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« Reply #5535 on: February 17, 2014, 09:32:45 AM »

One 2012 Gallup survey had 46% of Americans as claiming to believe in creationism. But a new, more precisely worded poll reveals a lower percentage. If creationism is defined as holding three positions -- (1) Humans did not evolve from other species; (2) God was involved in the creation of humans; and (3) Humans were created within the last 10,000 years -- then only 14% of Americans claimed to believe in all three. And only 9% of Americans claimed to believe in an evolutionary process without the involvement of supernatural forces.
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« Reply #5536 on: February 21, 2014, 01:26:21 AM »

As I was rereading Genesis tonight a question came to mind that I'd like to ask people of the young earth creationist approach.  Regarding part of the flood narratives mentioned, especially in Gen. 8:1-3, I'm curious about...

Quote
"And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters assuaged; The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained; And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated." - KJV

"But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down," - NIV

What was the purpose and result of the wind mentioned in verse one? If this is what caused the waters to recede, either as a primary or at least significant secondary cause, then how did this happen?
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« Reply #5537 on: February 21, 2014, 05:25:52 AM »

My personal belief is that the soul is immortal while the body is ever-changing, leaving room for physical evolution.  Also, God gave us our intelligence to discern the world around us; to deny the overwhelming evidence of evolution almost disgraces those gifts.

So the logic of man outweighs the word of God? You dont think he created you in his image. You think he created morphing life that became human over billion of years. So its your spin on these events.. What you want to believe, forget what God says.

The big question is, what research have you done to see other side of this 'overwhelming evidence'? Probably none (like most people). So, you will be willingly ignorant to support your own beliefe system of man. Yup.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2014, 05:27:19 AM by Cackles » Logged

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« Reply #5538 on: February 21, 2014, 05:39:54 AM »

My personal belief is that the soul is immortal while the body is ever-changing, leaving room for physical evolution.  Also, God gave us our intelligence to discern the world around us; to deny the overwhelming evidence of evolution almost disgraces those gifts.

So the logic of man outweighs the word of God? You dont think he created you in his image. You think he created morphing life that became human over billion of years. So its your spin on these events.. What you want to believe, forget what God says.
ISTM that you're pretty good at replacing what God says with your own goofy logic, so why shouldn't Rhinosaur be free to do the same?

The big question is, what research have you done to see other side of this 'overwhelming evidence'? Probably none (like most people). So, you will be willingly ignorant to support your own beliefe system of man. Yup.
What research have you done, Cackles?
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« Reply #5539 on: February 21, 2014, 11:35:26 AM »

As I was rereading Genesis tonight a question came to mind that I'd like to ask people of the young earth creationist approach.  Regarding part of the flood narratives mentioned, especially in Gen. 8:1-3, I'm curious about...

Quote
"And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters assuaged; The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained; And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated." - KJV

"But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down," - NIV

What was the purpose and result of the wind mentioned in verse one? If this is what caused the waters to recede, either as a primary or at least significant secondary cause, then how did this happen?


I am guessing that any decent climatologist could take a creationist approach starting from non-traditional El Ninos and La Ninas, adding maybe an El Superhombre with the help of Supernino and Supernina to create atmospheric oscillations that would cause the flooding in all habitable lands and for its reversal.

Just a guess.
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« Reply #5540 on: February 21, 2014, 11:38:51 AM »

I am guessing that any decent climatologist could take a creationist approach starting from non-traditional El Ninos and La Ninas, adding maybe an El Superhombre with the help of Supernino and Supernina to create atmospheric oscillations that would cause the flooding in all habitable lands and for its reversal.

Just a guess.

I don't really know what that means, but it sounds like you are talking about a local flood, whereas YECs believe in a global flood...

Thoughts?
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« Reply #5541 on: February 21, 2014, 11:49:49 AM »

One 2012 Gallup survey had 46% of Americans as claiming to believe in creationism. But a new, more precisely worded poll reveals a lower percentage. If creationism is defined as holding three positions -- (1) Humans did not evolve from other species; (2) God was involved in the creation of humans; and (3) Humans were created within the last 10,000 years -- then only 14% of Americans claimed to believe in all three. And only 9% of Americans claimed to believe in an evolutionary process without the involvement of supernatural forces.

