Author Topic: The Pope to resign?!?! / Pope Benedict XVI resigns / Pope set to resign on Feb. 28th  (Read 20695 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,256
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Have you shed your own liberal tendencies?

Tough, I heard that he was a proponent of liberal beliefs ( as head of the Pontifical council for Justice and Peace they recently issued a statement calling for world currency and government).  As a European American I'm proud of my culture,  religion,  and heritage and wish to see those things preservfor posterity.  If that's not PC to some people, then too bad.  I'm not a very PC person and make no bones about it. People of all races and colors are welcome in the Big Ten of the Roman Church, But people like myself would like to see that shirt continue to be becenter in Europe and certainly not become the religious equivalent to the Obama administration and all its policies.
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

You disgust me.
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline Balthasar

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 324

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 09:44:24 AM by ialmisry »
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

"Africa is great and all, but seriously guys, a white guy said something last century that I think completely trumps reality, so let's all focus on that."

Europe is the faith, my behind. Haven't seen Mass attendance rates in Europe at any point in the last decade or so I take it, Robb? They're not great, and hardly likely to improve.

Oddly enough, all indications point to African priests re-evangelizing the West, in direct contradiction of your unfounded idea that the African Catholic Church would place the needs of third world countries ahead of those of Europe (that they're doing the opposite, in fact, when they could very easily make the case that they need to tend to in-country needs is, frankly, amazing and highly commendable; when was the last time you went to Africa to serve the RCC faithful there?). Unless you think that Africans are too stupid to walk and chew gum at the same time, I don't see how such a ridiculous, insulting string of thoughts could ever enter your mind.

I hope you get a chance to meet some African Catholics some day, Robb. Many put the average Anglo/Euro-Catholic to shame in the strength of their devotions.
Btw, it was the first African archbishop of Rome, St. Victor I, who introduced the Latin mass to Rome.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,045
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




You never miss a chance, do you?
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline biro

  • Excelsior
  • Site Supporter
  • Hoplitarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 16,057
  • Leave me alone, I was only singing
    • Alaska Volcanoes
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOAA
No fascist Italian has ever been held responsible?

Mussolini was strung up by his toes. Not exactly getting out of it lightly.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline TheMathematician

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,836
  • Formerly known as Montalo
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: ACROD
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
There is no Archbishop of Rome, because the leader of the Diocese of Rome is entitled the Bishop of Rome, of which the office of the Pope is the same.

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
There is no Archbishop of Rome, because the leader of the Diocese of Rome is entitled the Bishop of Rome, of which the office of the Pope is the same.
this is the bishop of Rome


As for the Vatican hierarchy, I am aware that the archbishoprick of Rome has been abolished, like the Patriarchate of the West, in favor of the "supreme pontiff."
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
There is no Archbishop of Rome, because the leader of the Diocese of Rome is entitled the Bishop of Rome, of which the office of the Pope is the same.
this is the bishop of Rome


No, he is not.

Offline TheMathematician

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,836
  • Formerly known as Montalo
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: ACROD
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
There is no Archbishop of Rome, because the leader of the Diocese of Rome is entitled the Bishop of Rome, of which the office of the Pope is the same.
this is the bishop of Rome


As for the Vatican hierarchy, I am aware that the archbishoprick of Rome has been abolished, like the Patriarchate of the West, in favor of the "supreme pontiff."

I'm not even going to argue your semantics game, but that diocese has always just been that, a diocese, not an archdiocese.

(And to argue your point, that is the Metropolitian of Italy, not Rome)

Offline Jetavan

  • Argumentum ad australopithecum
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,580
  • Barlaam and Josaphat
    • The Mystical Theology
"(Reuters) - Pope Benedict had a heart pacemaker installed some time ago but was not suffering from poor health and remained lucid and serene in the wake of his decision to resign, the Vatican spokesman said on Tuesday."


Sursum corda.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 10:38:36 AM by Jetavan »
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,767
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

"Africa is great and all, but seriously guys, a white guy said something last century that I think completely trumps reality, so let's all focus on that."

