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Author Topic: Gay Illegal Immigrants becoming Legal  (Read 872 times) Average Rating: 0
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Deep Roots
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« on: February 07, 2013, 06:47:26 PM »

Have you guys heard about the proposals to allow illegal immigrants to use gay marriages as a means of getting a green card and becoming legal?s

What do you guys all think about that?!!?!

Just kidding, I know how you feel about it.
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« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2013, 07:20:19 PM »

Just kidding, I know how you feel about it.
So you have another username on this board?

How do you know how we feel about it?
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« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2013, 07:22:47 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
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« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2013, 07:25:48 PM »

Just kidding, I know how you feel about it.
So you have another username on this board?

How do you know how we feel about it?
Well maybe folks can weigh in and we'll see if my suspicions were right or wrong.

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« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2013, 07:26:10 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?
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« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2013, 07:26:44 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?
Truth...
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« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2013, 07:40:06 PM »

Have you guys heard about the proposals to allow illegal immigrants to use gay marriages as a means of getting a green card and becoming legal?s

What do you guys all think about that?!!?!

About the same as I think of using heterosexual marriage as a means of getting a green card to become legal.
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« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2013, 07:45:39 PM »

Have you guys heard about the proposals to allow illegal immigrants to use gay marriages as a means of getting a green card and becoming legal?s

What do you guys all think about that?!!?!

About the same as I think of using heterosexual marriage as a means of getting a green card to become legal.
In opposition or support?

If you oppose, you're saying you oppose the scenario in which, say, a Canadian or a Frenchman, marries an American and then becomes a citizen via the green card route?
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« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2013, 08:27:38 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
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« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2013, 08:29:57 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
qft
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« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2013, 08:33:04 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
qft
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« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2013, 08:36:58 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
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« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2013, 09:20:21 PM »

In opposition or support?

I'm saying that obtaining citizenship in any country should not be the sole or primary motivation for marriage with anyone.
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« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2013, 09:25:32 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.

o.O
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« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2013, 09:36:25 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
Huh
Citizenship = rights, nationalism = values. There is virtually no connection between the two at all.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2013, 09:37:06 PM by AustralianDiaspora » Logged

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« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2013, 09:50:23 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
Huh
Citizenship = rights, nationalism = values. There is virtually no connection between the two at all.
Citizenship is an affiliation with a group [i.e. nation] at the exclusion of others. It is the most fundamental component of modern nationalism.
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« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2013, 09:56:12 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
Huh
Citizenship = rights, nationalism = values. There is virtually no connection between the two at all.
Nah.
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« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2013, 09:57:15 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
Huh
Citizenship = rights, nationalism = values. There is virtually no connection between the two at all.
Not much on history I see.
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« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2013, 10:18:17 PM »

In opposition or support?

I'm saying that obtaining citizenship in any country should not be the sole or primary motivation for marriage with anyone.

And in the United States, marriage is hardly an automatic route to citizenship.
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« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2013, 10:32:10 PM »

In opposition or support?

I'm saying that obtaining citizenship in any country should not be the sole or primary motivation for marriage with anyone.
that wasn't part of the scenario.

Obviously I would not condone that, either.
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« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2013, 11:44:42 AM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.
Huh
Citizenship = rights, nationalism = values. There is virtually no connection between the two at all.
Citizenship is an affiliation with a group [i.e. nation] at the exclusion of others. It is the most fundamental component of modern nationalism.
That still doesn't mean that citizenship automatically makes someone nationalist, which is what was being suggested. One can be a citizen without being a nationalist in terms of values. The concept of national pride is a completely made up concept to excuse all kinds of racist horrors.

Quote
Not much on history I see.
What was the purpose of this? Did you just have a tickle and feel like deriding someone without actually contributing anything meaningful? Congrats, how Christian of you.
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« Reply #21 on: February 09, 2013, 11:56:26 AM »

*mental gymnastics* ^^
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« Reply #22 on: February 09, 2013, 12:31:27 PM »

^Signature of the month nominee!
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« Reply #23 on: February 09, 2013, 01:16:35 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.

