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podkarpatska
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« Reply #450 on: February 21, 2013, 09:34:39 AM » |
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Peter J
Formerly PJ
Taxiarches
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Faith: In-communion-with-Rome
Posts: 5,097
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« Reply #451 on: February 21, 2013, 10:31:25 AM » |
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I see. And you would separate the two? (Ecclesiology from faithfulness to tradition) I don't really get it, but okay.  Do you think you cannot practice your faith just because a bishop is claiming universal ordinary jurisdiction? I think the issue is more that he claims it dogmatically. Not necessarily, but when you cannot openly teach against errors embraced and propagated by said infallible and universal bishop and/or his particular church, it does seem to create problems...and cognitive dissonance among those beneath said bishop in such a scheme who happen to know better.  The fight wasn't for me, but there are those who recognize the problems but chose to persevere to remain in that communion in the hopes that they can bring about change. We should pray for such people and support them. Key word being "remain". It's not like I left Orthodoxy for Catholicism. (Well, key for me anyhow. I'm aware of course that there are many Catholics who say "If I were Orthodox, I would convert to Catholicism.") |
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"That last part was a joke."
- Samuel L. Jackson, Unbreakable
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choy
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« Reply #452 on: February 21, 2013, 11:56:58 AM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek No. He should translate the Divine Liturgy in Latin and people wouldn't know the difference between a Tridentine Mass. Seriously, nobody speaks Latin.   |
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Monk Vasyl
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« Reply #453 on: February 21, 2013, 12:07:29 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek No. He should translate the Divine Liturgy in Latin and people wouldn't know the difference between a Tridentine Mass. Seriously, nobody speaks Latin. Italians would understand it somewhat. I studies Latin and Italian in the Franciscan seminary and would often onfuse the 2. My Latin professor also taught me Latin and always got a good laugh out of my mistakes. I remember a Catholic priest asking some Italians how they liked the Mass in Italian, they responded, "Wasn't it always in Italian?" |
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The unworthy hierodeacon, Vasyl
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ialmisry
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« Reply #454 on: February 21, 2013, 12:49:55 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it?  |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #455 on: February 21, 2013, 01:38:13 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek No. He should translate the Divine Liturgy in Latin and people wouldn't know the difference between a Tridentine Mass. Seriously, nobody speaks Latin. I do  And did you watch the video of Patriarch John X's enthronement liturgy? One of the supplications was in Latin. So a Latin DL is possible. Erasmus translated the DL in Latin, I think. |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 01:42:24 PM by Cyrillic »
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #456 on: February 21, 2013, 01:38:50 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? It has happened in the past.  |
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ialmisry
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« Reply #457 on: February 21, 2013, 02:07:30 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek No. He should translate the Divine Liturgy in Latin and people wouldn't know the difference between a Tridentine Mass. Seriously, nobody speaks Latin. I do And did you watch the video of Patriarch John X's enthronement liturgy? One of the supplications was in Latin. So a Latin DL is possible. Erasmus translated the DL in Latin, I think. My priest does all the "inaudible" prayers during DL in Latin, and does the Hours in Latin. |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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That person
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Long live Commie Superman
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« Reply #458 on: February 21, 2013, 04:22:08 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? Because of the significant price and effort involved in converting thousands of sanctuaries into ones acceptable for use in the Eastern Rites and training priests to practice them? |
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"Some have such command of their bowels, that they can break wind continuously at pleasure, so as to produce the effect of singing."- St. Augustine of Hippo
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ialmisry
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« Reply #459 on: February 21, 2013, 04:30:08 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? Because of the significant price and effort involved in converting thousands of sanctuaries into ones acceptable for use in the Eastern Rites and training priests to practice them? I've seen it done many a time, with far less resources than the Vatican has. Roll out an icon screen across the boundary of the nave and transept, get those "Italo-Greek Albanian Catholics" whose Metropolitan resides in the Vatican (their only remaining monastery is located in Rome), and voila! |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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Romaios
Elder
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Jurisdiction: Romanian
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« Reply #460 on: February 21, 2013, 04:34:15 PM » |
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Roll out an icon screen across the boundary of the nave and transept, get those "Italo-Greek Albanian Catholics" whose Metropolitan resides in the Vatican (their only remaining monastery is located in Rome), and voila!
Not much left there... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXhybe--OvsThis is their commercial video: Basilian Monks of Grottaferrata |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 04:36:37 PM by Romaios »
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sheenj
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St. Gregorios of Parumala, pray for us...