Europe is the faith, my behind. Haven't seen Mass attendance rates in Europe at any point in the last decade or so I take it, Robb? They're not great, and hardly likely to improve.

Oddly enough, all indications point to African priests re-evangelizing the West, in direct contradiction of your unfounded idea that the African Catholic Church would place the needs of third world countries ahead of those of Europe (that they're doing the opposite, in fact, when they could very easily make the case that they need to tend to in-country needs is, frankly, amazing and highly commendable; when was the last time you went to Africa to serve the RCC faithful there?). Unless you think that Africans are too stupid to walk and chew gum at the same time, I don't see how such a ridiculous, insulting string of thoughts could ever enter your mind.

I hope you get a chance to meet some African Catholics some day, Robb. Many put the average Anglo/Euro-Catholic to shame in the strength of their devotions.
We have a priest from Uganda at my parish right now. He is probably one the holiest priests I have met.
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
Amongst all the jokes and wishful thinking and speculation, I'm surprised no one has mentioned this, yet. ;)

Metropolitan Hilarion of Volokolamsk comments on reports about Pope
Benedict XVI’s retirement:

Quote
Reports about the retirement of Pope Benedict XVI have proved to be unexpected even for his closest associates. Cardinal Sodano described it as ‘a thunder out of a clear sky’. Really, there have been no precedents of this kind in the modern history of the Roman Catholic Church. Pope John Paul II remained in office to the end despite his serious health problems.

Meanwhile, the office of the Roman Pontiff, just as that of any head of a Church, presupposes active work. It is not a ceremonial office. If one’s age and health prove to be an obstacle for effective work, the head of a Church may decide to retire. In recent years, the Catholic Church has come to face very serious challenges which require new incentives to come from the See of Rome. Perhaps, precisely this has made the pope to give way to a younger and more dynamic prelate to be elected by the conclave of cardinals. The Pope Benedict XVI’s decision to leave his office in the present situation may be seen as an act of personal courage and humbleness.
Full article here: http://www.pravoslavie.ru/english/59407.htm
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline Balthasar

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 324
No fascist Italian has ever been held responsible?

Mussolini was strung up by his toes. Not exactly getting out of it lightly.

You mean, the Mussolini who has been praised by the former Italian PM, Berlusconi as "good leader"?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/28/world/europe/berlusconi-praises-mussolini-as-good-leader.html?_r=0


Offline TheMathematician

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,836
  • Formerly known as Montalo
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: ACROD
When he eventually dies, will he be given the burial fitting of a pope, or reflecting his state at this death?

Offline biro

  • Excelsior
  • Site Supporter
  • Hoplitarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 16,057
  • Leave me alone, I was only singing
    • Alaska Volcanoes
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOAA
Balthazar- So what?

What does Berlusconi have to do with the Second World War?

Again, Mussolini is dead and the war is over. What are you talking about?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 10:43:39 AM by biro »
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline Jetavan

  • Argumentum ad australopithecum
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,580
  • Barlaam and Josaphat
    • The Mystical Theology
When he eventually dies, will he be given the burial fitting of a pope, or reflecting his state at this death?
The former, I suspect and hope.
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,045
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair
No fascist Italian has ever been held responsible?

Mussolini was strung up by his toes. Not exactly getting out of it lightly.

You mean, the Mussolini who has been praised by the former Italian PM, Berlusconi as "good leader"?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/28/world/europe/berlusconi-praises-mussolini-as-good-leader.html?_r=0



I must confess, I fail to see your point.
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
No fascist Italian has ever been held responsible?

Mussolini was strung up by his toes. Not exactly getting out of it lightly.

You mean, the Mussolini who has been praised by the former Italian PM, Berlusconi as "good leader"?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/28/world/europe/berlusconi-praises-mussolini-as-good-leader.html?_r=0



I must confess, I fail to see your point.