No its not.

Citizenship is a legal status in a political institution such as a city or a state. The relationship between a citizen and the institution that confers this status is formal, and in contemporary liberal-democratic models includes both a set of rights that the citizen possesses by virtue of this relationship, and a set of obligations or duties that they owe to that institution and their fellow citizens in return.

Nationality, on the other hand, denotes informal membership in or identification with a particular nation (which is not a synonym for country or state).[1] While nationality is sometimes conferred as a legal status (see below), it and nations are properly understood as social categories, characterised by at least a common language, culture and territory, and sometimes also by a common religious faith and a purportedly shared ancestry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citizenship_and_nationality
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« Reply #24 on: February 09, 2013, 01:27:02 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
qft

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« Reply #25 on: February 09, 2013, 02:00:36 PM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.
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« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2013, 02:04:28 PM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.

"Thou shalt not snark" said no commandment ever.
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« Reply #27 on: February 09, 2013, 02:20:18 PM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.

This forum is unbecoming of a Christian forum.
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« Reply #28 on: February 09, 2013, 02:31:26 PM »

That still doesn't mean that citizenship automatically makes someone nationalist, which is what was being suggested. One can be a citizen without being a nationalist in terms of values. The concept of national pride is a completely made up concept to excuse all kinds of racist horrors.
You are focusing on only the most radical characteristics of nationalism. Were there no national pride, it is unlikely that independent states would exist entirely. For the most part, any identification with one segment of humanity (over another) is a form of nationalism. This can be almost anything (ethnicity, religion, race, etc.) The modern state (and its corresponding citizenship) is entirely based on nationalistic principles. Concepts like "American", "British", "Chinese", etc. only exist because they stand in opposition to rest of humanity (that is, "non-American", "non-British", "non-Chinese", etc.)
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« Reply #29 on: February 09, 2013, 02:36:15 PM »

Nationalism is the tool of capitalism, there's no reason to deny anyone citizenship.
Citizenship is nationalism.

No its not.

Citizenship is a legal status in a political institution such as a city or a state. The relationship between a citizen and the institution that confers this status is formal, and in contemporary liberal-democratic models includes both a set of rights that the citizen possesses by virtue of this relationship, and a set of obligations or duties that they owe to that institution and their fellow citizens in return.

Nationality, on the other hand, denotes informal membership in or identification with a particular nation (which is not a synonym for country or state).[1] While nationality is sometimes conferred as a legal status (see below), it and nations are properly understood as social categories, characterised by at least a common language, culture and territory, and sometimes also by a common religious faith and a purportedly shared ancestry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citizenship_and_nationality
Notice I didn't say nationalism is citizenship.
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« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2013, 06:22:36 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
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« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2013, 11:08:43 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?
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« Reply #32 on: February 09, 2013, 11:31:41 PM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?

How can a private individual be said to 'recognise' or 'not recognise' legal bonds between homosexuals?
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« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2013, 12:11:21 AM »

Have you guys heard about the proposals to allow illegal immigrants to use gay marriages as a means of getting a green card and becoming legal?s

What do you guys all think about that?!!?!

Just kidding, I know how you feel about it.

Which part of the topic do you want us to focus on?  Homosexuality, homosexual "marriage", illegal immigration, green cards, becoming a legal resident...which one?
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« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2013, 12:12:44 AM »

Have you guys heard about the proposals to allow illegal immigrants to use gay marriages as a means of getting a green card and becoming legal?s

What do you guys all think about that?!!?!

About the same as I think of using heterosexual marriage as a means of getting a green card to become legal.
In opposition or support?

If you oppose, you're saying you oppose the scenario in which, say, a Canadian or a Frenchman, marries an American and then becomes a citizen via the green card route?

But now, you are changing the dynamics.  Are the Canadian or Frenchman in America legally or illegally?  Are they homosexual or heterosexual?  Are they applying for legal residency? 
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« Reply #35 on: February 10, 2013, 12:14:44 AM »

In opposition or support?

