Studying_Orthodoxy
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« on: February 10, 2013, 05:39:09 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2013, 05:40:18 PM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff  |
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Shanghaiski
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« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2013, 05:44:04 PM » |
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Not everything one reads is true.
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O Master Lord our God...who are wondrous in glory; who keeps his covenant and his mercy to them who love him with all their heart; who has given us redemption...through his only-begotten son, Jesus Christ...the life of everyone, the help of those who flee to him, the hope of those who cry to him.
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NicholasMyra
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« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2013, 05:44:47 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
Well, no scholars agree with those ideas, so I would discard them. |
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OrthoNoob
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« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2013, 05:58:14 PM » |
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Greek for Jesus: Ιησουσ. (pron. Yé-soos or Yee-soos)
Greek for Zeus: Ζευσ. (pron. Zyoos or Zefs)
They're not pronounced similarly. They're not spelled similarly. Iesous is a form of Hebrew Joshua. Zeus clearly is not.
Ridiculous idea. Pay no attention to it.
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Shanghaiski
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2013, 06:04:29 PM » |
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I remember going to a strange Greek candle shop and asking the lady there, because at the time I knew no Greek, if John in Greek was "ioannos" or "Ioannis," and she said, "Whatever you want it to be."
Zeus=Jesus is just more bizarre etymological relativism.
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O Master Lord our God...who are wondrous in glory; who keeps his covenant and his mercy to them who love him with all their heart; who has given us redemption...through his only-begotten son, Jesus Christ...the life of everyone, the help of those who flee to him, the hope of those who cry to him.
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Achronos
What's so good about Cincinnati? You like it? You think Cincinnati is cool? I've never heard anyone say, 'I'm going to Cincinnati on vacation.'
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And we gave him the Rolling Stone cover?!
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« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2013, 06:09:13 PM » |
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Yup.
Hey Zeus!
Or atleast that's what the Mexicans say.
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“Without music, life would be a mistake.”
“The last capitalist we hang shall be the one who sold us the rope.”
"Face the facts of being what you are, for that is what changes what you are."
"We see at once that the words absolute, divine, eternal, and so on do not express what is implied in them.
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2013, 06:12:04 PM » |
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Yup.
Hey Zeus!
Or atleast that's what the Mexicans say.
I wish Jesus and Satan played the same sport.  Speaking of which, I thought Satan was associated with hell and fire, why is he playing ice hockey? |
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« Last Edit: February 10, 2013, 06:12:37 PM by Asteriktos »
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Achronos
What's so good about Cincinnati? You like it? You think Cincinnati is cool? I've never heard anyone say, 'I'm going to Cincinnati on vacation.'
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And we gave him the Rolling Stone cover?!
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« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2013, 06:14:22 PM » |
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Because hell has frozen over.
Ba dum tish
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“Without music, life would be a mistake.”
“The last capitalist we hang shall be the one who sold us the rope.”
"Face the facts of being what you are, for that is what changes what you are."
"We see at once that the words absolute, divine, eternal, and so on do not express what is implied in them.
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orthonorm
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« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2013, 07:40:56 PM » |
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Yup.
Hey Zeus!
Or atleast that's what the Mexicans say.
Brilliant. |
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We cannot legislate morality by passing laws controlling firearms. The only evil we can combat lies within our hearts. We need stronger laws to protect the moral foundation of society against the evil of gay marriage. |
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orthonorm
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« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2013, 07:41:22 PM » |
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Yup.
Hey Zeus!
Or atleast that's what the Mexicans say.
I wish Jesus and Satan played the same sport. Speaking of which, I thought Satan was associated with hell and fire, why is he playing ice hockey? Dante much? |
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We cannot legislate morality by passing laws controlling firearms. The only evil we can combat lies within our hearts. We need stronger laws to protect the moral foundation of society against the evil of gay marriage. |
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Αριστοκλής
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« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2013, 09:47:54 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. |
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"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
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LBK
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« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2013, 09:52:26 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. I wouldn't waste my time doing so, A. The whole idea is a complete crock, historically and linguistically. OrthoNoob is dead right. |
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pmpn8rGPT
我不會說中國話
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יהוה יעזור לנו
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« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2013, 10:15:42 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
IIRC, the name "Jesus" is an English transliteration of the Latin transliteration of the Greek transliteration of the Original Hebrew Name "Yeshua" (the "s" sound at the end is the masculine end to many names in Greek if I've been told correctly, also the "j" sound was added at the beginning so it would be easier for people with German accents). Whoever told you it was a pagan name has no idea what he was talking about, all it was was a sad case of over-transliteration. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZtWlmjH35w |
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טוֹב, לַחֲסוֹת בַּיהוָה-- מִבְּטֹחַ, בָּאָדָם.