This, perhaps?
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline Shanghaiski

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,978
  • Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia
I'd like to see a pope come from an Arab land like Lebanon, Palestine, Syria, or such places. 

I wonder how the Russian Orthodox Church would feel if His Beatitude Sviatoslav of the Ukrainian Catholics become Pope.

Wouldn't happen for several reasons, but if it did, it still wouldn't happen due to many interesting forms of highly radioactive isotopes.
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
I'd like to see a pope come from an Arab land like Lebanon, Palestine, Syria, or such places. 

I wonder how the Russian Orthodox Church would feel if His Beatitude Sviatoslav of the Ukrainian Catholics become Pope.

Wouldn't happen for several reasons, but if it did, it still wouldn't happen due to many interesting forms of highly radioactive isotopes.

So, what you're saying is, even if it did happen it wouldn't happen?   ;D ;D
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline Schultz

  • Christian. Guitarist. Scooterist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,537
  • Scion of the McKeesport Becks.
No fascist Italian has ever been held responsible?

Mussolini was strung up by his toes. Not exactly getting out of it lightly.

You mean, the Mussolini who has been praised by the former Italian PM, Berlusconi as "good leader"?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/28/world/europe/berlusconi-praises-mussolini-as-good-leader.html?_r=0



And he was castigated by the Italian media (and people) for his comment.

He's also awaiting trial for schtupping an underage stripper.
"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
I hope that its not that African Cardinal ( Peter Tongo something)
I heard rumors that he might be an Afro Marxist eho would either favor third world nations over the desperately needed re evangelization of European nations.  He could also try to liberalize or Africanize the RC liturgy and theology / morality.  We need to reme.mber as Belloc said Europe is the faith and vis a versa. Other nations have the place but we should always take care of our mother first

they haven't elected a bishop of Rome for some time.  It's been an election for "supreme pontiff," in which Italy is just another province.

Maybe he can stay on as archbishop of Rome for the Vatican, and let them elect a different "supreme pontiff."
There is no Archbishop of Rome, because the leader of the Diocese of Rome is entitled the Bishop of Rome, of which the office of the Pope is the same.
this is the bishop of Rome


No, he is not.
According to the Sacred Canons of the Orthodox Church and the Statute of the Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate, yes, he is.

I'm not even going to argue your semantics game, but that diocese has always just been that, a diocese, not an archdiocese.
Not according to the Acts of the Ecumenical Councils, and the Orthodox practice of the Catholic Church.
(And to argue your point, that is the Metropolitian of Italy, not Rome)
According to the Sacred Canons of the Orthodox Church and the Statute of the Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate, no, he is not.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline age234

  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 555
OK so:

Quote
Statement by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew
At the Announcement of the Retirement of Benedict XVI, Pope of Rome
(February 11, 2013)

It is with regret that we have learned of the decision by His Holiness Pope Benedict to retire from his Throne, because with his wisdom and experience he could have provided much more to the Church and the world.

(...)

From the Phanar, we pray that the Lord will manifest his worthy successor as the head of the sister Church of Rome, and that we may also continue with this successor on our common journey toward the unity of all unto the glory of God.

Not sure what to make of the part in bold. That's not precisely how I would choose to word it. I mean, we can be respectful and wish him well, but this is a bit too much IMO.

link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013

post editted for our copyright policy - MK
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:47:27 AM by Michał Kalina »

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
When he eventually dies, will he be given the burial fitting of a pope, or reflecting his state at this death?
The former, I suspect and hope.
Someone with a degree in their canon law said it would be the former.  After all, at the funeral, they are are all former popes, whether they died in office or not.  Perhaps symbolic of that, they used to make it official that the pope had died by hitting him on the head with a silver hammer and calling his baptismal-not regnal-name.  If he didn't answer after the third knock, the see officially became sede vacante.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
OK so:

Quote
Statement by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew
At the Announcement of the Retirement of Benedict XVI, Pope of Rome
(February 11, 2013)

It is with regret that we have learned of the decision by His Holiness Pope Benedict to retire from his Throne, because with his wisdom and experience he could have provided much more to the Church and the world.