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« Reply #461 on: February 21, 2013, 04:35:14 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? Because of the significant price and effort involved in converting thousands of sanctuaries into ones acceptable for use in the Eastern Rites and training priests to practice them? NVM, did not read context... |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 04:36:38 PM by sheenj »
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choy
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« Reply #462 on: February 21, 2013, 05:20:22 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? Because of the significant price and effort involved in converting thousands of sanctuaries into ones acceptable for use in the Eastern Rites and training priests to practice them? Just give them a book with the rubrics to follow. I heard RC priests are very good at following rubrics. |
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ialmisry
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« Reply #463 on: February 21, 2013, 05:41:36 PM » |
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Roll out an icon screen across the boundary of the nave and transept, get those "Italo-Greek Albanian Catholics" whose Metropolitan resides in the Vatican (their only remaining monastery is located in Rome), and voila!
Not much left there... therein lies a cautionary tale. |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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Monk Vasyl
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« Reply #464 on: February 21, 2013, 05:41:54 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? Because of the significant price and effort involved in converting thousands of sanctuaries into ones acceptable for use in the Eastern Rites and training priests to practice them? Just give them a book with the rubrics to follow. I heard RC priests are very good at following rubrics. HA! Not since Vatican II. When I was with the Franciscans, I was working on my Masters in Liturgical Studies at Notre Dame. We were told if a priest wanted to "experiment" with the Liturgy, there were enough options in the liturgical books to use. The Guardian at our friary, refused to follow the rubrics and did whatever he felt like, which drove me crazy, and finally pushed me out of the Franciscans and out of the Catholic church into Orthodoxy. |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 05:44:22 PM by Monk Vasyl »
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The unworthy hierodeacon, Vasyl
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choy
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« Reply #465 on: February 21, 2013, 05:57:31 PM » |
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HA! Not since Vatican II. When I was with the Franciscans, I was working on my Masters in Liturgical Studies at Notre Dame. We were told if a priest wanted to "experiment" with the Liturgy, there were enough options in the liturgical books to use. The Guardian at our friary, refused to follow the rubrics and did whatever he felt like, which drove me crazy, and finally pushed me out of the Franciscans and out of the Catholic church into Orthodoxy.
So I guess no open door Anaphoras for you? |
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Jetavan
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« Reply #466 on: February 21, 2013, 06:47:09 PM » |
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Rev. James Martin, S.J.: Here are 12 reasons why you should elect me pope, which I'm calling: Twelve Reasons Why You Should Elect Me Pope.
1. I'm a man. That's half the battle, right?
2. I'm baptized. And I've got the papers to prove it. No birther controversy here.
....
9. Educated. The Jesuit training process is really, really, really long. I can't even remember how many years I was in studies. That means that I studied philosophy (good to know), theology (really good to know) and a whole lot of other stuff like church history, which I think would be pretty helpful as pope. And guess what? I know Ancient Greek, too. That really impresses the scholarly types in the church. E.g., when scholars ask me, "What translation of the New Testament are you using?" I'll say, "My translation." They love that kind of thing. Plus, that appeals to the Ancient-Greek-speaking demographic that the church may have given up on. |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 06:50:34 PM by Jetavan »
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
I'm not a witch.
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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Romaios
Elder
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Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Romanian
Posts: 1,199
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« Reply #467 on: February 21, 2013, 07:28:13 PM » |
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Roll out an icon screen across the boundary of the nave and transept, get those "Italo-Greek Albanian Catholics" whose Metropolitan resides in the Vatican (their only remaining monastery is located in Rome), and voila!
Not much left there... therein lies a cautionary tale. Chevetogne (Belgium) seems to be doing much better. Monastère de Chevetogne |
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« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 07:30:18 PM by Romaios »
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orthros
Jr. Member
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Faith: Melkite-Greek Catholic
Jurisdiction: Eparchy of Newton
Posts: 60
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« Reply #468 on: February 22, 2013, 01:48:26 AM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? It has happened in the past. Wow, nice pic. Which Pope is that? |
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biro
Ursus maritimus
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Jurisdiction: Metropolis of Atlanta
Posts: 9,801
Και κλήρονομον δείξον με, ζωής της αιωνίου
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« Reply #469 on: February 22, 2013, 04:22:18 AM » |
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With that headgear, I think Pope Paul VI. But I'm guessing.