I hope this survey will get some coverage once the data is published.
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« Reply #5542 on: February 21, 2014, 11:53:20 AM »

One 2012 Gallup survey had 46% of Americans as claiming to believe in creationism. But a new, more precisely worded poll reveals a lower percentage. If creationism is defined as holding three positions -- (1) Humans did not evolve from other species; (2) God was involved in the creation of humans; and (3) Humans were created within the last 10,000 years -- then only 14% of Americans claimed to believe in all three. And only 9% of Americans claimed to believe in an evolutionary process without the involvement of supernatural forces.

I hope this survey will get some coverage once the data is published.
I don't personally know anyone that believe all 3.

PP
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« Reply #5543 on: February 21, 2014, 11:55:23 AM »

One 2012 Gallup survey had 46% of Americans as claiming to believe in creationism. But a new, more precisely worded poll reveals a lower percentage. If creationism is defined as holding three positions -- (1) Humans did not evolve from other species; (2) God was involved in the creation of humans; and (3) Humans were created within the last 10,000 years -- then only 14% of Americans claimed to believe in all three. And only 9% of Americans claimed to believe in an evolutionary process without the involvement of supernatural forces.

I hope this survey will get some coverage once the data is published.
I don't personally know anyone that believe all 3.

PP
I know quite a few.
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« Reply #5544 on: February 21, 2014, 12:29:39 PM »

My personal belief is that the soul is immortal while the body is ever-changing, leaving room for physical evolution.  Also, God gave us our intelligence to discern the world around us; to deny the overwhelming evidence of evolution almost disgraces those gifts.

So the logic of man outweighs the word of God? You dont think he created you in his image. You think he created morphing life that became human over billion of years. So its your spin on these events.. What you want to believe, forget what God says.
ISTM that you're pretty good at replacing what God says with your own goofy logic, so why shouldn't Rhinosaur be free to do the same?

The big question is, what research have you done to see other side of this 'overwhelming evidence'? Probably none (like most people). So, you will be willingly ignorant to support your own beliefe system of man. Yup.
What research have you done, Cackles?

All my stuff is derived from Priest and Rabbi's. Usually directly copying their stance on things. What I say hopefully brings people closer to God.

Believing that we have another creator beside God basically x's out God. It holds doubt and denies His glory.

There are a couple of people like me on this forum that believe in all three. But thats only because we've done our due research. I've done 200 hours of research and it put my faith at a new level. I 'know' God is true rather than have 'faith'.

Lets put it this way, the gift of researching evolution, made me believe God is so real, it freaked me out realizing it was true and I immediatly submitted to Him. I even stopped eating pork to comply with His commandment. And I would have NEVER done this in the past. God blessed me in so many areas, the least I cam do is show Him i'm willing to go against the grain and obey him.

I had 2 McDonalds breakfast sausage and egg McMuffins in the fridge and fealt too guilty eating them when i found out I couldnt eat Pork. I actually have a smoker and used to make my own natural honey smoked bacon. It was GOOD too. But God knows best.
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« Reply #5545 on: February 21, 2014, 01:56:48 PM »

I had 2 McDonalds breakfast sausage and egg McMuffins in the fridge and fealt too guilty eating them when i found out I couldnt eat Pork. I actually have a smoker and used to make my own natural honey smoked bacon. It was GOOD too. But God knows best.

Yes, God knows best:

Quote
Acts 11

Now the apostles and the brethren who were in Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcision party criticized him, 3 saying, “Why did you go to uncircumcised men and eat with them?” 4 But Peter began and explained to them in order: 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying; and in a trance I saw a vision, something descending, like a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came down to me. 6 Looking at it closely I observed animals and beasts of prey and reptiles and birds of the air. 7 And I heard a voice saying to me, ‘Rise, Peter; kill and eat.’ 8 But I said, ‘No, Lord; for nothing common or unclean has ever entered my mouth.’ 9 But the voice answered a second time from heaven, ‘What God has cleansed you must not call common.’ 10 This happened three times, and all was drawn up again into heaven. 11 At that very moment three men arrived at the house in which we were, sent to me from Caesare′a. 12 And the Spirit told me to go with them, making no distinction. These six brethren also accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 And he told us how he had seen the angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and bring Simon called Peter; 14 he will declare to you a message by which you will be saved, you and all your household.’ 15 As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?” 18 When they heard this they were silenced. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life.”
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« Reply #5546 on: February 21, 2014, 10:33:28 PM »

My personal belief is that the soul is immortal while the body is ever-changing, leaving room for physical evolution.  Also, God gave us our intelligence to discern the world around us; to deny the overwhelming evidence of evolution almost disgraces those gifts.