I'm saying that obtaining citizenship in any country should not be the sole or primary motivation for marriage with anyone.

And in the United States, marriage is hardly an automatic route to citizenship.

Or anything else for that matter.
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« Reply #36 on: February 10, 2013, 12:25:16 AM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?

How can a private individual be said to 'recognise' or 'not recognise' legal bonds between homosexuals?
Some private individuals (e.g., hoteliers) might refuse service to homosexuals with legal bonds.
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« Reply #37 on: February 10, 2013, 12:55:37 AM »

I think the purpose of this thread being started fizzled out.  May I suggest next time use a poll and provide clearer intentions.
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« Reply #38 on: February 10, 2013, 01:00:07 AM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?
Would not recognize a legal bond between ANY contract marriage.  They are another form of pseudo-marriage and a scandalous finger in the eye of the sanctity and sacrament of marriage.
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« Reply #39 on: February 10, 2013, 01:01:35 AM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?

How can a private individual be said to 'recognise' or 'not recognise' legal bonds between homosexuals?
Some private individuals (e.g., hoteliers) might refuse service to homosexuals with legal bonds.

OK. Fair enough.
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« Reply #40 on: February 10, 2013, 02:03:35 AM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.

"Thou shalt not snark" said no commandment ever.

I heard a rumor there's an Armenian Saint Snark. Salpy may confirm or deny this. Though I don't think he has anything to do with snarkiness, unless the word "snark" is an Armenian import.
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« Reply #41 on: February 10, 2013, 02:05:52 AM »

This sounds like an awfully political topic...
more or less political than the Boy Scout thread, which appears in this same forum?

I don't see this as political at all.  Immigration is immigration.  Has nothing to do with a specific countries political system or beliefs. 

As a Christian, I cannot see matrimony as valid between homosexuals.  In my Christian perspective, this would make it impossible for me to recognize the spiritual bond between them.
Would you recognize any legal bond between them?

How can a private individual be said to 'recognise' or 'not recognise' legal bonds between homosexuals?
Some private individuals (e.g., hoteliers) might refuse service to homosexuals with legal bonds.

And be sued, fined, boycotted, tarred, and feathered.
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« Reply #42 on: February 10, 2013, 02:07:06 AM »

And be sued, fined, boycotted, tarred, and feathered.

Can't even refuse to make a wedding cake.
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« Reply #43 on: February 10, 2013, 06:56:14 AM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.

"Thou shalt not snark" said no commandment ever.

I heard a rumor there's an Armenian Saint Snark. Salpy may confirm or deny this. Though I don't think he has anything to do with snarkiness, unless the word "snark" is an Armenian import.
That's funny cos I'm pretty certain there's a fair bit in the NT that teaches us how to treat each other, and nowhere did it say that using condescension and making cruel little jabs at other people was Christian behaviour. Perhaps before we type our comments, we should consider how those words are going to make the person on the receiving end feel (would that be Christian??).
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« Reply #44 on: February 10, 2013, 05:46:27 PM »

I hope one day these threads can occur without the double dose of snark. It's really getting old and tiring and is very unbecoming of a Christian discussion forum.

"Thou shalt not snark" said no commandment ever.

I heard a rumor there's an Armenian Saint Snark. Salpy may confirm or deny this. Though I don't think he has anything to do with snarkiness, unless the word "snark" is an Armenian import.
That's funny cos I'm pretty certain there's a fair bit in the NT that teaches us how to treat each other, and nowhere did it say that using condescension and making cruel little jabs at other people was Christian behaviour. Perhaps before we type our comments, we should consider how those words are going to make the person on the receiving end feel (would that be Christian??).

Perhaps you should read Our Lord's invective toward the 'brood of vipers' and the 'wicked and adulterous generation' again. Or for the first time. Whichever fits.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2013, 05:46:55 PM by OrthoNoob » Logged

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