_mo

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2013, 04:14:14 AM »
Has anyone ever heard of an Orthodox priest endorsing horoscopes? I have, and it shocked me.
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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2013, 06:46:20 AM »
Has anyone ever heard of an Orthodox priest endorsing horoscopes? I have, and it shocked me.

Our church is big enough that you'll find all kinds of weirdness.
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Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2013, 09:02:32 AM »
Has anyone ever heard of an Orthodox priest endorsing horoscopes? I have, and it shocked me.

He's only human, and can make mistakes.

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Offline yeshuaisiam

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2013, 11:07:06 PM »
Yeah any kind of fortune telling is funky.  First it's really a bunch of bologna.....    Horiscopes are more so strange than fortune cookies, which I see for laughs, as they are detailed and based in astrology.  Soothsaying (possession) and going to "Mimi's palm reader" is pagan.

Fortune cookies I see as a laugh.  I did read one two years ago that said "You will find your first love soon".

I was sitting at the table with my wife and all five of our children.  LOL
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Offline Incognito777

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2013, 01:11:16 AM »
What of the saints who were astrologers (Daniel 5:11)?

Daniel was not an astrologer. He was appointed by a pagan king head of the astrologers. God condemned divination in several Old Testament passages (astrology is a form of divination) and astrology specifically in Isaiah 47.

Offline Incognito777

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #26 on: July 23, 2013, 01:14:55 AM »
I think it should be mentioned that astrology as a method of magic or fortune-telling is strictly forbidden for Christians; however, as a more general system of thinking about the heavens, the Church fathers tended to accept aspects of it. The main objection was to any notion that our fates are determined by the planets and stars, but they accepted that the heavenly bodies could influence events on earth in some way.

The Fathers believe heavenly bodies could influence events on earth? Who? Cite a specific passage.

St. Ephraim the Syrian:

"Regard not spells and divinations, for that is communion with Satan."( Homily on Admonition and Repentance).

St. Cyril of Jerusalem:

"Also give heed neither to observations of the stars nor auguries, nor omens, nor to the fabulous divinations of the Greeks. Witchcraft, and enchantment, and the wicked practices of necromancy, admit not even to a hearing."

"The watching of birds, divination, omens, or amulets, or charms written on leaves, sorceries, or other evil arts, and all such things, are services of the devil; therefore shun them." (Catechetical Lectures).

Offline Incognito777

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #27 on: July 23, 2013, 01:17:38 AM »
Daniel was most certainly a magician as was Moses before him.

False. Magic is condemned in the Mosaic law. See for example, Deuteronomy 18. There are nurmerous passages where God, through Moses, condemns magic and astrology.

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Re: Horiscopes?
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2013, 05:23:12 PM »
Can anyone explain that?