So the logic of man outweighs the word of God? You dont think he created you in his image. You think he created morphing life that became human over billion of years. So its your spin on these events.. What you want to believe, forget what God says.
ISTM that you're pretty good at replacing what God says with your own goofy logic, so why shouldn't Rhinosaur be free to do the same?

The big question is, what research have you done to see other side of this 'overwhelming evidence'? Probably none (like most people). So, you will be willingly ignorant to support your own beliefe system of man. Yup.
What research have you done, Cackles?

All my stuff is derived from Priest and Rabbi's. Usually directly copying their stance on things. What I say hopefully brings people closer to God.

.....
There are a couple of people like me on this forum that believe in all three. But thats only because we've done our due research. I've done 200 hours of research

Will you name some of the materials which were part of these 200 hours please?  Does the first sentence mean that you only used religious texts and not biological or other scientific materials?  Thank you in advance.

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« Reply #5547 on: February 21, 2014, 10:43:42 PM »

My personal belief is that the soul is immortal while the body is ever-changing, leaving room for physical evolution.  Also, God gave us our intelligence to discern the world around us; to deny the overwhelming evidence of evolution almost disgraces those gifts.

So the logic of man outweighs the word of God? You dont think he created you in his image. You think he created morphing life that became human over billion of years. So its your spin on these events.. What you want to believe, forget what God says.
ISTM that you're pretty good at replacing what God says with your own goofy logic, so why shouldn't Rhinosaur be free to do the same?

The big question is, what research have you done to see other side of this 'overwhelming evidence'? Probably none (like most people). So, you will be willingly ignorant to support your own beliefe system of man. Yup.
What research have you done, Cackles?

All my stuff is derived from Priest and Rabbi's.
That's what I feared. You align yourself more with Orthodox Judaism than with Orthodox Christianity. Cry

Usually directly copying their stance on things. What I say hopefully brings people closer to God.
Except that we grow closer to God by following Christ's commandments and the teachings of the Apostles, not by becoming more Jewish.

Believing that we have another creator beside God basically x's out God. It holds doubt and denies His glory.

There are a couple of people like me on this forum that believe in all three. But thats only because we've done our due research. I've done 200 hours of research and it put my faith at a new level. I 'know' God is true rather than have 'faith'.
Bub, until you see Jesus face to face, your 'knowledge' of God will always be faith.

Lets put it this way, the gift of researching evolution, made me believe God is so real, it freaked me out realizing it was true and I immediatly submitted to Him. I even stopped eating pork to comply with His commandment. And I would have NEVER done this in the past. God blessed me in so many areas, the least I cam do is show Him i'm willing to go against the grain and obey him.

I had 2 McDonalds breakfast sausage and egg McMuffins in the fridge and fealt too guilty eating them when i found out I couldnt eat Pork. I actually have a smoker and used to make my own natural honey smoked bacon. It was GOOD too. But God knows best.
While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.
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« Reply #5548 on: February 21, 2014, 10:45:24 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy
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« Reply #5549 on: February 21, 2014, 11:08:05 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
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« Reply #5550 on: February 21, 2014, 11:10:39 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.
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« Reply #5551 on: February 21, 2014, 11:12:14 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

Well the guy who said it has a reputation for making stuff up, so I guess that's that.
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« Reply #5552 on: February 21, 2014, 11:32:27 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

We have had enough bacon roasting in the Church oven that the Fire Department made a spectacular Mother's Day visit, allowing all the kids to climb all over the truck. This is what happens when men cook the food.

The Fire Crew then enjoyed some bacon and other breakfast items..and got to chat with Father for a while...

So can't say that we avoid it at ours either.  Grin Grin
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« Reply #5553 on: February 21, 2014, 11:41:42 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

We have had enough bacon roasting in the Church oven that the Fire Department made a spectacular Mother's Day visit, allowing all the kids to climb all over the truck. This is what happens when men cook the food.

The Fire Crew then enjoyed some bacon and other breakfast items..and got to chat with Father for a while...

So can't say that we avoid it at ours either.  Grin Grin

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?
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« Reply #5554 on: February 21, 2014, 11:47:40 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

We have had enough bacon roasting in the Church oven that the Fire Department made a spectacular Mother's Day visit, allowing all the kids to climb all over the truck. This is what happens when men cook the food.

The Fire Crew then enjoyed some bacon and other breakfast items..and got to chat with Father for a while...

So can't say that we avoid it at ours either.  Grin Grin

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?
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« Reply #5555 on: February 21, 2014, 11:47:52 PM »

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?

I'd be very surprised if these were not cultural standards being propped up by dubious religious authority.  