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phthalyl.podomatic.com | the-cornet.blogspot.com | https://soundcloud.com/meteor___ Charlie Rose: If you could change one thing about the world, what would it be? Fran Lebowitz: Everything. There is not one thing with which I am satisfied. |
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #470 on: February 22, 2013, 04:26:35 AM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? It has happened in the past. Wow, nice pic. Which Pope is that? John XXXIII |
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choy
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« Reply #471 on: February 22, 2013, 04:40:26 AM » |
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John XXXIII
I didn't realize there were that many Popes named John as of today. |
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orthros
Jr. Member
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Jurisdiction: Eparchy of Newton
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« Reply #472 on: February 22, 2013, 08:26:14 AM » |
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John XXXIII
I didn't realize there were that many Popes named John as of today. I can't tell if you're joking (the joys of the internet!)  but Cyrillic put in one too many "X"s. He meant John XXIII. |
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Cyrillic
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« Reply #473 on: February 22, 2013, 08:29:37 AM » |
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John XXXIII
I didn't realize there were that many Popes named John as of today. I can't tell if you're joking (the joys of the internet!) but Cyrillic put in one too many "X"s. He meant John XXIII. Oops  |
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ialmisry
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« Reply #474 on: February 22, 2013, 09:16:46 AM » |
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John XXXIII
I didn't realize there were that many Popes named John as of today. I can't tell if you're joking (the joys of the internet!) but Cyrillic put in one too many "X"s. He meant John XXIII. Although there have been more: the late supreme pontiff specifically took the XXIII to make the real Pope John XXIII (1410–1415) an "anti-pope" five centuries and a half after his papacy. |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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Iconodule
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« Reply #475 on: February 22, 2013, 09:23:27 AM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Given its present rules, it can happen now. Question: why doesn't it? It has happened in the past. He seems to be looking at the guy in front of him, murmuring, "Am I holding these right?" "You're holding them fine but you've dripped some wax down the back of my neck." |
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"A Poet a Painter a Musician an Architect: the Man Or Woman who is not one of these is not a Christian." - William Blake
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Peter J
Formerly PJ
Taxiarches
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Faith: In-communion-with-Rome
Posts: 5,097
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« Reply #477 on: February 22, 2013, 10:11:03 AM » |
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John XXXIII
I didn't realize there were that many Popes named John as of today. I can't tell if you're joking (the joys of the internet!) but Cyrillic put in one too many "X"s. He meant John XXIII. Although there have been more: the late supreme pontiff specifically took the XXIII to make the real Pope John XXIII (1410–1415) an "anti-pope" five centuries and a half after his papacy. I don't know if this branch will sprout, but in case it does I've started a thread Ialmisry on Anti-Pope John XXIII. |
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"That last part was a joke."
- Samuel L. Jackson, Unbreakable
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Charles Martel
Traditional Roman Catholic
Moderated
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« Reply #478 on: February 24, 2013, 11:10:54 AM » |
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Pope, on last Sunday, says following God's wishesThe Lord is calling me to climb onto the mountain, to dedicate myself even more to prayer and meditation," he said to cheers of "Long Live the Pope".
"But this does not mean abandoning the Church. Actually, if God asks this of me, it is precisely because I can continue to serve her with the same dedication and the same love I have shown so far," he said.
But he said he would be serving the Church "in a way more in keeping with my age and my forces".http://news.yahoo.com/pope-last-sunday-says-following-gods-wishes-142139668.html
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Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio, contra nequitiam et insidias diaboli esto praesidium.
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choy
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« Reply #479 on: February 24, 2013, 11:59:03 AM » |
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What if they elect him again?
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Peter J
Formerly PJ
Taxiarches
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Posts: 5,097
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« Reply #480 on: February 24, 2013, 02:33:14 PM » |
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What if they elect him again?
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"That last part was a joke."
- Samuel L. Jackson, Unbreakable
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Michał Kalina
proud Podlachian Belarusian parajournalistic engineer in spe
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Hypatos
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Posts: 15,883
OC.net's trickster
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« Reply #481 on: February 24, 2013, 02:37:18 PM » |
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What if they elect him again?
Or if they elect Patriarch Cyrill? |
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formerly known as mikeDespite being a Polish citizen I am not a Pole.  Long live Belarus! "It's my constitutional right!" |
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biro
Ursus maritimus
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Και κλήρονομον δείξον με, ζωής της αιωνίου
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« Reply #482 on: February 24, 2013, 02:59:36 PM » |
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What if they elect him again?
Or if they elect Patriarch Cyrill? Huzzah! |
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phthalyl.podomatic.com | the-cornet.blogspot.com | https://soundcloud.com/meteor___ Charlie Rose: If you could change one thing about the world, what would it be? Fran Lebowitz: Everything. There is not one thing with which I am satisfied. |
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orthonorm
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« Reply #483 on: February 24, 2013, 03:44:30 PM » |
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What if they elect him again?