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Αριστοκλής
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« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2013, 08:23:38 AM » |
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I understand LBK's point and your erudition, but depending on the content of these "materials", I have another direction to go, MAYBE, or maybe not.
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"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2013, 08:25:50 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
'Ἰησοῦς and Ζεύς are quite different in Greek. Even the pronounciation is vastly different. Edit: OrthoNoob already said the same and gave more details. |
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« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 08:30:56 AM by Cyrillic »
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Arachne
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Tending Brigid's flame
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« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2013, 08:35:01 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. I put down money that this pile of twaddle is among said materials. |
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The reason why clichés are so satisfying is because the truth never loses its residual force. Blog ~ Bookshelf ~ Jukebox |
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Pericles
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« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2013, 09:22:39 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. I've heard that one before and even though I think a case can be made for Iesous being a Greek name I don't think the Zeus etymology works. A better case can be made for Iesous being the male form of Iaso. |
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Graecia capta ferum victorem cepit.
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Santagranddad
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« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2013, 09:24:46 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. I wouldn't waste my time doing so, A. The whole idea is a complete crock, historically and linguistically. OrthoNoob is dead right. Amen |
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Pericles
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« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2013, 09:29:29 AM » |
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"Originally, the name of the Messiah
was , pronounced Yahushua" This particular twaddle has been doing the rounds for about 20 years now and I remember thinking yeah that must be right. unfortunately it's a reconstruction based on a false assumption and explained completely wrong. If Jesus had been originally Yehushua it would have been Latinised as Joshua, not Jesus.
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Graecia capta ferum victorem cepit.
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Αριστοκλής
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« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2013, 09:56:15 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. I put down money that this pile of twaddle is among said materials. If that is the OP's source then LBK is correct totally and I must redefine "twaddle" personally to something more odious. |
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"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
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LBK
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« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2013, 09:59:57 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. I put down money that this pile of twaddle is among said materials. If that is the OP's source then LBK is correct totally and I must redefine "twaddle" personally to something more odious. Arachne can speak for herself, of course, but I'm sure her choice of word was out of politeness, the generosity of which is hardly justified, given the sheer stupidity of the premise of the OP.  |
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Apostolos
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« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2013, 11:33:28 AM » |
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יהושע > Ἰησοῦς > Jesus, is of Semitic origin. Ζεῦς > Zeus, is of Proto-Indo-European root *dyeu- : to gleam, to shine, cognate with Latin Deus, dies, Sanskrit दिवा divA (daytime). The Greek εὐδία which means fair weather and the Sanskrit सुदिव (sudiva), which means bright or fine day are of the same origin. |
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Αριστοκλής
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« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2013, 12:09:29 PM » |
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יהושע > Ἰησοῦς > Jesus, is of Semitic origin. Ζεῦς > Zeus, is of Proto-Indo-European root *dyeu- : to gleam, to shine, cognate with Latin Deus, dies, Sanskrit दिवा divA (daytime). The Greek εὐδία which means fair weather and the Sanskrit सुदिव (sudiva), which means bright or fine day are of the same origin. Close to where I considered going. This is further to follow on this line in pre-Christian, 5th century usage, but no matter, now that we see, perhaps, from where this may have originated. Where is Studying_Orthodoxy, I wonder? |
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"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
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OrthoNoob
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« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2013, 01:54:42 PM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
'Ἰησοῦς and Ζεύς are quite different in Greek. Even the pronounciation is vastly different. Edit: OrthoNoob already said the same and gave more details. Yes, but I appreciate your correct use of polytonic Greek and final sigmas. |
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Jetavan
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« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2013, 02:10:25 PM » |
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Reminds me of the ancient Roman equation of Yahweh Sabaoth with Jove Sabazius.