(...)

From the Phanar, we pray that the Lord will manifest his worthy successor as the head of the sister Church of Rome, and that we may also continue with this successor on our common journey toward the unity of all unto the glory of God.

Not sure what to make of the part in bold. That's not precisely how I would choose to word it. I mean, we can be respectful and wish him well, but this is a bit too much IMO.

link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013

post editted for our copyright policy - MK



Maybe that's why you're not the Patriarch and His All-Holiness Bartholomew is  ;D.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:49:10 AM by Michał Kalina »
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
OK so:

Quote
Statement by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew
At the Announcement of the Retirement of Benedict XVI, Pope of Rome
(February 11, 2013)

It is with regret that we have learned of the decision by His Holiness Pope Benedict to retire from his Throne, because with his wisdom and experience he could have provided much more to the Church and the world.

(...)

From the Phanar, we pray that the Lord will manifest his worthy successor as the head of the sister Church of Rome, and that we may also continue with this successor on our common journey toward the unity of all unto the glory of God.

Not sure what to make of the part in bold. That's not precisely how I would choose to word it. I mean, we can be respectful and wish him well, but this is a bit too much IMO.

link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013

post editted for our copyright policy - MK

Where did you copy that from?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:49:49 AM by Michał Kalina »

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
According to the Sacred Canons of the Orthodox Church and the Statute of the Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate, yes, he is.

We were discussing that a few times and every time you failed to prove your claims.

Offline age234

  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 555
OK so:

Quote
Statement by His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew
At the Announcement of the Retirement of Benedict XVI, Pope of Rome
(February 11, 2013)

It is with regret that we have learned of the decision by His Holiness Pope Benedict to retire from his Throne, because with his wisdom and experience he could have provided much more to the Church and the world.

(...)

From the Phanar, we pray that the Lord will manifest his worthy successor as the head of the sister Church of Rome, and that we may also continue with this successor on our common journey toward the unity of all unto the glory of God.

Not sure what to make of the part in bold. That's not precisely how I would choose to word it. I mean, we can be respectful and wish him well, but this is a bit too much IMO.

link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013

post editted for our copyright policy - MK

Where did you copy that from?

An email sent from the GOARCH press office to their email subscribers.

[edit] link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:50:17 AM by Michał Kalina »

Offline ialmisry

  • There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 38,668
According to the Sacred Canons of the Orthodox Church and the Statute of the Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate, yes, he is.

We were discussing that a few times and every time you failed to prove your claims.
I posted the relevant Canons, Constitution, and Statute.  Their claims speak for themselves. And us.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Shanghaiski

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,978
  • Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




You never miss a chance, do you?

He never visited Ethiopia, but he sent his Portuguese henchmen to make converts.
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,045
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




You never miss a chance, do you?

He never visited Ethiopia, but he sent his Portuguese henchmen to make converts.
Yes, but that wasn't my point. I just don't understand, why he had to make a post that has absolutely nothing to do with this thread.
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




You never miss a chance, do you?

He never visited Ethiopia, but he sent his Portuguese henchmen to make converts.
Yes, but that wasn't my point. I just don't understand, why he had to make a post that has absolutely nothing to do with this thread.

Hey, it was *bound* to happen eventually  :angel:
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline Cyrillic

  • Arbiter Elegantiarum
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,783
  • Cyrillico est edere orbem universum
I hope Pope Benedict will write a more in-depth book on the Church Fathers than the one that he already wrote about the subject now that he has some free time. I liked the first one but would like to see a bigger one.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:47:35 AM by Cyrillic »
"April is the cruellest month, breeding
lilacs out of the dead land, mixing
memory and desire, stirring
dull roots with spring rain."
-T.S. Eliot

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
An email sent from the GOARCH press office to their email subscribers.

[edit] link: http://www.goarch.org/news/epbartholomew-benedict-02112013

Thank you. I ask you to observe our copyright policy next time.