I don't remember anything in the Rudder about dog meat being unclean for Christians; the closest thing I can think of is the "requirement" to reconsecrate a church if a dog enters within.  
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« Reply #5556 on: February 21, 2014, 11:50:16 PM »

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?

We?  You're still an inquirer, according to your profile.  Wink

There's a lot of "levitical" stuff in the wider tradition, whether or not it can be justified, and just about all of it predates the 20th century, so I wouldn't get too critical. 
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« Reply #5557 on: February 21, 2014, 11:51:26 PM »

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?

We?  You're still an inquirer, according to your profile.  Wink

There's a lot of "levitical" stuff in the wider tradition, whether or not it can be justified, and just about all of it predates the 20th century, so I wouldn't get too critical. 

Still a Christian though.  Smiley
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« Reply #5558 on: February 21, 2014, 11:58:41 PM »

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?

We?  You're still an inquirer, according to your profile.  Wink

There's a lot of "levitical" stuff in the wider tradition, whether or not it can be justified, and just about all of it predates the 20th century, so I wouldn't get too critical. 

Still a Christian though.  Smiley

Sure, but so are Pentecostals.  Tongue

I just think it's rude to criticise the "Genuine Orthodox" for stuff that was pretty common before 1900.  I don't think it can all be justified (some of it is certainly a type of Judaising), but it's not a quirk of Old Calendarists. 
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« Reply #5559 on: February 21, 2014, 11:59:39 PM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

We have had enough bacon roasting in the Church oven that the Fire Department made a spectacular Mother's Day visit, allowing all the kids to climb all over the truck. This is what happens when men cook the food.

The Fire Crew then enjoyed some bacon and other breakfast items..and got to chat with Father for a while...

So can't say that we avoid it at ours either.  Grin Grin

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?

Hey I wasn't endorsing these rules. I just said that I heard some people talk about them, but wasn't able to find confirmation anywhere else. Before writing it off completely I wanted to see if anyone else had heard of them.
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« Reply #5560 on: February 22, 2014, 12:02:09 AM »

It's kind of a moot point because I have no wish to eat reptiles or rodents. There is a canon of St John the Faster that says that if you drink water or wine from a vessel in which an "unclean" thing like a mouse has died, you must abstain from communion for three days. It wasn't clear from the text if it was because the animal itself was unclean, or because it died from drowning, i.e. with the blood still in it.
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« Reply #5561 on: February 22, 2014, 12:06:02 AM »

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?

I'd be very surprised if these were not cultural standards being propped up by dubious religious authority.  

I don't remember anything in the Rudder about dog meat being unclean for Christians; the closest thing I can think of is the "requirement" to reconsecrate a church if a dog enters within.  

It was tucked away in a footnote I think. I can try to find it if you're interested.
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« Reply #5562 on: February 22, 2014, 12:18:25 AM »

It was tucked away in a footnote I think. I can try to find it if you're interested.

Don't go through any trouble: if it's easy to find, I'm interested, but if not I'll take you at your word.  It's not unbelievable.  Wink
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« Reply #5563 on: February 22, 2014, 05:38:00 AM »

I had 2 McDonalds breakfast sausage and egg McMuffins in the fridge and fealt too guilty eating them when i found out I couldnt eat Pork. I actually have a smoker and used to make my own natural honey smoked bacon. It was GOOD too. But God knows best.

Yes, God knows best:

Quote
Acts 11

Now the apostles and the brethren who were in Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcision party criticized him, 3 saying, “Why did you go to uncircumcised men and eat with them?” 4 But Peter began and explained to them in order: 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying; and in a trance I saw a vision, something descending, like a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came down to me. 6 Looking at it closely I observed animals and beasts of prey and reptiles and birds of the air. 7 And I heard a voice saying to me, ‘Rise, Peter; kill and eat.’ 8 But I said, ‘No, Lord; for nothing common or unclean has ever entered my mouth.’ 9 But the voice answered a second time from heaven, ‘What God has cleansed you must not call common.’ 10 This happened three times, and all was drawn up again into heaven. 11 At that very moment three men arrived at the house in which we were, sent to me from Caesare′a. 12 And the Spirit told me to go with them, making no distinction. These six brethren also accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 And he told us how he had seen the angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and bring Simon called Peter; 14 he will declare to you a message by which you will be saved, you and all your household.’ 15 As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?” 18 When they heard this they were silenced. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life.”

If the above excuse was all it took, i wouldnt have entertained the idea. But I spent hours researching it and concluded that I must comply.