I know you are being clever, but a question for the RC experts, can someone choose not serve (or whatever word is most appropriate) as Pope. If the office is declined, is there a penance? |
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We cannot legislate morality by passing laws controlling firearms. The only evil we can combat lies within our hearts. We need stronger laws to protect the moral foundation of society against the evil of gay marriage. |
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William
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« Reply #484 on: February 24, 2013, 04:57:56 PM » |
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podkarpatska
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« Reply #485 on: February 24, 2013, 07:46:30 PM » |
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The folks posting that apparently are (1): not aware of what constitutes satire and (2): I would hate to see what they think of us Orthodox. |
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choy
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« Reply #486 on: February 24, 2013, 08:18:15 PM » |
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I mean, soon to be Cardinal Ratzinger again is the most qualified to be Pope. Aside from being a well respected theologian in and outside of the Roman Catholic Church, his experience as Pope is unparalleled by any other living bishop today. |
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William
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« Reply #487 on: February 24, 2013, 08:22:44 PM » |
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The folks posting that apparently are (1): not aware of what constitutes satire and (2): I would hate to see what they think of us Orthodox. Well from stuff I've read on his blog he kind of has dumb ideas about how Orthodoxy "rejects the atonement" or something. But his videos are funny. |
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Papist
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« Reply #488 on: February 25, 2013, 10:22:22 AM » |
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What if they elect him again?
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"The only-begotten Son of God, wanting us to be partakers of his divinity, assumed our human nature so that, having become man, he might make men gods." - St. Thomas Aquinas
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Peter J
Formerly PJ
Taxiarches
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Posts: 5,097
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« Reply #489 on: February 25, 2013, 04:10:30 PM » |
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What if they elect him again?
Cool. It's been a while since we had a two-term pope.  |
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"That last part was a joke."
- Samuel L. Jackson, Unbreakable
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FormerReformer
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« Reply #490 on: February 25, 2013, 04:29:54 PM » |
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The folks posting that apparently are (1): not aware of what constitutes satire and (2): I would hate to see what they think of us Orthodox. I don't know, aside from the jab in the credits (and the show is Lutheran Satire), it was remarkably positive toward the Roman Catholic Church's traditional stance. As far as a satire goes, it was a dead-on shot at a lot of the really inane statements made by the peanut gallery (I include us Orthodox OC.netters in that category) as to what is needed in the next pope. More ire was directed at the Episcopal Church and Glee than at the Vatican- and I am totally okay with that. |
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"Funny," said Lancelot, "how the people who can't pray say that prayers are not answered, however much the people who can pray say they are." TH White Oh, no: I've succumbed to Hyperdoxy! |
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Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)
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« Reply #491 on: February 25, 2013, 05:06:58 PM » |
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Or maybe the Eastern Pope will do away with the Roman Rite and just use the Byzantine Rite. That was what I had in mind. Imagine, millions and millions of people thinking they're watching Christmas Pontifical Mass on TV and suddenly there's an iconostasis and the Pope appears in his omophorion and starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom...". It would be even better if it's in Greek Actually, it would have more impac if he said it in Italian. |
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Peter J
Formerly PJ
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« Reply #492 on: February 25, 2013, 06:40:01 PM » |
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More ire was directed at the Episcopal Church and Glee than at the Vatican- and I am totally okay with that.
I am shocked -- shocked -- to learn that criticism of the Episcopal Church is going on here! |
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"That last part was a joke."
- Samuel L. Jackson, Unbreakable
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FormerReformer
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« Reply #493 on: February 25, 2013, 06:44:24 PM » |
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More ire was directed at the Episcopal Church and Glee than at the Vatican- and I am totally okay with that.
I am shocked -- shocked -- to learn that criticism of the Episcopal Church is going on here! Your winnings, sir. |
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"Funny," said Lancelot, "how the people who can't pray say that prayers are not answered, however much the people who can pray say they are." TH White Oh, no: I've succumbed to Hyperdoxy! |
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CoptoGeek
of Alexandria, the Christ-loving City
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« Reply #494 on: February 26, 2013, 11:58:17 AM » |
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What if they elect him again?
Cool. It's been a while since we had a two-term pope. Just when I thought I was out... http://youtu.be/UPw-3e_pzqU |
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"Be oppressed, rather than the oppressor. Be gentle, rather than zealous. Lay hold of goodness, rather than justice." -St. Isaac of of Nineveh
"Men never do evil so cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" -Pascal
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