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
According to the Sacred Canons of the Orthodox Church and the Statute of the Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate, yes, he is.

We were discussing that a few times and every time you failed to prove your claims.
I posted the relevant Canons, Constitution, and Statute.  Their claims speak for themselves. And us.

Apparently, you are mistaken.

" His Grace SILUAN ŞPAN, Bishop of the Romanian Orthodox Diocese for Italy"

"Preasfintitul Părinte SILUAN, Episcopul Ortodox Român al Italiei "


http://www.patriarhia.ro/en/roc_structure/mseuropesynod.html

http://www.patriarhia.ro/ro/structura_bor/mitr_meridionale.html
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 12:01:00 PM by Michał Kalina »

Offline Jetavan

  • Argumentum ad australopithecum
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,580
  • Barlaam and Josaphat
    • The Mystical Theology
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.

Offline Shanghaiski

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,978
  • Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia

Wooow! ??? A Roman Catholic Pope gets more attention in an Orthodox forum than Orthodox church leaders. What could be the reason?  ::)

Anyways, just before the beginning of the 2nd World War, fascist Italy carried out a systematic mass extermination campaign in Ethiopia with poison gas sprayed from airplanes and other horrific atrocities that claimed the lives of no less than 1,000,000 Ethiopian men, women and children, including the entire monastic community at the historic Debre Libanos Monastery ...from that time until now, no fascist Italian has ever been held accountable for the genocide of the Ethiopian people from 1935-1941, nor has the Vatican ever apologized for its complicity which are conveyed by Pope Pius XI's support of Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia: The Holy Father remained "conspicuously silent" while Vatican clergy blessed fascist military troops, and their weapons, before they departed to carryout Mussolini's "civilizing mission" in Ethiopia.

Do you know that a Catholic Pope never visited one of the oldest Christian nations, Ethiopia?




You never miss a chance, do you?

He never visited Ethiopia, but he sent his Portuguese henchmen to make converts.
Yes, but that wasn't my point. I just don't understand, why he had to make a post that has absolutely nothing to do with this thread.

I don't know. It's rare for that to happen here.
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,767
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
Because then that would reflect badly on Catholics, which is always a good thing.  ;D
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 12:08:31 PM by Papist »
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline Shanghaiski

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,978
  • Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Not the resignation itself.

Besides, there must be plenty of Eastern Orthodox patriarchs who have resigned.
Quote from: GabrieltheCelt
If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
Quote from: orthonorm
I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Offline Jetavan

  • Argumentum ad australopithecum
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,580
  • Barlaam and Josaphat
    • The Mystical Theology
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
In other words, does Orthodoxy see it as part of its tradition, the idea that patriarchs or bishops can resign voluntarily?
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
In other words, does Orthodoxy see it as part of its tradition, the idea that patriarchs or bishops can resign voluntarily?

They can and did.

Offline J Michael

  • Older than dirt; dumber than a box of rocks; colossally ignorant; a little crazy ;-)
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,448
  • Lord, have mercy! I live under a rock. Alleluia!
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
In other words, does Orthodoxy see it as part of its tradition, the idea that patriarchs or bishops can resign voluntarily?


They can and did.

Anyone in particular come to mind?
"May Thy Cross, O Lord, in which I seek refuge, be for me a bridge across the great river of fire.  May I pass along it to the habitation of life." ~St. Ephraim the Syrian

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug." ~ Mark Knopfler (?)

Offline mike

  • The Jerk
  • Stratopedarches
  • **************
  • Posts: 22,098
  • Scarecrow is watching you
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Makurian Orthodox
Does the Pope's resignation reflect a more Western, CEO model of ministry, as compared to the Orthodox, more 'fatherly', model of ministry?

Why would it?
In other words, does Orthodoxy see it as part of its tradition, the idea that patriarchs or bishops can resign voluntarily?


They can and did.

Anyone in particular come to mind?

Metropolitan Jonah? To name the most recent one...