The above passage is about Peter associating himslef with gentiles. He was following a sect where Jews were not permitted to associate with gentiles because they were unclean. In the vision, God shows Peter the a tent with animals inside and tells him to kill. Peter takes it as OBVIOUS THAT HE COULDN'T MEAN TO EAT NON KOSHER. So the dream confused him. God says to not call something unclean that he has never made unclean. Then God tells peter right after that someone has come for him and to go. Peter ponders the vision and realizes it was about him not associating with the Gentile. He even admits it later on.

God doesnt change and go back on his word. I thought that this was rabinical created nonsense like Kosher. I had no idea that this was a direct commandment of God himself. So I had to comply after I read it because i am God fearing now and take it for real.

God's blessed me in my life since I attempted to walk with him.

When I went to St Josephs Auritory in montreal last Christmas eve, I acted like a tourist didnt pray, took pictures. Lit a candle asking my wife to take pictures. Looked at girls. Dissed the fact people were praying with their hamd touching themstatue of Mary.

On Christmas eve at 8pm or so, we went out to the parking lot and the car wouldnt start. God punished me for my disrespect. We were stranded in another town. I knew God punished us. My 2 year old in the car freezing while I'm trying my best to get it started. i tried for an hour straight with my cel phone lighting under the hood trying to pull fuses. Nothing worked. It was a nightmare.. We finally had to call our inlaws and it seriously put a damper on Christmas. We took a cab back and the trip was basically ruined because of that. I had no car and couldnt leave the house.. It was awful.

So if God knows, that i know the truth in the Bible and 'know better', then i have to comply.

I used to put my whole bacon in brine for a week woth nitrites, then put brown sugar and syrup and then colde smoke it. I put bacon on the pizzas and pasta with alfreado sauce.

But I got beef pepperoni and it actually tastes really good. The chicken bacon is still in the fridge but Im not holding high hopes Sad

I knew if i ate those Egg Mcmuffins in the fridge, God would get me. I litterally couldnt touch the pork after doing my due diligence and research on the matter. At first I just wanted to stay ignorant, but my consience got the better of me and i realized that God was expecting me to do my research. So I did and wow it was pretty cut and dry. My wife also isnt going to be eating pork. She never ate it much anyhow.

If you know me you'd know i hate people who are vegetarians and dont eat pork. i used tho think it was for people of the far left, Athiests, and religious zealots that have issues. But wow I cant believe me out of all people is doing some 'dietary restriction' and not eating pork no less.

But God had this rule for a divine reason. I'll do as he says because I believe he's real (thanks to all the evolution research.). It was hard letting go, but women are expected to do it with their hair, so i should be expected to do it with Pork. Its not so bad though.. Oh yes and shellfish is included with that also so next time at the buffet, no delicious shrimp. Sad
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« Reply #5564 on: February 22, 2014, 09:58:58 AM »


While you eat kosher with the Jews, I will be eating bacon and ham with the folks at my church.

Only until Sunday my friend...so don't rub it in too much!    Cheesy

Once at a church lunch I asked if the meat in the dish was pork and I was told that pork is never served at trapeza. Has anyone else ever heard of this unwritten rule?
No. For one wedding we had at my church a few years ago, the wedding party had a big pig roasting whole in a roaster.

We have had enough bacon roasting in the Church oven that the Fire Department made a spectacular Mother's Day visit, allowing all the kids to climb all over the truck. This is what happens when men cook the food.

The Fire Crew then enjoyed some bacon and other breakfast items..and got to chat with Father for a while...

So can't say that we avoid it at ours either.  Grin Grin

I have heard claims that some kinds of meat are considered "unclean", but I haven't been able to find any written evidence. Forbidden things would include flesh of reptiles and rodents. There was something in the Rudder that suggested dog flesh was considered unclean for Christians to eat, but that's the closest. Has anyone else ever come across this claim?

lol is this how legalistic the Genuine Orthodox are? Why don't we just institute levitical law?
That comment was uncalled for, even if you were just joking! I hope you plan to apologize to Jonathan for this.
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« Reply #5565 on: February 22, 2014, 10:05:59 AM »

I had 2 McDonalds breakfast sausage and egg McMuffins in the fridge and fealt too guilty eating them when i found out I couldnt eat Pork. I actually have a smoker and used to make my own natural honey smoked bacon. It was GOOD too. But God knows best.

