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OrthodoxChristianity.net > Moderated Forums > Orthodox-Other Christian Discussion > Orthodox-Catholic Discussion (Moderator: username!) > Topic: Why would catholic Church teach that Theotokos is sinless and Perfect?
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walter1234
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« on: April 20, 2013, 11:27:19 AM »
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Luke1:47 and my spirit rejoices in God my  Savior

Why would Catholic Church teach that Theotokos is sinless and perfect？

If Theotokos is sinless and Perfect, Why does she still need a Savior?How does this teaching aligh with Luke 1:47?


Was there any Church Father teaching that Theotokos is sinless, holy and perfect?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2013, 11:34:50 AM by walter1234 » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2013, 11:31:00 AM »
Quote from: walter1234 on April 20, 2013, 11:27:19 AM
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Luke1:47 and my spirit rejoices in God my  Savior

Why would Catholic Church teach that Theotokos is sinless and perfect.


Because one guy decided he should make it dogma just because he felt he could.
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2013, 11:56:40 AM »
Because it is true.
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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2013, 12:06:17 PM »
Quote from: Michał Kalina on April 20, 2013, 11:56:40 AM
Because it is true.

Oh woops, I thought this was about the IC. Yes, the Theotokos is sinless and all. Walter's posts tend to confuse me.
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2013, 12:16:03 PM »
Quote from: walter1234 on April 20, 2013, 11:27:19 AM
Quote
Luke1:47 and my spirit rejoices in God my  Savior

Why would Catholic Church teach that Theotokos is sinless and perfect？

If Theotokos is sinless and Perfect, Why does she still need a Savior?How does this teaching aligh with Luke 1:47?


Was there any Church Father teaching that Theotokos is sinless, holy and perfect?
Saving in that the theotokos didn't need saving from sins but rather saving in being divinised, the ressurected body which she most certaintly didn't have? Thats one way they could go about it.
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truthseeker32
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2013, 12:34:06 PM »
Quote from: walter1234 on April 20, 2013, 11:27:19 AM
If Theotokos is sinless and Perfect, Why does she still need a Savior?How does this teaching aligh with Luke 1:47?
The Theotokos is sinless because of Christ, according to Catholics. In speaking about the Immaculate Conception, Catholics will often say that Christ redeems us by pulling us out of the pit of sin, whereas with Mary he prevented her from falling into the pit in the first place: retroactive redemption.

I have often wondered why, if God can remove the stain of Original Sin from Mary, He doesn't remove it from everyone.
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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2013, 12:44:13 PM »
The Theotokos was certainly sinless, but she was not made perfect until after her death.  And if Our Lord did not incarnate, suffer death, and rise from the dead, the Virgin, like the righteous before her, would have descended into Hades to await the coming of the Christ to release her from the bondage of death.  Personal sin is not all that we are saved from. 
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« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2013, 08:17:30 AM »
I know this sounds cliche but one can save a person by either pulling them out of a hole, or keeping them from falling into a hole. In our case, God saved us after we fell into the hole sin. In the Blessed Virgin Mary's case, God saved her from falling into the hole.
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