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« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 02:16:12 PM by Jetavan »
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
I'm not a witch.
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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James2
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« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2013, 02:40:53 PM » |
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By Jupiter, who'd've thunk it!
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Studying_Orthodoxy
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« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2013, 10:16:36 AM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff It is not very obscure. It is linked to the beliefs about the cross being a pagan symbol and that Christianity is sun worship. Not everything one reads is true.
Indeed it is not. Well, no scholars agree with those ideas, so I would discard them. Quite a few do. There are many discussions about Christianity being based on the old religions of Babylon, Egypt and Rome. Greek for Jesus: Ιησουσ. (pron. Yé-soos or Yee-soos)
Greek for Zeus: Ζευσ. (pron. Zyoos or Zefs)
They're not pronounced similarly. They're not spelled similarly. Iesous is a form of Hebrew Joshua. Zeus clearly is not.
Ridiculous idea. Pay no attention to it.
Thank you for clarifying. It may indeed be possible that they have no evidence for this claim. This claim is made by many in the Scared Name Movement. Zeus=Jesus is just more bizarre etymological relativism. That may indeed be the case. I hope it is. I would like to read these materials before I tender an opinion. You can find them all over the internet. IIRC, the name "Jesus" is an English transliteration of the Latin transliteration of the Greek transliteration of the Original Hebrew Name "Yeshua" (the "s" sound at the end is the masculine end to many names in Greek if I've been told correctly, also the "j" sound was added at the beginning so it would be easier for people with German accents). Whoever told you it was a pagan name has no idea what he was talking about, all it was was a sad case of over-transliteration. Well this idea comes from a larger set of ones that Christianity is based on paganism or sun worship. Therefore they want to say that the Christ of Christianity was a different person, not Jesus but a man who had a Hebrew name. Yes this is one example of these sorts of ideas. Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. I've heard that one before and even though I think a case can be made for Iesous being a Greek name I don't think the Zeus etymology works. A better case can be made for Iesous being the male form of Iaso. Understood and what would be the implication of this? |
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Nephi
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Ecumenism Lite
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« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2013, 12:23:18 PM » |
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This claim is made by many in the Scared Name Movement. The divisions within the Sacred Name movement are funny: Yahweh vs Yahuwah, Yahusha vs Yeshua, etc. |
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« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 12:23:27 PM by Nephi »
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2013, 01:52:04 PM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff It is not very obscure. It is linked to the beliefs about the cross being a pagan symbol and that Christianity is sun worship. I've been on theology forums of various stripes for 15 years, and read hundreds of theology books, and I can't remember coming across the idea before. But then I don't usually get into these types of subjects, so maybe I'm just showing how clueless I am |
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Jetavan
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« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2013, 02:07:30 PM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff It is not very obscure. It is linked to the beliefs about the cross being a pagan symbol and that Christianity is sun worship. I've been on theology forums of various stripes for 15 years, and read hundreds of theology books, and I can't remember coming across the idea before. But then I don't usually get into these types of subjects, so maybe I'm just showing how clueless I am Psalm 84:11 "For the Lord God is a sun and shield." |
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
I'm not a witch.
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #31 on: February 12, 2013, 02:14:21 PM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff It is not very obscure. It is linked to the beliefs about the cross being a pagan symbol and that Christianity is sun worship. I've been on theology forums of various stripes for 15 years, and read hundreds of theology books, and I can't remember coming across the idea before. But then I don't usually get into these types of subjects, so maybe I'm just showing how clueless I am Psalm 84:11 "For the Lord God is a sun and shield." What does that have to do with the idea that "the name Jesus the same as Zeus," which is what I was referring to?  |
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Jetavan
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« Reply #32 on: February 12, 2013, 04:05:16 PM » |
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I've never heard of this before... you must be reading some pretty obscure stuff It is not very obscure. It is linked to the beliefs about the cross being a pagan symbol and that Christianity is sun worship. I've been on theology forums of various stripes for 15 years, and read hundreds of theology books, and I can't remember coming across the idea before. But then I don't usually get into these types of subjects, so maybe I'm just showing how clueless I am Psalm 84:11 "For the Lord God is a sun and shield." What does that have to do with the idea that "the name Jesus the same as Zeus," which is what I was referring to? Just suggesting that the sun is a universally acknowledged symbol of divinity, so claiming that Christianity is sun worship, is not saying a whole lot. |
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« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 04:05:32 PM by Jetavan »
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
I'm not a witch.