Yes, God knows best:

Quote
Acts 11

Now the apostles and the brethren who were in Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcision party criticized him, 3 saying, “Why did you go to uncircumcised men and eat with them?” 4 But Peter began and explained to them in order: 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying; and in a trance I saw a vision, something descending, like a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came down to me. 6 Looking at it closely I observed animals and beasts of prey and reptiles and birds of the air. 7 And I heard a voice saying to me, ‘Rise, Peter; kill and eat.’ 8 But I said, ‘No, Lord; for nothing common or unclean has ever entered my mouth.’ 9 But the voice answered a second time from heaven, ‘What God has cleansed you must not call common.’ 10 This happened three times, and all was drawn up again into heaven. 11 At that very moment three men arrived at the house in which we were, sent to me from Caesare′a. 12 And the Spirit told me to go with them, making no distinction. These six brethren also accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 And he told us how he had seen the angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and bring Simon called Peter; 14 he will declare to you a message by which you will be saved, you and all your household.’ 15 As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?” 18 When they heard this they were silenced. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life.”

If the above excuse was all it took, i wouldnt have entertained the idea. But I spent hours researching it and concluded that I must comply.

The above passage is about Peter associating himslef with gentiles. He was following a sect where Jews were not permitted to associate with gentiles because they were unclean. In the vision, God shows Peter the a tent with animals inside and tells him to kill. Peter takes it as OBVIOUS THAT HE COULDN'T MEAN TO EAT NON KOSHER. So the dream confused him. God says to not call something unclean that he has never made unclean. Then God tells peter right after that someone has come for him and to go. Peter ponders the vision and realizes it was about him not associating with the Gentile. He even admits it later on.

God doesnt change and go back on his word. I thought that this was rabinical created nonsense like Kosher. I had no idea that this was a direct commandment of God himself. So I had to comply after I read it because i am God fearing now and take it for real.

God's blessed me in my life since I attempted to walk with him.

When I went to St Josephs Auritory in montreal last Christmas eve, I acted like a tourist didnt pray, took pictures. Lit a candle asking my wife to take pictures. Looked at girls. Dissed the fact people were praying with their hamd touching themstatue of Mary.

On Christmas eve at 8pm or so, we went out to the parking lot and the car wouldnt start. God punished me for my disrespect. We were stranded in another town. I knew God punished us. My 2 year old in the car freezing while I'm trying my best to get it started. i tried for an hour straight with my cel phone lighting under the hood trying to pull fuses. Nothing worked. It was a nightmare.. We finally had to call our inlaws and it seriously put a damper on Christmas. We took a cab back and the trip was basically ruined because of that. I had no car and couldnt leave the house.. It was awful.

So if God knows, that i know the truth in the Bible and 'know better', then i have to comply.

I used to put my whole bacon in brine for a week woth nitrites, then put brown sugar and syrup and then colde smoke it. I put bacon on the pizzas and pasta with alfreado sauce.

But I got beef pepperoni and it actually tastes really good. The chicken bacon is still in the fridge but Im not holding high hopes Sad

I knew if i ate those Egg Mcmuffins in the fridge, God would get me. I litterally couldnt touch the pork after doing my due diligence and research on the matter. At first I just wanted to stay ignorant, but my consience got the better of me and i realized that God was expecting me to do my research. So I did and wow it was pretty cut and dry. My wife also isnt going to be eating pork. She never ate it much anyhow.

If you know me you'd know i hate people who are vegetarians and dont eat pork. i used tho think it was for people of the far left, Athiests, and religious zealots that have issues. But wow I cant believe me out of all people is doing some 'dietary restriction' and not eating pork no less.

But God had this rule for a divine reason. I'll do as he says because I believe he's real (thanks to all the evolution research.). It was hard letting go, but women are expected to do it with their hair, so i should be expected to do it with Pork. Its not so bad though.. Oh yes and shellfish is included with that also so next time at the buffet, no delicious shrimp. Sad
Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?
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« Reply #5566 on: February 22, 2014, 01:14:21 PM »

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

Doesn't the fabric thing dicuss wool mixing only? I'll have to look into it and comply. That one I have more leniency, but I'll be held responsible for now on if i knowingly buy something that is mixed.

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.

Of course, when it comes to Santa Clause, fibbing to the kids is OK (which it should be noted that lying is not a sin in itself). But when the Bible dicusses stoning children from them misbehaving, all of a sudden thats not OK because in our modern enlightened society we know better.

My big issue that I really need to focus on is keeping the Sabath Day holy and getting out to Church each week and learning what is expected of us. Life is just so hectic. I know people say you dont technically dont have to go, but it's obviously expected of us if God said to remember him on the Sabath and keep it Holy. How do you do this? Easy. Go to Church.

Oh and i also made Canadian back bacon once. You smoke the bacon cold. Get an electric smoker. I have the Weber bullet with charcoal, but the electric is way better. You need to be able to set the temp digitally so you can set it at the lowest setting and keep it smoking for hours.

I also planned on making sausages and bought a sausage stuffer and such. Still in the box. Then to smoke them in the smoker and eat them in pizza and pasta with alfredo. There goes that.. No point now Sad

I have to say though, I feel better since eliminating pork. More stamina and clear headed. Less brain fog.
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« Reply #5567 on: February 22, 2014, 04:46:35 PM »

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

Doesn't the fabric thing dicuss wool mixing only? I'll have to look into it and comply. That one I have more leniency, but I'll be held responsible for now on if i knowingly buy something that is mixed.

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.

Of course, when it comes to Santa Clause, fibbing to the kids is OK (which it should be noted that lying is not a sin in itself). But when the Bible dicusses stoning children from them misbehaving, all of a sudden thats not OK because in our modern enlightened society we know better.

My big issue that I really need to focus on is keeping the Sabath Day holy and getting out to Church each week and learning what is expected of us. Life is just so hectic. I know people say you dont technically dont have to go, but it's obviously expected of us if God said to remember him on the Sabath and keep it Holy. How do you do this? Easy. Go to Church.

Oh and i also made Canadian back bacon once. You smoke the bacon cold. Get an electric smoker. I have the Weber bullet with charcoal, but the electric is way better. You need to be able to set the temp digitally so you can set it at the lowest setting and keep it smoking for hours.

I also planned on making sausages and bought a sausage stuffer and such. Still in the box. Then to smoke them in the smoker and eat them in pizza and pasta with alfredo. There goes that.. No point now Sad

I have to say though, I feel better since eliminating pork. More stamina and clear headed. Less brain fog.
Have you run your Judaizing by your priest to see what he thinks of it?
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« Reply #5568 on: February 22, 2014, 07:15:42 PM »

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.


So throwing rocks at one's children to just scare them is fine?   Huh

 The passages of Scripture that refer to stoning people, be they children, women or men, refer to death being the result such as Deuteronomy 24:24 or Leviticus 24:15.  In the Gospel the Adulteress isn't being threatened with stoning to "scare her"  The intent is to kill her.

What sources of rabbis or other persons have you read that you make this claim please?  Can you give names and titles or web sites to back up your idea?





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« Reply #5569 on: February 23, 2014, 01:56:07 AM »

As I was rereading Genesis tonight a question came to mind that I'd like to ask people of the young earth creationist approach.  Regarding part of the flood narratives mentioned, especially in Gen. 8:1-3, I'm curious about...

Quote
"And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters assuaged; The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained; And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated." - KJV

"But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down," - NIV

What was the purpose and result of the wind mentioned in verse one? If this is what caused the waters to recede, either as a primary or at least significant secondary cause, then how did this happen?

Any further thoughts?
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« Reply #5570 on: February 23, 2014, 02:14:35 AM »

As I was rereading Genesis tonight a question came to mind that I'd like to ask people of the young earth creationist approach.  Regarding part of the flood narratives mentioned, especially in Gen. 8:1-3, I'm curious about...

Quote
"And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters assuaged; The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained; And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated." - KJV

"But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down," - NIV

What was the purpose and result of the wind mentioned in verse one? If this is what caused the waters to recede, either as a primary or at least significant secondary cause, then how did this happen?

Any further thoughts?

I did not see your reply above. Do the YEC's have to believe that it is both inhabited and uninhabited lands? Couldn't it just be inhabited lands? If it is uninhabited how could they even know that it is there? I am sure I am being too simplistic once again.
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« Reply #5571 on: February 23, 2014, 02:38:26 PM »

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.


So throwing rocks at one's children to just scare them is fine?   Huh

 The passages of Scripture that refer to stoning people, be they children, women or men, refer to death being the result such as Deuteronomy 24:24 or Leviticus 24:15.  In the Gospel the Adulteress isn't being threatened with stoning to "scare her"  The intent is to kill her.

What sources of rabbis or other persons have you read that you make this claim please?  Can you give names and titles or web sites to back up your idea


Actually I just found a better explanation. Wow the Bible is such a book of wisdom:

http://www.njjewishnews.com/njjn.com/091108/torahSparingTheRebelliousSon.html
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« Reply #5572 on: February 23, 2014, 02:49:58 PM »

As I was rereading Genesis tonight a question came to mind that I'd like to ask people of the young earth creationist approach.  Regarding part of the flood narratives mentioned, especially in Gen. 8:1-3, I'm curious about...