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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psalm110
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Orthodox Christian
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« Reply #33 on: February 12, 2013, 07:16:38 PM » |
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Greek for Jesus: Ιησουσ. (pron. Yé-soos or Yee-soos)
Greek for Zeus: Ζευσ. (pron. Zyoos or Zefs)
They're not pronounced similarly. They're not spelled similarly. Iesous is a form of Hebrew Joshua. Zeus clearly is not.
Ridiculous idea. Pay no attention to it.
1+ That's right there is no pagan origin of the name of Iesous from Zeus, the Alexandrian Jews when translating the Old Hebrew Into the Greek Septuagit translated Joshua the Son of Nun as "Iesous" Joshua LXX 1και εγενετο μετα την τελευτην μωυση ειπεν κυριος τω ιησοι υιω ναυη τω υπουργω μωυση λεγων. (Koine Greek) |
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« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 07:17:49 PM by psalm110 »
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Incognito777
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« Reply #34 on: February 13, 2013, 12:39:50 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
It sounds like the pagan- parallelomania or pagan-copy cat thesis, refuted in the first half of the 20th century. These books destroy the pagan copy cat thesis. Written by non-Orthodox scholars, but still beneficial. Strobel, The Case for the Real Jesus, pp.157-187. Nash, The Gospel and the Greeks. Holding, Shattering the Christ Myth. Mettinger, The Riddle of Resurrection. Yamauchi, Persia and the Bible. |
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psalm110
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« Reply #35 on: February 13, 2013, 06:28:22 AM » |
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I'm interested in seeing Jewish Greek Literature using the name Iesous, does anyone know of any Jewish Literature which uses Iesous?.
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #36 on: February 13, 2013, 06:29:23 AM » |
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I'm interested in seeing Jewish Greek Literature using the name Iesous, does anyone know of any Jewish Literature which uses Iesous?.
The Septuagint. |
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Kerdy
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« Reply #37 on: February 13, 2013, 06:30:27 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
I think this was developed in the same room as the X-Men, or was it The Hulk. |
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"Let it be understood that those who are not found living as He taught are not Christian- even though they profess with the lips the teaching of Christ." - Justin Martyr ( c.160 )
"we recognize that the war is ultimately spiritual rather than carnal." - Gebre Menfes Kidus
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Kerdy
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« Reply #38 on: February 13, 2013, 06:31:15 AM » |
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Yup.
Hey Zeus!
Or atleast that's what the Mexicans say.
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"Let it be understood that those who are not found living as He taught are not Christian- even though they profess with the lips the teaching of Christ." - Justin Martyr ( c.160 )
"we recognize that the war is ultimately spiritual rather than carnal." - Gebre Menfes Kidus
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #39 on: February 13, 2013, 06:32:18 AM » |
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Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
Huh? |
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psalm110
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« Reply #41 on: February 13, 2013, 07:07:33 AM » |
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I'm interested in seeing Jewish Greek Literature using the name Iesous, does anyone know of any Jewish Literature which uses Iesous?.
The Septuagint. Apart from our Bible, is it found in any Greek Talmudic or other Jewish commentary ?. |
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Alpo
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« Reply #42 on: February 13, 2013, 07:24:43 AM » |
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Of late I have been reading some materials which say that the name Jesus is the same as Zeus. Apparently this name is also a curse in Latin. What are peoples opinions on this?
Welcome to the forum, Mr. Panos!  |
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Just a little reminder: this forum is not called OrthodoxChristianityUSA.net  |
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Apostolos
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« Reply #43 on: February 13, 2013, 08:05:01 AM » |
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I'm interested in seeing Jewish Greek Literature using the name Iesous, does anyone know of any Jewish Literature which uses Iesous?.
As Cyrillic posted, in Septuagint the book called "Ἰησοῦς τοῦ Ναυὴ" (Greek doesn't make a distinction between the name of the Lord, Jesus, and Joshua of Navi, they're both named «Ἰησοῦς») |
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