Quote
"And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters assuaged; The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained; And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated." - KJV

"But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down," - NIV

What was the purpose and result of the wind mentioned in verse one? If this is what caused the waters to recede, either as a primary or at least significant secondary cause, then how did this happen?

Any further thoughts?

The wind evaporated the water.

If I remember this process shortened all human life after the flood and changed the ogygen/climate/atmosphere composition as well. It also made made past things extinct.
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« Reply #5573 on: February 23, 2014, 02:52:13 PM »

I did not see your reply above. Do the YEC's have to believe that it is both inhabited and uninhabited lands? Couldn't it just be inhabited lands? If it is uninhabited how could they even know that it is there? I am sure I am being too simplistic once again.

I do not think it would be absolutely mandatory for them to believe that it was only a local event (or in a small region of 'inhabited lands'). However, this is only in theory. In actual practice/experience I cannot recall ever coming across a YEC who insisted that the Eden narratives be taken 'literally' but who then accepted anything other than a global flood in the passages a few chapters later. In any event, but I was mainly asking for the thoughts of those who insist that the flood was global, though I am certainly open to the thoughts of others on the matter (especially since no one is taking a crack at it at present).
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« Reply #5574 on: February 23, 2014, 02:53:05 PM »

The wind evaporated the water.

If I remember this process shortened all human life after the flood and changed the ogygen/climate/atmosphere composition as well. It also made made past things extinct.

How long did that take to work? Or was it a special wind that worked faster than normal?
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« Reply #5575 on: February 23, 2014, 03:25:14 PM »

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.


So throwing rocks at one's children to just scare them is fine?   Huh

 The passages of Scripture that refer to stoning people, be they children, women or men, refer to death being the result such as Deuteronomy 24:24 or Leviticus 24:15.  In the Gospel the Adulteress isn't being threatened with stoning to "scare her"  The intent is to kill her.

What sources of rabbis or other persons have you read that you make this claim please?  Can you give names and titles or web sites to back up your idea


Actually I just found a better explanation. Wow the Bible is such a book of wisdom:

http://www.njjewishnews.com/njjn.com/091108/torahSparingTheRebelliousSon.html
We take our instruction from only one Jew at a time.
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« Reply #5576 on: February 23, 2014, 03:38:37 PM »

Is there an Orthodox commentary as clear and cogent as this?

Is that sweater you're wearing woven out of two different fabrics? Do you stone your children for back talking you? These are also things God commanded us to do, but for obvious reasons we recognize that these laws are no longer enforceable. The apostles thought the same about God's command to Abraham and his posterity that the male children be circumcised at 8 days old. So why do you want to go back to being a Jew?

As far as the stoning thing I researched that in the past and am void of that because stoning is against the law. Also stoning was not done to death in nearly all cases. The Rabbi's say this was included to scare kids and was a common practice back then.


So throwing rocks at one's children to just scare them is fine?   Huh

 The passages of Scripture that refer to stoning people, be they children, women or men, refer to death being the result such as Deuteronomy 24:24 or Leviticus 24:15.  In the Gospel the Adulteress isn't being threatened with stoning to "scare her"  The intent is to kill her.

What sources of rabbis or other persons have you read that you make this claim please?  Can you give names and titles or web sites to back up your idea


Actually I just found a better explanation. Wow the Bible is such a book of wisdom:

http://www.njjewishnews.com/njjn.com/091108/torahSparingTheRebelliousSon.html
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« Reply #5577 on: February 23, 2014, 03:40:51 PM »

Is there an Orthodox commentary as clear and cogent as this?

Are you speaking of the writing style, or the content? Because the latter is completely unorthodox, is why I'm asking.
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« Reply #5578 on: February 23, 2014, 03:47:25 PM »

Actually, I mean both. I'm interested in the Orthodox position on this, and was honestly asking if there was an useful commentary out there. Actually, if there was a nice Orthodox commentary on the OT, I'd go buy it right now. Just don't know if there is ... hence, the question.

Is there an Orthodox commentary as clear and cogent as this?

Are you speaking of the writing style, or the content? Because the latter is completely unorthodox, is why I'm asking.
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« Reply #5579 on: February 23, 2014, 03:49:03 PM »

Of the stoning part, I (now) assume, not the thoughts/actions sin part in the article? Now that I look back I'm not sure that what I had in mind is applicable.
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